[Closed] Is it just me (first)?

Can't say I've noticed that it is any worse or better recently. Most people are polite but every now and then somebody oblivious to the world around them will soldier on and get in a pickle. First in gets priority and anyone driving past a good space within sight of the other car is a tool (IMO).

The weird thing is most people round here seem to get into a flashing contest as to who will let who through first but ride a bike in the same situation and 9 times out of 10 you'll be expected to stop and throw yourself into a non-existent gap lest they should have to move over a tiny bit, or heaven forbid, slow down.

I predict 7 pages, 1 flounce and 2 'making progress'

IMO A has right of way as the obstruction is on B's side of the road(*), so B should give way at the first parked car until A has passed them. A will then give a cheery wave of thanks, and B can go on their way after a tiny delay to make everyone's life that little bit less bothersome.

Or, as happened in front of me the other day, B drops it a cog and hits the gas forcing A to mount the pavement to avoid a head on collision, then B gives A the finger for making them slow back down to almost the speed limit as they squeeze through the remaining gap (I got it all on my bike cam but it's not worth logging with plod).

* - [url= https://theorytest.org.uk/highway-code-rule-163/ ]Highway Code Rule 163[/url]

give way to oncoming vehicles before passing parked vehicles or other obstructions on your side of the road

I've noticed it and I've put down the fact that it's become more of an issue down to the number of cars around now.  It used to be that there were less cars parked at the side so one of you could nip in and the other pass without it being an issue but it doesn't take the addition of many extra cars for those spaces to suddenly disappear and it all gets very difficult

3. am I wrong in assuming right of way as ‘first entrant’, as it were?

In my understanding you have the right of way coz you are already half way through the lane. I know car B might be blocking the junction but if car B enters the lane in front of you then all cars will be stuck unless you reverse.

Also why can't that car B wait? It's not the end of the world to wait for few seconds.

I encountered similar scenario while visiting my friend in housing estate with narrow lane and I tend to let other cars go first if they already in the lane, but the cars behind me were annoyed because I let one through and the rest followed. FFS! It's only few second.

It happened to me on Saturday in dreadful snowy conditions in Harrogate – there was a single parked car on the side of the road and both moving cars were due to meet it at the same time. So the complete and utter tool in the Q7 coming the other way swung out and forced me into the built-up snow at the edge of the road. Just why?

You should come and live on my road!

Seems there's no right or wrong - just who cracks first! 🙂

I agree B's side is obstructed A's side not so B is an ass for getting in A's way.
Also white car trumps red car.

Come and play on hard mode @p7eaven (it's Wood Street in Bury).

Often you can't see from either end where the gaps are, if there are any. To answer your question I think more and more cars (coming towards you AND parked) just makes you more likely to get in a mess and notice. And I'm with @purist on how it should be handled (including cheerfulness).

(EDIT - I'm worked up about image posting voodoo now.)

Our road is yellow line on one side, but with cars parked on the other there is barely room to pass, not room if one vehicle is a bus, and it is a bus route. Opposite is a sixth form college at which a good few inexperienced drivers drive to their lessons, and at tea-time around 4 school buses arrive and park along the road further up. This can create a no passing zone a couple of dozen cars long with a slight bend in it meaning you can't see the other end.

Hilarity ensues on a weekly basis. Fortunately our cars live in the driveway.

Does seem to happen more these days, or i'm getting grumpier. I don't think its always necessarily willful bellendery though, more often than not folk are just less aware of whats going on outside of their little bubble. Happens while walking on pavements a lot, folk carry on walking side by side blethering or glued to the phone and don't give way to oncoming pedestrians.

I grew up on (and therefore learned to drive on) a street which had never been designed to have more than 1 car per house, and probably had an average of >2 per house so had a real issue with this. That was 25 years ago, in fact it was an issue before I could drive when I was just cycling too! I don't think its a new problem but the number of cars does make it worse (it may also be that more WFH and delivery drivers means areas which were not to bad during the day are now problematic).

3. am I wrong in assuming right of way as ‘first entrant’, as it were?

You are wrong, although in your picture (the way you've drawn it) B should give way to A. The logic is: the obstruction (parked cars) are on B's side of the road so B should wait. In some cases that becomes impossible - you'll never get a gap big enough for long enough so you need to just go in reality, and usually not every "A" is a dick and so will let the traffic through periodically. Sometimes B has committed to starting their passage before A is even visible. In this circumstance A should allow B to continue as clearly reversing back is a higher risk. I've seen that principle applied almost universally except in the town of Malvern in the late 90's - no matter whether you were A or B though it appeared that the rule there was the "younger driver will give way - including reversing if necessary)!

One issue I have seen emerging is where the road is wider than a standard back street and has parking down one side but is wide enough for two cars to pass, but only if A adjusts their normal road position. B feels entitled to squeeze through (after all, waiting is for losers) but A feels they've been "forced to the side". I've seen A's who seem determined to exert their road position as well as B's who are coming through regardless. Possibly is getting worse as car sizes have crept up meaning 3 cars are now a "squeeze" when 20 yrs ago they'd have been easy in the same space.

I'm afraid I went full bellend last Thursday. Single-track with passing places. I assumed car coming would slow and pull into passing but didn't. When it stopped it was a couple of car lengths past pp and I was maybe 30m. Now I could have reversed but the one behind me was on the LHS and on the apex of a semi blind bend so I didn't want to.
Oncoming driver stared at me so I got my book out and started reading.
I gave her a hearty wave as I passed her.

This happens as lot in the city. I blame big stupid cars.

Anyway, first person in should have priority,  but what happens a lot is person A is just about to go through when massive SUV (B) will come barrelling in and right up to your front bumper and then throw their hands up as if they had no control in the matter. Then other cars will arrive and everyone will start leaning on their horns.

I once had a stand-off with a tiny lady in a huge 4x4 thing in the morning rush hour. When I turned the engine off and started reading a book she went MENTAL. First she got out and started screaming at me through the window, then wielding her phone like a weapon, started filming me (?). Finally she started screaming "ABUSE, ABUSE, HE'S ABUSING ME". to no one in particular.

I'm self-employed so was quite content to sit there all day watching this woman self-destruct. But she must've been running late as she gave in and started to reverse, which caused all the cars behind her to have to move and sound their horns appropriately.

Oncoming driver stared at me so I got my book out and started reading.

I once got out of my car and sat on a nearby bench (I was 9/10ths past a row of parked cars on her side of the road when she decided she would go for it).

You are wrong, although in your picture (the way you’ve drawn it) B should give way to A. The logic is: the obstruction (parked cars) are on B’s side of the road so B should wait.

In a different scenario, B might enter the zone when no car is in view approaching from the other end. Yet a car appears while B is in the zone, and decides to enter it before B has cleared it.

It does "seem" to happen more, and I was going to offer the same opinion as to why as leffeboy... drivers are used to having/finding a gap in the parked cars to nip into, and those gaps can often be fewer than they used to be.

I live under two sets of rules - UK and Wellington.

UK - the person on whose side the blockage is - parked cars etc - gives way.

Wellington rules - the person going uphill (which is 90% of the time) has right of way. We also have rules about parking on the correct side of the street, car facing in the same direction as traffic, which makes this a lot easier!

Also why can’t that car B wait? It’s not the end of the world to wait for few seconds.

Rhetorical or not:

😉

In a different scenario, B might enter the zone when no car is in view approaching from the other end. Yet a car appears while B is in the zone, and decides to enter it before B has cleared it.

This, often. Whomever is first into the tunnel (of no love) is not always the first seen ie on a bend or wotnot. But there is usually (?) only one side obstructed by parked cars or whatever, however this doesn’t help if the other twonk isn’t paying attention as they enter (or their view ahead is blocked), so then the Twit Zone is really the Twilight Zone if one or both don’t know/follow The Code

vehicular coqbagerie

I like this phrase but wish to clarify how to pronounce it - hard or soft G?
In other words is this person a coqbag or coqbadger? And if the latter, please clarify the exact difference between that and coqweasel?

TY

has right of way

has right of way priority

I’ve certainly noticed this I’ve also noticed cars not moving over to the left to give room, even on busy A roads, I’ve been in the normal driving position on my side and have had to move over to the left for an oncoming car due to their **** position (no obstructions on their side).

Surely "rules of the sea" apply and smaller vehicles gets out of the way of the bigger vehicle ............

@ossify

coqbagerie… I like this phrase but wish to clarify how to pronounce it

Depends. Pronounced with deep Parisian accent let the Gees go soft. Pronounced with deep Geordie accent go for the hard stuff. If Darn Proper Sarfeest then just make a few suppressed glottal sounds and make uncomfortably-prolonged eye contact until they get the message.

The coqweasel (OTOH) is an indescribably vile creature and as such beyond scope of thread. Suffice to say you won’t know if how or why it’s gotten you until after the event (oftentimes notatall!). That’s how you know. Or not. Conversely, one can usually see a coqbag coming (even predict its trajectory and manner).

has right of way priority

In fact the Highway Code mostly talks about motorists "giving priority" to others, rather than about anyone "having priority". So you don't have priority until someone gives you it.

If both cars arrive at the same time then the car on the same side as the parked cars should give way, if you’re already in the constriction then you have the right of way. If you’re on a bike then most car drivers will want you to get out of their way.

@greyspoke

So you don’t have priority until someone gives you it.

thnks, I thought I sensed something was amiss after I’d typed it.

In short: Twit wins, twonk loses?

Or is that the other way around? Because once in Great Malvern I witnessed two giant conqbags twonking at each other from static vehicles. Like bull-statues locked in eternal mortal combat. People were stopping to watch after 5 mins of this. Queues of cars now also honking at these twonkers. I finished a chore and returned by the same route, to find them still there 15 mins later. A bagers sett?

Delicious. I sat on the wall and watched a little longer before giving up. One was a shiny Merc and one was a shiny Beemer. I had then to try hard not to roll negative stereotypes around in my head like delicacies.

I’ve seen that principle applied almost universally except in the town of Malvern in the late 90’s – no matter whether you were A or B though it appeared that the rule there was the “younger driver will give way – including reversing if necessary)!

I’m assuming you know that pic is of a road in the town of that name (I kid you not), and that the author of this thread is in dire need of new glasses so as to determine age of oncoming driver? How very dare you.

i got confused reading the opening post.

if a car has to pass parked cars in their side of the road, any oncoming traffic has right of way.

if there is no oncoming traffic the car passing the parked cars is free to continue. should any oncoming cars appear they must wait until while the car passing the parked cars completed its manoeuvre.

ideally folk would take turns to pass through the section of road with the parked cars.

edit, the rules may have changed since i learned the highway code

the Highway Code

I see this referenced a lot round here. Is it an actual thing? I'd always assumed it was some ye olde thing like the domesday book (whatever that is). Or an unwritten code of best practice type thing written by keeno motoring enthusiasts. A bit like Camra for driving.

I see this referenced a lot round here. Is it an actual thing? I’d always assumed it was some ye olde thing like the domesday book (whatever that is). Or an unwritten code of best practice type thing written by keeno motoring enthusiasts. A bit like Camra for driving.

it’s entirely made up. when people quote it, they are just making it up. it has never been used as the basis for a court ruling in favour of an insurance company rather than the family of a child who was brain damaged when he was hit by a car.

If you’re on a bike then most car drivers will want you to get out of their way.

In my experience, most drivers will drive straight at you, at excessive speed, ignoring all opportunities they have to pull in and make room, expecting you to disappear into thin air.

This happens as lot in the city. I blame big stupid cars drivers.

Eff tee eff why.

Also why can’t that car B wait? It’s not the end of the world to wait for few seconds.

Does B need to wait if there's room for the cars to pass each other without colliding? So many people these days don't seem to be able judge the width of their car or position it correctly.

if a car has to pass parked cars in their side of the road, any oncoming traffic has right of way.

if there is no oncoming traffic the car passing the parked cars is free to continue. should any oncoming cars appear they must wait until while the car passing the parked cars completed its manoeuvre.

This is my understanding.

Something I have noticed is that many people choose to completely ignore that second part and instead use it as an opportunity to assert dominance and aggressively drive at the oncoming car.

I witnessed one recently where a car in front of me was passing a row of parked cars, no oncoming traffic in sight. As they were reaching the end, an oncoming car appeared from round the corner, and rather than just scrubbing off some speed, they proceeded to accelerate while sounding the horn, despite clearly not having the right of way. But what made it shocking was that it absolutely would have caused a head-on collision had the other car not swerved.

B should give way to A

If there is no A (not visible) then B can proceed. If A then appears, should give way to B until B has cleared.

That's just reiterating what others have said.

What hasn't been said (or I missed) is that B should be able to complete manouever before causing an obstruction to A. So if both are approaching and visible to each other, but B gets there first (obvs without flooring it to make the point) they should still stop to give RoW to A. Simply being first is not enough.

That has been checked with my daughter who is a late stages (nearly test ready) learner driver; the requirement is to not cause another user with RoW to need to adjust their speed or direction as a result of your actions.

Does B need to wait if there’s room for the cars to pass each other without colliding? So many people these days don’t seem to be able judge the width of their car or position it correctly.

My driving instructor taught me a rule of thumb when passing parked cars, something like ‘ always try and leave a space of at least the width of an average car door and if not then slow down by 10 mph per every foot closer (to a parked car) you get’. At which point a jogger ran into the road and bounced off the passenger door before running on as if nothing had happened. I was mildly traumatised and the driving instructor looked just carried on talking ‘so for example in that incident you saw there…’ 😬 🤓

Which could off an alternative explanation for observed behaviour/s of our Teutonic Middle Class Matadors mentioned upthread? They were both so politely cautious and observant of Thumb Rule…

..that they at exactly the same moment arrived to a polite and cautious stop? Wait, did I witness a nice-off?

#whenyouwishyoudmadeavideoofit

is vehicular coqbagerie on the rise?

I have only anecdotal evidence.

I summise: most drivers are pretty reasonable and aware. A small minority however are becoming significantly worse in politeness, awareness of others and driving skilz.

Just try driving a council minibus round Harrogate, you’ll soon realise that the largest vehicle has right of way.

@theotherjonv

the requirement is to not cause another user with RoW to need to adjust their speed or direction as a result of your actions.

Almost exactly! Except there is no RoW.

Just try driving a council minibus round Harrogate, you’ll soon realise that the largest vehicle has right of way.

As a fairly frequent visitor to the borough, I reckon Harrogate has the most extraordinary preponderance of shiny c***boxes driven by the shitbaggiest drivers I've ever encountered.

the requirement is to not cause another user with RoW to need to adjust their speed or direction as a result of your actions.

Almost exactly! Except there is no RoW.

I make the distinction because it's OK to make another driver stop or slow when they don't have RoW. eg: they're coming up to a T-Junction where you are on the main road and they are on the minor. Or indeed where parked cars are on the other driver's side of the road. If you leave RoW out that statement now says

the requirement is to not cause another user to need to adjust their speed or direction as a result of your actions.

You don't have to give way to everyone.

As a fairly frequent visitor to the borough, I reckon Harrogate has the most extraordinary preponderance of shiny c***boxes driven by the shitbaggiest drivers I’ve ever encountered.

I couldn’t agree more. The Merc Sprinter 16 seater always has priority over the Range Rover though.
Anyway, I’ve got a yellow schoolchildren sticker on it, so I win. 🤭

I think any issues we're seeing nowadays with this situation is because for years car A (who clearly has priority according to the highway code because a) he was there first and b)even if he wasn't there first the obstruction is on the opposite side of the road) has thanked car B for stopping despite the fact it is written in the highway code that they must do this. That is why if you ever see me as a car A you will not see me thanking you for what you must do and anyone coming flying at me at speed will find me come to a stop rather than mounting any pavement and I will have already started blatantly staring at you with contempt.

if you ever see me as a car A you will not see me thanking you for what you must do

Is that a typo, or genuinely. Sure, they 'must' do it but still worth a quick nod or wave surely?

We all just need to be a bit more Ogmios.

flying at me at speed will find me come to a stop rather than …

This is my response now. If they want to crash into my now stationary car, then that’s their choice.

Last time I had someone zoom out to deliberately block me 90% of the way past about five or six cars, I was luckily in no rush. So I too just stopped the car and waited. It only took a few minutes!

I think any issues we’re seeing nowadays with this situation is because for years car A (who clearly has priority according to the highway code because a) he was there first and b)even if he wasn’t there first the obstruction is on the opposite side of the road) has thanked car B for stopping despite the fact it is written in the highway code that they must do this. That is why if you ever see me as a car A you will not see me thanking you for what you must do and anyone coming flying at me at speed will find me come to a stop rather than mounting any pavement and I will have already started blatantly staring at you with contempt.

I see your point. But there's nowt wrong with being nice.

me come to a stop rather than mounting any pavement and I will have already started blatantly staring at you with contempt.

Ok so maybe the Beemer vs Merc toreadors I saw doing exactly that to each other (until way after the sun went down) weren’t having a ‘nice-off’ but were simply asserting their respective ‘entitlement’?*

*Albeit one being mistaken.

So this thread is like a public service. Sort of.