He’s absolutely pathetic! If the MAGA faithful were capable of embarrassment, they surely must be feeling it now?
Many of those seem to be clutching desperately to the concept that the war strategy Iran is fighting is the same as the war strategy the US is fighting.
Listening to Trump talking shit right now. How the Irish PM has not walked out of the room I do not know
The Taoiseach did interject a couple of times.
https://youtube.com/shorts/pOwPyvbIl9E?si=RurlUPpDEN52TCQK
https://youtube.com/shorts/Csi2xFC29FQ?si=dheyB_5wf8zQwA_M
Surely it takes more than a laundry fire to incapacitate an aircraft carrier. They do have their own fire systems so they can put it out and continue
It sounds like it was a significant fire that took 30 hours to extinguish - taking out sleeping quarters for 600 sailors through smoke damage. Maybe the designers of the fire suppression systems didn't account for them being started on purpose and allowed to get out of hand.
But that and the toilets point to a boat that's desperate for a refit, or the crew has had enough.
When the next fire is in the engine room it'll need a substantial tug to pull it back to the US
Sounds like it was a pretty major fire.
To give you an idea of what can happen on ships in situations like this (and give credence to the mutinous crew rumours), my best mate has just retired from the navy and was telling me a story of a similar situation.
They'd already been out at sea for six months (in somewhere far from pleasant, you really wouldn’t want to be) when as senior NCO he got wind that their deployment was possibly to be extended by a further few months.
On hearing this, he went to see the commanding officer and requested a sidearm if be this was the case, and recommended he did the same. It didn’t happen in the end, but that shows you his attitude to towards telling his crew they weren’t going home.
That carrier crew have been at sea for nearly a year. How happy would you be?
Sounds like it was a pretty major fire.
To give you an idea of what can happen on ships in situations like this (and give credence to the mutinous crew rumours), my best mate has just retired from the navy and was telling me a story of a similar situation.
They'd already been out at sea for six months (in somewhere far from pleasant, you really wouldn’t want to be) when as senior NCO he got wind that their deployment was possibly to be extended by a further few months.
On hearing this, he went to see the commanding officer and requested a sidearm if be this was the case, and recommended he did the same. It didn’t happen in the end, but that shows you his attitude to towards telling his crew they weren’t going home.
That carrier crew have been at sea for nearly a year. How happy would you be?
I would hate it which is why I respect those who do sign up and join
Had a similar (well, not so serious) story from an ex-navy security guard at my last job. I'd got back from a course down at HMS Raleigh and was bitching about the food (Sodexo), specifically about the cottage pie that looked delicious but, when touched with the serving spoon, showed a thin crust of cheesy potato floating on about half an inch of grease over grey mince.
His comment was that it must have changed a lot since he was in because anyone that cooked food that bad (on a ship) would have been lynched.
Sure, Raleigh is an on-shore ship, but it's where all the newbies go for training and they were eating the same food as us.
Trumps declared purpose was to stop Iran getting nuclear weapons. Nothing that's been done so far will do that. It would need boots on the ground to go into the tunnels and take the uranium. North Korea has shown that having a wrecked economy doesn't stop you building nukes. Likewise, the only way to make the Strait of Hormuz safe from seaborne attacks is to take control of the coast.
But Trump's not going to put boots on the ground, so he's created a lasting problem in the Strait, and not stopped them making a bomb, and unless the regime changes they will now be even more determined to get nukes.
Nothing that's been done so far will do that. It would need boots on the ground to go into the tunnels and take the uranium.
Which given their previous and, I think, part of their current wave of attacks was basically "destroy the entrances so people cant get stuff out" will be rather tricky. Those boots are going to need to hang around for a while to protect the engineers doing the digging.
Thats assuming half the uranium isnt hidden in various random places.
On one illegal fools errand after another.
It’s just yet another illustration of the fact that all those like Trump and Hegseth who claim to be patriots and wrap themselves in flags, don’t actually give a shit about those at the pointy end being asked to deliver on their stupidity
Trumps declared purpose was to stop Iran getting nuclear weapons.
I think everyone 'understands' that the principle aim here is regime change, don't they?
But that and the toilets point to a boat that's desperate for a refit, or the crew has had enough.
When the next fire is in the engine room it'll need a substantial tug to pull it back to the US
It was reported on SM that the toilet pipes were clogged with navy issue T-shirts. That isn't verified, of course, but it might support the reasoning behind the fire investigation.
PS "boomer" a US ballistic-missile submarine 🤔
His comment was that it must have changed a lot since he was in because anyone that cooked food that bad (on a ship) would have been lynched.
Osbourne's austerity has ripped through the armed services like a dose. I've long time-served friends in all 3 services and all of them have these sorts of stories. Particularly one in the RAF who is literally counting the days, and she's a pretty senior helo pilot who used to love her job.
Trumps declared purpose was to stop Iran getting nuclear weapons. Nothing that's been done so far will do that. It would need boots on the ground to go into the tunnels and take the uranium. North Korea has shown that having a wrecked economy doesn't stop you building nukes. Likewise, the only way to make the Strait of Hormuz safe from seaborne attacks is to take control of the coast.
But Trump's not going to put boots on the ground, so he's created a lasting problem in the Strait, and not stopped them making a bomb, and unless the regime changes they will now be even more determined to get nukes.
I was just listening to TRIP and they pointed out he's screwed either way now. All he's managed to do is show all the Middle Eastern countries that Iran can cause chaos for the region with very little effort. It was always feared they could, now he's proved they can so it actually strengthens their position. The only way out would be regime change but that's not happening without boots on the ground and the 1000's of dead soldiers that would bring follow.
I think everyone 'understands' that the principle aim here is regime change, don't they?
If we're guessing intentions...
The aim for Trump is to use the power of his country, and be seen to use that power as if it were his own. Power without restraint, wielded at his own personal whim.
The aim for Netanyahu is to weaken those seen as a threat to Israel, and force neighbours to choose to align with him against a common enemy. As always it looks like the timing is to maintain his position as PM, and stay out of jail.
Both also seem to want to build a personal legacy of expanding their country's territory and direct control.
Regime change? Destruction of infrastructure (in Iran and elsewhere)? Ongoing disruption? Side effects, not aims.
All he's managed to do is show all the Middle Eastern countries that Iran can cause chaos for the region with very little effort.
TBF I think everyone is the region was already clear that Iran's long held intention is to be be disruptive - because 'they can'. The entire history of Iran's clerical regime is one of distablement (a word I've just invented). All the US has achieved is the further en-shitification of an already economically and diplomatically isolated regime. It's normal Iranian citizens who'll suffer for this, of course.
Many of those seem to be clutching desperately to the concept that the war strategy Iran is fighting is the same as the war strategy the US is fighting.
The stupid thing is that a, 25 years ago, the US ran a War Games scenario called Millennium Challenge with some general playing the Red Team who immediately adopted these asymmetric warfare tactics. Drones, fast boats, radio silence via use of motorbike messengers...
Red basically "killed" everything the Blue team had by the end of Day 1. So the exercise was restarted with Red told to play nicely and allow themselves to be defeated.
This is what's happening in Iran. The US haven't learnt anything at all.
I was just listening to TRIP and they pointed out he's screwed either way now. All he's managed to do is show all the Middle Eastern countries that Iran can cause chaos for the region with very little effort. It was always feared they could, now he's proved they can so it actually strengthens their position. The only way out would be regime change but that's not happening without boots on the ground and the 1000's of dead soldiers that would bring follow.
Asymmetric warfare is a bitch.
Iran has no aircraft carriers, no heavy bombers, it can't even secure its own airspace. But one of its $5,000 dollar mines can cripple a $1billion dollar Arleigh Burke destroyer and the threat of a bunch of $20,000 drones can stop tankers carrying $200 million dollars worth of oil out of the Gulf.
It doesn't even have to fire the drones, the threat of using them is enough to stop all shipping passing through the Strait. And Iran has literally thousands of them and they can be dispersed and deployed from trucks and shipping containers anywhere along more than 200 miles of coastline.
The Strait of Hormuz is closed as long as Iran wants it closed. There is no conceivable naval operation that will guarantee the 100% safety that oil and LNG tankers need to sail.
The orange toddler can throw as many toys as he likes, but that's the reality.
The US haven't learnt anything at all.
If I'm being generous to the Trump Govt (and it's very generous) Nothing the U.S. has done either alone, with Europe, or regional states since '79 has had any meaningful impact to bring Iran's governing regime to anything like normality. I can see that from their perspective, they've just seen the over-throw of Maduro pretty bloodlessly, and "surely" they must have thought, Iran can read the tea-leaves...
Apparently not.
All the US has achieved is the further en-shitification of an already economically and diplomatically isolated regime. It's normal Iranian citizens who'll suffer for this, of course.
It's almost as though the CIA overthrowing the democratically elected government was a bad idea ?
It's almost as though the CIA overthrowing the democratically elected government was a bad idea ?
That the Islamic clerics who took over in '79 supported at the time? that overthrow? I'm against the attempted overthrow of any regime by anyone, but for the current Iranian govt to use this as propaganda is just disingenuous, and works largely I think because of western guilt over the region. I think the enmity between the two is more likely to be - the killing of over 250 US marines in Beirut, the hostage taking of US diplomatic staff and the kidnap and torture of the CIA station chief in Lebanon.
Neither the US or Iran have a monopoly on ignoring international norms here.
It's almost as though the CIA overthrowing the democratically elected government was a bad idea ?
The CIA does seem to have a habit of installing paper dictators then getting upset when it doesn't turn out the way they thought or when their man gets uppity so they have to go in and do the same again.
There's a Yes, Prime Minister scene where Sir Humphrey talks about partitioning as the standard British solution to geopolitical crises.
"Normally we partition the place, it's what we did in Ireland, Cyprus, India and Palestine, it always worked"
"Doesn't partitioning always lead to civil war?
"Well it did in Ireland, Cyprus, India and Palestine, but it kept them busy"
for the current Iranian govt to use this as propaganda is just disingenuous, and works largely I think because of western guilt over the region.
It's not propaganda, it's something that happened, and I haven't heard it referred to by any Iranian leader lately.
the killing of over 250 US marines in Beirut, the hostage taking of US diplomatic staff and the kidnap and torture of the CIA station chief in Lebanon
I'm guessing that the US support of Saddam in his war that killed 200,000 Iranians might have something to do with it.
The Strait of Hormuz is closed as long as Iran wants it closed. There is no conceivable naval operation that will guarantee the 100% safety that oil and LNG tankers need to sail.
Closely related to this...
In which is this...
France and Italy
The two European nations are understood to have requested talks with Iran about allowing their ships to pass through the strait, the UK’s Financial Times has reported, citing unnamed officials.
Which honestly, would be quite interesting if they pulled it off and others in Europe followed. Feels like quite a long shot.
and I haven't heard it referred to by any Iranian leader lately.
You don't think that they've consistently used the '53 coup as the US' 'original sin' and reason they can never be trusted, and have consistently blamed both the CIA and MI5 while obfuscating their own complicity and manipulation at the time, and is the cornerstone of their 'neither East nor West' policy which places the US and the UK at the centre of efforts to constantly overthrow them?
their propaganda clearly working better than they could've imagined.
I'm guessing that the US support of Saddam in his war that killed 200,000 Iranians might have something to do with it.
have you heard at all about this wee thing called the Iran-Contra Affair?
You don't think that they've consistently used the '53 coup as the US' 'original sin' and reason they can never be trusted,
I'm sure they have, and for good reason, but I refer you to the meaning of the word "lately".
have you heard at all about this wee thing called the Iran-Contra Affair?
Yes, I was living in the US at the time and news did filter through, even to Texas, so your patronising comment looks a bit silly as well as irrelevant.
The Strait of Hormuz is closed as long as Iran wants it closed. There is no conceivable naval operation that will guarantee the 100% safety that oil and LNG tankers need to sail.
Closely related to this...
Which honestly, would be quite interesting if they pulled it off and others in Europe followed. Feels like quite a long shot.
Definitely a long shot. Insurance is likely to be a problem because mines are a possibility and at least one tanker has been hit by missile debris causing a fire, despite not being directly targetted.
Europe doesn't rely on the Strait of Hormuz massively, Asia is far more impacted.
Having said that, jet fuel and fertiliser represent products that Europe is more reliant on, not helped by sanctions on Russia. This might be a less bad option
Iran could change its mind if defensive measures on behalf of other Gulf States cross a line and France has been involved there quite heavily.
It could be a tactic to open more general talks though.
It could be a tactic to open more general talks though.
Thanks to the actions of Trump, I don't think there's ever been a time recently where "general talks" seems as remote a possibility as it is now.
France and Italy
The two European nations are understood to have requested talks with Iran about allowing their ships to pass through the strait, the UK’s Financial Times has reported, citing unnamed officials.
And realistically that's how this actually ends. A diplomatic settlement with Iran, where they agree to re-open the Strait.
Trump rolled the dice on regime change and it came up snake eyes. A dictatorship facing an existential threat is always going to be willing to absorb more physical and political punishment than a "democracy" even one with an idiot in charge.
And Iran isn't fully backed into a corner yet, they've still got means of escalating it further. Mass attacks on oil, gas and de-salination infrastructure would cripple the entire Gulf region. The US taking Kharg island and strangling Iran's oil exports would probably lead to such an escalation.
And realistically that's how this actually ends. A diplomatic settlement with Iran, where they agree to re-open the Strait.
All the while Israel is assassinating people like Larijani who are the establishment figures who negotiations would be with. They are removing the possibility of diplomatic negotiations to sabotage any off ramp.
They are removing the possibility of diplomatic negotiations to sabotage any off ramp.
I don't think the current Israeli leadership are particularly interested in giving Iran an "off ramp" I think they think they can inflict sufficient damage on them to stop them being a destabilizing presence in the region for the foreseeable, and TBH, I think Iran's regional neighbours are pretty much content for them to carry on.
I don't think the current Israeli leadership are particularly interested in giving Iran an "off ramp" I think they think they can inflict sufficient damage on them to stop them being a destabilizing presence in the region for the foreseeable, and TBH, I think Iran's regional neighbours are pretty much content for them to carry on.
Unlike the US, Israel actually has achievable goals. They too would probably liked to have ended up with a friendlier regime in Iran, but they probably recognised it was a long shot. So massively degrading Iran's military while using the war as cover to go after and seize territory from Iran's proxies is a good outcome for them.
I think you're spot on. The US and Israel aligned on "regime change" but Israel had a second place option - degradation, which the US has not. Trump is very zero-sum transactional, having the regime still in power - is a 'win' for them and [as far as he sees it] a losing position for Trump.
And Iran isn't fully backed into a corner yet, they've still got means of escalating it further. Mass attacks on oil, gas and de-salination infrastructure would cripple the entire Gulf region. The US taking Kharg island and strangling Iran's oil exports would probably lead to such an escalation.
There were stories from the second Gulf War of US armour rolling into Iraq and going straight past all the museums and historic sites (which were being vandalised, looted etc) and straight to the oil depots. No interest in restoring law and order, just "get to the oil!"
I'm not sure that taking Kharg Island will achieve anything if tankers can't get in and out.
Asia taking the brunt of the economic impact of this war.
The two European nations are understood to have requested talks with Iran about allowing their ships to pass through the strait, the UK’s Financial Times has reported, citing unnamed officials.
And this is surely the way this plays out from now on. It's like Canada doing a deal with China for importing EV's instead of American ones and Argentina courting China to supply all the Soya the Americans used to, pre-Donalds-mad-tariffs.
One by one every country is going to hit the tipping point (we're probably there already) where they say "**** America!" and start making alliances that would have been inconceivable just a few years ago. Because there's simply no advantage to be had by dealing with a transactional, zero-sum half-wit who changes his mind like he changes his underwear and demands subjugation as the price of doing business. It's just not worth the trouble.
Way to go Donald. Make America Great Again appears to be making it irrelevant instead
and start making alliances that would have been inconceivable just a few years ago.
the problem with this is though is the sort of thing that European countries especially induldged in the decades running up to WW1. Dual Alliance - Germany and Austria, Franco-Russia in 1894, Entente Cordiale, Anglo-Russia and Treaty of London (the one that protected Belgium)
Interstate alliances have a habit of drawing other states into opposing alliances...
Thanks Donald, Thanks Brexit, it's been a blast.
There were stories from the second Gulf War of US armour rolling into Iraq and going straight past all the museums and historic sites (which were being vandalised, looted etc) and straight to the oil depots. No interest in restoring law and order, just "get to the oil!"
You should watch Generation Kill. HBO miniseries based on an embedded journalist's account.
Or Jarhead (for the same conflict/reason)
I'm not sure that taking Kharg Island will achieve anything if tankers can't get in and out.
Surely, in order to take the island, they need to get the amphibious assault ships through the straits first. If the Millennium Challenge war game was anything like accurate, that fleet will be annihilated if they try it.
The only invasion option is presumably to land on the coast east of the straits and make their way on land. However, that's tough terrain, one main road east/west. They'd be massively outnumbered by a force with local advantage. I can't see it being anything but a disaster.
Asia taking the brunt of the economic impact of this war.
At the moment...that cheap stuff we all like so much is going to be less cheap imminently.
Now the psychopaths are bombing offshore gas fields. What could possibly go wrong?
Interesting article here, seems the US have struck a huge deal with Asia to help ease the burden.
Trump saves the planet again - get him a Nobel prizeAsia taking the brunt of the economic impact of this war.
At the moment...that cheap stuff we all like so much is going to be less cheap imminently.
I think a few folk here work, or have worked, offshore. Safety is always a big part of the job and the memory of Piper Alpha never far away. I can't imagine the horror of being there while homicidal lunatics in warplanes are actively trying to kill you.
It's all getting silly now. The Beeb drawing Trumps misshapen willy, red raw, after it fails to penetrate Iran decisively.
Just saw this as a comment on the Whitehouse FB page 😂
What's the difference between Iran and Vietnam?
..
Trump knew how to get out of Vietnam.
Just saw this as a comment on the Whitehouse FB page 😂
What's the difference between Iran and Vietnam?
..
Trump knew how to get out of Vietnam.
Lol, that is very good.
Now the psychopaths are bombing offshore gas fields. What could possibly go wrong?
Lol, in this conflict that statement could apply to any of the 3 combatants! Gonna need to narrow it down a bit...
Anybody read the Alex Scarrow books 'Last Light' and 'Afterlight'?
Re: South Pars gas field
I've just looked at the NASA FIRMS website.
Some fires in the general area of the Persian Gulf International Airport and further along the coast towards Siraf.
Nothing obvious in the gas field
Anybody read the Alex Scarrow books 'Last Light' and 'Afterlight'?
No I haven't but just looked them up. I'll be getting them. Thanks. 👍
Apologies for going OT.
From the Beeb.
Unintended consequences indeed!
A little earlier the White House said it is loosening a law designed to boost US shipbuilding, as it tries to shield the US from spiking oil prices.
Press Secretary Karoline Leavitt said the administration would suspend the Jones Act - a 1920 law that requires American-made ships be used to transport goods between US ports – for 60 days.
She said the waiver would allow "vital resources like oil, natural gas, fertiliser, and coal to flow freely".
It’s a striking decision given the Trump administration’s previous focus on reviving shipbuilding – even considering new fees on foreign-made ships – and a sign of just how much pressure the White House is under to show it is responsive to rising prices at the pump.
How much difference it will actually make is unclear. Maritime groups upset about the move say the effect will be minimal, noting that oil prices, not shipping costs, are behind the price spike.
iran launching a lot of missiles tonight at Tel Aviv and Bahrain & saudi
its nuts that they still have the capacity after nearly 3 weeks of continuous bombing by israel/US
President DJT's Five Phases of Warfare.
The Americans are on thier own in this, as far as I'm concerned... they have no plan, and no end game and expect us in Europe to flock to them after the trade war and threats of a hostile takeover of Greenland...
How on earth can they expect any help after the constant insults? To even have the audacity to ask for help now, is a massive insult in itself.
at this point the quickest way to end the war would be for the rest of the world to dump US treasuries, ensuring a quicker victory for Iran
I think that, at this point in his delusion, dumping US bonds at a national scale would get you 1000000% tariffs and an invasion.
I'd also question who other than China would want to buy them. They already own a large chunk of the US debt, so anything more would be for the LOLZ. Maybe Putin could, ot Lil' Kim.
I think that there has already been some quiet quitting of US bonds, but while countries might hold dollar reserves to enable trade in dollars, I think most are owned by institutions rather than governments, ie pensions. All those who were in a panic when they took a small bump in the value of their over inflated pension gains last year when Trump started the trade wars, or when Truss had her moment, would go into meltdown by the impact it would have.
The EU starting a "euro" oil trade could be a better long term plan, chipping away at the dollars dominance without causing the same level of damage as dumping bonds. If there is a rough idea of a plan from team Trump, it does look like they could be trying to take a stranglehold on oil supply, so the rest of the world should look at preparing against that.
Oh, look who’s stepping in to offer an alternative supply of gas to the Middle East….
Who'd have thunk it? He seems to be doing very, very well indeed out of all this chaos. But Trump definitely isn't a Russian Asset
Oh, look who’s stepping in to offer an alternative supply of gas to the Middle East….
Who'd have thunk it? He seems to be doing very, very well indeed out of all this chaos. But Trump definitely isn't a Russian Asset
I'm starting to think Trump isn't technically a Russian asset.. I think he's just genuinley this pig-headed and dumb, but he's not used to hearing the word "no". Especially when it comes to under age girls.
I've gotta hand it to him, this is one a hell of a distraction from the Epstein files.
Tulsi Gabbard threw Trump under the bus in a congressional hearing yesterday. Basically:
Senator: your intelligence departments role is to deliver non-partisan advice yes?
TG: Yes
S: last year you stated that Iran's nuclear weapons capability was obliterated by US strikes?
TG: yes
S: did you have evidence on March 1st that Iran's nuclear capability was an imminent threat?
TG: no
S: but the president said it was in his statement on March 1st
TG: only the president can decide if there is an imminent threat
Will make no difference, but her alibi/exit strategy was plain to see
I guess it could be read like that, but I heard it more of "If the president decides they are an imminent threat then they are an imminent threat. Kind of like Dick Cheney's statement on waterboarding terrorists which was something like "we only waterboard terrorists, so if we are waterboarding them they must be terrorists".
Tulsi Gabbard is the one with links to Russia's intelligence services, right?
I also remembered thinking that Gabbards positions seemed quite reasonable when she was in the Democratic primaries in 2020, just found her campaign site for then, she has done an about turn of just about every principle she claimed to have.
https://www.tulsi2020.com/about
a few highlights
Regime change wars are wasteful and have drained our country of trillions of dollars, undermined our national security, and cost the lives of thousands of our men and women in uniform. I will bring an end to this failed foreign policy and withdraw America from ongoing conflict that achieves nothing and wastes so much.
I’m concerned that our civil liberties are under attack. Our right to privacy, guaranteed by the 4th Amendment, is threatened by overreaching intelligence agencies and big tech monopolies that falsely invoke national security interests to take away our civil liberties. Our right to free speech is jeopardized by the ever-increasing power of mainstream media corporations.
Our criminal justice system is not just and allows wealthy crooks to profiteer whilst poor criminal go to jail. This can no longer stand and I will ensure fairness and the same rule of law for all, so we have a criminal justice system that finally works the same for everyone.
We can and must begin to build a renewable energy economy. By redirecting the billions spent every year subsidizing the fossil fuel industry to instead invest in the industries of the future — expanding wind, solar, and geothermal — we will guarantee a cleaner, safer energy future and create high-quality jobs.
I was just looking at the FTSE 100 graph and saw another sharp drop, checked the news to see what had happened - oh, Hegseth has been speaking, that'll do it.
A great cartoon in today’s Times
Isn't it Boomer? But yeh point taken
I also remembered thinking that Gabbards positions seemed quite reasonable when she was in the Democratic primaries in 2020, just found her campaign site for then, she has done an about turn of just about every principle she claimed to have.
Hell of a switch in positions!
Russian money will do that to a person. Either that or they have good leverage too
https://bsky.app/profile/peark.es/post/3mhg54n3sck2g
Best case scenario, if the bombing stopped today it will take months for prices to stabilise, this tral world consequences are huge
The worryingt part is that Trump is completely clueless about consequences of it all, so will judt keep escalating
The worryingt part is that Trump is completely clueless about consequences of it all, so will judt keep escalating
Yup... he seems set on new attacks on Iran 'till they decide not to retaliate in kind. That day isn't coming any time soon.
"ExxonMobil holds stakes in damaged LNG facilities"
Maybe somebody at the golf club will have a word, although even the boss of Exxon probably can't stand being in the same room as him.