[Closed] In this day and age can you ever afford to give people the benefit of the doubt?

You leave negative feedback, that's what it's for..

You don't say if you've tried to sort it out with the seller, which is always the first port of call.
[edit]No result from that, [i]then[/i] you leave negative feedback.

Give them an opportunity to explain themselves/give you a refund before giving negative feedback. Thats what its for and will hopefully warn other potential buyers that the person is not to be trusted as a seller.

As far as eBay goes, you don't know the seller at all so I'd not trust anyone on there as far as I could throw them.

Kinda getting the same on here by the sound of recent threads. Only tend to buy stuff now who I've had a decent conversation with, seen plenty of pics and who has been a member for a while AND posts in the forum as well as the classifieds...

I think you protect and insulate yourself as far as possible.

Use paypal and credit cards (not debit cars) to pay for stuff as it pushes some liability onto the card issuer.

Post stuff out with insurance.

Make sure you take pictures of items condition for your own protection should a buyer subsequently complain.

I don't always do all of the above for stuff I buy and sell online but I accept the risks and tend to take a view that (for me) less than £100 is worth a punt but more than that I need to be careful.

Perhaps DezB, but some of the biggest scum bags in the history of our race are polite and appear helpful and genuine!

I don't know that much about guitars but it was obvious to me just at a glance that it had taken an impact.

Can we really afford to give complete strangers the benefit of the doubt and should the feedback not be left so that other are warned ❓

wwaswas - Member

I think you protect and insulate yourself as far as possible.

Use paypal and credit cards (not debit cars) to pay for stuff as it pushes some liability onto the card issuer.

Post stuff out with insurance.

Make sure you take pictures of items condition for your own protection should a buyer subsequently complain.

I don't always do all of the above for stuff I buy and sell online but I accept the risks and tend to take a view that (for me) less than £100 is worth a punt but more than that I need to be careful.

I think you misunderstand the question wwaswas, as a proffesional trader who earns a living from trading, I think I know a bit about risk management and the operating procedures that ensure risk are minimalised.

The question is when you recieve something that is not as described and the seller claims not to know about the damage defect or other issues, do you give them the benefit of the doubt or not!

I know this is going to sound like a smart-ar$e '...I told you so...' comment, but I did think at the time on your guitar thread that you were COMPLETLY CHUFFING NUTS buying a guitar unseen, let alone from Ebay. I've bought a couple off Ebay and have gone to see/play it before buying and have simply walked away from well over half of the ones I've looked at as they are clearly not as described because a) the seller doesn't really know enough to describe it properly or b) is clearly trying it on.

Yes.. i'm still very much a trusting person.

Sold a Roadie last week. Bloke emailed me telling me it had turned up and was damaged and he didn't want it. I'd refunded him 4 mins later before he'd even mailed me the pictures.... Why ? because i'd like to think if the situation were reveresed he'd do the same...

I also like to think, next time something goes wrong... he'd think more favourably about doing the same in reverse etc.

[i]I know a bit about risk management and operating procedures to ensure it.[/i]

[i]the scratch plate is missing it's been ripped off or removed due to being damaged[/i]

not trying to be funny but how did you mitigate risk in this case - surely the lack of the scratch plate would have been obvious from pictures of the actual item?

to answer your point - I think you have to judge each case on it's merits. This looks more like you've been deliberatly lied to than someone just 'not knowing'?

bristolbiker - Member

I know this is going to sound like a smart-ar$e '...I told you so...' comment, but I did think at the time on your guitar thread that you were COMPLETLY CHUFFING NUTS buying a guitar unseen, let alone from Ebay. I've bought a couple off Ebay and have gone to see/play it before buying and have simply walked away from well over half of the ones I've looked at as they are clearly not as described because a) the seller doesn't really know enough to describe it properly or b) is clearly trying it on.

It would sound a lot smarter if I had a guitar thread 😆
You are right but I want a decent guitar to learn on and there are some truly classic guitars on ebay for good prices.

I always start off by giving people the benefit of the doubt. That's just the way I am.

As previously posted, discuss discrepancies with the seller. If they're decent, a resolution should be reachable.

If not, they've had the opportunity and therefore it's time to use the feedback facility to highlight them as not entirely trustable.

Fair enough - we both came to that thread late, but my sentiment still stands.

http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/guitarists-newbie-help-please

FFS Kaesae do you seriously believe:

The tiny number of bad experiences you have mean your life is ruined?
Everyone has experiences as bad as yours?
Everything was better in the past?

These threads should be banned.

[img] [/img]

I bet the bloke selling the guitar is a postie. Hang on a minute though - you didn't say how it got delivered - did it get damaged in delivery by the posties?

cynic-al - Member

FFS Kaesae do you seriously believe:

The tiny number of bad experiences you have mean your life is ruined?
Everyone has experiences as bad as yours?
Everything was better in the past?

These threads should be banned.

Oh great alfonso fudd has turned up 💡

What's the appropriate defense/responce to a petty, deluded, stroppy, handbag swinging bully who has nothing to contribute to this thread or any other but insults, hostility and well lets face it self aggrandisement, in his relentless persuit of attention.

What's wrong al ❗ is your mankini chaffing the skin of your ARSEHOLE ❓

kaesae - how about you lend me a grand so I can help restore your faith in mankind?

I thought that was a very un-cynical posting from al.

Faith isn't my style TSY, I prefer logic and reason based analysis techniques, anyone who places themselves in a vulnerable possition when they do not need to, or who does not limit risks as much as they possibly can, will sooner or later get thier fingers burnt ❓

Gotta go work to do 😀

kaesae - fairpoint, without taking some risks though you, errr, risk missing out as well though.

So this £1k?

Oooh personal insults already...well done.

Fine here, just thought you might want to consider another viewpoint/stop churning out your own small minded nonsense.

Well, this thread's gone downhill very quickly ...

You are right but I want a decent guitar to learn on and there are some truly classic guitars on ebay price realistically and a load of absolute biffers described a classic/never gigged/as new accompanied by either no photos or stock photos from an online shop priced to attract the people likes bees round a honey pot and end up disappointed having taken a punt after spending more money than they were happily prepared to lose.

FTFY

I prefer logic and reason based analysis techniques, anyone who places themselves in a vulnerable possition when they do not need to, or who does not limit risks as much as they possibly can, will sooner or later get thier fingers burnt

Is this statement of your preferred approach not completely at odds with buying a guitar unseen/unplayed from a bloke you've never met over the internet, and somewhat ironic given the result??? 😕

Benefit of the doubt within reason, I had a customer (a sole trader) who hired some staff from me for 3 weeks the three invoices came to over 2k, he at our initial meeting said he would pay the invoices upon receipt, guess what three weeks later no money each week I'd given him the benefit of the doubt after one excuse or another, that was as long as I was prepared to wait, I personally paid him a visit I kindly insisted it would be a good idea for him to pay the money otherwise I may get upset (read into that what you will), that got invoice number one paid, six weeks on and we still have two invoices outstanding to the tune of £1600, not wanting the hassle over Xmas I let my solicitor deal with it, the customer ignored him.

So last night I went his premises and got very upset with him, this morning my solicitor gets a fax saying the money will be paid on Friday and to tell his client (me) that not to step foot on his premises, not to harass him or make threats otherwise he will call the police - poor lamb.

Result.

bully!

Yes!

cynic-al - Member

FFS Kaesae do you seriously believe:

The tiny number of bad experiences you have mean your life is ruined

Everyone has experiences as bad as yours?

Everything was better in the past?

These threads should be banned.

Based on what grounds exactly, that they are relevant to a lot of peoples circumstances and we might come to a better understanding of our options / choices also what to do when we find ourselves in this situation 💡

kaesae - I still don't understand why you've ended up in this position despite being a 'professional' at buying and sellign over the web?

If anything should be banned it should be the ****ing smileys.

If anything should be banned it should be the **** smileys.

...or at least a per use tax.*

*With all profits going to refund Jimmy.

He's not a bully al, that's his money and the life source of his company. He's given the guy xmas off, but the money needs to be paid and that's all there is too it!

Jamie - Member

If anything should be banned it should be the **** smileys.

...or at least a per use tax.*

*With all profits going to refund Jimmy.

NNNOOOOOOO!!!!! I like the stupid smiley's, they add character and humour, they reinfoce my belief that STW is a bunch of big kids, trapped in adult bodies mucking about and that helps me feel at home 😀

wwaswas - Member

kaesae - I still don't understand why you've ended up in this position despite being a 'professional' at buying and sellign over the web?

Well wwaswas I can't control what someone puts in a listing or make them tell the truth, unlike you my psychic powers are a bit wornky 😉

OK K (thought you were busy/had work to do - although you've previously said you were on the dole?)

In this day and age* can you ever** afford to give people the benefit of the doubt?***

Implies:

* things were better previously.
** "you" (i.e. everyone)...
***can't trust anyone.

I don't mean to teach you to suck eggs but you appeared to need it spelt out - and you seem to post immense amounts of BS like the RM holding the country to ransom etc all in a similar vein.

[i]I can't control what someone puts in a listing or make them tell the truth[/i]

were there pictures?

have you used a method of payment that you can do a chargeback on?

why are you being so aggressive towards people?

why are you being so aggressive towards people?

Because he is obviously men...[b][Stop That! - MODS][/b]

cynic-al - Member

OK K (thought you were busy/had work to do - although you've previously said you were on the dole?)

In this day and age* can you ever** afford to give people the benefit of the doubt?***

Implies:

* things were better previously.
** "you" (i.e. everyone)...
***can't trust anyone.

I don't mean to teach you to suck eggs but you appeared to need it spelt out - and you seem to post immense amounts of BS like the RM holding the country to ransom etc all in a similar vein.

😯

wwaswas - Member

I can't control what someone puts in a listing or make them tell the truth

were there pictures?

have you used a method of payment that you can do a chargeback on?

why are you being so aggressive towards people?

😯

Jamie - Member

why are you being so aggressive towards people?

Because he is obviously men...[Stop That! - MODS]

😯

I know I shouldn't contribute to the derailing of my own threads, but lets face it, STW has it's collective head so far up it's own arse that very few threads accomplish anything or even survive anyway!

All too often we are distracted by the fools that add in jibberish and turn what could be a good oppertunity to learn into an ego driven farce!

The innitial question for those that are interested in being fair when they recieve something that isn't as described is.

In this day and age can we ever afford to give people the benefit of the doubt ❓

[i]In this day and age can we ever afford to give people the benefit of the doubt[/i]

I think you've answered your own question...

[i]I can't control what someone puts in a listing or make them tell the truth, unlike you my psychic powers are a bit wornky[/i]

kaesae - Member
All too often we are distracted by the fools that add in jibberish

[img] [/img]

What was the question again?

In this day and age can you ever afford to give people the benefit of the doubt?

and there are some truly classic guitars on ebay for good price

BBSB he says of himself;

[i]
as a proffesional trader who earns a living from trading, I think I know a bit about risk management and the operating procedures that ensure risk are minimalised.[/i]

so one assumes he was looking to buy a load of toot rather than being duped into it.