[Closed] Help! Claiming ESA or SSP as Ltd Self Employed

Dunno, but I do remember there being a big push from jobcentres to get people to go self-employed

I wonder if the 2 are linked ?

you are still the owner and you still run the business so you are still technically working.
I dont see how you can both own the company and be an employee of the company and they probably stop this as I suspect some folk have done this then paid themselves a lot of money on one week then signed on for the rest of the year hence they are risk averse

You can call them again but i think what they said was true- few years since i gave advice on this so not p to speed. Add many caveats here

Thanks Junkyard - I am an employee also as the company pays me a wage other than dividend profit. Indeed I have a PAYE no. and am registered as an employee with HMRC.

Its a hugely grey and complex area though hence why I was double checking as the trouble is its not the kind of business where there is money trickling in through sales for example - if I ain't driving I ain't earning.

As it happens I can just about cover the time off anyway and I have a new job back in insurance starting January so at least the house isn't going to get repossessed etc!

You can - you need to go on to the HMRC's website, fill in and print off the SSP1.
Then fill in the SC2 form as well.
Thats direct from the JC here.
Then call 0800 055 6688 to arrange an appointment

Thanks Hammy - I can't see a suitable reason for not getting SSP on form SSP1 though?

What do I put as the reason from options A-K?

Similar to JY, add many caveats to this, but SSP is paid by employers, so your initial assertion about not being able to claim it is correct - you'll be paying yourself! (You can't claim it back from Gov't anymore).

Just make a claim with JCP for ESA; you're entitled to make a claim. See what the outcome is and take it from there. Your circumstances will probably dictate it ends up with what's called a Specialist Decision Maker, who tend to be pretty good at what they do. (if they still exist!)

Thanks BN - the initial decision maker has booted the ESA claim out. I may go for a statutory review in that case as I'm not convinced that they fully understood my position.

As for SSP - yes not only would I be paying myself but I have nothing to pay myself SSP with!

Yeah, do that if you're not confident in a correct decision.

It's an incredibly complicated area, naturally. 🙂

Should you get bored, look at your circumstances in reference to these pages - you may be able to answer your own questions.

Main ESA guide

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/decision-makers-guide-vols-8-and-9-employment-and-support-allowance-staff-guide

If you're classed as employed.

If you're classed as s/e.

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/474058/dmgch50.pdf

It's a bit dry.

Limited company you reclaim the SSP back against your payroll through PAYE. Most likely your minimal salary would have been posted to your directors loan and offset against your drawings. If you've got no income coming in then you're a bit stuck as the PAYE doesn't do refund during the tax year and any tax over paid you will need to wait until after 5th April.

Self employed/sole trader/partnership then you claim through the benefits office.

Thanks all for the advice.

BN, gives me some Christmas reading! I think either the assessor in my case took about 3 seconds over their decision which means either a) they really know their stuff or b) theyve seen 'director' and hard somewhere this means no claim which may or may not be correct...

Sorry to thread jack but..
I have a serious injury and wont be able to work for some time. I am a full time student was working part time self employed but cannot work atm, I assumed I wouldn't be able to claim anything, can anyone confirm or give any advice.

You'll need to put a claim in chap; nobody can advise without knowing all your circumstances, but nothing you've said above would necessarily exclude you (but students are another complex area).

Just make a claim now and hope your recovery is speedy.

Thanks

..and if it's a serious injury, look into PIP also. Have a word with your CAB if you can.

[i]I have a serious injury and wont be able to work for some time. I am a full time student was working part time self employed but cannot work atm, I assumed I wouldn't be able to claim anything, can anyone confirm or give any advice. [/i]

Normally I say sign-on telling them you've been looking for work, but as a full-time student you can't. As need to be available for work.

But the OP could.

what he said you area student so cannot claim anyway - does the comany pay you SSP? Either way you cannot claim ESA

the initial decision maker has booted the ESA claim out

IIRC its always in the high 70 % of decisions that are overturned

Dont complain to then complain formally as you can easily prove you are unfit for the work the only relevant point is whether you are eligible or not- on that point I have no idea

what he said you area student so cannot claim anyway

You don't know what level of study he's doing, you don't know what his contributions are or whether the injury is serious enough to warrant PIP (possible gateway to ESA(IR) IIRC )

This really isn't my area, but don't tell people they're ineligible to claim for help without knowing their circumstances, pretty please.

Its so unlikely an independent student with an injury that will recover is eligible for PIP* that I did not think it worth considering. Personally I think you are clutching at straw with that one but there may be some relevance - albeit highly highly unlikely. The level of study and contributions are not factors as its not a means tested nor a contributory payment- well DLA was not so I assume this is still the case.Checked its still the case

* its for long term ill health

Here are the criteria

You must have a long-term health condition or disability and face difficulties with ‘daily living’ or getting around.

You must have had these difficulties for 3 months and expect them to last for at least 9 months, unless you’re terminally ill (you don’t expect to live more than 6 months).

Daily living difficulties

You may get the daily living component of PIP if you need help with things like:

preparing or eating food
washing, bathing and using the toilet
dressing and undressing
reading and communicating
managing your medicines or treatments
making decisions about money
engaging with other people
Mobility difficulties

You may get the mobility component of PIP if you need help going out or moving around.

At least three of those have been exceeded/failed by simply asking on here.

Not looking for an argument and its true I am no expert and all your details matter so CAB /Welfare advice is always the best port of call. Its very unlikely to be applicable here

[i]You don't know what level of study he's doing,[/i]

Full-time, or so they said.

Bloody hell - I don't really want to get dragged into this!

I did not think it worth considering.

That's not up to you though is it, if you're putting 'advice' out there for someone that may well be taking is as gospel.

Personally I think you are clutching at straw with that one

For what reason?! I'm not a bloody advisor! I am just trying to ensure that people that are asking for advice in a complex area, do not take notice of inaccurate statements said as if they are fact.

you area student so cannot claim anyway

^ That's all I'm trying to correct.

That's when contributions and level of study come into it - I mentioned PIP as it's simply another condition of entitlement for ESA.

Now goddam it, Merry Christmas & just say 'I was wrong', go on...... 😀

EDIT: B R, it's not just whether it's full-time or part time.

Dannybgoode, you are not self employed, suggesting you are is what confuses HMRC etc. You presumably pay class 1 national insurance like any other employee and therefore are entitled to SSP. The bad news is that it is paid from your company, and I don't think Hmrc refund it anymore. if the company can't afford to pay I can see no option other than to make you redundant, which presumably would open up ESA as a possibility.

Thanks poly - To be honest I don't think I'll bother if that's the case.

I have a new job starting January and have just about enough money to cover things until my first pay day from that.

The ESA, SSP or whatever would have meant I had all the money I need but I'm only a couple of hundred off and can scrabble that together.

FFS, can people stop posting well-meaning, but ill-informed comments, please.

I am not saying anyone is entitled, or not entitled, but benefit legislation is complicated, as are an individual's circumstances, so for anyone needing help - do your own research, speak to CAB, make your claims to DWP, but don't take notice of 'decisions' given on here or any part of the internet.

A director of a limited company is an office holder and will usually be an employee
of the company. The current or future receipts of the business are not payment to
the director1
. A director can own or be a shareholder in the company and receive
payment or have a realistic expectation of payment in that capacity. It is possible for
an office-holding director to also have a contract for service with the company and
thus be a S/E earner. In such cases DMG 41330 applies.

'I was wrong', go on.

am not saying anyone is entitled, or not entitled, but benefit legislation is complicated, as are an individual's circumstances, so for anyone needing help - do your own research, speak to CAB, make your claims to DWP, but don't take notice of 'decisions' given on here or any part of the internet.