[Closed] Going on holiday, schools says no to 12yr old.....

un-orthorised

I suggest he stays in school 🙂

I hope you are not going to pander to them, YOUR family, you decide what is best...

homeskoolin's da foture innit!

what happens if you say s*d it and go? do you get fined?

just means the school wont get shit for poor attendance, dont worry about it. Speak to individual teachers if your worried about him missing stuff

I'd rather go to school than spend a 3rd week in Florida.

That's normal policy in most state schools and goes by the government guidlines.

Basically they unauthorise it, you still take him/her out of school for the week and it goes down as unauthorised. This means little unless your child has a history of being off a lot then you might get a visit from the EWO. Otherwise it'll never be a problem.

Nothing to do with 'we know best'. Although there is reasonable evidence and it's reasonably obvious that prolonged periods of absence lead to poor exam performance. Also, as the school has to record it as unauthorsied then their % attendance goes down. This does not look good and is another government target that needs to be hit.

Take him to Florida, enjoy it, just don;t go to chuffin' Disney if you want it to be educational ;0)

Florida, is not my choice TBH. The lads doing well at school so theres no problems there. Its all target driven stuff thats lost touch with reality. A couple of teacher friends think its a load of bull too, all its doing is alienating parents.

It's just arse covering, they don't really mind.

When my daughter is old enough to go to school, I fully intend to take holidays in term time, no way am I going to pay twice as much for holidays.

I will be up to us to make sur that her scholing doesn't suffer. If the government want to contribute to the price of holidays, fair enough...

Loddrik, we've always taken holidays with our other children as close to the school holidays as possible. You are spot on about the cost. As soon as you hit the schools holiday period the price goes through the roof. In infant and primary school the teachers were not bothered about missing school TBH i think they really did understand how important it is for kids to get away with their parents. So why should it change when they get older?

[list]Mate it's your family, you're the father/parents: you decide what's right for your kids (as long as you are a right thinking individual).

Don't this pathetic New Labour Nanny State tell you how to run your family.

BTW I've just spent 3 years divorcing my wife, and I've got the house and kids - for their benefit.

just take him out - i'm going to do that next year!

It won't even show up in the school stats anyway. It's a little advertised fact that school attendance figures collected for the census and publication only actually count the autumn and spring terms.

With more than a half term left before you go you could ask for the schemes of work for the missing week when they'll be starting fresh topics and get him to read ahead.

I'm chair of governors at our local primary and we've been under intense pressure from LA to set a policy of not authorising any holiday in term time. Since we think it wouldn't actually change any family's behaviour and would just put barriers between school and parent we keep telling them to butt out. Our attendance figures, like all schools are not dominated by the odd week here and there, but by a handful of families who lead chaotic lives and subsequently have very significant lateness and attendance problems, not to mention neglect, physical and sexual abuse. Government are attempting to mask the failure to successfully address these family issues by using the blunt instrument of denying holiday authorisation for all in order to hold the figures up.

If you are a decent parent doing what you think is best for your child, enjoy the holiday, and don't avoid Disney, just seeing the intense workrate and attention to detail those guys put in to the place day after day was an education to me, and the big wavepool at Typhoon lagoon is an absolute must anyway.

i wouldn't take my kids out of school, just for a week on some tacky package holiday. i know it costs more so we work a little harder or cut back on non essentials so we have enough money to take our kids to see the world, and not compromise their education.

Very few things compromise the education of a child more than making the parents pissed off and disengaged with the school, it has to be a working partnership if you want the best possible education.

Wow, you are amazing, your kids are so lucky to have a parent like to, you put the rest of us to shame 🙄

Hell, I reckon they could spell sanctimonious before they could walk...

Wow, you are amazing, your kids are so lucky to have a parent like to, you put the rest of us to shame

true

Hell, I reckon they could spell sanctimonious before they could walk...

false

wow 3 weeks in Florida - you must really love them

IIRC schools are now obliged to tell their LA, it is no longer at the schools discretion.

That's what we have been informed of in writing at our sons school.

so the school has times when your child is expected to attend and times when they are not. How about working within these dates - yes it does cost more but that is because they are peak times.
See how you get on with work if you just say sorry I know I cant take this week off but I'm just going to anyway. Maybe the teachers could take holiday when they wanted too.

There's rules around this here too (Aus).
With two kids I'll be taking them out during school term time or not as I see fit. I certainly won't be listening to some trumped up policy that makes a govener happy.
That aside, they'll not be off to see Mickey Rat either, but each to thier own and I suppose if it's been 'earned' through exceptional kiddie duties etc etc.

just don't get arsey with taeching staff when son/daughter has missed work and then you expect the teaching staff to sort it out - I know you won't but we have that all the time. One of my Year 11s was off on hols during key coursework time and we were expected to pick up the pieces.

sympathy on both sides here - as long as it's not regular and too long I can sympathise. On the other hand; bleating about the extra costs of holidays out of term time is pretty futile. Kids are expensive and you knew before hand this would happen. Accept it, move on.

Now an honest question - why can't different areas of the country take holidays at different times. Maybe a 4 term system? And start to break down this overdemand / price hike scenario?

it's a week out of school! hardly going to make a huge impact now is it and anyway, if a kids off sick for a week they have to catch up so what's the difference?

It's only one week, not likely to cause issues. But the reason these guidelines etc were brought in is because parents were doing it sometimes twice a year, mid term, no-where near the school hols (because it was cheaper) and it was damaging kids education, and the schools were having to deal with the bad side of that later. At 12 a week off is a lot of time missed in a term, but then if kid is half decent he'll catch up. The problem is they're taught so damn little already that its a large percentage 🙂

Bit of a difficult one this. Completing an education that will be needed to survive in the modern world, or a week eating junk food in Disneyland aka Capital of the Obese.

Hard call that.

😀 got to admit, Jengas point is a good one 🙂

[i]I'd rather go to school than spend a 3rd week in Florida.[/i]

I'd rather not spend even a week in Florida.

It doesn't seem to affect things too much when a couple of flakes of snow fall & they close the school

I used to have a job that didn't allow any holiday during schools holidays so we used to take ours for a week on the last week of the summer term - they always refused [as above] so in the end I just stopped telling them as it was obviously not a real consideration of our request.

I had a moan about the cost of holidaying withing school holidays, and that IMO the travel companies were being very cinical. For that I was shot down in flames with the supply and demand arguement thrown at me.
Thing is you guys throw around the word cheap, but we are possibly talking thousands.
You draw a paralel with estate agents and the arguement soon changes.

aleigh - Member
just take him out - i'm going to do that next year!

Best check with twosheds first eh Aleigh?

It's your decision at the end of the day, but I have no sympathy for people whining about this.

When we had kids, we knew that we would only be going on holiday in the school holidays, when it was busy and expensive. It was kind of one of those things we knew would happen when we decided to have kids. Quite looking forward to a cottage in Northumberland at Easter.

While there is an argument that [u]some[/u] foreign travel can be more educational than a week at school (and I have my doubts that a week in Florida falls into that category) I would suggest that showing the importance of school and education by not taking them out for a week in the sun may be a more important lesson for them.

IMHO

Can't stand sanctimonious wnakers (deliberate mis-spelling) like Mr_Krabbs.

Exactly the kind of person who supports our totalitarian state and ruins the place for the rest of us.

Tw*t

Take 'em on holiday and have done with - they'll probably learn more on holiday anyway given the state of education in this country...

Do it and enjoy the time, Florida is a great place for 12 year olds.
A weeks schooling can easily be recouped if you are a half caring parent (I assume that if you were a beligerent parent you would not have started this thread). If going to Florida, Universal studios is better than Disney. And Animal Kingdom is the best of the disney parks. Busch Gardens is also great and has the best rollercoasters in the whole of Florida.
Also make a diversion to the "Cheescake factory" the food is amazing.
We were there two years ago and had a fab time.

I feel for anyone with children facing upto the dilemma of being shafted for the high cost of holidays in half term etc. TBH though 3weeks is a long holiday. If it was in somewhere like Peru, Bhutan, Beijing etc the school might be more inclined to say 'ok' as its an educational experience in part.

If we looked at it from a schools perspective- how many teachers etc have to combat this sort of thing all the time from different parents?

There is a difference between supporting a policy designed to support the education of children, and supporting all the other nanny state guff that this stupid government has brought in.

But as I said before, if you don't like having to pay extra for holidays in the school holiday periods then you should have thought about it before you had them. Don't expect sympathy.

Anyway, this sanctomonious wnaker had better get on with some work.

As a teacher here is my 2 penny worth

1. Taking kids off school give out the wrong signals about the importance of education.
2. Dont come to me (or whoever) and complain when you kids is messing around in lessons and not achieving because he's no longer bothered ( and thinks his parents have the same attitude)
3. Dont come to me (or whoever) and complain when your kid underperforms in his GCSE's.
4. What is the educational value of seeing Micky Mouse?
I personally think it is very selfish of parents to take kids outof school so THEY can save money on holidays.

I had a moan about the cost of holidaying withing school holidays, and that IMO the travel companies were being very cinical. For that I was shot down in flames with the supply and demand arguement thrown at me.

I will say I don't take my kids out in term time. But I still get annoyed at the cost what ever you say. i.e term time break £530 next day in half term £2630 IMO that's c**t culture. What sort of place would it be if all businesses adopted that attitude.
Hey there you go bike shop owners, quadruple the price at weekends supply and demand and all that.

JulianA I don't think it's totalitarian to ensure your children are at school during term time. If you want to go on holiday, do it in the holidays. Christ knows they have plenty of time off already.

What if they have a week off on holiday, are off sick for 2 weeks of the year, there are days like today when they cannot attend, because buses and trains aren't running? All these days add up.

My view is we go where we can afford to in the school holidays. If I can't afford a trip to Florida, we'll go somewhere in Europe. If we can't afford that we'll go somewhere over here.

twosheds why do you feel that it's okay for your child to miss a week of school. I know a lot of teachers and to them there is nothing more irritating than parents who think the rules don't apply to them. It's not just about what your child misses, it's about the fact that they have missed lessons so have dropped behind, the teacher than has to give them special attention to make sure they catch up.

Is behaving the way you want, and **** everyone else, the best way to bring up a child? Pretty selfish way to behave if you ask me.

[i]we've always taken holidays with our other children as close to the school holidays as possible.[/i] You are having a laugh aren't you? Note the phrase 'school holiday'.

We did something similar at Easter when ours were little. Youngest had just started nursery, middle lad just started school and our eldest was in top infants. We had to apply to have the two weeks off either side of the Easter holidays - we planned to drive across USA coast to coast (Baltimore to LA) and the headmaster gave us his blessing on the condition that our eldest would compile a diary of the holiday. We still have the book which Lucas made (it was on display in the school for some time) - a fantastic reminder of the holiday of a lifetime (we had told the boys we were going to Disneyland and had four weeks of 'Are we there yet?') 😉

Have a fantastic time!

When I was a kid my folks took my sister and me out of school, generally for a week but on occasions two, for holidays. Mainly due to my Dad's work but also because it was better value. Whilst we were away the two of us had to do daily scrap books, exercise books basically, which we had to fill with pictures and comments about our days. Good fun but also educational. We actually spent a couple of holidays in FL and, barring the themeparks (which I loved at the time), had some fantastic learning opportunities:

Everglades - loads of amazing boardwalks, alligators, birds etc - biological wonderland

Keys Bridge - amazing civil engineering

Keys themselves - more eco stuff and geography

Miami - historic buildings etc

Great place Florida, shame it's being ruined! Pick up a couple of Carl Hiassen books to read by the pool - he's done a kids [url= http://www.carlhiaasen.com/books/books-scat.html ]book[/url] too:

Mrs. Starch – fearsome biology teacher – never returned from a field trip to Black Vine Swamp.

The principal says she was called away on a "family emergency," but Nick and Marta don't buy it. They think Smoke, the class delinquent, has something to do with her disappearance.

And he does! But not in the way that they think. There's a lot more going on in Black Vine Swamp than any one player in this twisted tale can see. And Nick and Marta will have to reckon with an eccentric eco-avenger, a stuffed rat named Chelsea, a wannabe Texas oilman, a singing substitute teacher, and a ticked-off Florida panther before they'll really begin to see the big picture.

That's life in the swamp, kids.

Only problem with the policy is that it breaks when the parent has rostered holidays. (I was that parent, one year in 5 my holidays coincided with the school breaks). I pointed out that like a teacher I could only take holiday when I was allowed. Collapse of argument, always ensured that we had school work to catch up and never in the run-up to SATS.

Just take the holiday. Since school league tables etc they have to cover their backs. An un-authorised absence doesn't affect the school's figures so negatively so they have to advise against holidays in term time.

Stitting in a room being told what to learn? Or travelling?

Tricky...

[i]Stitting in a room being told what to learn? Or travelling[/i] lol, they're going on a tacky holiday to florida ffs, they're not going on a track through some amazing country, meeting amazing people and seeing amazing things.

Wow strong opinions or what?

Taking a 12 y.o out of school once probably not a problem repeating it yea a problem. Make sure that there are no tests etc that you'd expect them to do and that they catch up on the work without addinng load to the teacher's (3 pupils can add a massive load if work is to be caught up).

Obviously in exam years taking kids out of class is irresponsible.

Authorized v's unauthorized just means that the school is not condoning the absence but makes no real difference. To slate all teachers for what is standard operating procedures is infantile.

sorry Gary_M but Florida is an amazing part of a fantastic country with some interesting people, you just need to know where to look.

What sort of place would it be if all businesses adopted that attitude.

They do. It's called supply and demand. All businesses operate that way.

Imagin eth ereponse if your kids teacher decided to go on hols during term time. After all it's cheaper.

If a child stays in education until they're 18 that's probably about 2600 (200 days a year * 13 years at school) days at school. Is 5 days such a big deal?

I took my 10 year old out of school for the last two weeks of term before Christmas. The school refused to allow the time off as authorised and told me if my son missed more than eight consecutive days then our details would be passed to the Local Authority who then had the power to issue me an on the spot fine of £50. As I still haven't heard anything from the LA, I'm guessing they're not going to persue it.

If my son had attended school for those two weeks, he would have spent most of the time learning Christmas carrols for a concert he never attends, and also playing games rather than any "proper" lessons. The experience he had on holiday (scuba diving, submarine trip, helicopter flights, learning to sail etc) compared to those two weeks in school were imho, far more benficial to his development.

"Is 5 days such a big deal?"

Yes, because it starts to set a bad precedent both for parents and kids

what is the 3rd week going to do that the first 2 didn't.

Anyway how would the discussion go if the kid was bunking off for a week?

1 week in florida or 1 week hanging round McD's in town?

All kids should attend school every day, including weekends, then when they finish school there should be a direct tunnel they walk down and exit straight into a factory.

Until this happens the farming process is flawed.

Go on the holiday, have a great time, beats parents who have never taken their kid out of their home town. What are they going to miss anyway in the first week of term? Other kids talkin about how many eggs they got? Go give them a first hand experience of other culture, show him the things he would see in the geography video he is missing and stand in the places where the historical events happened.

[i]If my son had attended school for those two weeks, he would have spent most of the time learning Christmas carrols for a concert he never attends, and also playing games rather than any "proper" lessons. The experience he had on holiday (scuba diving, submarine trip, helicopter flights, learning to sail etc) compared to those two weeks in school were imho, far more benficial to his development.[/i]

Then perhaps you should look at sending your child to a better school. My 11 year old son does school work up until the morning of the day they finish for holidays. Mind you if you're happy to take your kid out of school for 2 weeks during term time then you're probably not that bothered about the standard of education your child is receiving.

It amazes me how so many of you are so lackadaisical when it comes to your kids education. It’s not just about missing a few days of school; it’s that fact that you are letting your child know that education isn’t of any great importance to you.
Don’t you want them to be successful, educated people? I’m also amazed that any of you are surprised by the fact that the school refuses to sanction unofficial holidays – why on earth would they do that?

And yes of course travelling is a great cultural education to children, but they get plenty official holidays don’t they.

And why can't that be accomplished in 2 weeks mike_check?

christ allmighty schools really cannot do right by people no matter what they do. If you want to take your kid out of school fair enough, but dont expect the school to think its a good idea... stop ****in winging and live your life and let others do their job

not to say again it's florida ffs

Im not saying it couldn't be, however a three week trip to florida is a once in a lifetime thing for a young kid. This will be something they will look back on with great memories for most of their life afterwards. Maybe something that will inspire them to succeed in life so they can offer this to their kids later in life. Maybe walking around Disneyland as an amazed 12 year old will inspire this kids towards taking an interest in animation for example, maybe this trip will shape their futures more than another week at school could ever do. Of course education is important, but so is having a purpose for that learning, and that is likely to come from outside of the school.

Gary_M

You rumbled me, I couldn't care less about my sons education!! The shool he attends is the best performing school in the area and he is so far ahead of his peers that he has almost completed Year 6 curriculum half way through this year even though he is a Year 5 pupil. If you think him missing two weeks of school at age 10 is going to have a negative impact on his development and result in him being less successful or less educated, then I think you're even more deluded than you posting suggest.

I'm constantly amazed at how black and white people think the world is 🙂

mike_check why is a 3 wek trip to Florida any better for a child than a 2 week trip?

salad_dodger your sons school sounds fantastic, they don't do any work for 2 weeks prior to a holiday. wow, that really does sound amazing. If thats the best school in the area you should move.

Although I do of course realsie that I'm in a deluded state and all the best schools now do this.

I went to one of the top 20 schools in the country (then and now) and we didn't do much in the last week...

Kids also went off on holidays during term time sometimes (not the norm but it did happen). I don't recall any correlation between the kids that did that and their exam results or more importantly their lives now 🙂

Well, a 2 week trip gives them 2 weeks expeience and opportunity, a 3 week trip gives them...

You seem to have made your mind up, and you seem to know (read; you assume) that the topic starter is just going to point his kid towards Mickey Mouse then feed him MacDonalds 3 times a day, if you had any idea how vast the world is you would know that while you could do a 2 week trip to Florida, if you were looking for things to experience you could also do a 3 month trip.

I'm constantly suprised (and despair at the fact) that so many people genuinely believe some blanket policy, thought up by sheltered idiots completely detatched from how things really work for the majority of the population, is deffinitely for the best in their individual childs life.

I actually couldn't care less, I don't know any teachers, have no thoughts on whether it's a good or bad thing to take your kids out of school but I knew it would wind a few of you up. Sorry I was a bit bored.

[i]Yes, because it starts to set a bad precedent both for parents and kids [/i]

Depends on the type of parents and their own values. If you have a parent that doesn't care about their child’s schooling and persistently takes them out of school for holidays then that's a problem. If you have someone that wants to take the child out of school prior to a school holiday to save costs etc then I don't see the harm in that.

If the tour operators were willing not to cash in on school holidays then I suspect none of us would be having this discussion!

"If you have someone that wants to take the child out of school prior to a school holiday to save costs etc then I don't see the harm in that"

The trouble is that if it happens once it is likely to happen again. I get sick of talking to supposedly supportive parents who "have the best possible intentions for their kids" but as soon as the see the pound signs pull them out of lessons for an "educational trip", sometimes weeks before their exams.

Five days out of twelve years, you'd better book his cardboard box under the arches now.

Can someone on here define "education"?

And really an unauthorised weeks holiday in term time is'nt really that different to the jolly sorry school ski trip my 12 year old will be going on in April.

Molgrips come on, it would'nt be that bad if it was expensive all year round but to go up and down so much around school terms is really a major p***er. especialy when you can see it laid down for the year in black and white.

[i]The trouble is that if it happens once it is likely to happen again[/i]

at the end of the day it really doesn't matter what you and i think! if someone wants to take their kid out for a week for one reason or another and it doesn't have a long term effect on their kids education i really dont see what the issue is.

midlifecrashes - Member

It won't even show up in the school stats anyway. It's a little advertised fact that school attendance figures collected for the census and publication only actually count the autumn and spring terms.

What absolute rubbish, as an Assistant head of year i KNOW for a fact that ALL attendance counts

Just say he's ill.

As a parent who has a child who has acheived a massive amount I see teachers here saying don,t blame me for your childs education if you keep them off school,I am having to pay for private tutors so that my child can get the quality of teaching she needs,yes spending the money is worth it I believe in investing in her future but if she is not recieving this at school,who would you say is to blame,and should us taxpayers be paying the teachers if they are not producing the goods,seems they are not long in blaming us if we keep the kids of a whole week

Molgrips come on, it would'nt be that bad if it was expensive all year round but to go up and down so much around school terms is really a major p***er. especialy when you can see it laid down for the year in black and white.

You seem to have a total misunderstanding of the way the holiday market works. If they charged out-of-school-holiday prices all year they'd go bust as those prices don't give them much profit to cover their overheads. If they charged in-school-holiday prices all year round (whilst it seems it would make you happy if everybody had to pay lots) they'd go bust as they wouldn't get low season bookings and they have to pay for the accommodation for a full season.

Asked for permission to take our 13 year old out of school on the last day of term and it was refused. Put back the trip away for a day and meanwhile the kids actually did nothing on the day.I think this had been our only request in maybe 2 years.
A few months later I was going to race at Spa in Belgium and he wanted to come. So a drive through France and Belgium then 2 days in the paddock at the most famous race circuit in the world I figure was an experience he shouldn't miss. Know it's going to be refused so he is called in sick.
So I set a bad example yet there was no way that the trip and it's merits could have been debated.
Rules-yes and some rational limits on time off but carte blanche refusal is not intelligent policy

MikeWW - Member

Know it's going to be refused so he is called in sick.
So I set a bad example yet there was no way that the trip and it's merits could have been debated.
Rules-yes and some rational limits on time off but carte blanche refusal is not intelligent policy

Good lesson right there. It's OK to lie.