Surely that's the point. Oversteer is instinctively easier to correct (up to a point obviously). If your car understeers you're just along for the ride...
i find not driving at the limit of my car means i tend to get my self into these situations not very often.
beanum - Member
Surely that's the point. Oversteer is instinctively easier to correct (up to a point obviously). If your car understeers you're just along for the ride...
Eh?
Car understeers, lift off throttle a bit, car regains grip, carry on as you were.....obviously if you are really ham-fisted you might provoke lift off oversteer, but unlikely unless you are driving a 205GTi.
In my experience, oversteer is much harder to correct and regain control of than understeer.
The point is that this particular car is designed to understeer....it's set up to understeer. You then make it oversteery and things get unpredictable.
Anyhoo. it makes sense to me, so that's what I have done. New tyres on the rear for my FWD car.
beanum - MemberSurely that's the point. Oversteer is instinctively easier to correct (up to a point obviously). If your car understeers you're just along for the ride...
I think the point is that under the weight transfer of emergency braking/swerving, you don't really want the back end overtaking the front!
Understeer is instinctive to cancel anyway, just lift off the accel or brake and it usually sorts itself out with no drama.
Oversteer is not difficult to initially catch, but avoiding a tankslapper oscillation by winding off the countersteer at the right time is quite a skill! Unless you're glupton of course.
29 secs on...
I think they are both as predictable as each other. The most unpredictable thing is the actual roads. Could be diesel or oil on the road. Either way people should know what to do when the car skids.
Understeer - Dip Clutch, eventually will turn
Oversteer - Dip Clutch, will stop oversteer
I personally prefer oversteer, as tightening a turn can be untightened. Understeer cannot be countered, unless you slow down or lift off oversteer.
Whichever one, you need to know how the car will react before you know what to do. This is why I think skid pan should be mandatory.
Interesting points. I just wouldn't like the front to be jumping through the turn or skidding from not having enough grip. If it's that slippy though I guess the tyres should have been changed.
What way round would you have it on your bike Stumpy?
I have grippy on the front for the mtb, opposite way round for my FWD van. I'm not really sure you can compare the two...
Edit: Check this out [url= http://www.theaa.com/motoring_advice/safety/car-tyres.html ]http://www.theaa.com/motoring_advice/safety/car-tyres.html[/url]
Anyway..... Now that can of worms has been opened....what's the story from the OP?
Milkie - MemberUndersteer - Dip Clutch, eventually will turn
Oversteer - Dip Clutch, will stop oversteer
This is a massive oversimplication and quite simply wrong in many circumstances.
If you are going to generalise, it would be better to say "reverse the input that caused it".
the advice from the AA is ok, but i feel you are more likely to rapidly slow down / stop - alter direction than need to correct oversteer in the wet.
I'll happily keep the new rubber on the front.
Bottom line- most cars are front wheel drive, that means go-stop and steer through the same two patchs of rubber. Its not asking for much.
If you want to practice catching oversteer try a quad bike on snow/ice. With the short wheel base when they go they go quickly. Loads of fun though 😀
obviously if you are really ham-fisted you might provoke lift off oversteer, but unlikely unless you are driving a 205GTi
The 306 was quite good for this too.
stumpy01 - MemberFor FWD cars, I thought the latest advice is to put new tyres on the rear for almost exactly the reason you mention....
You expect a front wheel drive car to understeer and that's what it should do. Stick grippy new tyres on the front and you might find that the rear has less grip than the front so you turn into a corner and all of a sudden your understeery car is oversteering...
Lots of people swear by that, I don't buy it at all... The 2 ends aren't doing the same job, the front does the lion's share of the changing of direction (and braking, and drive in fwd cars), the rear is more or less along for the ride. It's certainly true that if the rear end brakes loose on a fwd things are a bit clenchier than if you slide the front by the same amount, but it's also true that it's less likely to happen than the front, all other things being equal.
Speshpaul - Member
the advice from the AA is ok, but i feel you are more likely to rapidly slow down / stop - alter direction than need to correct oversteer in the wet.
I'll happily keep the new rubber on the front.
Bottom line- most cars are front wheel drive, that means go-stop and steer through the same two patchs of rubber. Its not asking for much.
Oh, maybe you should let all the tyre manufacturers know they're wrong then? 😀
http://www.michelin.co.uk/tyres/learn-share/care-guide/ten-tyre-care-tips
http://www.klebertyres.co.uk/KleberUK/front/index.jsp?codeRubrique=8032005184616
http://www.goodyear.eu/uk_en/tire-advice/faq/tire-maintenance.jsp
http://www.bfgoodrichtires.com/help.page#rotate
http://www.firestonecompleteautocare.com/cf/tires/buying-new-tires-tire-mounting-tips
Oversteer is not difficult to initially catch, but avoiding a tankslapper oscillation by winding off the countersteer at the right time is quite a skill! Unless you're glupton of course.
Just make sure your front wheels are pointing the way you want to go and you'll be grand.
I've no idea how to describe what to do in a slide. It just happens whatever happens to correct. I still cant remember which is over and understeer!
I still cant remember which is over and understeer!
If you crash into the ditch front first its understeer
if you crash into the ditch rear first its oversteer
Penny Mallory was no slouch behind the wheel but even she cant help but be impressed, McRae's car control was just sublime.
why did you not check what dealer had fitted before leaving their premises ?
if you haven't already done so you need to return to said dealer to determine year of manufacture there will be a date code on the side wall of the Tyre which denotes week and year from what i can remember the NCT 5 hasn't been manufactured for some time now and they have only a shelf life of 4 years and usual after 10 years whether they have been in service or not the manufacturer recommends that they are scrapped ideally you need them to rectify this situation with a pair of identical tyres on either axle
with regard to all the threads relating to who recommends what the general opinion of the tyre manufacture is when fitting only a pair of new tyres across an axle it is usually to the rear and move the rears to the front this is mainly due to you more a custom to driving the car with worn tyres and is attributed to either a front or rear wheel drive car unless said rear wheel drive car has different size tyres front and rear
the above advice should/would be given to the customer at point of sale in a real world once given the customer can then decide on whether to take said advice or not
and for all u grammar freaks excuse the grammar and punctuation/spellings mistakes
The car was dropped off when I wasn't around to check.
Anyway, as I mentioned yesterday - they agreed it didn't sound right and fitted two matching tyres, so everything ended well as far as I'm concerned.
Retro
to quote the Mich link you posted
"Rear wheels are not connected to your steering wheel,"
what all of the links above discribe is one situation where you might lose the back end and where extra tread depth would help in standing water. and yes it would, in that one situation.
In all the other situations i'd rather have the most resistance to aqua planing on the wheels i steer and stop with.
also if you took their example to the extreme and had new tyres on the back and 2mm of tread on the front, the front would probably wash out before the back anyway.
Plus many test show (nice quote from Kieber IIRC) that on a FWD car if you put the new tyres on the back and the most worn ones on the front, that you'll be back buying a pair of tyres for the front again in a few weeks.
First time I've put new on the front and left the old on the rear.
In the wet the fronts out gripped my older rears. But it was easy to control and braked better.
mrmonkfinger - Member
efficientgrip is the performance version
what does it do the non-performance version doesn't?
POSTED 5 DAYS AGO # REPORT-POST
It's better in the wet and braking. Won numerous tests. I've used both and the difference in the wet is huge. But drive safely anyway and both are fine.
tbh driving around the uk any major understeer incidents are likely to see you on the other side of the road pretty swiftly or into a barrier.
