Sort out fag ends, chewing gum, litter, noise pollution, light pollution, dog crap and pavement parking before spitting.
Pillocks!
What he said!
Yes how dare goons stop antisocial behaviour.
Or maybe it's just trying to stop the pavements becoming covered in a thick green layer of bogeys that old people will then skid down, out of control on and end up putting the hip replacement surgeons under even more pressure.IIRC (probably not though) is the fining for spitting in the street come from trying to prevent the spread of TB back in the day ?
Don't get the spitting in the street. Basically he couldn't be arsed to put it in a tissue and throw it in the bin, or even spit it in the bin. Common decency, like common sense, doesn't seem that common any more.
Hired Goons?
Sort out fag ends, chewing gum, litter, noise pollution, light pollution, dog crap and pavement parking before spitting.
How do you know said goons aren't also prosecuting people for those things too?
Good. Filthy habit, especially in in town.
How do you know said goons aren't also prosecuting people for those things too?
Because I still see loads of fag ends, chewing gum, litter, hear radios etc, experience light pollution, see dog crap and witness pavement parking on a daily basis. Maybe they are prosecuting these too so either they're not working hard enough or are wasting money because the prosecutions aren't effective.
jambalaya - MemberI couldn't help myself and sneezed/coughed heavily
Do you think he has that problem when he's at home watching telly - he just gobs yellow phlegm on his carpet, because he just "can't help himself"?
Good. Filthy habit, especially in in town.
Pefectly acceptable in the country though! 😛
Because I still see loads of fag ends, chewing gum, litter
Maybe the goons have not yet been hired in your area?
Someone has taken a stand, in one area, and I'd bet they are prosecuting all these things. So you don't have much to complain about other than the fact they are NOT doing it in your area.
First they came for the fag butts, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a smoker.
Then they came for the chewing gum, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Sir Alex Ferguson.
Then they came for the litter, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a ****.
Then they came for the gob, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a PeterPoddy.
Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.
Maybe they are prosecuting these too so either they're not working hard enough or are wasting money because the prosecutions aren't effective.
Well in this case the fine seems to have been very effective - Mr Poddy has come here to warn potentially hundreds of people of the possible consequences of gobbing phlegm near a shop doorway.
PeterPoddy - Member£80 fine......
Be careful out there everyone.Posted 1 hour ago
olddog - Member
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/enforcement-officers-issuing-fixed-penalty-notices
That's an interesting read. Not least because nowhere does it mention spitting being an enforceable offence. Nor here,
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/fixed-penalty-notices-issuing-and-enforcement-by-councils
So much else questionable.
Presumably "the system" is the DVLA database and they've accessed it in a way not covered by those guidelines?
Assuming it's akin to littering then they've issued a maximum fine rather than the default.
They're supposed to give you an opportunity to pick up litter. Why didn't they ask him to wipe it up?
They're not supposed to issue FPNs for trivial offences.
They're not supposed to issue FPNs when there's no evidence in case of failure to pay.
They have to make enforcement details publicly available, including details of what's considered an offence. Have they? Who are they issuing fines on behalf of?
They're supposed to give you an opportunity to pick up litter. Why didn't they ask him to wipe it up?
Maybe they did? We need to get the hired goon's side of things.
And they pursued him into Sainsbury's without asking the landowner's permission...
Given they have absolutely no powers to detain you, I think I'd have wandered off before they had the chance to call the coppers. Then again, I wouldn't have gobbed one up on the pavement, but you do hear of cases where they've fined people when things have fallen out of their pockets.
That's an interesting read. Not least because nowhere does it mention spitting being an enforceable offence. Nor here,
I guess that Iist isn't exhaustive.
And they pursued him into Sainsbury's without asking the landowner's permission...
No they didn't.
Given they have absolutely no powers to detain you,
Yes they do.
martinhutch - Member
Given they have absolutely no powers to detain you,
And your actual local antisocial scrote knows this all too well - laughing at them and calling them 'Power Rangers', thus are usually left alone when there's easier pickings with students and old people.
Goons
They're supposed to give you an opportunity to pick up litter. Why didn't they ask him to wipe it up?
I think that opportunity to pick it up is just in case you dropped the litter by accident or didn't know it'd dropped out your pocket etc.
Flobbing on the floor is pretty much a deliberate act
nowhere does it mention spitting being an enforceable offence
It does, it mentions "littering". Waltham Forest Council established a landmark legal ruling 3 years ago that spit/phlegm is the same as litter.
iirc PeterPoddy works in a bike shop - I'm assuming that the 'perp' was working in that shop, so they followed [s]Peter[/s] him back to that shop, not into sainsburys
They have said "goons" in Glasgow, in fact they have done for years. Basically there to tackle antisocial behaviour whilst the police get on with catching "real criminals". It may not be on the statute books but it could well be a local bye-law.
As for spitting itself, its been illegal in Hong Kong for at least the 25odd years since I first went. When you see how the likes of SARS ran through the place and killed so many people you can see why those in charge took it so seriously. It's a public health issue, maybe if more people had consideration for what they are hacking up and how they deal with it there would be less rampant outbreaks. People in this country are by and large disgusting creatures, you only need to look at the amount of phlegm and chewing gum on our streets to prove that.
http://content.met.police.uk/Article/Accredited-persons-and-powers/1400016117624/1400016117624
We're not talking about PCSOs here. Local authority enforcement agents have power to detain whatsoever (above and beyond citizen's arrest level).
iirc PeterPoddy works in a bike shop - I'm assuming that the 'perp' was working in that shop, so they followed Peter him back to that shop, not into sainsburys
Aha - they should have brought some biscuits with them to help things along.
easier pickings with students and old people.
What oddly disparate examples.
Hired Goon 1: Who shall we harass today, Barry?
Hired Goon 2: Well, Garry, I think we should go for the low hanging fruit!
Hired Goon 1: Students and OAPs it is then!
[quote=tinybits ]iirc PeterPoddy works in a bike shop - I'm assuming that the 'perp' was working in that shop, so they followed Peter him back to that shop, not into sainsburys
Ta. That makes more sense.
I think that opportunity to pick it up is just in case you dropped the litter by accident or didn't know it'd dropped out your pocket etc.
No, that's covered specifically elsewhere.
It does, it mentions "littering". Waltham Forest Council established a landmark legal ruling 3 years ago that spit/phlegm is the same as litter.
Ah, I didn't know that. Ta.
Oh yeah marched into the bike shop.
Sounds like he'll get away with it if he appeals. Then he can buy some hankies.
Jamie - Member
What oddly disparate examples.
Not really. Could've said Deep-Sea Divers and District Nurses.
iirc PeterPoddy works in a bike shop - I'm assuming that the 'perp' was working in that shop, so they followed Peter him back to that shop, not into sainsburys
Did they issue the FPN or the police?
Did they seek the owner's permission before issuing an FPN on private land?
You don't need a landowner's permission to walk into a shop. I certainly never ask for permission, or even who the landowner is.
I wonder if farting loudly in a built up area between the hours of 7pm to 7am is ok or is it best to disguise with a simultaneous cough
I guess being fined for littering is more understandable as your potentially throwing something that isn't biodegradable.
Although, I've seen green lumps of spit on the ground and it is a bit gross to look at...I suppose you're being fined for unsociable behaviour.
You don't need a landowner's permission to walk into a shop. I certainly never ask for permission, or even who the landowner is.
Of course you don't but.
You must have permission from the landowner or occupier before you enter private land to issue FPNs.
I wonder if farting loudly in a built up area between the hours of 7pm to 7am is ok or is it best to disguise with a simultaneous cough
That's an interesting question...my wife and I went to a fancy BBQ smoked meat restaurant in that there London yesterday and I ate a lot of meat. This morning whilst on my commute I was happily parping away chuckling to myself that people behind might be walking into a cloud of guff.
If a police person was walking behind me and he could be sure I was the perp of the parp...could he fine me for unsociable behaviour?
In fact, am I just as disgusting as the people who spit on the floor because I farted in public. Although a fart is more temporary than spit.
Also, would the noise of the fart be more of an offence than the smell...
McHamish - Memberperp of the parp...
McHamish wins the internet today
Maybe the goons have not yet been hired in your area?Someone has taken a stand, in one area, and I'd bet they are prosecuting all these things. So you don't have much to complain about other than the fact they are NOT doing it in your area.
That area being the North West of England, North Midlands and the top half of Wales, parts of the West Midlands and a fair bit of Oxfordshire and Bucks. Fair to say that the behaviours I mentioned are fairly well spread throughout the country. You could, of course, pick on another point to dispute, like the demand of enforcement officers to give ID for such a trivial crime.
I think a good lawyer would get you off if the portable seisometer to record your magnitude had not been calibrated at the start of the shift.Out of curiosity what do you reckon your parps would reach on the Richter scale
You must have permission from the landowner or occupier before you enter private land to issue FPNs.
Fair point however I've had a check and whilst it would appear that this the case generally for private land not so in the case of shops which are open to the public :
[i]"Cllr David Smith, confirmed that 3GS officers are legally entitled to follow suspected offenders into shops."[/i]
[url= http://www.bournemouthecho.co.uk/news/14447678.Overzealous__Private_litter_wardens__following_people_into_shops___council_told/ ]Overzealous? Private litter wardens 'following people into shops', council told[/url]
So... do they or don't they have power to detain you?
If a police person was walking behind me and he could be sure I was the perp of the parp...could he fine me for unsociable behaviour?
Depends, if he challenged you on it, surely that would fall under the He Who Smelt it Dealt It Act of 1972?
On the question of detention, the answer is no, they cannot.
And Ernie, although local councillors and private security firms are generally acknowledged to be the ultimate arbiters of truth when it comes to the law, on this occasion the Home Office guidance makes it very clear you can't enter private land without permission to issue an FPN, including land which is open to the public.
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/enforcement-officers-issuing-fixed-penalty-notices
do they or don't they have power to detain you?
Well in this case it appears to be completely irrelevant since they knew exactly where he was and that he wouldn't be going anywhere before the police arrived.
The answer is no btw, although according to an earlier post they do have the power to demand personal details.
matt_outandabout - MemberYes you do *have* to give him details if he so requests them with reasonable reason.
Depends, if he challenged you on it, surely that would fall under the He Who Smelt it Dealt It Act of 1972?
HAHA
So... do they or don't they have power to detain you?
If it was uncontrollable farting rather than spitting, would they want to detain you.
I hope McHamish isn't following through on this issue.
I don't know what this country is coming to if you can't reach down into your trachea, awk up a bit lump of germ-ridden phlegm and gob it out onto the pavement. I blame Brexit. And political correctness.
Come to think of it, I can't believe I'm not allowed to drop my keks and have a shit in the street either. It's the nanny state gorn mad, it is.
