[Closed] Fatties on 4

And the award for most provocative thread title of the day goes to....

....wait, is there a Top Gear thread?

Leave her alone, it's her thyroid !

It's her slow metabolism... Jesus people are so judgemental lol

No, but I have a very strong urge to kick you in the knackers.
🙂

Being very overweight myself , I feel quite qualified to take the piss

rusty...........fantastic.......... 😆

Shes ruining her kids life cos she cant say no to her. "She wont clean her teeth, she wants to watch peppa pig"

Monty for prime minister

wysiwyg : apologies for slight hijack but i've emailed you regarding borked iPhone 4s that will not restore/recover after failed iOS upgrade

I'm going for biscuits

And cake

ok buck

Aaaand the penny drops.

Was this woman receiving appropriate treatment for her thyroid condition? Or kept undiagnosed/inadequately medicated?

It was depressing to watch, i think we look after our dog better than some of these people look after their kids. 🙁

Not as depressing as the title of this thread, thought there was a fat bike related programme I had missed, and my evening viewing had been found, but alas it was another programme of lets generate some outrage in a daily mail type journalistic way.

It's her slow metabolism... The misguided cry of the fat. No such thing as a slow metabolism, or a fast one. You just have a metabolism, and it runs in direct proportion to your weight and activity levels.

Had to switch off after seeing the little boy having his baby teeth taken out.
The mother should be put in the stocks for a week.

The misguided cry of the fat. No such thing as a slow metabolism, or a fast one. You just have a metabolism, and it runs in direct proportion to your weight and activity levels.

you silly idiotic man.
read up on hyperthyroid stuff.

and stop spouting shyte.

It's her slow metabolism... The misguided cry of the fat. No such thing as a slow metabolism, or a fast one. You just have a metabolism, and it runs in direct proportion to your weight and activity levels.

[img] [/img]

No such thing as a slow metabolism, or a fast one. You just have a metabolism, and it runs in direct proportion to your weight and activity levels.

Yeh like everyone is exactly the same 🙄

It's her slow metabolism... The misguided cry of the fat. No such thing as a slow metabolism, or a fast one. You just have a metabolism, and it runs in direct proportion to your weight and activity levels.

Silly me, I thought hormones had something to do with it. 🙄

c_g, one of 22,000 [s]pi$$ed off[/s] members who belong to a UK based thyroid forum that the NHS links to on its website.

[i]Silly me, I thought hormones had something to do with it.[/i]

C_G.

I sense your frustration at some of the comments posted on threads such as this. All I can do is suggest you role with it, don't let it add to any problems you already have. Perhaps, rather, accept that out there, in the vast ignorance of the world, such opinions will persist, regardless of what others may know.

Thanks Solo for the kind words. Yes, it would be easier to keep quiet but too many people make too many assumptions and there's nothing wrong with challenging people's views.

I'm done on this thread.

Just to add for those who didn't watch it.. The kid DIDN'T have a thyroid problem.
It was a was programme about a completely avoidable problem - parents allowing their children to eat terrible food and drink terrible drinks, resulting in sickeningly overweight kids having their teeth pulled out 🙁

I admired the honesty of the consultants. It's a shame they are 'feared' into shying away from the truth.

The best statement was something along the lines of "it IS the patents fault, but those parents need help to improve, not simply blame".

DrP

[i]I admired the honesty of the consultants. It's a shame they are 'feared' into shying away from the truth.[/i]
I haven't seen the program, but I wonder why you put it like that.
Who/what's intimidating the consultants? If that's what you mean.

The program was trying to highlight lazy/poor parenting & the parents excuses for not feeding/educating their children properly.
[url= http://www.channel4.com/programmes/junk-food-kids-whos-to-blame/on-demand/57487-001 ]On 4 OD here[/url]

Snaps.

Thanks for the link, I'll try to give it a look, but from DrP's post, it sounds pretty grim:

[i]It was a was programme about a completely avoidable problem - parents allowing their children to eat terrible food and drink terrible drinks, resulting in sickeningly overweight kids having their teeth pulled out[/i]

It was pretty grim watching them in the supermarket.

I admired the honesty of the consultants. It's a shame they are 'feared' into shying away from the truth.
I haven't seen the program, but I wonder why you put it like that.
Who/what's intimidating the consultants? If that's what you mean.

Obesity and it's causes is (as demonstrated above) a very sore spot to talk about...

If someone has a smoking related lung disease, we (A doctor) is quite happy to say "this is 95% likely to be due to you putting a cigarette to your mouth, lighting it, and inhaling it. This is almost certainly due to you and your life choices". And the patient generally accepts it. They may not change their habit, but often shrug and go "yeah, I know Doc". There's the minority that are 'non lifestyle' diseases.

But with obesity there's often a big 'blinkered' effect from the patient, and the general consensus is "it's not my fault, I eat healthily, I exercise, it's the government, it's the sweet makers fault, gyms are too expensive, it's my metabolism etc etc". (yes, in a small number of cases there are metabolic concerns, but i promise you, the VAST VAST majority of cases of overweight people are simply down to lifestyle - eating too much).
Unfortunately - if you try to challenge people on this they become very defensive, argumentative, it's draining and in cases can result in complaints.
Despite wanting to do teh best for our patients, we (the medical profession) also have to look out for ourselves - both mentally and medico-legally.
IT's simply too much faff to have to respond to complaints and too time consuming in an already busy day to try to convince someone who's overweight that it's THEM at the root cause....

This, I think, is what the consultants are shying away from. It's not that they don't want to do a good job - it's just that the system is set up to make it too easy for patients to make the doctor's life very difficult if they are told something truthful, but just not what they want to hear (As opposed to a doctor making a genuine or farcical error, or simply being rude - then complaints SHOULD be made).

Simply telling a fat person they are fat because they have eaten too much of the wrong foods for too long (of course, said in a sensitive and honest manor) shouldn't be grounds for a medical complaint. But all too often it is.
So nothing gets said. And nothing changes....

DrP

Thanks DrP

Simply telling a fat person they are fat because they have eaten too much of the wrong foods for too long (of course, said in a sensitive and honest manor) shouldn't be grounds for a medical complaint. But all too often it is.
So nothing gets said. And nothing changes....

I reckon there might be an opportunity for a few forum members to help out here.

Once you've done your bit, you tell them to go into the small room next door (which will free up your time for the next patient), then you could have someone from STW sit them down for a quick "eat less, move more" chat. Maybe even employ iDave to [s]relieve them of their funds[/s] help them lose weight.

THe key with trying to get that point across is the need to [b]implement change[/b]. It's not to simply 'blame' anyone and point fingers and prod bulging stomachs, it's to get someone to accept responsibility, and then to empower them to change for the better.

"If I don't believe I have the power to change something in my life, would I bother trying to try to change it?" Unlikely.
Accepting 'responsibility' is the first step to making change.

DrP

@ DrP. Thanks for that insight from your side of the screen, I appreciate it. After reading that I sympathize with how it must drag on people in your position, when you can't perform your primary role, for being frustrated/confronted by the very people your trying to help. I'm guessing the issue for you and your colleagues is that it can go up a notch if you have to tell a parent their child is over weight/on the wrong diet, because then you'll have crossed the border into the land of questioning someone's parenting skills/choices.

I couldn't watch the 4 OD thing, my browser said no and I had the internet dumb. I'm not so good with computers.

it's to get someone to accept responsibility, and then to empower them to change for the better.

If that's the case, isn't it unfair on the patient to allow them to leave the surgery without being made aware that their weight is their doing? I understand your point on how difficult that is and know you're limited in what you can do in a short appointment...but surely the problem can never get better so long as they believe it's something other than themselves?

No idea how you manage that in a respectful and tactile way though! 🙂

I'd be a rubbish dr for that exact reason. I wouldn't be able to help myself from saying "I need you to leave here today understanding that there is nothing medically wrong with you. You are this size because of your lifestyle. You are causing this. We can get you help but it will be to adjust your lifestyle, nothing else"

..because then you'll have crossed the border into the land of questioning someone's parenting skills/choices.

If that's the case, isn't it unfair on the patient to allow them to leave the surgery without being made aware that their weight is their doing? I understand your point on how difficult that is and know you're limited in what you can do in a short appointment...but surely the problem can never get better so long as they believe it's something other than themselves?

DrP

Herein lies the skill of a good doctor.

You sound like a good doctor DrP. I had some anxiety/stress issues in my early twenties which I assumed was ill health. My family GP said "There's nothing wrong with you. Stop worrying." But of course, I just thought he was wrong and/or missing something so I worried even more. Eventually I moved and got a different GP who actually explained what anxiety was and it felt like someone had switched on a light in my head, an awakening. It was then a long, but achievable process to fix the problem.

[i]I [b]could[/b] given them a printout of their [b]normal[/b] blood results, circle a gym in the yellow pages, and tell them to consume less calories and move more.[/i]

@ DrP. Is that/Would that be the actual advice you would give?
I only ask as I believe you are an actual GP and so I'm just curious.

Edit:
I suppose another way to ask would be, does the NHS strictly instruct GPs on what advice to give on the matter of diet correction and exercise, or are GPs permitted a certain margin for including possibly, individually derived advice?

You sound like a good doctor DrP

Solo - definitely not - it was a crass example of actually how straight forward the 'pure medicine' could be. That would never work - we're humans, not computers or machines!

Example: I [b]really [/b]want to be able to play the guitar. It would be awesome!
I've got 2 working hands, and the money to buy a guitar. And could find the time to learn. So why aren't I a guitar god...?? I can't even read music Meh....
If someone offered me a pill to be able to play the guitar, would I take it - heck yeah!

If you've the time, go on a "motivational interviewing course" - very interesting , and even if you can't help others, you can really identify your own pitfalls in change!

[img] [/img]

DrP

Re the guitar thing - I'm stuck in the 'thinking about change' wedge, and have been for, ooh, 15 years....

DrP, Thank you 🙂

I'm stuck in the 'thinking about change' wedge

Don't quite know what to do with that now but it's helpful

I only ask as I believe you are an actual GP and so I'm just curious.

Or is she? 8)

[i] pictonroad - Member

I only ask as I [b]believe[/b] you are an actual GP and so I'm just curious.

Or is she?.[/i]

😉

Ok, I agree that some in society just eat what they want, when they want without excercise and are surprised when they become overweight.
Others can do nothing about it. I was 10 stone wet, then I got a bit sick. On a cocktail of Risperidone, depakote, seroquel and priadel I ballooned to sixteen stone at my worst. Now I'm off most im at 13 stone and struggling to get lighter(with daily 5k (slow) runs, gym 4 times a week and swimming 3 times a week
It could happen to any one of you guys when you least expect.

Remarkably helpful little diagram that. I know when I have a problem (or I am talking to someone else who says they have a problem) I will tend to focus on the 'making changes' web whereas the problem actually lies in moving from the 'thinking about change' to the preparing to change wedge

That's why rather than telling an overweight person how to get thin (making change), you have to help then understand the benefits of change (precontemplation/thinking about change), and help them realise HOW they can do it (preparing for change). The eat less/move more part (making change) is easy compared to that, isn't it!

DrP

We all, as members of society need to bear the responsibility for the obesity epidemic in our society. It seems that people are unwilling to take responsibility for their eating as the cause of their weight problems and blame other factors. So to help achieve this goal people need to be reminded why they are fat. So whenever you see a fat person you should shout at them;

'You're fat because you eat too much, stop eating fatty'

That should do it, this would have an even greater affect if they are actually eating at the time. So, maybe whilst cycling past a KFC or a Mcd's, those places are always stuffed with fatties, maybe you could circle it a few times or into the building and that way your responsility awareness 'strike' would hit more fatties. Go to it STW, you have the power.

I'm waiting for the guy next week who said its the governments fault, the shops and the manufacturers.

No it's not. It's your fault.

I prefer DrP's message. Move on from the dead end and demotivational blame game. History is history. Instead find a way to motivate people to complete 4/5s of DrP's chart ^^^

Just catching up with episode two on 4od....

Just as we feared.."It's everyone's fault but the parents".... 🙁

DrP

wysiwyg - Member
I'm waiting for the guy next week who said its the governments fault, the shops and the manufacturers.

No it's not. It's your fault.

Is it though? For years the advice was fat is bad so food manufacturers went low fat. To try and get some taste back into food, fat was replaced with sugar, and still is. If you can spare 1.5 hours this video is well worth watching.

Anything in moderation. Someone just needs to define moderation. And tell them what coke zero is. And freshly prepared meals..