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So May is asking everyone to vote for an amendment that offers an ‘alternative’ to the backstop, but won’t tell us what that might actually be? And the EU won’t reopen negotiations anyway?
Never look a gift horse in the mouth
Do we know for sure if the Brady amendment has been selected?
And which others?
mikewsmith
Subscriber
The only other option is to get May to resign
Well that should be easy.
Do we know for sure if the Brady amendment has been selected?
And which others?
I think Bercow decides tomorrow which are selected.
So Theresa May is about to try to whip through a massive amendment to a deal she negotiated and spent the last two months telling us was set in stone. Even though it is utterly pointless to do so unilaterally, as the 27 will just tell her to piss off and stop wasting everyone's time.
Perhaps she should just support a further amendment about the EU paying for the MPs' Christmas Party - why not go all in?
Shower of hopeless, gutless, bastards.
Once again just pandering to the ERG headbangers and ignoring everyone else.
She doesn’t even get, even at the 11th hour, that they cannot and will not be placated! They are fundamentalist zealots, totally unwilling to compromise and the only thing they will accept is a no deal Brexit
I’d hate to think this would effect anyone we know or at least I do hope they can move to Paris easily if it does.
Meryl Lynch staff 3 minutes ago:
I heard a snippet this morning about some new immigration bill which sounded like it was similar to powers that could have been enacted under EU FoM rules - anyone got the detail on what the differences are and where we've "taken back control"?
With the new bill they get to strafe dinghies trying to cross the channel from Spitfires, while singing Land of Hope and Glory
I heard a snippet this morning about some new immigration bill which sounded like it was similar to powers that could have been enacted under EU FoM rules – anyone got the detail on what the differences are and where we’ve “taken back control”?
I thought the exact same thing - why aren't journalists holding them to account over this? So this new bill you're voting for is exactly the same as we have been able to do previously? What is the point??
Also - loving this graph...
https://twitter.com/MattChorley/status/1090163540030377985
So May still thinks she can dictate terms to the EU, it really is farcical just how ignorant and incompetent a person can be, educated and promoted beyond their abilities, the whole ****ing tory front bench.
Don't forget to include the shadow cabinet in that assessment aas well.
I heard a snippet this morning about some new immigration bill which sounded like it was similar to powers that could have been enacted under EU FoM rules – anyone got the detail on what the differences are and where we’ve “taken back control”?
it was very similar indeed, except we still get to lose our rights in the EU
All the ‘solutions’ being offered seem to be even more unicorn-based than before.
And it was achingly predictable that the labour front bench would decline to support Yvette Coopers amendment to prevent a hard Brexit
Two equally clueless bunches of total ****-wits
I’m getting to the point where I can’t watch the news any more. The BBC is just talking about food shortages and some Brexit loon said ‘good! I think it’ll do the country some good to go without for a while’
I mean, where do you even start with that level of total ****-wittery
This. I’m almost embarrassed watching. This mans opinion was given the same billing as a man that said ‘maybe we should look into this before we plough on.’
I remember when I did without food and insulin for 3 days once. 4 days in intensive care, followed by a week on a ward. Halcyon days...
Oh, just thought, maybe they could get Thanos to present his view on how we could deal with food shortages? Simply shoot all the remainers!
Then eat them?
There was a report on TM on Europe 1 this morning. The rest of Europe knows she's not the right person(ality) for the job.
Im not saying that brexiters are ignorant of history but............
Then eat them?
What and corrupt their strong brexiteer souls from the inside?
The rest of Europe knows she’s not the right person(ality) for the job.
So does the UK. The tricky issue is getting all the tories to agree on the right person within just the tory party.
So Corbyn ****ed up the vote on FoM by switching from not-opposing to opposing, because guess what - the youngsters who put him there wanted him to oppose it.
Incompetent buffoon.
Just been listening to the BBC talking about the Malthouse plan for 20 minutes without actually saying what it proposes. Shit reporting.
That Brady amendment is pretty vague, how come no one is questioning the content???
So today will be another wasted day. A lot more negotiating with ourselves, only we are taking it seriously now, honest.
We will possibly go back to the EU with an 'offer' that crosses one of their fundamental red lines and involves them selling a member state down the river to appease a soon-to-be-former member who has lost its marbles. And the EU will rightly say 'no'.
And the UK will say 'but, by golly, look at how much blood, sweat and tears it has taken us to get to a position that is still fundamentally unpalatable to you - so pleeeeease'.
And the EU will say 'no'.
And the Mail will fulminate, the Brexies will blame everyone else and........
Tick........tock..........
Someone is going to have to get a grip soon - but I fear it just won't happen because no one dares upset the nutters.
but I fear it just won’t happen because no one dares upset the nutters.
Unless there is something really subtle being missed here I cant see why anyone but the brexiteer elite would go for this.
Anything which has the ERG saying its not a bad idea is clearly going to **** everyone but them and their pals over. Seems to be a way just to try and get a hard brexit through.
I remember when I did without food and insulin for 3 days once. 4 days in intensive care, followed by a week on a ward. Halcyon days…
Careful what you wish for - at least in the old days you didn't need to have paid into a health insurance policy for the privilege. Give it a couple of years post-Brexit and the safety net will be removed.
That Brady amendment is pretty vague, how come no one is questioning the content???
Because everyone with anything between their ears knows its more pie-in-the-sky nonsense that won't survive first contact with the real world
I other news: the Brexit-voting old giffers may be less keen on a no deal once this becomes apparent. Although its surely the EU just stating the bleeding obvious
British pensioners in EU will lose NHS-covered health care under no-deal Brexit
My local MP married into one of the largest land owning family has the answer.
So it seems Labour are now whipping to support the Cooper amendment. If that gets carried tonight I think the BBC HYS comments section will go into meltdown.
The trouble with Disaster Capitalism is that, by definition, you need a disaster on which to capitalise. The Brexiteer loons therefore won't give up on their No Deal Brexit easily
They know that the EU will take a casual look at this 'proposal' and tell us to **** right off. The ERG know this (as does everyone else), but they're gleefully running the clock down to doomsday. And they have a PM in their pocket who they've held hostage for so long she developed Stockholm Syndrome a long time ago
Blimey! Labour 3 line Whip to support Yvette Cooper!!!
Could this mark a watershed moment where the Labour front bench actually does something useful for the first time in the entire Brexit process? Something that could actually be labelled as 'opposition'?
I agree with many of the sentiments with above on the Brady amendment. It's a "deck chairs on the titanic" moment. The Tories vote to go back and try and change the Irish backstop, which no-one in the 27 wants to change especially the Irish. Waste of time.....
Blimey! Labour 3 line Whip to support Yvette Cooper!!!
Interesting (and good news).
Out of interest, how do you know this?
edit: I really should use Twitter more and 'traditional' new websites less.
Have the amendments to be voted on been announced yet? So far the BBC just seem to be listing those that have been tabled, but not whether any have been accepted.
So it seems Labour are now whipping to support the Cooper amendment.
But pushing for a shorter (useless?) extension than Cooper proposes (maybe because the longer extension would only wash with the EU if it was paired with a possible way out of this mess? Don't mention a referendum including a Remain option).
Have the amendments to be voted on been announced yet? So far the BBC just seem to be listing those that have been tabled, but not whether any have been accepted.
All will be revealed by Badger Bercow at 13:45, I believe.
Blimey! Labour 3 line Whip to support Yvette Cooper!!!
Yes, and only an hour ago you were ranting on about how predictable it is that they wouldn't. Crystal ball need a bit of a clean?
Yes, and only an hour ago you were ranting on about how predictable it is that they wouldn’t. Crystal ball need a bit of a clean?
Not really. He's nothing if not consistent. Consistently shit! Have a think about it? This is the f first useful thing that the labour leader has done in years is grudgingly accept an amendment from one of his own backbenchers? Perhaps Kier threatened to resign again?
See the John McDonnell HARDTalk interview I linked to… this approach has been on the cards for a while… support a short delay… because all options, even no deal, require it now. Cooper's longer extension is required if we're to change who is agreeing the WA, or if we're to have a general election or a referendum… all of which are in some weird way Labour policy… so they should really support a longer extension… but then the questions turns back to what the longer extension is for…
Drac, that's Anne-Marie Trevelyan MP, Tory Eurosceptic and granddaughter of Dr and Mme. Francois Bougarel, of Chateauroux, France. Hopefully, she's stockpiling the fois gras and cavier whilst we can eat cake. We need a hypocrisy barometer.
Yup the very same.
OK, next dumb question... many of these amendments today (some of which will not be heard and few of which will be passed) seem to rely on an extension of Article 50. What happens if the EU say no to that? I guess the default is still out with no deal on March 29th but do any of the (credible) amendments have anything built in for if/when they say no?
Hang on, so if the cooper amendemnt is acccepted and passes, may goes back to EU and gets told to sod off again over the backstop, MPs vote for an extension...
But the EU won't allow an extension unless for an election or 2nd ref...
It can only come down to a binary question.. no deal, or retract a50...?
^ that's what I thought - I hear the Cooper amendment "takes No Deal off the table" but how exactly?
Bercow selects Corbyn, Blackford, Grieve, Cooper, Reeves, Spelman, Brady amendments.... so the important debates are on, seven potential votes, altho those MP s putting them forward could withdraw them at any point
The amendments all come down to the goodwill of the EU 27 to allow them and it seems to me that the EU27 are now accepting that there will be a no deal exit, which will be a financial blip for them and a disaster for us.
The voting after 7:00pm tonight may very well decide the fate of the UK.
European goodwill is running out, not the politicians, the electorate. Before the referendum about 60% of the French thought Brexit a bad idea. After the vote it went to 38% in favour 32% against. Differnt questions but you get the idea. I haven't been able to find any recent polls perhaps for the good reason that in the current political climate European politicians would rather not know - because they know.
Macron now knows that going easy on the UK will compound his problems with the RN and gilets jaunes, Merkel has the afd to worry about. It's a really bad time to be negociating cake and getting worse.
Sorry I should also have said that I also see no EU goodwill coming on this issue. I think most European countries see this as self inflicted pain on the part of the UK and hence have no sympathy (just incredulity) for us.
If I was an EU citizen (I know that technically I still am, but you know what I mean) watching this shitshow unravel, I be they can't wait to see the back of us.
And with the toxic utterances from the likes of Mark Francois last week and our general neo-colonial flag-waving and petty nationalism, actually beginning to wish for the maximum damage possible to our economy. We are (or the Tory right are...) turning bridge burning into an artform
Doesn't the order the amendments are voted on have a big significance to? Surely for quite a few MPs (remainers and soft-brexiteers) they would only vote for certain amendments if their preferred amendment failed to pass?
But yeah it all seems a huge mess, the Brady amendment seems to be nothing more than a way to end up blaming a no-deal brexit on the EU being unwilling to negotiate.
The postponing for a short time (mentioned 3 months on the news) seems pointless, even if the EU agreed (which they might well not without a clear UK plan), just continues the uncertainty.
A 2nd referendum seems increasingly unlikely so I guess it's a no deal brexit to look forward to...
At which point we should just go full-pirate regarding the NI border and go for no border in the Irish Sea (keeping the unionists happyish), not enforcing the border on land (keeping the Republicans happyish), and letting the EU work out what on earth to about the fact that we are no longer in the EU, but defacto allowing free trade.
*I'm aware that we'd have to offer the same deal to everyone else under WTO rules, but a free backdoor into the EU for all your dodgy goods? That's got to be worth some trade.
he Brady amendment seems to be nothing more than a way to end up blaming a no-deal brexit on the EU being unwilling to negotiate.
This were my thoughts. I'd say a No Deal is now a racing certainty (as this is the default growing ever nearer as this farce conitinues) and the ERG wreckers are just looking to shift the blame for the bed they just shat
My New year's resolution was to become a leaver, I've failed but really I know it would be good for my family unit and the prosperity of the area I live. In the event of a hard Brexit I reckon theres a very good chance that Airbus wing making would end up in Toulouse. I reckon a lot of tax evasion facilitated by the City would stop. Some of the multinationals have already chosen France over the UK for forward investment and that would go a step further. Toyota have invested enough to maintain the staus quo in the UK but have chosen France for their new site. Japanese and US inward investment would in general head for well over 400 million consumers rather than 70 million.
Agriculture, well everybody has to eat and as world commodity prices rise as resources are stretched, I don't see a small drop in UK consumption of fine European goods being a problem. Besides, however much a significant proportion of Brits hate the French they're still more than happy to quaff Champagne and drive those horrible unreliable French cars they slag off on forums.
🙂
Pound volatility has always been one of the UK risks and that will exagerated.
What will the UK have to offer that Turkey or Moroco don't?
Money laundering?
Want to stay sane…? Then don't tune into Corbyn's "contribution" right now in the commons…
(the interruptions from Tory back benchers as much as the nonsense from the front bench)
So these are the amendments in full -
https://twitter.com/SebastianEPayne/status/1090247886674243584
I reckon a lot of tax evasion facilitated by the City would stop
Bless. All that would happen if it couldnt be done by London another country would take over.
Obvious candidates are Malta and Cyprus considering the services they already provide to dubious high wealth individuals.
You think that tax evasion facilitated by the city will drop after the bonfire of regulation and oversight that Brexit will usher in?
Of course it will.
Or alternatively, every dodgy African dictator, Russian oligarch and Mexican Drug Cartel will be welcomed with open arms. The ones who aren't here already
Hmmmmmmmm... I wonder which of those outcomes is more likely.....
The amendments that matter require teh agreement of the EU, PrinceJohn. Why in particular would the EU budge on the backstop? The EU's first loyalty is to the ROI so were back to the Irish Catch 22. Tear up the Good Friday agreement (already done) or put a customs border down St George's channel.
At which point we should just go full-pirate
Which is what we'd need to do with commandeering shipping in the event of a No Deal - after P&O's rather deft move in changing all its shipping to sail under the Cypriot flag. Their vessels (not one) can now not be commandeered by the UK - to do so would be piracy.
What Boris wanted to do unto business, it turns out business can do back - and it is not a throwaway line for them.
Airlines likewise.
Anyone watching live? Sounds like a right bunfight currently.
The Brady one is the one frightening one - TM to vote against her deal, to re-open the withdrawal agreement, even tho the EU have repeatedly said, no, we're done. WTAF?
All of those are just postponing the inevitable refusal (I hope) of her deal being voted through...
& now this...
https://twitter.com/Longshanks1307/status/1090258626646687745
eu would allow article 50 extension for a significant shift in the UK offer. A GE, no confidence, etc, are obvious but I think a substantial change to the current red lines would also create that impetus.
They won't just so we can keep going back asking for the same thing over and over again, when the answer is clearly no.
Anyone watching live? Sounds like a right bunfight currently.
I can't from work but I believe Yvette Cooper is going well.
They won’t just so we can keep going back asking for the same thing over and over again, when the answer is clearly no.
That's rumbled it - as soon as the EU realise this.....oh....they already have.....oh dear!
Anyone watching live? Sounds like a right bunfight currently.
Where’s everybody gone?
Some class journalism from the BBC's Chief Political Correspondant Vicki Young
We haven't really heard much from Theresa May in the last couple of weeks about what her plan B is. She has been forced by various parliamentary shenanigans to come to the House today and she has made it clear now that she's going to go back to the EU and say 'I want you to reopen the withdrawal agreement', something they have said all along that they can't do.
As far as the EU are concerned, this deal has been signed off.
What she is saying to Parliament is that we can't keep showing people what we're against, it's time we showed them what we're in favour of. So if the problem is the backstop, if it's the problem that we can't get out of it unilaterally or it needs to be time limited, then we need to tell the EU that and it's clear she's going back to them them and will ask them to compromise.
I suppose she has no other choice at this point. With only two months to go until we leave, she has to show that she has tried.
I mean, really, really heavyweight analysis there.
She has to be seen to be trying to do the thing that has failed for the past two years and that the EU has repeatedly stated they will not back down on?
Even the BBC is living in cloud ****ing cuckoo land, doesn't suprise me as she's another Oxbridge elitist like the Oxford PPE lot, who likely knows shit about the world outside her own bubble.
We are literally being ****ed by graduates of two universities who display rank British exceptionalism.
So Vicki, even if the Brexiteers get the EU to back down - what do you think Labour and pro-EU Tory rebels are going to do, hey?
Where’s everybody gone?
It is a bit empty isnt it?
I guess though since there is no new arguments not much point in repeating them. Just turn up for the votes.
So, in my blunt reasoning.
Brady amendment is basically just about positioning and being able to sell the blame onto the EU in the eyes of your average UK voter. Going through mock contortions in the sure and certain knowledge that the outcome will be (as always has been) anathema to the EU. But at least if we keep making them (perfectly reasonably) say 'no', more UK voters will swallow the line about EU intransigence.
That seems to be basically 'it' for that one(?)
Skybet:
UK To Officially Leave EU By 29/03/2019 - Yes @ 10/3
Brexit - Brexit Specials
£1 bet Returns £4.33
its alright the Gillet Jambon have it covered
That seems to be basically ‘it’ for that one(?)
Think there are a few reasons.
Its been deliberately written to be as confusing as possible to give people a reason to fool themselves into voting for it.
For the maybot and co its just kick it into the long grass for a bit longer.
For the ERG and their fellow travellers there is a tweet from one of Skys reporters that the get hard brexit and blame the EU is precisely why the ERG extremists are for it.
All those in favour of brexit should be made to wear a yellow vest at all times, preferably with a "Kick Me" sign on the rear.
That flyer reminds me of one of these
