Forum menu
kimbers - Memberdeviant I see you fallen for the basic brexie error of scapegoating the EU for the failings of our own government.
Two posts earlier:
kimbers - Membergood job that germanys doing so well, that must really upset all the EU haters
😆
Futile thread is futile.
elliptic - MemberIf there were 27 net contributors then the EU would be sitting on an ever growing cash mountain. They have to *spend* the contributions somewhere.
Low tax wages for EU staff and cushty pensions? 🙂
Futile thread is futile
Yet you can any keep away....
TBF i have no clue what point you are trying to make tho sbob
Sorry, thought it was obvious.
It amused me that in one post you're saying a country's failings aren't because of the EU, yet the post you wrote just before alluded to another country's success being because of the EU.
🙂
I am sure the world can then refuse to supply nuclear fuel as no legal framework, i am sure they can refuse to sell military spares, remind me where are Typhoons made? How about blocking access to all European satellites etc etc etc.
No winners.
I suppose we could just start a nuclear war with France just to be sure that there are no winners?
sbob, no real contradiction, the UK is richer than it was because of the EU, but Germany has been far better. That Germany has done better points to the Germans using the EU better than the UK*
*which when the UK has tended to use the EU as a whipping post isn't hard.
are we all done yet?
no.
a mere 100,000 London jobs in Euro clearing? more double that with the ripple effect.
families with no skills or intention to work can be turned back please
Isn't this what Germany does? Despite being in the EU?
There are 11 net contributors to the EU budget, out of 27 countries I think that's disgusting and that's why I voted out
How much do you earn? Are you a net contributor to the UK economy? I am. Should I find all those who are net recipients disgusting?
Should I find all those who are net recipients disgusting?
I think the general idea is that you should, yes. 🙂
There are 11 net contributors to the EU budget, out of 27 countries I think that's disgusting and that's why I voted out
There's much more to the EU than a spreadsheet. The whole is greater than the sum of the parts.
Darcy, might need to ask your opinion on flooring later 🙂
That Germany has done better points to the Germans using the EU better than the UK
😆
It does absolutely nothing of the sort.
There are so many possible reasons, to come up with the above is quite frankly ridiculous.
Useful as another example of the blinkeredness of STW's Europhiles though.
I really, really need to move out of Surrey.
Surrey voted remain.
Surrey voted remain.
As did London, but they're both still in the South East!
[i]It does absolutely nothing of the sort.
There are so many possible reasons, to come up with the above is quite frankly ridiculous.[/I]
+1
And having worked across a number of sectors in Germany plus lived there you'd have to say its because they work better, not harder, just BETTER.
And having worked across a number of sectors in Germany plus lived there you'd have to say its because they work better, not harder, just BETTER.
I worked in Germany for a massive internationally known firm whose services you've probably all used, and they were definitely NOT better at working. They were an absolute joke. A British ex-pat who worked there was adamant that the concept of German efficiency was a myth, and that they had no common sense at all.
That was software though - I can imagine what works well in manufacturing would not work well in software.
good job that germanys doing so well, that must really upset all the EU haters
Artifically low exchange rate is a massive boost for the worlds largest/second largest exporter. EU/EEC generally accepted to be a Franco / German club. Always has been. I mean if it didn't work for Germany what would be the point ?
Whose really projecting Project Fear??
Simple comparison about where the risk vs opportunity lies. As we've discussed when the eurozone crises [b]really[/b] hits its going to affect the UK very badly. My point is that the less entangled we are in the EU the better, the less dependent we are on European trade the better.
So while May is in Saudi, desperately trying to sell them more bombs to blow up Yemeni civilians
that bastion of decency and integrity, Lian Fox is meeting international pariah Rodrigo Duterte, whom he claims we have 'shared values' with - thats what grovelling for a trade deal looks like
[img] 
[/img]
truly a proud day for the brexies
Simple comparison about where the risk vs opportunity lies. As we've discussed when the eurozone crises really hits its going to affect the UK very badly. My point is that the less entangled we are in the EU the better, the less dependent we are on European trade the better.
So....
You're using a hypothetical situation which has poor consequences for the UK.....as an example of how you're not employing "Project Fear" tactics....
Hmmm..
I think you've come up a bit short there old son.
Facts, Jamba, we like facts round here....not wishful thinking combined with smoke & mirrors!
French Presidential debate tonight. Plenty of euroscpetism on show and not just from Le Pen.
Remind me where those "plenty of eurosceptism" candidates are in the polls. Populist nationalistic isolationism that is taken to pieces each time Macron replies. Macron is the one with all the answers, now we'll go along and vote, and see if that shows up in the result.
@kimbers - looks like there is a bright future full of opportunities waiting for us post-Brexit!!
One assumes we've sold the Saudis a fresh batch of bombs for Yemen (with an agreement they wouldn't do it at Easter).
what can you say to this really....
[I]I worked in Germany for a massive internationally known firm whose services you've probably all used, and they were definitely NOT better at working. They were an absolute joke. A British ex-pat who worked there was adamant that the concept of German efficiency was a myth, and that they had no common sense at all.[/I]
Yes, for one-off stuff the Brits are as good as anyone but where it's a repeatable process (design and operation) then they're very good and are prepared to invest. Seen this across both aluminium and building materials sectors.
good job that germanys doing so well, that must really upset all the EU haters
I posted an artilce a few pages back - the following is an extract from it.
Lahnstein explained that he supported the ERM because it was in Germany’s national interest. “His argument was, as always, simple and powerful,” wrote Healey. “The mechanism would require the weaker countries to intervene on the currency markets to keep the stronger currencies down, and vice versa; this meant that France and Italy would have to pay to keep the Deutschmark lower than it would have been in a free market, thus keeping Germany more competitive, and other countries less so.” The euro removed the inconvenience of interventions in the currency markets to secure Germany’s advantage over the rest of the continent. But it still followed Lahnstein’s logic.
We are a small scale seller of weapons to Saudi. French are 4x us and US bigger again. Let me find some numbers.
@mrleb - there aren't really facts about the future are there ? It's unknown.
Edukator I think the run off will be between Fillion and Le Pen. Lets see.
Jamba - you gonna stop claimin' you can see the future then? 😉
Macron is the one with all the answers
What are his policies?
We are a small scale seller of weapons to Saudi. French are 4x us and US bigger again. Let me find some numbers.
Oh I guess that makes it all ok then??
what can you say to this really....
she probably still wants a housemaid on the cheap when she leaves office.
what can you say to this really....
I'd expected it to unravel slowly but it's coming on really rather fast since Article 50 was signed and the gloves have come off. More than a few people at work are expressing concern at the 'let's fight the Spanish' outburst...
I'm really rather worried about how those who believed the most obvious lies of the Leave campaign will respond as it becomes clear just how big those lies were. Same as Trump supporters - having put so much faith in something so obviously an electoral ploy, what will be the reaction when the faith turns out to be misplaced...
@mattjg there are not 100,000 jobs in euro clearing. Thats the total number of jobs in clearing in all currencies in London (the worlds largest fx market). You can clear euros in New York too for example.
Wow - Michael Fallon said this:
"Our object is to regain control over migration – to make sure we can manage the number of people who are coming here and the numbers of people who are going to Europe."
So they actually want to stop people leaving the country as well? They want to trap people here?
What the actual ****?
@jambalaya : "The future of an estimated 100,000 jobs has been plunged into doubt after a close political ally of the German chancellor, Angela Merkel, and president of the European commission, Jean-Claude Juncker, warned that a prized sector in the City of London must relocate to EU soil after Brexit."
Is that factually incorrect? I'm not a fundamentalist and find it very plausible any article can be wrong.
So they actually want to stop people leaving the country as well? They want to trap people here?What the actual ****?
Only enemies of the people would want to leave glorious Wangland.
I'm only half joking, the quitters throw around the word "traitor" without a thought.
Morning giggle: https://capx.co/england-has-gone-mad/
We’ll all remember where we were when we heard about the 2017 War with Spain, inspired by unlovely Gibraltar, declared by Michael Howard and passionately taken up by the kind of right-wing Tory who lovingly displays decommissioned weaponry on their living-room wall. I was on a long train journey passing through some of England’s finest countryside when the news broke. How sad, I thought, that one day this would all be patatas bravas fields and manchego trees. We’d have to learn how to pronounce “chorizo” the right way and to pass a football properly. I worked through the maths – at 43, was I too old for the frontline? I checked my conscience – I’d happily write racist propaganda from home, but would rather avoid having to shoot Andres Iniesta in the face.Now that the war is over and we survivors are making the best of the aftermath, a much more serious issue dominates the national debate, namely whether Cadbury and the National Trust have removed the word “Easter” from their Easter egg hunts. The answer to this is “no”, but in loopy England that hasn’t stopped the Prime Minister and the leader of the Opposition and the Church of England expressing strong condemnation.
I'm really rather worried about how those who believed the most obvious lies of the Leave campaign will respond as it becomes clear just how big those lies were. Same as Trump supporters - having put so much faith in something so obviously an electoral ploy, what will be the reaction when the faith turns out to be misplaced...
Brooess - according to Andrew Rawnsley in the Observer a few weeks ago, theres a core of less rabid Tory MPs who share your concerns. They believe that as the working classes, who believed all this bullshit and voted leave, realise the scale of the deception - as their employment rights and benefits (EU red tape?) are gleefully torched by the Tory Right - all hell is going to break loose
"Our object is to regain control over migration – to make sure we can manage the number of people who are coming here and the numbers of people who are going to Europe."So they actually want to stop people leaving the country as well? They want to trap people here?
What the actual ****?
Build a wall!!
They believe that as the working classes, who believed all this bullshit and voted leave, realise the scale of the deception - as their employment rights and benefits (EU red tape?) are gleefully torched by the Tory Right - all hell is going to break loose
It won't though. That's not how it is in Britain. The Mail and Express will publish some suitable Dunkirk spirit messages and the proles will tug their forelocks and carry on. As long as the masters in the Big House are OK, everything is fine in Downton Abbey.
all hell is going to break loose
Yup. Big trouble coming IMO.
DrJ - I think there could be serious civil unrest ahead, because of a combination of things creating a perfect storm. A couple of things that will happen simultaneously
1) A Tory party now having policy dictated exclusively by its lunatic fringe, and taking full advantage of the utter shambles of Corbyns labour, will be simply unable to resist its base instincts. This will lead to them, as they enact the Great Repeal Bill (nice flag-waving name) taking a torch to workers rights, and benefits that have been taken for granted for decades. I think that may lead to the scales falling from a lot of peoples eyes.
But this is the clincher...
2) At the same time, there will be no reduction in immigration. Far from it. David Davis has already conceded this. The Tory party's paymasters want their supply of cheap labour to continue. And what they want, they get.
How do you think these things are going to play out to a population sold the 'Taking back control of our borders' bullshit, that was blatantly exploiting fear, xenophobia, and out and out racism? This was always a dangerous game to be playing. I think that the right wing nut-jobs, getting carried away with their victorious, crowing 'Enemies of the People' posturing, seem to be forgetting that as this pans out, delivering the polar opposite of what you promised will have repercussions. Even the less foaming-at-the-mouth in the Tory party know this.
Do you think the unquestioning Sun/MailExpress/Telegraph axis will carry on their unwavering flag-waving support once it becomes clear that the immigration figures won't be coming down?
The right are going to be brought down by their own swaggering cocksure over-confidence making them think they can do whatever they damn well like. They can't. They've had a very easy ride so far. As reality intrudes on the rhetoric and lies, that won't last. I expect at some point the public mood is going to change rapidly and dramatically once the extent of the lies and deceptions become apparent.
What happens then? Who knows? Its impossible to predict anything at the moment. But I very much doubt it'll be good.