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EU Referendum - are...
 

[Closed] EU Referendum - are you in or out?

 Del
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woah there! just roll back a minute Hoss!
WTO regulate subsidies!?
weren't we shrugging off the chains of the evil EU so we could do what we damn well please, subsidise who we want where we want!?

the good news just keeps coming. 😆


 
Posted : 10/02/2017 3:42 pm
 br
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Pretty much the last person you need to be deciding what industry/business to invest in (ie subsidise) is a politician IMO, they've not a great track record on either straight business or subsidising stuff. Example:

August 2016
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-36710104

Kieran Donnelly, the auditor general, said there was "no upper limit on the amount of energy that would be paid for".
"The more heat that is generated, the more is paid," he said.
In one example cited by the report, a business taking part in the same scheme in Great Britain could collect about £192,000 over 20 years by using a boiler all year round, but a Northern Ireland firm doing the same could earn £860,000.
Mr Donnelly said the scheme had "serious systematic failings from the start".


 
Posted : 10/02/2017 3:56 pm
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a national investment bank is off-agneda

Why so?


 
Posted : 10/02/2017 3:57 pm
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Pretty much the last person you need to be deciding what industry/business to invest in (ie subsidise) is a politician IMO, they've not a great track record on either straight business or subsidising stuff
where as we all know no business ever makes an error, loses money or ever goes out of business due to poor decisions hence i was unable to cherry pick a link to substantiate this

Humans are fallible ....whatever sector they operate in

Its hardly news is it. Heck even trump declared bankruptcy a number of times ....


 
Posted : 10/02/2017 4:08 pm
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where as we all know no business ever makes an error, loses money or ever goes out of business due to poor decisions hence i was unable to cherry pick a link to substantiate this

But they lose their shareholders' money - not ours.


 
Posted : 10/02/2017 4:21 pm
 mrmo
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But they lose their shareholders' money - not ours.

They won't be though... Too many deals now come with no risk to the private sector. Guaranteed minimum payments for power, subsidies for transport etc.


 
Posted : 10/02/2017 4:27 pm
 Del
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blair's labour did master the art of privatising profits while publicising risk.


 
Posted : 10/02/2017 4:47 pm
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But they lose their shareholders' money - not ours.
Tell that to the bankers


 
Posted : 10/02/2017 4:51 pm
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Tell that to the bankers

Their shareholders don't need telling they have lost huge amounts.


 
Posted : 10/02/2017 5:12 pm
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Junky I know many bankers who have lost amounts in the tens of millions on shares in their employers. Just look at bank share prices since say 2006. A very large portion of Lehman Brothers employees held large numbers of shares for example. Didn't stop the bank blowing up. Also if you look at the share prices of those banks rescued shareholders lost a lot of money.

We have discussed banking before but if you let a bank fail the Govt is on the hook for customers deposts (up to a limit) and if a bank fails small, medium and indeed large business customers will find their overdraft facilities cancelled. It's not a simple decision.

@zokes yes indeed, in my view the eurozone crises is going to dwarf the credit crises of 2007-9 in terms of impact and severity.

I am surpirsed the Remainers here haven't commented on today's "EU exit bill". France and Germany wanted a bigger figure (€70bn I think) not surprising as they have elections in May and October and they are going to be on the hook for increased contributions to plug the hole we are leaving.

My gut feel is we well pay €10-15bn that being UK MEP's pensions (so paid out over decades) and Academic projects which the UK has already said it will match (so that's smoke and mirrors about whether it's paid to the EU first and then back to the UK or we just pay direct. Also again that's paid out over a number of years).

The big row is going to be whether the EU will discuss trade before we finalise this "exit bill", another reason why I say plan A is WTO tariffs with all amounts routed to NHS and let's just get on with focusing globally.


 
Posted : 10/02/2017 6:08 pm
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The point is that both business people and politicians fail and when business fail its not ALWAYS just shareholders who pay out- taxpayers are often left to pay the redundancy payments never mind what happened with bankers where, clearly, it cost the taxpayers a few pence.


 
Posted : 10/02/2017 6:10 pm
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Is it coincidence that Jamba is the first post on page 666...............? 😉


 
Posted : 10/02/2017 6:37 pm
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The big row is going to be whether the EU will discuss trade before we finalise this "exit bill", another reason why I say plan A is WTO tariffs with all amounts [s]routed to NHS and let's just get on with focusing globally[/s] used to pay people on the increasing dole queue or fund a cut in income tax for the top earners.


 
Posted : 10/02/2017 6:39 pm
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Is it coincidence that Jamba is the first post on page 666...............?

How dare you sully his number! 👿


 
Posted : 10/02/2017 6:40 pm
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never mind what happened with bankers where, clearly, it cost the taxpayers a few pence.
That's a good point. Where exactly are we with the cost of the bank bailout these days? We're still heavily into RBS of course (and given their ongoing issues we might have to write that off) but we must be breaking even on everything else?


 
Posted : 10/02/2017 6:44 pm
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🙂 I did used to live next to the Cathedral used in The Omen !


 
Posted : 10/02/2017 8:55 pm
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Scot we are nearly out of Lloyds after a recent share sale. RBS was clearly a massive error from Brown wrt bailout, wrong price and insufficient control despite 80% shareholding. Most of the bailout was in form of loans which have either been paid back or will be. The Asset Protection scheme (insurance) resulted in a massive profit £8bn I recall but wouod need to check. The smaller regionals like Alliance and Leicester, Bradford and Bingley and Northern Rock are all break even / profit I believe having been wound down/sold/restructured.


 
Posted : 10/02/2017 9:00 pm
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Why so mol?

Because they are not very good at it. Simple,


 
Posted : 10/02/2017 9:34 pm
 br
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[I]Junky I know many bankers who have lost amounts in the tens of millions on shares in their employers. Just look at bank share prices since say 2006. A very large portion of Lehman Brothers employees held large numbers of shares for example.[/I]

Yep, pretty much proved what we came to find out - they didn't really understand risk. Every company I've worked for that awarded me shares I sold straight away.

Company goes pop, you lose your job and your shares are valueless. It's not difficult.


 
Posted : 10/02/2017 9:54 pm
 br
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[I]The big row is going to be whether the EU will discuss trade before we finalise this "exit bill", another reason why I say plan A is WTO tariffs with all amounts routed to NHS and let's just get on with focusing globally. [/I]

Sorry, did you miss my post a few pages back where even the most committed of Brexiters in Govt have finally worked out that WTO will be a disaster - I gave you a couple of goes at answering...


 
Posted : 10/02/2017 9:56 pm
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I'm looking forward to watching the forthcoming tory party explosion when they eventually realise that they can't actually have their cake and eat it. Given that they'll have the choice between crashing out to North Korea status, or remaining an EU member in all but name, it's hard to see the former attracting a majority of MPs and choosing the latter will lose half their voters to UKIP.

It will be an entertaining couple of years.


 
Posted : 10/02/2017 10:36 pm
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just wanted to be on this page 😈

as you were 😀


 
Posted : 10/02/2017 10:43 pm
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thecaptain - Member
... crashing out to North Korea status, ...

North Korea is doing just fine. They don't cause harm to anyone and they do not intervene in others' affairs unlike busy body EU system. North Korea just want to live in peace with their own Korean people.

Are you afraid of isolation?


 
Posted : 10/02/2017 11:46 pm
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jambalaya - Member

so that's smoke and mirrors about whether it's paid to the EU first and then back to the UK

Why does that sound familiar?


 
Posted : 10/02/2017 11:50 pm
 Leku
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North Korea is doing just fine.

Unless you actually have to live there with the death camps and starving millions...


 
Posted : 10/02/2017 11:53 pm
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Are you afraid of isolation?

Depends who I'm isolate with, and cut off from…


 
Posted : 11/02/2017 1:03 am
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Junky I know many bankers who have lost amounts in the tens of millions on shares in their employers. Just look at bank share prices since say 2006. A very large portion of Lehman Brothers employees held large numbers of shares for example.
But THM was arguing how we coudl not trust politicans as they are bad at investing and here we have the bankers being bad at investing

Have we finally all agreed that the sector that makes the decision is no indication of how good the decision is and the decision is not magically good[ or bad] because it was made by a politician, a business leader or a shareholder/investor.

Any of these groups can make good or bad decisions and if you dislike one of them its because of your personal politics - hence THM [ neutral but always agreeing with Tory ideology ] distrust politicians.
That was my only point both sectors make errors and it seems like we all agree on that.


 
Posted : 11/02/2017 10:49 am
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Are you afraid of isolation?

Of course!


 
Posted : 11/02/2017 11:15 am
 mt
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They'll be no isolation in a free Yorkshire, the bike rides are so good people queue to get in.


 
Posted : 11/02/2017 12:31 pm
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that will be at the paying booths no doubt 😉


 
Posted : 11/02/2017 12:53 pm
 DrJ
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Another gift to Greece from the generous Germans

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/feb/11/unexploded-ww2-bomb-prompts-huge-thessaloniki-greece-evacuation


 
Posted : 11/02/2017 12:57 pm
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that will be at the paying booths no doubt

Of course a wall will be needed. But that will be paid for those wanting to visit. Definitely not by Yorkshire.


 
Posted : 11/02/2017 1:10 pm
 mt
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@slowoldman, I see you have joined the Yorkshire Freedom Party. A wall around Gods country paid for by a tax on goods from Southerners and Lancashire has been mentioned at the last YFP meeting. However the idea was dropped as there are no taxes generated, due them not having anything worth buying. Everyone know only good stuff comes from Yorkshire.


 
Posted : 11/02/2017 1:58 pm
 br
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[i]However the idea was dropped as there are no taxes generated, due them not having anything worth buying.[/I]

Eccles Cakes and Bakewell Tarts?

And tbh taking on the idea of exporting Jam etc, surely there is WORLDWIDE market for Curd Tarts?

Although funny how it's only when you leave Yorkshire that you find out that they are actually referred to as Yorkshire Curd Tarts elsewhere (recently served on a KX-Edinburgh Virgin train). 🙂


 
Posted : 11/02/2017 2:41 pm
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Another gift to Greece from the generous Germans

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/feb/11/unexploded-ww2-bomb-prompts-huge-thessaloniki-greece-evacuation

There is no mention of Germans in the article apart from the reference to a German city which had to deal with an unexploded British bomb. Apparently the bomb in Thessaloniki was too degraded to establish weather it was an Allied or German bomb. Or indeed Italian - they bombed Thessaloniki.


 
Posted : 11/02/2017 3:09 pm
 mt
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I do believe that Curd Tart is the best tart int world (well apart from that lass who sells her assets up Golcar), with that n Yorkshire Puddings the encommy of Gods own Country is assured, especially when you add the Rhubarb triangle. We'll be living of fat o the land (well fish n chips) for years to come.


 
Posted : 11/02/2017 5:30 pm
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The Yanks are no doubt dying to buy more of our Rhubarb. Our future as a Free Yorkshire is secured by that fact alone.


 
Posted : 11/02/2017 5:34 pm
 DrJ
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Apparently the bomb in Thessaloniki was too degraded to establish weather it was an Allied or German bomb.

You're riight - in fact I did what I criticise others for, neglecting the negative impact of the "allies" on Greece.


 
Posted : 11/02/2017 5:37 pm
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The Yanks are no doubt dying to buy more of our Rhubarb. Our future as a Free Yorkshire is secured by that fact alone.

Oddly enough I was chatting to someone at lunch on Friday in the Los Gatos (Bay Area) office of the company I work for. He was saying how much he missed Rhubarb pie.

Apparently American rhubarb isn't as good as the proper stuff.


 
Posted : 11/02/2017 6:09 pm
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Let's not forget Henderson's Relish.


 
Posted : 11/02/2017 7:33 pm
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Will Free Yorkshire be reverting to pre-1974 Borders?


 
Posted : 11/02/2017 7:59 pm
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I'm pretty sure reverting to the old Ridings would be a vote winner.


 
Posted : 11/02/2017 8:03 pm
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I'm pretty sure reverting to the old Ridings would be a vote winner.

Not with the poshos in Harrogate and Ripon it wouldn't 😀

The whole thing opens a can of worms - reversion to 1930 borders will be fun around Sheffield,while 1887 borders might be controversial for Singletrack Towers staff as well.

I think we need to be told!


 
Posted : 11/02/2017 8:15 pm
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i think we need an non-binding, advisory vote....


 
Posted : 11/02/2017 8:16 pm
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The whole thing opens a can of worms - reversion to 1930 borders will be fun around Sheffield,while 1887 borders might be controversial for Singletrack Towers staff as well.

Derbyside area and Yorkshire/Lancashire border will be magically fixed … just like Gibraltar and the NI border will be… just have faith… quit your moaning…


 
Posted : 11/02/2017 8:26 pm
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