[Closed] EU Referendum - are you in or out?

Thanks to Brexit you can cancel that and just watch the news for all your comedy/drama/soap needs.

Plenty of debate among C lawyers

what does the "C" mean?

Not that you might think!!!

Constitutional

Not true. Plenty of debate among C lawyers on this issue. We even negotiated and entered the EU under Royal Perogative, so it would be helpful not to keep making things up.

Know your place THM, You're forgetting that we are getting a lecture on constitutional law from the bloke who spent two years telling us that Scotland would retain automatic EU membership, and after losing a referendum said that they never needed to hold one in the first place as they could UDI 😆

Still, little Englanders like myself ought to be careful, we run the risk of drowning amidst the flood of tears and bed wetting if The Donald wins this month, followed by the deluge when parliament votes to uphold the result of the referendum

[IMG] [/IMG]

[quote=5thElefant ]That would be immoral. They're supposed to represent their electorate.

I don't think that means quite what you seem to think it means.

Ninfan, I am not sure it's about upholding a decision. If I have read the ruling correctly, it's essentially a technical issue. Does this need and Act - yes or no. They were be clear that the decision had nothing to do with the rights and wrongs of Brexshit

If we're doing pretty graphs, have you seen this one ninfan?

[img] [/img]

I'll let you work out the conclusion yourself

So the 5% (or whatever) that regret voting the stay... err... why? It's not like we're staying.

5thElefant - Member
So the 5% (or whatever) that regret voting the stay... err... why? It's not like we're staying.

Which graph are you reading? 😕

98% of Remain are happy with their vote, 1% are unhappy, 1% are undecided,

89% of Leave are happy with their vote, 6.5% regret their vote and 4.5% are undecided.

11% of 17.4m voters is 1.9m which means that were the referedum re-run, with exactly the same voters, it'd be a dead heat.

Oh, look aracer, an opinion poll.

If only we had had some sort of national opinion poll in which everyone got to decide once and for all whether to stay in the EU or leave, instead of a 'representative' sample run by a polling company

😳

So MPs should represent their constituents/the electorate, in which case, presumably they should vote to remain. 30-something percent of the electorate voted to leave, 30-something percent voted to remain and the rest didn't vote, so presumably weren't fussed with the idea of change (there is some (non Brexit focused) research that says you're less likely to vote if you are happy with the status quo). Therefore the will of the electorate (rather than the will of the voters of the referendum) is probably not to leave the EU.

Also if I was a self serving MP I might well gamble on the youngsters who can't yet vote but who like the EU voting for me at the next GE while the elderly leavers die off

You could hold an election with MP's being forced to say how they would vote and each party saying how they would carry out the...er plan?

The sooner we dig a big moat between us and Europe the better.

http://www.lbc.co.uk/radio/presenters/james-obrien/james-obrien-nigel-farage-brexit-betrayal-court/
Very well put.

What a kerfuffel.
Especially have to laugh at leavers saying its undemocratic that the high court ruled to uphold democracy.

Those sneaky foreigners will just tunnel underneath it if you do that, BWD

I have minimal doubt that we'll leave, this is a step towards soft brexit. Or Sexit, as I'll be calling it from now on.

BadlyWiredDog - Member 
The sooner we dig a big moat between us and Europe the better.

😀

If only we had had some sort of national opinion poll in which everyone got to decide once and for all

Once and for all? An excellent idea because clearly nobody is ever likely to change their minds, and certainly not within a few months of such a vote. Anyway if a small % did then that wouldn't change the result of a vote with such a clear margin...

OH what fun.

I am loving the leavers moaning about the fact that a British Court has decided on this in line with known British legal and constitutional principles but somehow it is wrong because it didn't go there way.

The twirling as they try to make their ludicrous position look like it makes sense is hilarious.

Thing is, if mp's only accept brexit if we still have single market access, Europe will insist on free movement, so what then?

Ok then we leave, but the only thing that will achieve is less influence in EU, and less control..everything else stays the same?

Spectacular cluster****.

nobody is ever likely to change their minds

This was inevitable but, despite no wanting the result of the vote, I am not comfortable with the MPs ignoring the populus

My prediction is a fudge with another ref vote that is binding

That would be immoral. They're supposed to represent their electorate.

They are supposed to represent the best interests of the electorate. Its not in the best interests of the electorate to jump into the unknown. Neither is it if the governments proposal (if they finally get round to having one) is clearly at odds with what is best for the country.

The small majority voted leave, but it would be hugely irresponsible to do this without having a clear plan of what 'leave' actually means. Or are you suggesting that regardless of the implications, because the largely uninformed public have had their say (on both sides) it doesn't matter what the deal on the table or implications are?

Due diligence in the decision making process is a mainstay of any successful business or organisation. Should the running of the country be any different?

I have minimal doubt that we'll leave, this is a step towards soft brexit. Or Sexit, as I'll be calling it from now on.

😆

Excellent work RichPenny!!!

That is definitely what it's getting called from now on

Those sneaky foreigners will just tunnel underneath it if you do that, BWD

That could never happen. Unless Mexico pays for it of course.

Of course my local MP (lobby fodder, no thinking parts, lack of moral compass) supported leave. His constituency voted remain.
When I suggested that if he were following the will of his people (actually I believe MPs should act in their constituents interests, but hey) he should speak out in favour of remain he claimed there were no figures by constituency.

I must be thick here, because I am lost with the headline and the noise here. As far as I can make out, we have merely seen a ruling on a technicality - you need an Act of P to pass something that effects so many people, even if there is precedent that suggests the opposite. But this makes no difference to the nature of the Brexit - that is something TI be negotiated after A50 has been triggered - as the legal opinion I quoted concluded this is essentially a symbolic gesture.

The fact that Farrage is getting his y-front in a twist seems to be irrelevant

What have I got wrong here?

Exactly, imagine trying to make a business case or get a project approved..

Goal: leave the EU
What's the mandate: there isn't one
What will this accomplish: dunno but some members of staff think it's a good idea
What will it cost: a shed load, it will probably sink the company, best case scenario we'll outsource everything apart from the CEO
How will you implement this: not telling you

Project not approved.

Igm are you epsom? Exactly the same result that I got.
Of course the results are obtainable.

i see why theyr'e dragging putin into this now

how else would you explain away 3 high court judges dying of polonium poisoning

tpbiker - Member
That would be immoral. They're supposed to represent their electorate.
They are supposed to represent the best interests of the electorate......The small majority voted leave

A minority of the electorate voted to leave. Therefore MPs morally should vote to remain

teamhurtmore - Member
I must be thick here, because I am lost with the headline and the noise here.

Basically, the ruling government (the Conservatives) cannot enact Article 50 (which triggers Brexit) without the full approval of parliament. That means that it must have a majority vote in both the House of Commons, and more troublesome for the Brexiteers, the House of Lords in order to leave the EU.

What a fun story to come home from work to.

THM is this your day job? 😀 😀 😀

[url= http://http://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/articles/article_50_no_need_for_frothing_and_foaming_the_system_is_working_1_4761442 ]New European Editorial today.[/url]

(My bold)

And in case anyone forgets, and begins [b]to froth and foam [/b] about betrayals of democracy and treachery, it was the Great British public that put this system in place, over the course of centuries.

Let's not forget why we are objecting.
My mother voted out as a Nigerian nurse was apparently rude to one of her friends in hospital.
This level of stupidity and bigotry is unlikely to be a one off.

ZippyK - York

I must be thick here......
What have I got wrong here?

I am sure they will find it rather easy.

It is a first step. That's all. There's a fair way to go yet before we can consign the brexy-boys to history.

But a nice start.

hich means that were the referedum re-run, with exactly the same voters, it'd be a dead heat.

Boris Johnson, "Brexit means Brexit and we are going to make a Titanic success if it". Perhaps worst speech he's ever made

What a knob.

Looks like we have new form of democracy being created by the influencing losing few.

Rejoice! Rejoice! Said the reminders as they put the spanner into the works.

They cannot even believe they have managed to overturn the majority vote with the help of the devil.

Now they are celebrating. Joy they feel! Joy!

The question do they know how to celebrate? Do they?

igm - Member
It is a first step. That's all. There's a fair way to go yet before we can consign the brexy-boys to history.
But a nice start.

Chewk did you /could you vote?

zippykona - Member
Chewk did you /could you vote?

To me I disagree with the EU system.

You wanted UK society to be governed by UK laws, that is what you got today. 3 UK judges applying UK laws.
If you are not happy about it, you can appeal to the European Court.