[Closed] Entitled dog owners

she was right though they had a point if it was just a curious puppy being curious - I thought the dog was going to either eat bag or wee on it tbh - still time to edit 😉 ]
Could have been a childs face next time though

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BREAKING NEWS: Dog Sniffs Bag In Park!

You would have called the police regarding a puppy sniffing a bag .........
Do you call the RSPB when bird shite in your garden 🙄

she was right though they had a point if it was just a curious puppy being curious

What?

It was a puppy so it needs disciplining so it can learn. Exactly what Mrs Aracer was doing, no?

[quote=Junkyard ]she was right though they had a point if it was just a curious puppy being curious

But the issue was the owner complaining at her shouting to the dog to get away from the bag (because the owner clearly wasn't going to), and also suggesting to her that it was her fault as she wasn't allowed to leave her bag in a public place.

I'd have suggested calling the police due to owner's attitude - I don't really have anything at all against dogs, just their owners.

Get a life. I guess you felt you were entitled to put your bag down in a public space. Own that space do you? Both parties sound stupid here.

Er, yes she is entitled to put her bag down in a public place without it being interfered with. Dog isn't entitled to mess with other people's stuff even in a public place.

Why's she been stupid? She shooed a dog away from her stuff, what on earth is wrong with that?

I'd have called the police and put up the bat signal. Sniffing can kill. Puppies can kill. Put the two together and you've mega-armageddon-death-spiral-apocolypse.

If it was my dog sniffing someone's bag then I would have called it away. However, I can't really see what crime is being committed here. Being "under control" does not mean being on a leash. It's a park, dogs go to parks.

It was a puppy so it needs disciplining so it can learn.

Trying to teach a dog not to sniff things is like trying to teach a goldfish to keep its mouth closed. 🙂

the issue was the owner complaining at her shouting to the dog to get away from the bag

Agreed - a reasonable owner should have just said [i]"Sorry"[/i].

But then I think your wife should have just said [i]"That's alright. He's just a puppy. Aren't you boy.. aren't you.. yeff you are.. awwwhh..whoo's a wittle cutey..."[/i] 😀

substitute dog with child - even though you wouldn't want someone else kid poking through your stuff, if you shouted at the kid i expect most parents would get offended - rightly or wrongly. imo talking about calling the police because a dog sniffed your bag is probably taking things a bit far. the owner moaning at you cos you shouted at his dog for poking in your stuff is probably upset at the shouting, and not thinking clearly about the fact he was poking in your stuff, he probably should have apologized for letting the dog get at your stuff and moved on.

i'd forget about it and go and do something else.

The issue was that the dog owner didn't call the dog away, hence not under control, and didn't think it reasonable for mrs aracer to tell it to go away.

What graham s says to save me some cutting and pasting time 😉

if you shouted at the kid i expect most parents would get offended

Some would but we are discussing right and wrong not what folk do.

Most folk will cut you up and then give you the finger if you beep them.

If the owner didn't call the dog away, how do you know it wasn't under control?

I think I'd have been tempted to get my phone out and ask if I should call the police to get their advice on whether dogs were supposed to be under control in a public place

"Hang on lads, put that rape case investigation on hold, frame someone quickly for the murder last week. There's a puppy sniffing a bag in a park. That SOB is going down!"

scotsroutes Imagine it was savaging a childs face then if it helps 😉

I don't know if its the general feeling of lethargy in the workplace this morning, or the subject of this thread, but I can't be bothered to say anything.
So here's a man who once sniffed a boy's arm.
Big chin or what.

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I don't tihnk this thread is about the dog. It's about the owner shouting at aracer's wife.

It's generally not ok to abuse strangers.

The dog/bag incident is not really the issue.

It the dog owners attitude of 'it's a dog, it can do whatever it wants and to hell with the rest of you' that stinks.

I'm with you OP and would have confronted the owner (not the police bit!). I'm also sore right now after being knocked off my bike by a dog yesterday. Owner - same attitude. Dog out of owner's sight and therefore not in control at the time.

Phew, I'm glad some people get it - clearly I didn't write the original post very well if folks think it's the dog acting like a dog which is the problem (though I'd have thought the title might be a clue).

Maybe I'm just touchy because I got a similar attitude when I got bitten by an out of control dog (in that case getting my phone out and suggesting calling the police did result in a change in attitude).

If your bag was so important to you that left it on the other side of the pond, then you had a go at my dog / puppy for sniffing it, then I'd probably not have been particularly receptive either! 😆

What exactly was she trying to achieve by shouting at the dog anyway?? Trying to train it to ignore unattended property??? Bet it won't do that again 🙄

Hmm, so you're also entitled. Bag was important enough to keep in clear view, with the assumption that social norm is not to interfere with other people's stuff (one which dogs belonging to entitled owners are exempt from, because dogs can do what they like).

Not her job to train the puppy - I'd imagine shouting at one is a reasonable way to get it to stop doing what it's doing though.

A dog once ate my packed lunch in Richmond Park. I was rather upset about that, as I had ridden 15 miles to get there, I was very hungry and completely skint.

The owner did apologise, which was decent of them. If they'd yelled at me for shouting "oi! gerroff my lunch you knob!!" at their hound I would probably have killed them and buried their corpses in a shallow grave.

Phew, I'm glad some people get it

(currently suffering from a high incidence of [i]crap dog owners[/i] on my commute so a bit of a touchy subject)

You could kick my dog up the arse. Wouldn't bother me in the slightest.
(Lethargy again, sorry)

I think the general reaction of people when someone is shouting at a pet or child (whether they are in the wrong or not) is a defensive one.
Anyway, why was Mrs Aracer so worried about the dog sniffing the bag? Hmm did it find the large stash of heroin that she was dealing to the little kids in the park...?

Such anger.

and also suggesting to her that it was her fault as she wasn't allowed to leave her bag in a public place.

Actually its a bit irresponsible leaving the bag for a number of reasons

did it find the large stash of heroin that she was dealing to the little kids in the park...?

Or just mummy's secret stash of Nigella's Finest Baking Powder? 😉

Actually its a bit irresponsible leaving the bag for a number of reasons

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only a puppy so what did you expect

I don't get this. The [i]owner[/i] should be thinking about what a puppy is likely to get up too, and then showing a bit of common courtesy.
IMO if you take your dog out to a public place then the dog is basically an extension of you, and you should control it accordingly.

and you should control it accordingly.

And I don't get this - what the hell did the puppy do that was so objectionable that it was out of control anyway?? I can understand your righteous indignation if it had curled out a walnut whip in Mrs aracer's handbag, but it had a bit of a sniff of an unattended bag. So what? Not really a big deal, is it??

Did none of the entitled dog owners on this thread read the "investigating" bit in the OP?

Dogs sniff, puppies are generally safe. Owners are sometimes rude. Non-owners are sometimes rude. Work it out, folks.

Our dog is totally harmless, very friendly but nosy - he once peed up a sports left bag near a goalpost on common land. We were very sorry and handled it like champs - ie ran away and hid behind a bush while the dog caught us up 🙂

Few days ago our dog got attacked by another dog on the street because the owner wasn't good at controlling his 'not friendly' german shepherd. No remorse from the beller, except when it was suggested by Mrs Rider that he was a pole-smoker.

People and dogs eh?

Did none of the entitled dog owners on this thread read the "investigating" bit in the OP?

Dog investigates seemingly abandoned bag in park. Impressive dog.

Reported by mrs aracer, not experienced directly by me (I'd have been a lot more rude). She'd left her bag round the other side of a pond the kids were sailing their toy boats on, when a dog came up and started sniffing/investigating the bag. She shouted at the dog to get away from the bag. Which resulted in the dog owner having a go at her, telling her that it was a public place and dogs were allowed to go wherever they liked and anyway it was only a puppy so what did you expect.

personnaly I don't get the logic that dog owners can freely toilet their dog in spaces where we want kids and families to congregate and play and that the only (supposedly) dog free space is the fenced of little kids play area.

the priorities should be reversed with a fenced off dog toilet/ exercise area and zero dog presence for the rest of the park

not that I'm fed up of "in-control" dogs chasing after my kids whist I try and teach them to ride in a traffic free environment

I once encountered something similar but it was actually a child's face! well nearly any way.

A dog came up and took some food from my 2 year old daughter, I shoo'd the dog away and told the owner he should learn to control his dog or put it on a lead and the owner got very upset and ended up offering me out for a fight, swearing and everything in front of my and his kids/wives. His wife dragged him away looking very embarrassed!!

Some dog owners are tits, but most aren't. I think.

Dogs normally sniff things before peeing on them so I would of shooed the dog away but not of shouted. Mind you there are so many dimwitted dog owners who feel its okay to let their dogs piss anywhere.

In our defence (the bag was obviously owned by one of the blokes busy playing footie) there's no fence between the fields and the pitch and he got away from us (usually trots alongside like a magnet), we are normally very responsible dog owners I like to think, and it's the only issue in the seven yrs we've had the scamp. Karma caught us up, he nearly died of gall bladder failure last year and cost nearly two grand to fix 🙁

One of my hounds once jumped up and ate a kid's apple. I bought him an ice-cream to compensate (the child, not the dog). Everyone was happy.

As a dog-owner you have to expect that your hound might very well sniff out food, and apologise when they do it. At the same time, it's a bit galling when people lay out a picnic in a park where they know there are a load of dogs and then act surprised when a hungry trailhound tries to investigate the sausage rolls.

Tolerance all round would be a very good thing.

At the same time, it's a bit galling when people lay out a picnic in a park where they know there are a load of dogs and then act surprised when a hungry trailhound tries to investigate the sausage rolls.

Ridiculous. Are you suggesting that the onus is on the picnic party to go somewhere else rather than you control your dog and keep it away from the picnic?

[quote=nickf ]At the same time, it's a bit galling when people lay out a picnic in a park where they know there are a load of dogs and then act surprised when a hungry trailhound tries to investigate the sausage rolls.
Tolerance all round would be a very good thing.

So where are you supposed to have a picnic without getting somebody else's dog trying to eat it? I'm quite tolerant of dogs who don't interfere with me - are you also tolerant of people having picnics who aren't interfering with your dog?

Hint: there is a solution to the issue of dogs interfering with people's picnics which doesn't involve people not having picnics. Well actually I can think of a couple, one of which is to ban dogs from parks, is that your preferred solution?

Some [s]dog owners[/s] people are tits, but [s]most[/s] many aren't. I think.

Some [s]dog owners[/s] [s]drivers[/s] [s]cyclists[/s] people are tits, but [s]most[/s] many aren't. I think. fixed

there is a solution to the issue of dogs interfering with people's picnics

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the priorities should be reversed with a fenced off dog toilet/ exercise area and zero dog presence for the rest of the park

Not sure about zero presence. the problem is badly behaved dogs and their irresponsible owners not dogs per se

you can d that with cars, bikes, people /children whatever

If it ever happens, it will be an awesome day when city parks become dog free zones. Nothing against dogs, just don't like seeing city parks becoming no go zones for families and kids as there are just too many dog produced land mines.

Reported by mrs aracer

It's natural for a free running dog to check out a picnic in a public place, the argument is whether the dog should be on a lead for the whole picnic season just because it may happen to run upon a picnic (picnicers aren't always visible from a distance in order that one can leash the dog in time). - these things will happen, the important thing is to control your dog if you are aware of picnics, or deal politely with the potential fallout if not. People have to learn to co-exist in public spaces with the potential of all manner of variables as there's no shortage of nobs on either side.

And I don't get this - what the hell did the puppy do that was so objectionable that it was out of control anyway?? I can understand your righteous indignation if it had curled out a walnut whip in Mrs aracer's handbag, but it had a bit of a sniff of an unattended bag. So what? Not really a big deal, is it??

That's sort of my point. It's for Mrs aracer to decide whether it's a big deal or not, not the dog owner. When you're trying to prove a point it's easy to say anything short of someone getting bitten is "not a big deal", but the same's true of most inconsiderate behaviour. OK, in this instance it's not exactly anyone getting savaged, but it really gets my goat when dog owners basically abdicate responsibility for what their dog's doing and expect everyone else to like it.

[quote=Malvern Rider ]It's natural for a free running dog to check out a picnic in a public place, the argument is whether the dog should be on a lead for the whole picnic season just because it may happen to run upon a picnic

How about if you're in an area where you know people are likely to have picnics? The issue is still that it's not those having picnics interfering with your dog. If the dog is doing what is natural then clearly it's not actually under control, and the likelihood is that it's never under control when running free in such areas whether or not anybody has a picnic. It's simply that usually you get away with it.

I'd happily shout at a dog if it was sniffing my stuff. Nothing nasty about it but I just don't like it.

When you're trying to prove a point it's easy to say anything short of someone getting bitten is "not a big deal", but the same's true of most inconsiderate behaviour. OK, in this instance it's not exactly anyone getting savaged, but it really gets my goat when dog owners basically abdicate responsibility for what their dog's doing and expect everyone else to like it

This.
I'm bruised and sore right now because of a free-running dog yesterday. I haven't broken any bones so that's ok then?

Hint: there is a solution to the issue of dogs interfering with people's picnics which doesn't involve people not having picnics. Well actually I can think of a couple, one if which is to ban dogs from parks, is that your preferred solution?

Did you read what I said? If you did, you'll note that I said that

(a) people [i]shouldn't be surprised[/i] if a dog comes along in a full-of-dogs park. I didn't mention banning anyone, or stopping people having picnics. But the dog owners are entitled to be there, just as much as the picnickers, and the dog owners are there 52 weeks a year, not just for two weekends in the summer.

(b) tolerance on both sides is a good thing.

Now, tell me again what I said that was so wrong.

[quote=nickf ]Did you read what I said? If you did, you'll note that I said that
(a) people shouldn't be surprised if a dog comes along

Ah, translation: "people shouldn't be surprised that dog owners feel entitled for their dog to do what it likes". How galling it is for you that some other people don't like your dog not being under control.

But the dog owners are entitled to be there, just as much as the picnickers, and the dog owners are there 52 weeks a year, not just for two weekends in the summer.

I don't think anybody disagrees that dog owners are allowed to be there - I think some of us are even happy if they bring their dogs. What we're suggesting is unacceptable is when the dogs interfere with other people who are also allowed to be there. Oh and BTW I do also particularly like the sense of entitlement which comes from being there more often.

(b) tolerance on both sides is a good thing.

Can you remind me again what the dog owners are being tolerant of? Other people sitting there minding their own business not interfering with their dogs? It doesn't seem a particularly two way thing this tolerance.

Oh and I noticed that you didn't suggest stopping anything or banning anything, just as I'm not suggesting stopping or banning dogs [b]which are sufficiently under control that they don't come interfering with my things, sniffing around my picnic, or jumping up at my kids who might be afraid of dogs[/b]

Somehow I had expected that free-running dogs are under control. It appears from the above and similar experiences to the OPs that I shouldn't expect that.

I now remember why I left this place for over a year.

Don't worry, I'll not be back.

(a) people shouldn't be surprised if a dog comes along in a full-of-dogs park.

No, they shouldn't be surprised. But they absolutely, unequivocally have the right to be left alone to go about their day without being hassled by other people and / or their dogs.

If your dog is sniffing around someone else who's sitting their minding their own business, [i]you[/i] are intruding on [i]their[/i] space. No ifs, not buts, no excuses, no "he's only a puppy and it's what they do," take some responsibility. You do not have a dog-given right to mither others.

Quite why some people think that a shared public space where children play is a great place to use as a free-roaming dog toilet is beyond me anyway, but that's a whole other argument.

[quote=nickf ]I now remember why I left this place for over a year.
Don't worry, I'll not be back.

Because people disagree with you, not everybody loves your dog as much as you do, and you don't appreciate being told that your dog isn't under control if it's sniffing at somebody else's picnic or jumping up and stealing food from somebody else's kid?

Missing you already.

Though congratulations on singlehandedly proving the title of the thread.

Though congratulations on singlehandedly proving the title of the thread.

Singlehoundedly?

(sorry)

Because people disagree with you

No I think it's because you are coming across as a sanctimonious prick.

She'd left her bag round the other side of a pond

If you have a dog picnics are a nightmare, as the amount of litter left around is a PITA

A sanctimonious prick who thinks dogs should be under control?

Whereas he and presumably other dog owners on this thread doesn't think there's anything wrong with an out of control dog sniffing around a picnic, or jumping up on a child (so long as he buys an ice cream).

If you have a dog picnics are a nightmare

If only there was some way of, I don't know, tethering your animal to you so that in didn't run off uncontrollably at the first whiff of someone else's food. Radical I know, it'll never catch on.

(And TBH, litter is a PITA regardless of your dog-ownership status; grotty buggers, take it away with you.)

Well that's 3 minutes I'll never get back, what a load of old cobblers.

If you have a dog picnics are a nightmare

Shirley Put them on a lead when there is a high risk of them wandering off into other peoples picnic??

Because people disagree with you, not everybody loves your dog as much as you do, and you don't appreciate being told that your dog isn't under control if it's sniffing at somebody else's picnic or jumping up and stealing food from somebody else's kid?

No, because of the usual pick-holes-in-what-people-say bitchiness and general whining on STW.

For the record,(and this really is my last post on this or any subject) I have my dogs under control. I don't take them to the park in the summer precisely because there are picnickers there and it means I'd have to keep the dogs on the lead in case a hysterical muppet might think my dogs (friendly, well-controlled) are about to attack a child. I have no time for those irresponsible dog-owners who don't clean up after their animals.

Tolerance is what you need, not a narrow-minded viewpoint that you are right and everyone else is wrong. I keep my dogs away from mollycoddled children and hysterical parents because it's just too much like hard work to deal with the hassle. I shouldn't have to, but I do so because, after all, life's just too short.

Can't imagine anything like that happening around our way - most of the dogs and dog owners have far too much filling and scattering of poo bags to be getting on with. 😀

[quote=nickf ]Tolerance is what you need, not a narrow-minded viewpoint that you are right and everyone else is wrong.

I've already said that I'm tolerant of dogs which are under control - I actually quite like dogs (which aren't interfering with me and my stuff). Is it OK if that's all I'm tolerant of?

I keep my dogs away from mollycoddled children and hysterical parents because it's just too much like hard work to deal with the hassle. I shouldn't have to, but I do so because, after all, life's just too short.

Would it be "pick-holes-in-what-people-say bitchiness" to wonder why you think you shouldn't have to keep your dogs away from other people (some of whom, and not just the mollycoddled and hysterical, might not like dogs - or are they by definition mollycoddled and hysterical in that case)?

Or maybe just "pick-holes-in-what-people-say bitchiness" to correct:

[quote=nickf ]I don't take them to the park in the summer precisely because there are picnickers there and it means I'd have to keep the dogs on the lead in case a [s]hysterical muppet[/s] normal person might get upset at [s]think[/s] my dogs (friendly, well-controlled when on a lead) [s]are about to attack a child.[/s] sniffing around their picnic

If only there was some way of, I don't know, tethering your animal to you so that in didn't run off uncontrollably at the first whiff of someone else's food. Radical I know, it'll never catch on.

Its the ****ing litter *everywhere* that makes it a real problem, so in the rare event of taking them anywhere where people picnic I have the joy of them pulling rubbish,plastic packaging, nappies and human shit out of the undergrowth.

If I see a picnic mine go on the lead as 1 of them was regularly fed by picnickers when he was younger so he has learnt to sit by a picnic and look hungry, and the other was also starved to death and then dumped by her previous owners so has a bit of a thing about food.

Also if someone yelled at me about my dog sniffing their abandoned bag, I think I would just laugh at them tbh; as I would think they were a bit special.

No, because of the usual pick-holes-in-what-people-say bitchiness and general whining on STW.

I thought you were't going to be back?

I shouldn't have to

Yes, you really should. And the fact that some dog owners either can't or won't see that is the root of the problem.

I like dogs. I'd have one myself if I was prepared to deal with the responsibility. But plenty of people don't, or are scared of them, or allergic to them. Plenty of people also have this wacky, irrational aversion to getting their bags peed on (as a random example). And you know what, they are well within their rights to reasonably expect to be able to go for a walk without getting covered in slobber, slutch or dog hair from someone else's pooch. You're not being special in not bothering people, I don't bother lots of people on a daily basis and don't give it a second thought.

If your dogs are under control they won't be going anywhere near the picnicers, will they? Do these people leap up and shout "oh my god, a dog! Quick Brian, hide the Spam!" from the other end of the park when they see you? I don't think I'd be walking a dog in that park either, it sounds like it's full of weirdos.

I genuinely applaud the fact that you sound like a responsible, respectful dog owner. I'm just a little confused as to why you appear to resent being so.

Also if someone yelled at me about my dog sniffing their abandoned bag,

No-one yelled at the owner
Bag was not abandoned

How about if you're in an area where you know people are likely to have picnics?

As I wrote: The important thing is for you to control your dog if you aware of people having picnics.

This would (hopefully) be the same if one thought it likely that there are picnicers. I know it would for me. That's what leads are for! Get along, people!

nickf » Tolerance is what you need, not a narrow-minded viewpoint that you are right and everyone else is wrong.
...
Don't worry, I'll not be back.

*Preaches Tolerance*

[IMG] [/IMG]

Rage Quits!

😀

molgrips - Member
Also if someone yelled at me about my dog sniffing their abandoned bag,
No-one yelled at the owner
Bag was not abandoned

The bag was dumped/left/abandoned on the opposite side of the pond to its owner.

As for the yelling part I was referring the aracers reply that he would have been much more confrontational if he had been there; mind you he could be an 'internet warrior' in which case the reality is he would have just mumbled into his latte.

Ah, sorry MR - lost in translation. Certainly wasn't meaning to have a go at you.

The bag was dumped/left/abandoned on the opposite side of the pond to its owner.

She shouted at the [u]dog[/u] to get away from the bag

What would have been acceptable? a polite conversation with the dog?

Yes the bag was left, but i really can't see what is wrong with shouting at a dog to leave someones belongings alone regardless of where they are.

Shouting at the owner on the other hand is a different matter, but that isn't the issue here.

[quote=richc ]As for the yelling part I was referring the aracers reply that he would have been much more confrontational if he had been there; mind you he could be an 'internet warrior' in which case the reality is he would have just mumbled into his latte.

Oh believe me I've been pretty confrontational with irresponsible dog owners. Not that it involves yelling, and in case you missed it the original situation involved shouting at the dog, and the dog owner then being rude and confrontational.

As for the yelling part I was referring the aracers reply that he would have been much more confrontational if he had been there

I think he means he'd have yelled at the owner for yelling at his wife. As I would too - well perhaps not yell but I'd have had a word.