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Seems Edinburgh covid cases are dropping pretty rapidly - down to the trigger for level 2 now:
I wonder if the tier will change when they do the review this week?
I can't see it, I think scotgov will want numbers down to lower levels before easing again.
Where's that from YGH?
A colleague this morning been pulled over by police as she headed across the Tay bridge. Police checked her reasoning to go from Fife to Dundee (medical appointment), and sent her on her way. They said that they are now implementing patrols on bridges and key roundabouts to check who is travelling where.
Funnily enough, there was a police car on the Dunblane bypass today (seen on lunch walk), so it does seem they are pulling the net a little tighter.
But, it's not law as yet, is it?
As long as they don't check the cycle lanes. 😉
But, it’s not law as yet, is it?
Nope. She said they made that clear, and she personally feels reassured that they are checking some of the key crossings. Obv's they could tell her address from number plate, so clearly a targeted stop.
And we're (Shetland) finally in proper tier 1 from Friday with 2 households allowed to meet inside. I did worry we might go to 2 as we've had a few cases recently.
Edinburgh remains in 3 despite the fall in cases. I'm miffed
Ah, that means the P&K border a mile from my house is now not 'wrong' to cross. #lookonthebrightside
And Stirling on the naughty step despite having never (that I have seen) going over the 150 cases threshold! Although we did jump up to 139 today, maybe I'll have to be happy on the naughty step.
No travel from 3 to 3 either Matt I'm pretty sure.
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we're kinda just dragging it out, eh...
No travel from 3 to 3 either Matt I’m pretty sure.
LA+5miles for travel to exercise, providing you're not going into a lower from higher or higher from lower.
means if East Dunbartonshire moves to T2 and all around remain T3, I'm on a virtual island.
No travel from 3 to 3 either Matt I’m pretty sure.
Correct. Though the way it's worded I can see how you could be mistaken. Exercise reason excepted.
if East Dunbartonshire moves to T2 and all around remain T3, I’m on a virtual island.
You can transit to another safe zone through higher zones.
means if East Dunbartonshire moves to T2 and all around remain T3, I’m on a virtual island.
I essentially am already in the Borders. T2 area bordered by England (lockdown) 10 miles one way, East Lothian (T3) 10 miles the other way, the sea, and the entire width of the Borders to Dumfries & Galloway (T2).
How long were cases in Shetland below the tier 1 trigger value before it moved down to tier 1?
And when is next review? Can see a lot of hospitality businesses and suppliers not doing well if they miss the Christmas trade.
Shetland was in Level 1 from the start of that system. The documentation on Level 1 states that two households can meet indoors but that was excluded when it first started. We are in Highlands. That's also Level 1 but we still can't meet up in each others houses.
You can transit to another safe zone through higher zones.
yeah in theory I could head out to the trail centers, but to me, it just wouldn't feel right with everyone else around me in a 'warmer' tier.
Yeh we've been in level 1 in Shetland all along but couldn't meet inside. Nicola has said island communities can meet t with one other inside now. But if anyone leaves the Isles they should not mix inside for an undetermined period of time.
We've had a total of 70 cases now, 3rd from bottom I think.
Top suggestion to name Glasgow city councils new gritter is.....
Margrit Ferrier super spreader! 😆😆😆
Class!
LOLz!
I got stopped by the police this AM going to my Mums in Balmullo, from Edinburgh. I was dropping off a food delivery for her as she couldn't get an online delivery and is blind so is scared to go out. They were fine about it but wanted to see the groceries in the boot !
Hey, my mum and dad are in Balmullo too!
Where did you get pulled over?
A92, just by Kirkcaldy.
Looking likely greater glasgow will be into Tier 4 this Friday
Seems that way - a sweetener so it can be relaxed for Xmas so we can all mix and then need a third lockdown in mid January.
I'd just put all of us in the central belt in tier 4.
From an east coast perspective people here seem to be getting pretty antsy at being in the same tier as Glasgow, when we're doing literally twice to three times "better" on average. I do think Glasgow probably has to go up but I also think it'll restore a bit of faith in the east and make people think that we're in the right tier after all.
(IMO, as long as things are stricter in England they should be taking advantage of that here to get controls as high as they dare and get prevalance down as far as possible and also to get a bit more reality to set in instead of the ridiculous "Oh god, the pubs are closed, this is DRACONIAN" bullshit that seems to have actually become pretty standard. I reckon they can get away with and basically motivate people to approve of much more, as long as it's 1% less than England and the national news is obsessing with that. So even though we could probably drop edinburgh a level I'm quite happy that they've not)
Aye, while we're far from great here, we're not at Glasgow levels, I'd support driving it down for 2 or 3 weeks.
Easy for me to say, as it wouldn't really affect me.
Nurse on wife's ward was due to get punted on rota to ITU yesterday, got sent straight back, 6 nurses, only one patient. That's a good sign.
Sights like this are pretty depressing
I have to say as an Edinbugger that I am getting pretty fed up of this and want us to go down a tier.
I know the long lens is a cliche, but that is made to look a lot worse, you can see the slope of buchanan st.
Spoke briefly to neighbour of past 18 years earlier today, intelligent guy, early 50s, responsible job and his wife is a head teacher, 2 late teens boys. He was saying they have basically all said stuff it to lockdown, now it’s winter they’ve had enough - fed up missing nights out, gigs etc. They had folk round both nights of the weekend, boys had pals staying over etc.... Oh, and his mother died of Covid a month back.
I honestly didnt know what to say, so just said nothing and moved on...gobsmacked..
I have to say as an Edinbugger that I am getting pretty fed up of this and want us to go down a tier.
The biggest growth in the last few weeks has been from tier 1 and 2 areas, be careful what you wish for. Tier 3 restrictions is what has driven your numbers down, I'd rather see us stick with it than look for a gold star.
Iain, There's another covid cliping thread, move along.
I didn’t say anything about cliping, my thoughts were more around the ineffective nature of the lockdown measures as time goes on.
Aye, we're surrounded by these folk, I'd just rather not give them a platform or even a second thought tbh.
Agreed, though when you think you know someone reasonably well and have had some respect for them it kinda highlights the flaws in the whole approach. I suspect we will float between Level 3 & 4 here right through the winter and until the majority have been vaccinated.
Aye, I think you're right.
I did just find out that my bit of Edinburgh is one of the current offenders. I assume it was a key swapping party or something. Or maybe that one dude that works in Alldays whose mask doesn't fit properly over his epic beard.
But, still, it slightly rankles that Edinburgh is 87 cases per 100000 over 7 days, Glasgow is 275 and in the same tier, borders is 61.5 and is a tier lower. I'm not that guy, but I can totally see why that guy says "this is stupid, it's the same here as there really, I'm driving to glentress". Or whatever. It's a hard sell.
Many pals who work in or run pubs, venues and restaurants aren't very happy at missing out on the December/Christmas trade which is essential for their businesses.
Doesn't make much odds to me personally, I'm on UC and just go for long walks all day and make my own beer.
The 11 areas moving to level four in Scotland
Those council areas are: the City of Glasgow, Renfrewshire, East Renfrewshire, East Dunbartonshire, West Dunbartonshire, North Lanarkshire, South Lanarkshire, East Ayrshire, South Ayrshire, Stirling and West Lothian.
The measures will begin on Friday, will be in place for three weeks, and are due to be lifted on 11 December.
☹️
"The guidance on travel restrictions will become law from Friday.
That means people living in level three or level four must not travel outside their own council area, except for certain essential purposes."
No more Glentressing for Edinburghers
Pessimistically I think we need to change the thread title. The other big news is that travel ban is becoming law! Struggling to see the justification for certain areas tbh. But there we go.
"Pessimistically I think we need to change the thread title" Nah we're lucky enough to have up to 3 groups meeting out doors now. Still not the 5 groups that we had in August though.
It must be hard for those much more restricted, never mind those now going to level 4. Regardless of Xmas easing I'll not be seeing family for Xmas as they're down in England, hoping I'll get to see them at Easter when my daughter baby arrives.
The other big news is that travel ban is becoming law
Will be interesting to see if the 5 mile guidance for exercise etc becomes part of the travel law.
'The maximum number of people you can meet indoors and outdoors in a restaurant, café, pub or bar is 6 which can be from up to 2 separate households. From 19 November 2020 this will increase to a maximum of 8 people from up to 3 households outdoors.'
Does this mean 3 households can only meet for hospitality outdoors (beer garden or something), but not indoors for hospitality from Thursday? In which case it's effectively meaningless here (Shetland)
Will be interesting to see if the 5 mile guidance for exercise etc becomes part
Hopefully the 5 Miles outside yer council area for exercise is still the plan, wee yin goes horseriding 2 miles into East Ayrshire on a Saturday, wife and I take this time to go walking the local hills (within south ayrshire)
Sorry Edinburgh City People, that's because I washed my motorhome in anticipation of a cheeky weekend away. Bugger.
V interested to hear more about the legislative side of travel. Nicola used the words "not out and abouut"
I was planning a socially distanced ride with a mate from another part of stirling at the weekend. He is not leaving the council area but will be more than 5 miles from home.
I didn't hear her mention 5 mile limit Steve
finally tier 4, should have happened 2 months ago countrywide.
The tier levels are a pile of nonsense btw, as ye say got guys like TJ upset they aren't going down to tier 2, nothing surer than if that happened, things will start rising as things open up in edinburgh and more people travel over there... (Where do you think all the glasgow dafties will go for their christmas shopping and pints.)
Who was it that said whack a mole.... cause that's what we are playing at. (ie this is boris's silly game)
Should have been. 2/3 week lockdown 2 months ago, and we'd probably be going into another 2 week lockdown just now, but that would be infinitely better than this dragging it out nonsense. tier has been inevitable for months now.
2 week aff for everyone every 2 months(or as soon as numbers start rising) should be the strategy, instead of this procrastinating about overly complex tier systems and rules they've put in place.
The game is to keep numbers down, not let them rise quickly and then drag it out.
Re the five miles for exercise - it is all in the travel guidance - under Exceptions at the end. So you can travel for exercise but only five miles. I am pretty sure Glentress is more than five miles from the border with any other local authority area - Mid Lothian would be the closest I think?
https://www.gov.scot/publications/coronavirus-covid-19-guidance-on-travel-and-transport/
Aye, 5 miles outside your authority, not 5 miles hels? I'm not reading it now, as it usually takes a couple of days to update, or even change.
local outdoor informal exercise such as walking, cycling, golf, or running (in groups of up to 6 people from no more than 2 households) that starts and finishes at the same place
travel locally (within around 5 miles of your local authority area) to reach a place to take exercise outdoors
Without wanting to confuse things, surely the within around 5 miles of your local authority area is a typo that should read within around 5 miles of your local authority area
Looks like a content writing failure to me
Why should Highland have tier 4 now Seosanh?
Incidentally I agree we should have gone to a lockdown a few weeks ago Problem is people didn't want to comply with rules or advice, now that it's going to be law I have doubts that will be anymore effective.
Re Local authority area. Stirling is bloody massive. Tyndrum is over 50 miles from the city for instance, so that is not even remotely passable for local but according to that, its fine. So i could, im theory, cycle over half the west highland way as mugdock is still stirling.
I think what they are trying to say is travel five miles - if you live right on the border you can travel five miles into another authority for exercise. I think. I don't actually know but that would make sense and be easier. I just tried to find the draft amendment to the regulations but nae luck.
What I don't think they are saying is that you can travel all the way across your authority, then another five miles. That would make no sense. In any case - whichever is correct - we get Glentress to ourselves for a few weeks except the law breakers who I am sure will be both manifest and legion.
I am taking it as hels reads it.
You cannot travel outside your local authority area without 'proper' reason.
You can travel up to 5 miles or so for exercise, regardless of local authority boundary.
And remember Rule No.1.
I live in Edinburgh and I'm in an extended household with my parents who live in Aberdeenshire. Currently I can travel to visit them despite them being in a different authority and a different level to me. Is there any news whether that'll change with travel restrictions becoming law?
I think what they are trying to say is travel five miles – if you live right on the border you can travel five miles into another authority for exercise. I think. I don’t actually know but that would make sense and be easier.
It's an awful bit of content. I lead teams that build GDS services and I'd be having a user researcher and content designer having a long hard look at that.
gordimhor
Full Member
Why should Highland have tier 4 now Seosanh?
now cause they're committed to the tier system, that horse has bolted, point i'm making is the slow decision making of their tier system and their slow decision making is the big issue here.
2 months ago, if you are applying their current rules, no where should have gone tier 4. But if you applied common sense rules. Everywhere should have. But dragging on we going. They've allowed prevalence to go to high.
Let's wait and see what is written into law.
The guidance will be following the law - if the amendments to regs come into force Friday they must be laid in the very near future. Already written I would say.
GDS - how did that TLA make it past the swear filter!
Seosamh I agree with your assessment of the situation we're in and of where we were two months ago. I just think that people finding a way of stretching the rules because they feel that they're an exceptional case or especially folk just plain doing what they want because they're scunnered, stressed at breaking point etc, is a major cause of the higher prevalence of the virus.
I reckon some of Scottish governments decisions have been late. I worry that this one may be too late to allow any relaxation at Christmas but we still need to tighten up now and if that means a crap Christmas so be it.
Frustrating to be just inside an area that remains tier 3- our council boundaries got changed a while back and without that we'd be in tier 2. But so it goes.
****ing Richard Leonard...
"And he questioned why areas such as North and South Lanarkshire had been included at a time when their transmission rates were falling."
Is it because even though their rates are falling they're still the third and fourth worst areas in Scotland and literally twice as high as the tier 3 average? 3 times higher than at mine? Yes Richard, yes it is. Just as well he's totally irrelevant, or shit like this could be harmful.
The guidance will be following the law
The guidance was there before they mentioned putting the travel restriction into law.
The 5 mile thing is too vague. As the crow flies? By road? By footpath? It'll have to be removed from the law part. You can either leave the area or not. Although it's a pain for those of us that live right on the border of 2 areas. I can walk a couple of streets into a different local authority area
I worry that this one may be too late to allow any relaxation at Christmas
I detest my mother in law and sister in law so I'm desperate for the restrictions to be in place at Xmas so I can avoid the day from hell with them.
If it's not then I may fake covid to get out of it or claim that I've been in close contact with a positive case!
Ok. I am slightly confused. Is the 5 mile thing about travelling to exercise or for exercise? I’ve read it that you can’t drive 20 miles to go for a walk, for example but you could do a 20 mile walk. Also can I do a road ride starting/finishing at home which takes me into a different tier?
gordimhor
Full Member
Seosamh I agree with your assessment of the situation we’re in and of where we were two months ago. I just think that people finding a way of stretching the rules because they feel that they’re an exceptional case or especially folk just plain doing what they want because they’re scunnered, stressed at breaking point etc, is a major cause of the higher prevalence of the virus.
Nah, people don't help, but it's absolutely government handling that's to blame, both uk and scottish gov(uk taking a bigger share of the blame imo.). But It's been either half arsed or just sheer incompetence, probably a mix of both.
New restrictions will make sod all difference to the folk doing what they want anyway.Boils my piss that I won't be getting up any hills as I help reduce the rate by following the regs.Meanwhile some wee scheme goblin can carry on stotting from house to house at the weekend, with the odd maskless swagger through Tescos to confirm their baddie status. Bet social media is just as full of group rides, folk up hills etc.
NB; for clarification scheme goblins range from 14 to their natural diet suppressed lifespan of late 50's.Not singling out young folk here.
Was more just thinking you are being a middle class bawbag rather than ageist there tbh. Of course the middle classes are exempt from house parties. They'd never do such a thing! 😆
I guess people's particular prejudices come to the fore at times like this...
New restrictions will make sod all difference to the folk doing what they want anyway.
Very much this. Particularly as it has all but been announced that the legislation won't really be enforced.
From the BBC website,
Asked by Highlands and Islands MSP Donald Cameron how the travel ban will work, Ms Sturgeon replied: "The police will enforce the regulations in the way that the police have enforced all the regulations that have been in place, in other words it will be a last resort."
She added that she expects people will be punished only where there is a "clear and flagrant breach".
Assistant Chief Constable Alan Speirs encouraged people to take personal responsibility and "do the right thing" to prevent the virus from spreading.
He added: "We will use enforcement as a last resort where there is a clear breach of the legislation.
"The chief constable has said publicly on numerous occasions that we will not be routinely stopping vehicles or setting up road blocks, and that will not change as a result of travel restrictions now being in law.
"However, officers may in the course of their duties come across people who are travelling from one local authority area to another. In areas where travel restrictions apply, officers will continue to use the common sense, discretion and excellent judgement that they have applied since the crisis began."
Oh well, looks like the wee yin is stuck hillwalking in South Ayrshire with us on a saturday instead of going 2 miles into East Ayrshire for her day of buggering aboot wi horses. She'll be delighted! 🙂
as ye say got guys like TJ upset they aren’t going down to tier 2,
I am just peed off about it as I try to follow the rules and with cases lowish and going down in Edinburgh I had hope for a relaxation
I am going to have to look very carefully at the rules for riding for exercise as I live in the city and most of my commonly used routes take me out of the city. riding within the city is somewhat limited
local outdoor informal exercise such as walking, cycling, golf, or running (in groups of up to 6 people from no more than 2 households) that starts and finishes at the same place
travel locally (within around 5 miles of your local authority area) to reach a place to take exercise outdoors
I read that as there is no restiction on riding outside the area? Anyone help me out? the five mile travel is to travel to start my exercise so no glentress but if I am on my bike ride no resatiction on how far I go as all my bike rides will be starting and finishing from the same place - my front door.
I am just peed off about it as I try to follow the rules
So, the same as the rest of us then.
TJ - Scottish Cycling say no to travel outwith your LA to ride, under Level 4, unless you ride there..
I am in tier 3.
However then that agrees with my interpretation that I can ride from my house out into east lothian and back again