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Shit. Unsurprising, given Trump's appointees, but still shit.
Not quite that simple, he has immunity when carrying out official acts. One of the next tasks will be to see which of his many crimes were "official" and which were not
End of democracy?
The US system of politically appointed prosecutors and judiciary has always reeked of shit. It naively relies on politicians of integrity. I'm not sure that ever has been the situation but the US has scrapped the barrel in recent years when choosing it's president and not unsurprisingly the scrappings turn out to not taste that great.
I'm not sure democracy is dead, but by any standard the US would look like total hypocrites if they ever attempted to promote it in a 3rd party ever again.
Don't worry though, give it 12 months and Trump will have pardoned himself of everything and anything and will be moving on to a Putin style removal of time limits on presentency and today's news will be the merest of sidenotes.
The US system of politically appointed prosecutors and judiciary has always reeked of shit.
Theres a bit of research that has been done by a project called 'Fix the Court' recently into 'gifts' made to Supreme Court over the last 20 year - the figures tot up to over $4.7m dollars- of, you know, innocent ol' 'gifts'. Before clicking on the link have a guess what proportion of that figure is just gifts to Clarence Thomas.
Then consider that its not a proportion of the gifts to the current court, but all the justices he's served amongst totalling 18 judges
Also look at the percentage of those gifts he willingly disclosed and how much more is suspected and hasn't been declared yet
Don’t worry though, give it 12 months and Trump will have pardoned himself of everything and anything and will be moving on to a Putin style removal of time limits on presentency and today’s news will be the merest of sidenotes.
I can sadly see this happening (or at least attempted). The irony of ripping up 'The Constitution' whilst at the same time arguing about such things as the right to bear arms as it is written in 'The Constitution'.
Certainly Biden should withdraw. I would say a great deal of voters in the US do not want trump representing them on the world stage, but at the same time arent too happy about voting for a president who possibly has dementia.
A new dem' candidate would secure more votes
The definition of an Official act
seems to be anything done in his capacity as president, which leaves any president an insane amount of leeway, Reps too dem to see that this could be abused terribly by a future Dem president to their detriment
official act
(3) the term “official act” means any decision or action on any question, matter, cause, suit, proceeding or controversy, which may at any time be pending, or which may by law be brought before any public official, in such official’s official capacity, or in such official’s place of trust or profit;
This could be the best gift that Biden (assuming he runs) could have hoped for
certainly galvanised the democratic base
If Biden wins he can now take a hit out on Trump and the right wing SCOTUS appointees.
All official like, too.
Well, that is certainly rather shocking to read. Although sadly not surprising
I'm not sure in all the cheering, whether the GOP might have overlooked the galvanizing effect it will have on their opponents
If there's one thing I'm sure of, it'll come back and bite their arses.
If there’s one thing I’m sure of, it’ll come back and bite their arses.
Yup President Harrises MAGA emergency internment act of 2026, will come as quite the shock
If Biden wins he can now take a hit out on Trump and the right wing SCOTUS appointees.
If he wins? He can just send the Seals round tonight (not legal advice).
If there’s one thing I’m sure of, it’ll come back and bite their arses.
One of the other major cases heard was a reversal of a decision the republicans had loved at the time since it put power into the hands of the federal agencies which were under their control. They changed their mind when that slowly got undone and now moved it into the courts which they control.
found out today that Gavin Newsom was married to Kimberley guilfoyle, crazed former DA and fiancee of Trump Junior and now head of RNC
this article is fantastic insight on the bind the Dem's find themselves in:
So sleepy Joe could have a dream that navy seals could gut trumpy fish and nobody cares if it becomes reality.
cool
And take out the maga Supreme Court judges too 🤷♂️🤦🏻♂️ they aren’t very bright are they 🤯?
finishthat
Free Member
So sleepy Joe could have a dream that navy seals could gut trumpy fish and nobody cares if it becomes reality.cool
As long as it's an official presidential dream it's all good. 😉
I'm not sure if it hasn't wiped the debate slate clean for Biden
Massive own goal long term.
It's another step away from democracy, and Biden must put the corruption of the Supreme Court front and centre of his campaign. Can you imagine what Trump will do with unrestricted power in a second term?
It is rather ironic that the typical republican voter is one who wants less government power over their lives, yet they're likely voting in a president and party that's going to do their utmost to give themselves even more unchallenged power over them
They scream themselves hoarse about liberty when all along they wanted a king.
Ironies upon ironies.
Can anyone explain what the line is right now between what the president can do without question and what needs to go to Congress or the senate. I'm aware of the "Executive Orders" but who decides what they can be? Is that the supreme courts responsibility?
They scream themselves hoarse about liberty when all along they wanted a king.
Yes, I would imagine there's some fairly furious re-writing of Independence Day speeches going on...... if the Dem's can't leverage this, now, then there really is no hope for them.
Indeed.
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c035zqe7lgro The US has a King
I don't understand perhaps naively, how party politics can play a part in the Supreme Court. Surely there is the law, not a Conservative or Liberal interpretation of it? Trump appointing judges seems to be helping him...
FB this morning full of memes of Biden on the phone to Seal Team 6 now he's got the all clear....
If the law is vague, or general, and open to interpretation, then people will have a view on it. That will depend on ther own beliefs, experience and/or morals (see Roe vs. Wade and 2nd amendment).
If you make a law specific, then people will find a way around it, if it is more general, it _will_ be open to interpretation.
Just cos el trumpy is king doesn't mean the poor chumps enacting his dodgy proclamations will be immune too
Just cos el trumpy is king doesn’t mean the poor chumps enacting his dodgy proclamations will be immune too
There will be pardons flying left, right and centre if Trump gets back in. The bloke will pardon himself as soon as he gets the chance. Even the old Tiger King will get one this time around.
I don’t understand perhaps naively, how party politics can play a part in the Supreme Court. Surely there is the law, not a Conservative or Liberal interpretation of it? Trump appointing judges seems to be helping him…
remember that next time judges or lawyers question the ability of government to influence their decisions! The US system of politically appointed judges makes this sort of stuff inevitable. (That said I’m not sure the ruling says what a lot of people think it does - but once you let politics into court rooms the assumption is, it is playing a part and so must be doing what the media says these polar opposites expect).
Well, that is certainly rather shocking to read. Although sadly not surprising
I’m not sure in all the cheering, whether the GOP might have overlooked the galvanizing effect it will have on their opponents
If there’s one thing I’m sure of, it’ll come back and bite their arses.
The military will be confused...
"I, _____ (SSAN), having been appointed an officer in the _____ (Military Branch) of the United States, as indicated above in the grade of _____ do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign or domestic, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office upon which I am about to enter; So help me God." US military officers' oath. Enlisted personnel also swear allegiance to their officers (including their Commander in Chief, the President)
All in it's a dangerous precedent for a dangerous president.
But, there's a great deal of time and testing to figure out to what extent it applies, and what an 'official act' is. It creates a massive cushion of litigation and uncertainty for Trump to take advantage of, even if it doesn't end up giving him carte blanche in the way he thinks (which it may!?). I've no idea if it only covers the period of presidency/sworn in/out of office either, it bloody well should do.
With his current cases, how can anything about the hush money case be seen as an official act of a president, when the crimes occurred before he was sworn into office (as far as I understand?). Same with the classified papers: didn't that occur after he was in office, and waving top secret papers around at parties can be claimed to be an 'official act'.
I guess none of that matters as the headline and not the detail of the decision will be used and abused for all it is worth. It will be seen by him and his supporters as 'I am the immune king of the US'. What an epic and dangerous mess. If feels like the US is unravelling itself.
faustusFull Member
All in it’s a dangerous precedent for a dangerous president.
ISWYDT
A corrupt decision made by a corrupt court. Nowhere in the constitution does it say that a President is immune from criminal prosecution. They are just making stuff up now 🤷♂️🤦🏻♂️ .
Enabling Act Lite.
Even if Trump is elected, DOJ is apparently going to continue with the various cases until roughly January 20th.
how can anything about the hush money case be seen as an official act of a president
As I understand it, it's something to do with some of the evidence the prosecutor used in the trial, which came from when he was in office. The argument is that evidence shouldn't have been included cos of immunity, and if it hadn't, he'd have been found not guilty.
As I understand it, it’s something to do with some of the evidence the prosecutor used in the trial, which came from when he was in office. The argument is that evidence shouldn’t have been included cos of immunity, and if it hadn’t, he’d have been found not guilty.
yep a lot of the SCOTUS ruling was about blocking the use of evidence and making it much harder to request & obtain it
So, where does this ruling stand in terms of the second amendment? Same place as the forces oath?
They are just making stuff up now
I think that boat sailed a long time ago. I doubt that the right to bear arms was written with automatic weapons in mind. The constitution, much like the Ten Commandments, is a document of its time. Some bits still hold up, others not so much.
I hope Trump will reject this decision as politically motivated and false, as he has done with every decision that went against him.
Paying hush money to a prostitute is definitely an official act, everyone knows this 🤦🏻♂️🤦🏻♂️🤦🏻♂️
How long is Biden going to wait before officially authorising the removal of this threat to democracy and national security?
I doubt that the right to bear arms was written with automatic weapons in mind. The constitution, much like the Ten Commandments, is a document of its time. Some bits still hold up, others not so much.
Theres not even a definitive version of the Ten Commandments. Theres a case going on in <I forget which state> requiring schools to display the 10 commandments in classroom. This is
a) in contravention of the US Constitution
b) the version of the Ten Commandments they want to be displayed was written by Cecil B DeMilne as part of the promotional material for his movie.
Theres a case going on in <I forget which state> requiring schools to display the 10 commandments in classroom
Read that.
Ironically the guy insisting on it had his personal fortune go from nearly $3m to $12.5m in only 3 years. So pretty obvious which god he worships.
Crazy
He's a lucky f****ng man
Unlucky for the rest of us
https://twitter.com/yashar/status/1812253927695642918?t=H_9EMfpP0SJ6MtUwtWEBTA&s=19
Gary O'Donoghue on bbc just quoted a passer by as saying (they fired first, this is f*cking war!" It's certainly going to embolden him and his supporters, assuming he's ok.
This is not going to go well, is it?
Covered in blood, shouting 'fight! fight!' to his supporters. Couldn't have wished for a better image.
He’s a lucky f****ng man
If avoiding STIs were 'his Vietnam', I wonder he'll say about this?
Wouldn’t put it past him to have staged this for PR purposes. Including fake blood
America heading into an even darker place.
Attempted shot with a sniper rifle apparently…….
Conspiracy theory hyperdrive from this point on in America.
Could be the Russians stirring the pot? Wouldn’t put it past them in the slightest.
Ignoring all the tempting tin-hat stuff about this being a false flag.
Assuming the shooter is found to be an Anti-Trump lefty this is basically the best possible thing that could have happened to Trump's campaign, he looks like a damn hero.
Everything about this is bad.
Trump’s campaign, he looks like a damn hero.
Everything about this is bad.
Completely agree, how depressing
Weird response from Secret Service. Take him to the deck behind the podium for a few seconds, then let him stand up again and stay there in full view for all the bleeding and fist pumping rather than bundling him off to the side. Very odd.
One of the few people whose death would benefit almost the entire world, but I'd rather he stroked out on the toilet, TBH.
johnstell
Full Member
Could be the Russians stirring the pot? Wouldn’t put it past them in the slightest.
If that were the case and it were proven it could almost be a “positive” in regard to Ukraine at least. A dangerous positive mind you, very dangerous.
I don’t think they would be this brazen though, traceably anyway, or could guarantee they wouldn’t kill him and lets have it, Putin doesn’t want Trump dead.
I suspect this will now ensure Trump wins the GE.
Yeah dead on the bog eating cheeezburgrz is preferable, but not overly picky on the method. This particular outcome however is bigly bad.
Poor old Ukraine. This has probably sealed their fate now.
How could a trained sniper miss something that size?
He’ll be all over media tomorrow, swathed in bandages, and dismissing it as ‘just a flesh wound’ ???
That's Trump winning the election then.
Bit like WWE.
https://twitter.com/danbarker/status/1812257452173525110?t=1jgR5scSSFYh8xBzjkfKZg&s=19
Well that's Ukraine fuct then
Weird response from Secret Service. Take him to the deck behind the podium for a few seconds, then let him stand up again and stay there in full view for all the bleeding and fist pumping rather than bundling him off to the side. Very odd.
Considering the sheer number of armed security in that venue the shooter was probably dead within seconds, hence why they let him back up.
How could a trained sniper miss something that size?
It can't have been a sniper in the professional/traditional sense, there were quite a few shots fired in quick succesion by the sound on the clip, they don't operate like that, you have to re-aim as the recoil would make it impossible to fire that fast and get anywhere near your target on follow up shots.
I would say false flag/staged, but I can't see trump wanting his hair messed up like that in public, so who knows.
He’s obvs better than Abraham Lincoln, JFK and all those other losers who didn’t know how to handle a sniper the way he does
…and where’s Melania?!!! Makes you think
It can’t have been a sniper in the professional/traditional sense, there were quite a few shots fired in quick succesion by the sound on the clip,
I'm. Guessing the other shots were security shooting the shooter
I'm also predicting the politics of the shooter will be complex
But if it was I any doubt Trump has now won the election and Ukraine is stuffed
Considering the sheer number of armed security in that venue the shooter was probably dead within seconds, hence why they let him back up.
Even if they had confirmation that this attacker was dead, assuming that this was the only shooter also seems curious.
Confirmation from the local sheriff's office that the shooter and at least one member of the audience is dead.
You can hear "shooter down!" in the video, so I suspect the identity of the shooter will shed more light on this. There are several gunshots, and its hard to make out what were from the shooter, and what were security/police, shooting the shooter.
This Biden interview in the last week will not play well in retrospect.
“I have one job, and that’s to beat Donald Trump. I’m absolutely certain I’m the best person to be able to do that. So, we’re done talking about the debate, it’s time to put Trump in a bullseye,” Biden said.
Republican politicians have used bullseye motifs on campaigning materials and rightly faced criticism, he won't get off lightly for this.
"myopicFree Member
Wouldn’t put it past him to have staged this for PR purposes. Including fake blood"
That aged well.
? You have to admit everything is possible to Trump. Incidental casualties just as likely to be staged or sad collateral in his fight against the system
What if it was an "offical act of the president" ?
Like other I fear this will aid his campain.
Elon Musk endorsed Donald Trump minutes after he was rushed from the stage at his rally.
The billionaire wrote: "I fully endorse President Trump and hope for his rapid recovery."
He later posted a photograph of Trump with the message: "Last time America had a candidate this tough was Theodore Roosevelt."
The American hero narrative already being pushed.
Wonder if he’ll defend the shooters right to have a gun