[Closed] Donald! Trump!

Ah, so approximately what proportion of teachers do you reckon are failures? Presumably you'd be including the ones who haven't taught their pupils how to correctly use plurals...

I watched the Newslight highlights of Trump's press conference and Evan Davis' interview with Gorka and find myself a little torn. Is Trump's administration playing a blinding - if irritating - game here or are they all just as belligerent and ignorant as each other. On the one hand Trump and his supporters chant "fake news", whilst the opponents chant "alt-reality". Is it all just a big smoke screen or is this really the main feature?

I can understand why a lot of people watching it would have felt that Davis "lost" and Gorka "won", despite my despair at the tactics employed by Gorka. It's either a much cleverer strategy than I'd given them credit for, or just plain luck that will run out in due course.

Fascinating and terrifying.

You can only rate a teacher on the difference they have made to each pupil. A super thick kid will never become super intelligent kid no matter how good the teacher is. Yet a super thick kid could rise up to just thick with the correct teaching.

The fact that all kids of all intelligence are taught the same things and judged against the same things is where the problem is. We have to accept that we cannot all be judged on the same learning.

In equality got us in this situation, I see plenty of well educated 'thick' people who benefitted from the their parents wealth.

On the other hand If you dont have a stable home with good internet access and access to quality education theres a also a good chance you'll end up in shit job mixing with other poorly educated people and confirming each others prejudices.

The brexiters I keep moaning about are the first sort having everything given to them in a plate and they are just thick ****s, their kids are following in their footsteps.

stilltortoise

I can understand why a lot of people watching it would have felt that Davis "lost" and Gorka "won".

And this, in a nutshell is the issue. An News interview is NOT about winning or loosing. It's about explaining to your nation why you have done what you did. However, all Trumps (frankly immoral) team do is to shout and wave their arms around. They don't say ANYTHING, it's just become a "who can win more points" s**t throwing activity.

Go back and look at some of Obamas press conferences. You might not have agreed with him or his policies, but he at least treated people (including the questioners) with respect, and attempted to explain his actions.

That Newsnight "interview" and i use the term in the loosest possible sense, was pointless, nasty, and frankly all it showed was that Trump has put in the place the worst possible people you could ever want. And then you go an look at the backgrounds of those people, and they tend to be less than flattering as well (even if <10% of Gorka's history is bull, he's still a nasty piece of work.

On September 11 2001, i watched aghast, as over 3000 people were murdered by terrorists in a country, which at that time, i considered to be our closest ally.
Fast forwards to today, and you know what, i'll be a lot less sad if the same happens again.
This is what Trumps, angry, playground politics does. It just causes anger, and disagreement. Trump and his cronies say "ah but we taking down the system" but they fail to realise that the system is there for very good reasons. The system is the result of hundreds of years of experience on how to run a country with the least possible anger and conflict.

History shows us what happens when individuals try to rewrite the rules. (see Hitler, Stalin, Pol pot, Kimvjung-un, Mugabee and numerous others). All bucked the "system", all resulted in suffering and anger for the people they were trying to protect)

I'm a bit confused by big n dafts argument - is he suggesting that teachers should consider themselves failures unless all pupils leave school with an above average education?

Hard to beat those damn averages, but never mind, it all evens out in the end.

And this, in a nutshell is the issue. An News interview is NOT about winning or loosing. It's about explaining to your nation why you have done what you did. However, all Trumps (frankly immoral) team do is to shout and wave their arms around. They don't say ANYTHING, it's just become a "who can win more points" s**t throwing activity.

Go back and look at some of Obamas press conferences. You might not have agreed with him or his policies, but he at least treated people (including the questioners) with respect, and attempted to explain his actions.

That Newsnight "interview" and i use the term in the loosest possible sense, was pointless, nasty, and frankly all it showed was that Trump has put in the place the worst possible people you could ever want. And then you go an look at the backgrounds of those people, and they tend to be less than flattering as well (even if <10% of Gorka's history is bull, he's still a nasty piece of work.

But all that works two ways doesn't it? if the news media were reporting in an unbiased fashion, and asking constructive and reasonable questions then it might be different, but we all know that isn't the case much of the time (much, not all), with loaded, leading and and 'trick' questions being laid out because the newsreader thinks they are the new Paxman. It's not like this is purely a Trump complaint, remember not long back when the Scottish were at the point of Lynching the BBC in the runup to the indyref, let alone the ire reserved for the BBC over their coverage of Corbyn in the UK. N
ow, I'm far from saying that there isn't room for critical journalism, but the news medias coverage of Trump can hardly be called unbiased in the runup to numerous recent political events, but particularly in the US election, so this really is a situation of their own making.

so this really is a situation of their own making.

On the subject of people's lack of credibility being a situation of their own making...

much of the time (much, not all), with loaded, leading and and 'trick' questions being laid out because the newsreader thinks they are the new Paxman.

ISTM that you're complaining there about the BBC being biased against idiots.

indeed Trump is a blameless big bag of honest probity and integrity just like you and your argument 😉

To read you fake news like that about fake news is truly awe inspiring
Admit it you were proud of that double whammy weren't you.

I think we would all agree the media often have an agenda [ not least those he considers to be kind and good like say Fox news] but there is a seismic step from this to what trump is doing and saying they make it all up and really his first four weeks have been the best ever or he got the most voted FACT and the most attended etc as he tries*
This is not spin or agenda its just complete BS

* My favourite is spicer and these are your words when they pointed out Trump said ban in a tweet - its just a lie.

Still tortoise, good points. I felt the same but think the answer is the latter. Truly disturbing.

Q good coverage on CH4 news

To read you fake news like that about fake news is truly awe inspiring

See, you appear to be unable to tell the difference between news, reportage, comment and opinion

Much like the BBC really

By the way, did you follow Gorkas advice at the start of the BBC interview? http://bfy.tw/A9qC

Every now and again I have to remind myself that many many millions of people voted for Trump to be their President. I would love to type an impassioned, informed and eloquent post but, seriously, WTAF were they all thinking?

[quote=scotroutes ]It's often the "when did you stop beating your wife" questioning that leads to an aggressive response.

The trouble is, in this case the aggressive response is coming from somebody who is still beating his wife. It appears that not only do we live in a post truth world, but one in which honest journalists get shot down for challenging lies.

See, you appear to be unable to tell the difference between news, reportage, comment and opinion

asking constructive and reasonable questions then it might be different

"What we are concerned about, and what we haven't really heard being addressed, is an uptick in anti-Semitism and how the government is planning to take care of it," Turx said.

As Turx continued, Trump interrupted, "See, he said he was going to ask a very simple, easy question, and it's not."

The reporter said, "It's an important one."

"Not a simple question. Not a fair question. OK, sit down. I understand the rest of your question," Trump said. "So here's the story folks. No. 1, I am the least anti-Semitic person that you've ever seen in your entire life. No. 2, racism. The least racist person. In fact, we did very well relative to other people running as a Republican."

Turx raised his hand again and spoke up.

"Quiet, quiet, quiet," Trump replied. "See he lied about -- he was going to get up and ask a very straight, simple question. So, you know, welcome to the world of the media."

See, you appear to be unable to tell the difference between news, reportage, comment and opinion

Is Trumps knowledge of Uranium 'news, reportage, comment or opinion' ?

Maybe people would give him a chance if everything he did wasn't a lie or contradiction, off for another golf weekend? See his hilarious tweets about Obama playing golf while the world burns.
It just goes on.

News, reportage, comment or opinion.
Or...the semi coherent ramblings of someone who vocalizes his internal monologue....including all of the other voices he hears.

Regardless of prior opinions about Trump, how could anyone who watched that press conference even consider he was fit for any high office?

F***wit doesn't even get close as a description.

As my fellow teacher wife just commented, "I've seen poorly prepared year 7 students give better presentations".

My willingness to give the benefit of the doubt is wearing mighty thin.

I find part of the issue is that we expect our leaders to be at least decent orators and thinkers. OK, George W lowered the bar somewhat, but Chimp is taking it to an all new low. Chimp makes W look like a frickin' genius.

Chimp can't hold a press conference without taking offence when someone shows up his ignorance, which is a classic sign of someone who knows they are way out of their depth. It's a bit like children picking on the remedial kids at school; only in this case, that remedial kid has somehow found himself as Principal and really has no idea how he got there or what to do now he's there, except for taking his anger out on those who have wronged him.

I'm going to ask my mates kid t'morn if he knows what Uranium is, he's only 8, coming 9 in April but I bet I receive a more cohesive answer than [i]"You know what uranium is, right? This thing called nuclear weapons like lots of things are done with uranium including some bad things.[/i]

In fact I'd bet money on it

Or...the semi coherent ramblings of someone who vocalizes his internal monologue....including all of the other voices he hears.

As opposed to someone who couldn't function without a Teleprompter, like Obama?

A Russian spy, a sexual predator and a billionaire walk into a bar.
The bartender says "what can I get you Mr President?"

That phony Lincoln wrote down the gettysburg address as well

i hate those folk who think about what they want to say and make sure its cogent

[quote=ninfan ]As opposed to someone who couldn't function without a Teleprompter, like Obama?

[quote=Socrates ]The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing

As opposed to someone who couldn't function without a Teleprompter, like Obama?

Speaking and communication is a key part of the job. His skills at conveying information are shit.

oh, wow - now then, if only the public had had a chance to come to their own conclusion on this issue before the election, what with Donald craftily keeping himself away from public speaking opportunities during the campaign. Obviously, if he hadn't done this, the people would never have voted for him, would they?

Democracy appears to be a real shitter for lefties at the moment, doesn't it? 😆

none of that even tries to negate the point that he is a shit speaker you sound like trump just saying he won - we know we can count 😉

Its bad but i have to say the humour - your attempts aside- is spectacular. It was the best of times it was the worst of times.

colournoise - Member

Regardless of prior opinions about Trump, how could anyone who watched that press conference even consider he was fit for any high office?

F***wit doesn't even get close as a description.

As my fellow teacher wife just commented, "I've seen poorly prepared year 7 students give better presentations".

Which hardly surprising - Donald Trump is a showman not a politician. 70 years old, Trump has never preciously held elected office. Indeed it is precisely that fact which millions of people found so appealing about Trump - he wasn't part of the political/Washington elite.

Politician is a dirty word in the US in much the same way as it has become here in the UK. The people got what they wanted - someone who isn't a politician.....and lo and behold he's clueless. What else would you expect?

Donald Trump also isn't a dentist, I can guarantee that he would make a pig's ear of giving someone root canal treatment.

The daily situation in goes like this:

1) Trump gives some rambling, farcical, and non-nonsensical speech about how he's going to make the world great again by doing something or other

2) Nobody can understand what he actually meant to say or what he's going to do (where nobody is both the media and the general populous)

3) People who naturally misunderstand Trumps incoherence, take offence, often not helped by his "i don't give a **** about anyone else but myself" attitude

4) The media, similarly confused attempt to ask questions. Rather than clarify, or explain, trump or one of his cronies just derail the conversation, blame someone else (usually harking back to blaming HillaryC), or just shout "fake news" or "the media are liars"

5) Eventually in the face of over whelming public opinion, being ruled against in the supreme court, and yet more petty blame throwing, Trumps team try to pass off the original statements as "we were given the wrong info" or "we didn't mean to say that" or "you idiots in the media misunderstood us". Yet more winging that the whole world is against them and not telling the truth.

6) Return to 1) and repeat ad-infinitum

I was brought up to treat others as i would like to be treated myself, with respect. From the get-go, Trump has been about conflict, name calling, trying to "destroy the career" (<<<his own words) of people he doesn't agree with. Well you know what. **** HIM. It's about time someone beat some good old fashioned manners into that fat sack of S**t. Treat him like he treats others (including his ridiculous, power hungry, immoral, selfish, lying arse licking, rapist, racist, fascist puppet mouth pieces like that POS Gorka)

Clear enough for you Ninfan??

Oh, and anyone who has to repeatedly say things like:

"Number one, I am the least anti-Semitic person that you've ever seen in your entire life. Number two, racism, the least racist person"

Is quite clearly both a liar, and a See You Next Tuesday of the highest order.

People with True Morality don't need to say things like that^^^^

if only the public had had a chance to come to their own conclusion on this issue before the election, what with Donald craftily keeping himself away from public speaking opportunities during the campaign

Seen a couple of articles suggesting that the Democrats and press use his own tactics against him.

All well and good, but then we are in a proper race to the bottom.

Having said that, not yet sure how you would go about negating the current Whitehouse tactics?

Ernie. Totally agree, but just trying to articulate my struggle to comprehend what is going on in the US right now. I watch the news and am floating between incomprehension, laughter and terror.

All down to the nature of the man himself. This is not about his politics or policy (as to be honest I'm not sure what they exactly are based on his announcements).

And, wouldn't you expect someone you choose as your dentist to at least be competent to fix your teeth, whether or not you like them as a person?

Oh, and anyone who has to repeatedly say things like:

"Number one, I am the least anti-Semitic person that you've ever seen in your entire life. Number two, racism, the least racist person"

You missed out this one :

[img] [/img]

I can't help thinking that if Trump believes that "nobody has more respect for women" than he has, then he probably hasn't looked very hard.

maxtorque - Member

On September 11 2001, i watched aghast, as over 3000 people were murdered by terrorists in a country, which at that time, i considered to be our closest ally.
Fast forwards to today, and you know what, i'll be a lot less sad if the same happens again.

GWB was President in 2001 are you sure Trump is much worse than him? Trump is just the latest in a line of horrible US Presidents. Clinton would have been equally horrible.

GWB was President in 2001 are you sure Trump is much worse than him?

Clinton would have been equally horrible.

You don't really believe that do you? If you do, it just shows that if you throw enough shit, some of it will stick.

I don't think Clinton would have spent her first month provoking China and Iran

Probably not as Clinton would be too busy provoking Russia into a military conflict, something which she promised to do as she set out to help her terrorist friends in Syria.

[url= https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/oct/25/hillary-clinton-syria-no-fly-zones-russia-us-war ]Why Clinton's plans for no-fly zones in Syria could provoke US-Russia conflict[/url]

Furthermore Trump's first month of "provoking" China doesn't appear to have had serious consequences for his business interests there.

[url= http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/china-awards-donald-trump-trademark-honour-one-china-policy-taiwan-a7583431.html ]China awards Donald Trump valuable trademark days after he agrees to honour 'One China' policy[/url]

Dwight Yorke refused entry to US (transit via Miami) due to an Iranian stamp in his passport. Regulation introduced by Obama for "that" list of countries

The incident came as controversy continued to rage at the entry ban imposed on citizens of seven Muslim-majority countries by Donald Trump, which was suspended by the courts last week.

However on this occasion, Yorke appears to have been caught by a regulation introduced by the Obama administration.

It ruled that anyone who had visited Iran - along with Iraq, Syria, Somalia, Libya, Yemen or Sudan - were no longer allowed to use the visa waiver programme.

Anyone with an offending stamp in their passport is required to obtain a visa from a US embassy before attempting to enter the country.

Trump = anti-Semitc thing is a bit if a stretch as the Americans would say. Daughter converted and marri d to a relatively religious Jew, administration top team has numerous Jewish appointees and a strongly pro-Israel stance certainly far more than Obama the least supportive President for a long time.

The desperation of Trump's supporters on here, in the face of his increasingly bizarre behaviour, to defend him no matter what simply because he is not representative of their hated "left-wing" politics, is a wonder.

His unguarded comments during the campaign regarding John McCain's war record are coming back to bite him. McCain seems now to be leading the attack from within the GOP against him. I think we will see an accretion of notable Republicans around his lead.

Not only is Trump's "own" party gathering to be rid of him, but when even Fox "News" starts to attack, he must know that it's nearly game over.

In the wings, a well-placed Mike Pence, who is playing a superb game of hide-the-dagger...