Your a disgrace Maxtorque would it make you happy if he was ?
I'm normally deeply uncomfortable with such suggestions, because a life is a life. But in this case I'm reasonably confident it would result in a net decrease in human suffering.
Let's just put this one out there:
http://www.fox2detroit.com/news/local-news/232856168-story
So Trump's travel ban has already resulted in more deaths than all those caused in the US by terrorists from the 7 countries. A green card holder, hence protected by the constitution it seems. I'm sure somebody is working on his impeachment, this seems like an early candidate.
Hmm linky not worky - is it unsuitable news for Fox?
Try
http://amp.timeinc.net/time/4656182/trump-muslim-ban-woman-died-green-card-immigration/
Hmm linky not worky - is it unsuitable news for Fox?
Fox seemed to have pulled that story. The Time story links to the same place you did and the story still shows up if you search the Fox site for "green card", but when you click on the story it just leads to their home page. 😕
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has already resulted in
Correlation ? Causation
Correlation ? Causation
Yeah, impossible to know if reaching medical treatment in the US would have prevented her death (though according to the story her son believes so).
But if the story is accurate then that was still a US resident, a Green Card holder who has lived there since 1995, the mother of an American Serviceman who served in Iraq, who got turned away, couldn't reach US healthcare and subsequently died.
Surely even you can recognise that is not great.
TBH it's all a bit tenuous. Was she flying home for medical attention, and would it have made a difference? Was she already declining? We don't know how old she was or any background... If as he says his mum was certain she'd die if she stayed in Iraq, why did he leave, that seems weird to me... But otoh it's easy to see how a traumatic experience could make the difference here- and let's not piss about, being told you can't return to your home, and that after 20 years living there, raising kids there, you're suddenly being treated like an alien (that's the actual wording)- especially for someone who's been a refugee before? That could be absolutely crushing.
It's very sad but it's possible that "all" the ban did, was make her last days miserable and make her son miss it. That's the best case scenario and it's still absolutely shit. But it's not "killing people".
Agreed Northwind.
Was she flying home for medical attention
Yes, at least according to the text snippet on the image of that oddly missing Fox story:
[i]"A local business owner flies to Iraq to bring his mother back home to the US for medical treatment"[/i]
But hard to confirm since they seem to have deleted it.
It's very sad but it's possible that "all" the ban did, was make her last days miserable and make her son miss it. That's the best case scenario and it's still absolutely shit. But it's not "killing people".
Yep at worst it's just screwing with people's lives for some petty reasons.
It's very sad but it's possible that "all" the ban did, was make her last days miserable and make her son miss it. That's the best case scenario and it's still absolutely shit. But it's not "killing people".
Agreed. I didn't have a chance to read the whole thing but was anyone else confused by the Son's decision to jump on the plane, leaving his mother to a fate he "knew" would result in her death? I probably missed something, though.
Your a disgrace Maxtorque would it make you happy if he was ?
I have no shame in saying it would make me ecstatically happy if he was assassinated. Live on TV hopefully so we can all replay it on youtube at our leisure. If we're really lucky, our own collaborationist leader might be with him when it happens and take some of the crossfire.
Does seem an odd decision, but the story is pretty light on detail.
It doesn't say [i]he[/i] knew she would die, it says that she knew, if she was sent back to the hospital, that she wouldn't make it.
Perhaps at that point he thought she'd be allowed on a later flight after further checks?
I'd imagine a flight from Iraq to the US isn't all that cheap. He may not have been in a position to just throw it away on the off-chance that she wasn't allowed to travel.
I have no shame in saying it would make me ecstatically happy if he was assassinated.
Then you get Mike Pence in charge, and an enraged public ready to grant the government new powers to strike back.
No thanks!
Then you get Mike Pence in charge
Something tells me if the CIA or whoever got to the extreme effort to do a JFK, they'll take out Pence with him.
and to add having spent a brief 40 minutes waiting at check in leaving NZ to come back home to Oz due to "Passport" problems (immigration had not recorded me leaving properly) even in that innocent situation where the staff were being very helpful to get me on the flight it was exceptionally stressful. I wouldn't want to go through it in a place I did not feel safe or when a lot depending on being on that flight. Or where the staff were trying to get you out.
dazh - MemberSomething tells me if the CIA or whoever got to the extreme effort to do a JFK, they'll take out Pence with him.
It'll be like By Dawn's Early Light, they'll work down the list til we'll end up with some random guy who was never supposed to be in charge of anything more challenging than a pub crawl. Hopefully James Earl Jones is on standby.
some random guy who was never supposed to be in charge of anything more challenging than a pub crawl
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taxi25
Your a disgrace Maxtorque would it make you happy if he was ? This thread has disappeared up it's own arsehole IMHO
Firstly, i never said i supported killing Trump, i simply highlighted it was a possibility. US presidents have been killed or attempted to be killed for far less.
So, would i be happy to see Trump shot, frankly, i'd don't care. He's a nasty piece of work, he doesn't GAS about anyone else but himself and his bank balance. He's degrading to women, racist, bigoted and acts like a 7yo. His "play ground politics" only rubs people up the wrong way and leads to days of name calling rather than positive outcomes. His policies are ill thought out and poorly communicated. To compensate he is gagging the press and freedom of speech.
So, if he gets shot i'm not going to shed a tear no. The world will be a safer, less volatile place without him. Yes, America, and the UK, might be a bit poorer, but you know what, i'm more than happy to exchange some material wealth for some decency and integrity.
(in reality, quite how a greedy man, who's the figurehead of a huge capitalist multinational company (which doesn't pay it's fair share of taxes) that exploits it's workers for his personal gain is going to "give power back to the people" i have no idea)
If Trump is either impeached or voluntarily decides to leave office, we're facing the prospect of President Mike Pence.
I'm reminded of an unkind joke from the late 1980s that Bush snr was guaranteed to avoid an attempt on his life because the prospect of Dan Quayle being left in charge was too terrifying a prospect for anyone to risk doing a Lee Harvey Oswald.
Like it or not, Trump is hugely divisive and seems to be attempting to shut down criticism rather than addressing it head on if his orders to shut down the twitter feed of NASA and Parks & Recreation is anything to go by.
I did get revere-Godwinned in this very thread by someone when I suggested that the rise of the Third Reich should be carefully studied, but at what point do you draw the line? Do you protest after people have had freedom of speech denied, after the publication of peer review science has been supressed - and I refer directly to the influence that Trump's cabinet is attempting to lever upon NASA etc - or the legions of Putinesque keyboard warriors who scour the internet for derogatory comments about Trump and post abuse on social media - as recently happened when Singletrack posted on Facebook gently mocking Trump and suggesting his support for regressive bottom bracket standards.
Id put it 50:50 on him being shot dead in the next 3 weeks...........
Id happily admit i'd be happy. Especially if it saves one innocent refugee from persecution, whos life I would value many times more.
What the AG should have done is fight the actions in court and let them decide based upon the law. She knew she was going and just did something for show / raise her profile.
Wasn't she going to have to defend trumps actions in court however, rather than fight them? I thought the refusal to do this was the reason she got sacked. So a woman standing up for her principles is a bad thing?
I did get revere-Godwinned in this very thread by someone when I suggested that the rise of the Third Reich should be carefully studied, but at what point do you draw the line? Do you protest after people have had freedom of speech denied, after the publication of peer review science has been supressed - and I refer directly to the influence that Trump's cabinet is attempting to lever upon NASA etc
The comparison with 1930's Germany is completely incorrect. The political system were very different.
The US system is designed to prevent the President having too much power.
The Senate, House of Representatives and the Supreme Court have a great deal of power and can stop the President from pushing much through, look at Obama.
The AG was going to be replaced anyway. She would not have been able to defend herself in court.
By taking her stand, she knew she would be sacked but she also knew it would draw a lot more attention to the case.
She did very well.
The comparison with 1930's Germany is completely incorrect. The political system were very different.The US system is designed to prevent the President having too much power.
Noted.
But my point was that at what point we decide that policies which blatantly supress truth and freedom of speech become offensive to one's own sensibilities.
did this just slip off the first page for the first time? thought the roaster had had it nuked! fear not, problem solved!
Have you discussed Univision and the ongoing court case yet?
Interesting that one of their reporters was chucked out of a press conference today, and the reporter who has US citizenship was told to
"Get out of my Country"
That wasn't today. It was ages ago. Just went viral today.nickc - MemberHave you discussed Univision and the ongoing court case yet?
Interesting that one of their reporters was chucked out of a press conference today, and the reporter who has US citizenship was told to
"Get out of my Country"
ah, right, couldn't be arsed to search, this thread needs footnotes and indexing
The US system is designed to prevent the President having too much power.
Though one of the big issues right now are his apparent attempts to circumvent some of that (which should be the bigger story, but is being ignored behind the immediate issues)
gobuchul
The comparison with 1930's Germany is completely incorrect.
not completely incorrect no.
In both cases, a strong, single minded, outspoken leader talked a depressed, politically disengaged population, one small step at a time, into accepting "single point" decisions (ie, decisions not passed through the system of democracy in place at the time, but just coming from that leader). In both cases, Freedom of speech was the first victim, where people were blocked, either by actual physical action or through the fear of possibly retaliation, from airing their views. And in both cases, the media became a biased mouth piece from that leader.
Despite being nearly 100 years ago, the similarities are STRIKING and un-deniable.
(NOTE: No one is saying Trump is a Nazi, or similar sensationalist rubbish, but there are significant similarities between the rise and methods of the early Nazi party and Trumps actions today.)
I think I've posted this on here before, but I suspect lots of people haven't read it:
maxtorque - Member
not completely incorrect no.
Of course you are absolutely wrong with that description. 😛
How many dictators did you have in EU over the 100 years?
Where did the two World Wars started?
How many dictators have you seen coming from America?
Did the two World Wars started in the land of the free, America?
😆
Land of the free, which has the highest rate of incarceration in the world
I'll obviously regret it but here goes, so only countries that have previously had dictators can have dictators and world wars can't start in different places because? Chewkw just because something hasn't happened before doesn't mean it can't happen.
I'll obviously regret it but here goes,
How's that regret going? Feel good?
Chewkw just because something hasn't happened before doesn't mean it can't happen.
Which presumably explains why you are attempting to have a sensible discussion with Chewwy.
The comparison with 1930's Germany is completely incorrect.
Agree. He's more like the Social Democrats who preceded Hitler. Inept, hated by everyone, blamed for everything and utterly failing to get his message out.
According to Dan Carlin Hitler had a private army a million strong before he was in government at a time when the German Government had a limit of 100,000. Trump couldn't even get 100,000 people to clap him at his inauguration, let alone an army!
Amazing stuff: Sean Spicer appears to have used the Quebec shooting as proof that The Donald's Muslim Ban is a good idea ?!
“It’s a terrible reminder of why we must remain vigilant. And why the president is taking steps to be proactive, not reactive,’’ Spicer said Monday.
WTF?!
So a French-Canadian (who likes Trump and Le Pen on Facebook) guns down six muslims while they are praying at their mosque. And Spicer basically says "See that's why we can't let them in".
Just wow.
(Apologies if this has been done already. Just getting caught up)
"See that's why we can't let them in".
It's obviously for their own safety. Lots of crazy guys with guns in the States.
I wonder how much money America is going to lose in tourism because of trump?
It's obviously for their own safety. Lots of crazy guys with guns in the States.
Which is, I believe, a direct rip off of the law in some Arab states. If you weren't in the country, the accident wouldn't have happened. 😕
So a French-Canadian (who likes Trump and Le Pen on Facebook) guns down six muslims while they are praying at their mosque. And Spicer basically says "See that's why we can't let them in".
Well given fox news managed to get Moroccan into the first reports its no surprise. (until the Canadian pm's office got on to them and pointed out they were dicks)
Like reading back through some posts in here the flips and spins from Spicer are incredible especially when strung together, you have to wonder of he is enjoying it
That comment by Spicer was made a couple of days ago after a Moroccan born man had been arrested and a fuller picture hadn't been established.
Bigots rely heavily on knee-jerk reactions. I would say that it was an honest mistake that any bigot could have made.
Trump reportedly preparing papers for his run in 2020. Smart move shows he in the job for the long term.
@outofbreath even the most pessimistic estimates for the inauguration where around 300,000
jambalaya - Member
Trump reportedly preparing papers for his run in 2020.
so he can start taking donations
hes all about the $$$
Trump will be impeached before too long
He's all about the ego. That's why he's preparing for 2020
