[Closed] Dogs biting

Another Collie attack yesterday. Was out on my local loop when these 3 girls with a youngish collie walk across prob 50 meters away. I am not aiming at them , as I am on a parrallel track. Collie drops its haunches, tail drops, body drops and comes straight at me. I unclip . and come to stop, as the collie circles.
The girls had to come and grab it in the end as it stayed just out of boot range, barking. I told them if it is disobediant and won't come when called it should be on lead.

druidh - Member
Report it to the police. Give as much identification as you can regarding both the dog and the owner. They may well be regulars in the area.

+10

the next time it could be a child.

AA - you are the one being ridiculous - I have been bitten twice by dogs when out cycling so wtf do you know?- get off your bike and face down a biting dog - don't be absurd. If the owner has not controlled and trained the dog then a swift boot might do so. No way on earth am I stopping and taking the risk of being bitten more. Boot the dog and it may learn that biting cyclists hurts.

Note several dog owners on this thread agree with this approach. I am not talking about maiming the dog but making sure it know who is boss and that biting cyclists hurts

billyboy - Member

Has anyone tried a deliberate policy of running them over when they do attack?

Might depend on size of dog (or owner), this labrador type dog caused chaos in the TDF a few years ago

Admittedly dog hit bike, rather than bike hitting dog, but there is another incident where bike hits dog, and rider doesn't come out that well either.

Fat knacker labrador compeltley pretzels the front wheel, must have been made out of stone - little fücker gets up unhurt and walks away too!!

 

Collie drops its haunches, tail drops, body drops and comes straight at me. I unclip . and come to stop, as the collie circles.

So in other words dog ran towards you and nothing bad happend, who gives a ****, a disobidient dog isnt great but its not a huge drama. From your description the collie genes kicked in and it wanted to round you up as long as your dont start acting like a sheep and try to get away you'll be fine.

I have been bitten twice by dogs when out cycling so wtf do you know?

I know I havent ever been bitten by a dog and that includes separting dogs fighting in the park on a number of occasions recently. Your current actions seem to be driven by fear and dont seem to be working for you too well.

If the dog bites can we bite back? or bite the owner?

😈

AA - bollox - both times the dog attacked without warning. No chance to do anything - no warning no barking or growling - just one moment cycling along the next a dog fastened to my ankle.

I wouldn't kick the dog until it bit

What you dog owners fail to understand is the rest of us have a right to go about are lives unbothered by your dog. Control it or accept the consequences - of which a booted dog is the least. Want to be in court? Want the dog put down? Want to be paying dsamages?

You are responsible for your dog.

AA = Cock .
FACT

TandemJeremy, you quite clearly don't have or like dogs and that's up to you. I do feel your approach is all wrong though. My dog has never bitten anyone but she can get a little exited as dogs do but is under control. I have had people swing kicks at her when she's been out biking with me for no other reason than her going up to them and even try to mow her down because they don't want to slow down. This is completely unacceptable and I make sure I get an apology even if that means chasing them down!

I have been bitten myself very recently of some Jack Russell's and while it is annoying, kicking it would just be over reacting and it is the owners fault anyway. I would only ever kick a dog as a last resort in self defence if I thought the dog could inflict some serous damage.

I have to say kicking a pup is pretty low its hardly going to savage you is it? If people slow down/stop when approaching dogs and owners (which is what your meant to do) it can make a big difference to the dogs behaviour and preventing anything silly happening. If you don't slow/stop then get a nipp you are part to blame and have no right feel aggrieved. If someone actually did kick my dog and it would need to be a very very good reason, if not I would be aiming a kick straight back at the person who did it. Thankfully this has never happened though, maybe being 6'5" has something to do with that? lol

You are responsible for your dog.

I'm well aware of that, but the point your apparently tiny mind cannot cope with is that I am not able to be reposnible or control other peoples dogs and so insead of trying to kick any dog that runs up to me uninvited or wave a letter from my solicitor under its nose or scream and swear at the owner, I take steps to prevent it biting me. Waving my foot at it isnt the best way of doing this.

AA = Cock .
FACT

singletrackmind = internet hardman, gosh I'm trembling in fear.

AA - you are the one being the internet hardman and a complete cock. No one has said the things that you claim they are. Your dog has no rights and I have a right to go about my lawful business without your dog bothering me in any way.

sherry - the pup drew blood before I did anything to it - and I had warned the owner I was riding past. Because it was a pup I merely gave the owner a bollocking - I didn't report it for destruction.

My dog has never bitten anyone but she can get a little exited as dogs do but is under control. I have had people swing kicks at her when she's been out biking with me for no[b] other reason than her going up to them [/b]and even try to mow her down because they don't want to slow down.

That is not a dog under control - this is what you fail to see. A dog should not be going up to strangers uninvited. Get your dog under control or on a lead or accept the consequences. If it was under control then people would not be swinging kicks at it.

No one has said the things that you claim they are.

Any chance of saying that in english?

Your dog has no rights and I have a right to go about my lawful business without your dog bothering me in any way.

Of course you do, but the at the risk of labouring the point that you seem unable to understand, my dog has never and will never bite you so I couldnt care less about your macho bluster. However you do seem to be having a disproportionate number of problems with dogs which is not suprising if you act towards them the way you describe here.

Your dog has no rights

not true, she is my property so if someone damaged her it would be illegal

You are saying people have made statements that they have not made. is that any clearer?

its not macho bluster - I am trying to get into your head that your attitude is is wrong - morally and legally

You accept I have the right to go about my business unbotherd by a dog - but you also state that people should stop and get off their bike if a dog is around.

The dog should be under control - bottom line. Damaging a diog in self defence is not offence at all - infact tits the other way round - allowing your dog out of control is an offence

she can get a little exited as dogs do but is under control. I have had people swing kicks at her when she's been out biking with me for no other reason than her going up to them

If your dog comes up on me, then either you let it or it is out of control. If I haven't invited the dog to me, then it is out of control. I don't know whether your dog is friendly and, frankly, why should I have to? It is your remit to keep it under control.

You are saying people have made statements that they have not made. is that any clearer?

Yes much clearer, care to give an example though.

You accept I have the right to go about my business unbotherd by a dog - but you also state that people should stop and get off their bike if a dog is around.

care to show where I said that?
You can do what you like of course, however I expect dogs will carry on biting you.

I have the right to go about my business unbothered by horses also, however if one is around I slow down or stop and show a bit of consideration to other people. You can run about complaining to the the law about dogs bothering you all you like. It wont stop dogs bothering you though.

I have never been biten by a dog and would think most of you just need to [b]man up and face down the dog[/b] rather than posting on internet forums about your prowes at kicking dogs, whilst no doubt sipping on warm milk whilst mummy tells your its all better.

so insead of trying to kick any dog that runs up to me uninvited or wave a letter from my solicitor under its nose or scream and swear at the owner,

Both from you AA. The first to me means giving way to the dog everytime, both contain a load of hysterical twaddle that none of the posters who want you to control dogs have said.

You clearly think that I should slow down or stop everytime I see a dog - on one of my regular routes I will pass 20 or 30 dogs in a couple of miles

I do not insist every dog be on a lead. I warn every dog owner in plenty of time that I am about to pass. I just want the dog under control.

Any dog is dangerously out of control if:
• it injures a person, or
• it behaves in a way that makes
a person worried that it might
injure them.

DEFRA.GOV.UK "http://www.defra.gov.uk/wildlife-pets/pets/cruelty/documents/ddogslawyouleaflet.pdf"

The first to me means giving way to the dog everytime,

and you said I misquoted you and I talk twaddle, do what you like mate but you'll keep getting into bother. Most people would look for reasons and maybe take some friendly advice, you clearly dont want to, so dont come hopping to me crying next time a dog bites you :lol

You also seem to be trying your best to make out my dog isnt under control, I dont remember anyone on this thread complaining about my dog.

'Dangerously out of control' is defined as being 'on any occasion on which there are grounds for reasonable apprehension that it will injure any person'

reasonable would seem to be the key term here. Getting in your way as you ride your bike I wouldnt expect is covered.

A - we appear to be rather at cross purposes. I have not said you dog is not under control.

You completely miss the point however. It is not up to me to take avoiding action, to slow down more than I would to pass anyone else or anything else - it is up to teh dog owner to control the dog or face the consequences.

I use a bell, I warn everyone I pass dog owner or not, I give them plenty of space.

being bitten twice in decades of riding is not a lot.

Getting in your way as you ride your bike I wouldnt expect is covered

I don't say anything about getting in my way. However if the dog does get in your way after I have given the owner a warning in plenty of time it clearly is not under control

no your right you clearly were not referring to my dog

What you dog owners fail to understand is the rest of us have a right to go about are lives unbothered by your dog. Control it or accept the consequences - of which a booted dog is the least. Want to be in court? Want the dog put down? Want to be paying dsamages?

You are responsible for your dog.

However if the dog does get in your way after I have given the owner a warning in plenty of time it clearly is not under control

I'm no legal expert (thank god) but I dont think the dog is dangerously out of control its just out of control.

You completely miss the point however. It is not up to me to take avoiding action, to slow down more than I would to pass anyone else or anything else - it is up to teh dog owner to control the dog or face the consequences.

My point is the consequences are far more immediate for you ie face gravel interaction. The law will only become involved after you have been injured.

Dunno if you are being sarcastic there but that was written in the general case - "you" plural as in the class of people that are dog owners

I haven't been bitten by a dog but if I am being chased I slow down enough for the dog to catch up and then encourage the dog to run along with me away from its owner. Then when I think am far enough away I speed up and leave the dog behind.
So far the furthest I have managed to get is about half a mile. It's funny to hear the owner shouting at the top of their voice trying to call their dog back whilst it's quite happy running alongside me wagging its tail.

If enough cyclists did this I'd bet we'd start to see a lot of dog owners start to call their pooches to heel at the sight of a cyclist approaching!

Brilliant tyke and what about the cyclist following behind?

TandemJeremy, Yes my dog is under control at all times but if let her of the lead and she wonders up within a few feet to someone and does nothing what's the problem? she does nothing reckless. I call her to heal and give commands and she does it every time, therefore she IS under control. I don't feel the need to constantly have her right at my side at any given moment when off the lead as I can control her. If I see someone visibly uncomfortable around dogs or children are around etc I call her put her on a lead. My dog has NEVER jumped up on anyone or invaded their personal space, the fact you fail to see is dogs like to run and walk around when off the lead which is perfectly normal and legal, and I don't mean on the street.

You sound like your looking for an excuse/opportunity to hit animals? If my dog walks past some idiot who thinks its OK to kick her because she came "to close" then I will be making my point very clear to them. And if you mean face the consequences by hitting an animal that has done nothing to warrant such an attack ie by walking near or past you, you would be the one breaking the law. What is to close by the way, is a few feet OK?

I get the feeling that you would only kick a dog and shout at an owner if they were a woman, old or vulnerable, I can guarantee that you would never do it to me. This may come as a surprise but the world does not rotate around YOU and your self righteous attitude. Other people and animals use this planet as well!

Animals do have rights by the way. They have the right not to be abused by idiots. That's why they have things called animal rights and welfare? You may not have heard of them.

Sherry - fair enough then. You initial posts sounded like your dog was not under control.

My dog has never bitten anyone but she can get a little exited as dogs do but is under control. I have had people swing kicks at her when she's been out biking with me for no other reason than her going up to them and even try to mow her down because they don't want to slow down.

Edit - so which is it - you allow it to come cles to people as in your earlier post or it never invade peoples space?
If it comes too close to me I will call to you to get it under control. If it bites me I will kick it

Stop being so precious about your dogs.

I wonder what would happen if I was walking my leopard and it tore your leg off as you went past? Technically cats are classed as wild animals and you don't actually own them, they just choose to live with you until a better owner/offer comes along. Who would be liable?

Lighten up chaps, weather is getting better, trails are drying out, it's all good!

you let it come up to me it is not being controlled properly and is in breach of the law - that is clear

No it isnt, the law says the dog must be "dangerously out of control" and the worried person must have a "resonable apprehension" that it will injure them. So someone is dog phobic and runs about screaming because my dog is near them thats not illegal, just imoral on my part.

Thats only under the dangerous dogs act there is other law on this both statue and common.

I think a lot of you are missing the point a dog will not stop biting you if you kick it, it is far more likely to see other riders as an agressor and try to bite them. Its down to the owner pure and simple their in the wrong for not keeping the dog under control, problem is finding out who the owner is and where they live, if they came to walk the dog and parked up you may get the reg number. I stop if I see a dog off the lead or slow right down until the owner gets the dog under control if they don't then I have a word with them.

is there, really? could you point me towards it?

In Scotland at least, it an offence for the owner of a dog to let it cause

danger or annoyance to any person

Note the "annoyance" bit. Whether or not someone is in danger from the dog is irrelevant.

Yup for sure there is - I can't find anything but oblique references to other bits of law - same as for definitions of "under control" Need a legal database I guess with access to all the case law.

So your sure yet you cant state what laws my dog would be breaking if it was sat next to you licking its arse?

Links are broken but looking into them on other sites I cant see anything that says the dog cannot wander freely amongst people.

http://www.thekennelclub.org.uk/item/397

a_a - that list is NOT comprehensive. In fact, it says at the top...

On the following pages, you can read about the laws which affect you and your dog the most.

For example, I can quickly point out that both the Countryside (Scotland ) Act 1967 and the Land Reform (Scotland) Act 2003 are missing.

danger or annoyance to any person

yet my dog seems to annoy TJ and it doesnt even live in scotland

For example, I can quickly point out that both the Countryside (Scotland ) Act 1967 and the Land Reform (Scotland) Act 2003 are missing.

Thats cause scotchlandshire is a third world country.....

so what do they say on the matter?

My dog has just read this entire thread and thinks you should all just get over it. He said there are good dogs and bad dogs, and he thinks of himself as a very good dog (but he would say that wouldn't he?), he also said he would be upset if he got a kick in the head because of some peoples prejudice. He believes that you can't treat all dogs the same, and feels sad that in this age of tolerance amongst men that, this tolerance cannot be extended to man's best friend.

he's gone off to lick his bollocks now.

a_a - From the Scottish Outdoor Access Code (produced to assist comprehension of the PRSA 2003)...

the Code defines ‘under close control’ to mean that your dog responds to your commands and [b]is kept close at heel[/b]

TandemJeremy, when I say she never invades personal space I mean she never comes within a few feet or touches them in any way. If I'm out on the trail with her then its inevitable she is going to come near or walk up to some people and it completely cant be avoided if the trails 1 meter wide.

You say stop being so precious over about our dogs but they are our dogs and we like them very much. I can appreciate that being a non dog lover is hard to comprehend this but dog owners get very attached and protective of them. I sort of see where your coming from but I will still go about biting dogs the way I always have and that's to confront the owners. I have never had to kick a dog yet and have only been bitten twice in 17 years of biking and they have been small dogs.

Prevention is always better than cure and I can see where anagallis_arvensis is coming from. Anyway were all after the same thing and that's to get away from the rat race and enjoy ourselves on the trails and have a good time. So lets all be a bit more civil to each other out there, dogs in all.

Scottish Outdoor Access Code sounds like a code to me not a law.

See the quote from Druidh above. I have seen other stuff as well about causing annoyance and definitions of under control

From the defra site

Something as simple as your dog chasing, barking at or jumping up at a person or child could lead to a complaint, so ensure that your dog is under control at all times

The other stuff I have seen is under common law.

However by we are getting a long way away from the crux which as I have said repeatedly is that a dog should be under control at all times and should not cause fear or annoyance to anyone else.

Definitions of under control are hard to find but on a lead, at heel or coming straight to heel or dropping on command seems to be the consensus.

I do not ask that your dog be on a lead or muzzled in public much as I would like - just that your dog is kept under control and I can go about my lawful business without being bothered by your dog in any way. Your default position should be to keep it away from people not to wait until they complain.

I have no issue with properly trained dogs.

As few places with bits of law and interpretations and a couple of quotes

The quote from the Act above means that any dog which is a bit lively might commit an offence if not kept under control - this could be your dog too! For example, we understand a farmer was prosecuted and fined under this section of the Act when his aggressive dogs intimidated walkers on a public footpath, even though the dogs were on private land and behind a fence

On a right of way your dog does not have to be on a lead but it does have to be 'under close control'. This phrase is not defined but pretty much means ............and your dog will not always come, straight away, when called even when he's chasing things, and then stay there, .........

http://www.naturenet.net/law/dogs.html

http://www.endangereddogs.com/EDDRDogLaw.htm

anagallis_arvensis - Member
Scottish Outdoor Access Code sounds like a code to me not a law.

You didn't bother to read what I wrote then....

Try sticking your fingers in your ears and going "[b]LA, LA, LA, LA, LA"[/b].

muggomagic - Member

My dog has just read this entire thread and thinks you should all just get over it. He said there are good dogs and bad dogs, and he thinks of himself as a very good dog (but he would say that wouldn't he?), he also said he would be upset if he got a kick in the head because of some peoples prejudice. He believes that you can't treat all dogs the same, and feels sad that in this age of tolerance amongst men that, this tolerance cannot be extended to man's best friend.

he's gone off to lick his bollocks now.

Best post on the thread!

If they don't hassle me then its fine - live and let live is fine by me.

Sherry - thats fine then - a well trained dog or one on a lead that does not bother me is fine. I have no issue with them at all as I have repeatedly said.

for sure if the path is only 18" wide then we have to come close to pass. I will warn you I am coming past in plenty of time and I expect you to make sure I can get past without the dog jumping at me

I've read all that you've both written but the problem is it does not match up with what you want it to say. I havent said that a dog should be able to chase or jump at children clearly that is wrong and illegal. But TJ's assertion that the dog being near him is annoying and therefore illegal is incorrect. My dog could be perfectly under my control as it strolls past you as long as it would come back or sit when asked to.

Should also be noted that all these codes say cyclists should give way to other users