I want your one with the off switch ^^^
Might be a misconception here.... it's one thing having an off switch, doesn't mean you can press it when you want. In fact I'd go further, as ours has got older the default mode is off, but when she decides it's time to press ON then on it is, and you'd better be ready for a game.
Some good advice here, think Golfchick is spot on. We've had springers the last 25 years and more recently working cockers. They are really, really different. WCS are 'on it' all day. My wife, a dog lover, says we won't have more WCS, but I love it, but my day is geared around them. Stimulating them is absolutely key. It's hard work, every day, but massively rewarding. But accept that you have to prioritize engaged time with them, several times a day, every day.
Wouldn't ever consider another breed!
I have a 7m old working cocker. Absolutely adore him he's a really lovely dog, relatively easy to train and very affectionate. Fits in with the lifestyle we like - outdoors etc.
He can be really hard work, as everyone above has said. It's not just the one long walk, it's needing mental stimulation. Plus very social. It's like when you are trying to cook and the smells and noise are exciting him so he wants your attention.
The bit that I would add to what others have said : (bear in mind he's still really a puppy)
They are very clever, so you can train them to be quiet and 'well behaved'and to sit and watch you cook, but it's still an active thing, he has to be actively concentrating on sitting. Kind of how they don't have an off switch, but you can train a dimmer switch into them.
Also, even if you are at home all the time, consider a day a week at day care from an early age. It socialises them well, gets them used to others, and gives you a quiet evening when he's worn out from playing all day.
Not enough pictures on this thread. Two working cockers here, dark one is 9 and a sprocker (mutt) of some kind, lighter one is 4 and apparently full cocker (no paperwork so no clue if that is true). The older one is fairly calm now (in spaniel terms) the younger one is a nob-end and constantly drives me nuts, love them both to bits though. Fortunately they keep either other entertained and stimulated most of the time as there just aren't enough hours in the day if it was just us (me) having to do that.
They are really, really different. WCS are ‘on it’ all day. My wife, a dog lover, says we won’t have more WCS, but I love it, but my day is geared around them.
And interestingly none of our dogs have ever been this way!
(and this is why I try to keep out of these threads as people portray WC as hyper - which they definitely are not... or shouldn't be)
Our Cockerpoo
AlfieOllie has a working cocker mum and a miniature poodle dad.
He’s by far the cleverest dog I’ve know, I’d swear he’s close to talking.
I was just about to write this so just copied. I am just back in from 20 mins at the park with him with ball launcher. Brings it back every time, then when we are done he carries ball back, does his business beside the park bin so easy to bag and place in bin. Into house , big drink of water, now asleep at my feet 🙂
The best thing i was told to remember...
Labradors come into the world half trained. Spaniels go out of the world half trained !
Cockers and Springers are both ace. Just as per most other comments, they do need a lot of engagement with and training/ stimulation. Because they are not dumb or brain dead. A cocker meets my own minimum size and woof definition of a 'real dog' too (rather than a rat on a rope).
What ever you go for... get decent insurance (read terms and caveats properly) unless you've got £10k+ spare you're OK handing to vets at some point in the future - maybe not now but maybe when they are 8 or 9 or 10 or 11 or 12 and the cheapo insurance Co's have walked away. Said as someone who's Labrador is well over £8k into cancer treatment (after 9+ years fault free running) and will be up around £11-12k by the end off Feb. (We went with Pet Plan - not cheap at all, but when it matters they've not dodged and dived anything and have paid up the first £5-6k we've submitted without problem. Thank fheck we did).
@sharkbait And interestingly none of our dogs have ever been this way!
Sorry, came across as hyper all day, not intended at all. I'd intended alert, interested, ready for whatever next. Lots of training and involvement means they're pretty good at downtime, but I'm conscious they'll need some uptime shortly!
Definitely agree with the day at day care, it's both mine and his favourite day. He gets to fully mix with a huge variety of breeds that I can't simulate without coming across as a crazy dog stalker. It also gets him used to the fact that it's okay that I'm not always there and to be confident.
Sometimes people have perceptions of how a breed behaves based on only owning one of that particular breed and that doesn't always provide an accurate representation. As some have evidenced with multiple dog houses. I certainly wouldn't have described WCS as 'hyper', more as a breed that has a drive to want to do something all day. If you have expectations of the dog happily chilling when you want to watch TV in the evening, or fitting around your lifestyle then it isn't going to happen without input and time investment. When I get home sometimes on my rare working from the office days my OH tells me the dog has been a PITA all day and I ask what he's done with him to engage him to prevent this from happening. He has invariably been trying to do jobs around the house and in the garage all day and surprised he can't just do this with a 9 month old dog around the place who wants input and won't amuse himself without causing chaos.
A pet forum I frequent some users often post suggestions for those people considering dog ownership. For the next three months of your life you have to act like you have a dog so get up early enough everyday and go out for a walk no matter the weather. Do the same after work, spend at least half an hour of your day stood in the garden no matter the weather, another half an hour of the day in a room where you'll train him. Then put asside all the money you would spend that month so £30 insurance and lets call it £40 worth of dog food. Then other bits of money as well for things like natural treats to keep their teeth clean and to amuse them. If you can hack it every day for three months then maybe you're worthy of the devotion and utterly unwavering loyalty a dog will bring.
Not a WCS but always willing to join in on the photos. Yes he's definitely inherited the vocal vizsla trait.
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All Spaniels (Cocker, working, Sprocker, Springer) are ultimately the same dog, however much selective-breeding between different aspects of runts of the litter has resulted in the different breeds. People like to point out the various traits to support their own choice within the breed, as you may have guessed I own a Sprocker :).
Your dog will get used to its up-bringing, so if you can get it in to a routine of you being away from home during the day, and then being around more, its much easier to train that than the other way round. Our dog was 3 when lockdown 1 happened, so appreciated seeing us more, but she can also be left home alone for several hours. They are also very much creatures of habit. I can take our dog on a 20 mile run (she's been trained up to it), but she's euqally happy if she gets her 2 x 30 minute off-lead runs in the woods as her only exercise for the day.
Sounds like you'll be fine with that dog, but I would strongly recommedn that you invest in lead-walking and recall. A lot of spaniels are eager to walk (run) off-lead so pull a lot on the lead, a harness makes no difference. SOmething I need to spend time taining her on.
how's about a Sringador - lab/springer mix?
I have one. Amazing temperament, great with the kids and weirdly does not seem to shed that much or affect my allergy ridden family!
We've had our 'show' Cocker for just over 2 years, first dog, and at the stage we got her the kids were 9 & 12, so similar scenario to you. We decided on a SCS (or SCS/WCS mix) rather than WCS deliberately as they are supposedly a little less 'on' at all times. We also wanted a dog which was sensible sized and would like exercise (part of getting the dog was to encourage us out more). We looked at rescue but at the time (between C19 lock-downs) there were less available (seemed to be a lot of lurchers) and also very hard to find someone who would consider a youngish family / first time owners. I'd echo a lot of what is written above but also note:
- Puppy stage there was a lot of nipping and a few holes in sleeves, but it dod not seem to be long until that stage had passed.
- She can have issues with guarding 'high-value' items. This is something that we have worked with a trainer on, but sometimes can still be an issue. I understand that this can be a trait more common in cockers than other breeds.
- Prey drive, it's got better (she no longer has to chase every bird that dares land on the ground), but if she sees a squirrel, cat, fox etc she'd be off. We have to be careful in a couple of the local parks to avoid 'Fenton' moments.
- She likes to be off to explore. She'll run off quite a way exploring / sniffing. This was very concerning at the start, but we've learnt that she will return and have worked hard on regular treating for checking in with us.
- She pulled very hard when younger on lead walks. She's pretty good at walking to heel now, again regular training with treating worked here.
- Invest in insurance or save a pool of cash. We've had at least 3 grass seeds removed from ears / paws, she freaks out at the vets so has to be sedated which is an expensive exercise. Insurance has covered this for us.
- She's pretty good at home and will happily sleep and watch the dog TV (out of the patio doors) but we are conscious of her getting bored, the kids play with her which also helps and we try to do other things to stimulate her.
- She hates fireworks (we live SW London area so there is a lot of noise around Diwali and 5/11)
- She loves water / mud. Honestly, if there is a large muddy puddle to be found, she'll be in it before you know it's there.
- Having a dog really restricts flexibility. She's pretty good at being left if needed for up to 5 hours but we don't do it on a regular basis. Boarding is expensive if you go away.
Having said all of this, we went into this with our eyes open and knew to an extent what were were getting into. We wouldn't change it, Margo is a proper family member even if she is a little sh*t at times.
A working cocker not working earlier.
My advice to anyone getting a dog is to prioritise getting them used to the car. If your dog loves being in the car, it is a lot less restricting if you want to head out for the day. My dog will happily spend all day in the car, she treats it as her kennel. This means if we are going over to friends house for example, dog can come, even if not coming in to the actual house. Makes life so much easier.
Our car is also her quiet space if she wants to chill without being alert to everything that is going on in the house.
Our WCS is genuinely much calmer in the house than we thought he would be and quick to settle when we want him to. This is partly down to training but also his breeding I think.
Maesydderwen Stevey is his sire and his Mum is a bitch from Rollafields Redbud. Apparently they make great gundogs and family pets. We found a few breeders that seemed shout about one or the other but rarely both.
As no body else has mentioned COI I will mention it again. If you believe biologists the WCS is destined to become extinct. Average COI is really quite high and are in/subject to something called an “extinction vortex”. We decided to try and find some puppies that were bred by people aware of this problem and so selecting mating partners to improve the COI of the breed. Although you could argue that a sprocker or similar would be better!
Interesting what you say about inbreeding. I guess it didn't really occur to me that they are inbred because they appear 'healthy', well proportioned, can walk, run and breath etc, unlike bradycephalic dogs.
Here's a gorgeous boy enjoying being in the front.
Has anyone got tips for sudden teenage loss of good recall?
ah, the teenage years!
No tips for the adolescent loss of recall other than it does comes back!
We also worked really hard on resource guarding from the start (basically because the breed can be prone to this so just 'nip it in the bud').We can take anything off Callie without any problem (including food). However we have friends with a WCS and he is sod for for not handing stuff over - even when it isn't his!
Another point that I don't think has been mentioned and might be contentious but I really wouldn't recommend picking up the dog at eight weeks old. Try to leave him/her until ten/twelve weeks. That extra few weeks of socialisation with mum and siblings in our experience makes for an easier and less 'flighty' pup.
We're 18 months into a WC pup (not our first). Jeez, I forgot just how much of a **** a puppy can be.
Most of what I would say has already been said. Golfchicks advice is excellent.
Do you have a 3 mile (absolute minimum) walk & safe off lead area close enough that you can walk/drive there every single night? If the answer is no, reconsider the breed. We don't 'work' ours, but know many people that do, and we're all agreed on one thing; A healthy working cocker (and I mean from working stock) will walk ALL DAY on a lead, and get nothing from it. They need to run and flush in the undergrowth for an hour a day.
We live (literally) on the edge of the new forest, and If we didn't, I wouldn't even think of getting an active/working breed.
Working cockers in general are a phenomenal breed as a pet, but please don't underestimate the time & effort involved in keeping them happy, especially in the first year.
However we have friends with a WCS and he is sod for for not handing stuff over – even when it isn’t his!
Ours (1/2 WCS) isn't too bad, extremely vocal about it but will give it up on a firm command. We usually offer up something else in return instead. It's interesting what she considers a high value item though - will rummage through the washing basket for my socks, but only dirty ones will do. And the only thing higher value than my worn socks is food.
IDK if that rewards hoarding stuff she shouldn't have, or makes her more inclined to give it up again. She's intelligent, I'm not sure it extends to planning socknapping. She just likes my socks.
A friend’s working cocker had 2 sock related vets visits in a day. Margo is partial to a sock, but tends just to sheepishly hide it in her crate and gives them up ok. We tend to take a small bag of ‘higher value’ treats on a walk as an extra incentive when the normal offering won’t do.
We've been very lucky with our sprocker, she's happy with 20 to 30 mins in the morning, and approx 3 miles in an afternoon, but will do much more when we're out for a "proper" walk.
She doesn't mind being left for several hours, and loves being in the car. After a lot of work, her and the (very timid) cat have even formed a bond.
She's never chewed or stolen anything she shouldn't (she has a well stacked toy box). The only thing we never managed to cure was pulling on the lead, although with a figure of 8 lead she's not too bad.
Has anyone got tips for sudden teenage loss of good recall?
Get that long line back on the go, reduce your criteria to recall him in boring situations and don’t expect him to recall away from high stimulation environments, don’t set him up to fail and also don’t allow him to fail. Once they start to realise that they can effectively ignore the command they will start to question whether it’s worth it. When he does recall in even dull easy situations it’s your job to sound like an utter pillock and make it sound like he’s just done the best thing ever. Not just a pat on the head but full on arms in the air shouting like a loony. Have a toy with you or scatter treats around you that he found because YOU helped him by bringing him back.
I think the best owners are those who are prepared to make plonkers of themselves just to express their feelings to their dogs. I’m often to be seen singing ‘see it’ when he’s watching something stationary as I’m trying to cue him for steadiness rather than pouncing. You’ll also spot me several fields over as I’m running through the grass with him and engaging him in games. He always picks me to sit with and picks me for his shoulder hugs of joy and that makes looking like a nutter totally worth it.
