[Closed] Car Insurance

It's all about risk Tom. You're a high risk, so you pay.

Simples (sorry!)

EDIT - if you take an advanced test/lessons, you'll probably find it comes down

http://www.endsleigh.co.uk/Motor/Pages/young-driver-insurance.aspx

Yes a risk, but over £5k is still ridiculous!

Have you been on the comparison sites?

yep all of them

Postcode also has an effect

Blimey. How young are you?

Mines about £250 and includes the Mrs :O)

(lovely old Golf diesel bought off here last year)

insure your father (or mother for that matter) as a named driver. Always brings premiums down. Assuming they have little or no claim history and aren't disqualified etc.

where i live is in the middle of no-where a few miles from the village and about 5 or 6 from the nearest town

Tom's postcode is - "up on top o't hill, near a tree"

🙂

Put it in a parent's name and be a named driver? Might be worth going with a company that allows you to build up no claims when you are a second driver.

Obviously you need to be comfortable with putting someone else as the main insured party, or else you get into difficulty trying to explain to insurer why your Mum is the main insured, but never drives the car.

£5000 does sound a bit ridiculous though.

ive tried it with my mum and dad as named drivers brings it down to about £4700

isn't fronting illegal ?

It's all about risk Tom. You're a high risk, so you pay.

Basically, the insurers don't want your business- it's not worth their while.
Insurance is all about risk mitigation, or minimisation- you buy insurance (in theory) because you think there's a chance things may go wrong (your house burns down, you crash your car) and you want to minimise the downside or cost to you (rebuilding the house, buying another car).
The insurance company wants to minimise it's downside (paying out), so makes it so expensive for you (you being a 17 year old male) to buy a policy that you don't.

Trouble is, that you need to have vehicle insurance to drive on the road- but that they don't have to provide it for you.

Why's it so expensive?

Well, as a young driver, you will almost certainly have an accident in the next few months, statistically.

And speaking for the over 40's, when we went out with out mates and they crashed a car, putting a mimi on its roof, you climbed out, pushed the car back over, and comiserated. The claim cost £500.

These days, all 3 of the occupants will develop "whiplash" and will all proceed to instruct bottom feeding solicitors who tell you its ok to sue a mate, as "his insurer pays". These aformentioned scum will send you to a dodgy medical expert, who's word is not worth challenging economically at a county court, especially somewhere like Birkenhead or Liverpool county court, where the judges feel the need to "support their local law firms". The lawyers get £1500 min legal fees, the medical expert £250 ish, the dodgy "after event legal fee insurers" get £500, and the medical expert who will always supply a prognosis long enough that their solicitor friends guarantee the legal fees, meaning the claimant gets £2k. He will ask you pointed questions about twinges, and ensure he doesnt have to do too much cut and paste to his standard report he bangs out after a 10 minute appointemnt.

So what was a £500 claim in 1990, becomes a £15000 claim in 2010.

Once upon a time, you tended not to see injuries until you saw labour figures of about £500. Now, anyone gets whiplash for the most trivial of impacts.

And woe betide if you hit someone in another car. They not only double the "whiplash" payout, but it seems everyone needs a "like for like" car for repair duration, a courtesey car is never good enough.

In many cases, the cost of short term hire is far mroe than the repairs, and oddly, when garages are not supplying the car themselves, but one of these "scumbag" accident management companies, your car gets repaired convieniently slowly.

And the courts just love this rip of. Darren Bent the footballer, hardly short of a bob or two, recently recovered over £60k in HIRE CHARGES ALONE when his Aston was hit, despite having another car awailable to him. Courts threw out the insurers arguments.

I see daily, hire charges of over £20k for a few weeks when people have a prestige vehicle damaged.

taka - Member
isn't fronting illegal ?

Yes

Tom - does your mother still have access to a company car? It might be cheaper to have you listed as a driver on that (though it'll increase the excess) and for her to buy/insure another car 🙂

dooosuk - Member
Yes a risk, but over £5k is still ridiculous!

Hmmmmm, I'm not sure about that.

If you set up your own insurance company, would you insure 17 years boys? And how much would you charge them, bearing in mind that the biggest killer of under 20 males in the UK is car accidents? (I think I read that in the paper lately, but I may be wrong!)

All it would take is a fairly minor accident and the insurance company makes a loss on taka's policy even at a premium of £5k - pay off his £300 if fully comp for his written off car, damage to the third party's bumper and parking sensors and a bit of whiplash damage to the third party.

Of course taka doesn't actually [i]need[/i] to buy the car so he doesn't have to pay huge amounts for car insurance.

druidh i need to be over 21 to go on her company car policy

taka, sounds like the same car (106 Kid?) as my daughters. Paid just over £700 while she was learning which increased to £900+ once she passed her test through Autotrader insurance, the renewal last year was about double so switched to Swinton for just over £800 with 1Years NCD. Strangely both policies were with Sabre as the under writer (as were all the other quotes) Now I know girls get cheaper rates and all everyone’s circumstances are different but it may be just a case keeping on looking there may be something out there.

Adding parents (assuming fairly clean driving records) as named drivers should help as will reducing the anticipated mileage. And increasing the excess, but don’t agree with that, what’s the point of insurance if you still have to pay. Although at the car’s value any claim would be a write-off.

Good luck

Realistically, you get the premiums you deserve in the UK.

If you want hte service that allows for claims management companies to earn huge sums out of hire and credit repair, and for everyone to get a £2k payout on the flimsiest of evidence, then premiums have to be high to pay for it.

Its the lawyers that win every time. But then, they get to write the rules without consequence.

IdleJon - I realise that any payout from an accident taka may have will probably be in the region of thousands...but it isn't just taka's premium that covers any potential payout from his wrong doing.

It's ridiculous to expect 17yr olds to be able to pay that much and is no wonder there are so many uninsured drivers around.

Couldn't all the young drivers pay into a pot and effectively underwrite themselves? Standard premium of £1200 say but with restrictions on the car, mileage etc.

Daft idea?

£5600? Blimey.

Saying that, I past my test at 30 and it is costing me £620 fully comp on a 1.4 Fiesta....and that is with Carol Nash taking into account my 7-8 years of NCB I accrued on the motorbike.

Have you tried Hoot?

I think they do a restricted hours policies for younguns

Get a moped... as has been said the £5600 isn't supposed to be realistic, they don't want your business. There probably should be a 3rd party cover scheme underwritten by the government for young drivers but I'm sure it would get abused and be unsustainable.

Just gone through the same process with my wife's insurance.

39 year old librarian with no accident or penalty history. 1 year NCD. Does sod all miles. 7 year old Ford Fusion. Renewal quote was nearly a grand! Bonkers.

Like me Taka, I believe you have a BD postcode. Although I live nearer to Bradford than you, you aren't that far away. Too many uninsured drivers knocking about (50% in some wards) which means they load the premiums. It's been highlighted in the local paper several times recently.

Too many uninsured drivers knocking about (50% in some wards) which means they load the premiums.

Self fulfilling prophecy ahoy! 🙄

Fraud is also a big problem, and the BD postcode is up there.

As is PR, BL, Ol, BB, UB, LU, some B, BD, some Il, and any where else with a large asian/immigrant population. L, SK, M are also problem areas.

Regrettably, the numbers of whiplash claims, where 4 people in a car hit another 4 people in a car where police are never notified of an incident, despite both vehicles requiring expensive private recovery, storage, the non fault driver requiring a hire car, and multiple injury claims funnelled through the same accident management company, are very high.

Essentially, if you were able to see the addresses of companies, known to be a souce of fraudulent claims, you would find culturally, that asian (****stani/afghanistani) areas are grossly over represented. Its quite usual to find asian drivers hit asian drivers, who have their vehicles recovered by asian owned firms who are not even in the phone book or on the net (suggestive they are "prepared" for the accident) and then provided with a hire car from an asian owned firm. Asian solicitors are instructed, as is an asian medical expert. You see how "closed" culturally UK living asian people can be, when working in motor insurance fraud.

I would say however in balance, that those areas identified tend to be economically "poor", and certainly the likelyhood of "frauulent" or "unlikely" injury claims from any ethnic origin from say, large parts of lancashire, yorkshire, are high.

Interestingly, the issue now appears to be escalating with those from eastern europe over represented statistically, and it seems with its high court compensation awards (we are the second highest in europe, behind Eire) and low standards of proof required, that people "claims shop" ie they actually come to the UK to have their accidents. This is born out by the over representation of people with pw or px national insurance numbers. (signifying non uk born).

It seems a cultural issue, that big companies can be defrauded easilly, and so they will, by certain groups. Along with the +'s of multiculturalism, there are -'s, and the attitude to fraud is one of them.

still no better spent all afternoon searching and the lowest ive got is £4700 thirdparty i found it funny when i put in miss Thomas Waller and all the same details it was £1100 discriminating ****ts

Well, if you can buy a set of shears for under £3599 then you're onto a winner.

i could make my self a miss on my insurance policy then blame it on the insurance company for getting it wrong my dads had his car insurance for 15years with his name as markz walker

Is it any cheaper to just get 3rd party ?? That way if you damage your own car you bear the costs, but anybody you hit is covered.

Maybe that should be compulsory for younger drivers, they risk their own car - might make them better drivers. Ban car loans to under 25s might help too. That way if they smash it to bits its already paid for.

You'll need to spend a lot of time on the phone to get a better deal as a young driver the comparison sites really don't work best for people like you. Prepare to spend a lot of time on the phone/online trying lots of people. Prices vary day by day so the cheapest company for you one day will be expensive the next. It will always be expensive but you should get it down to much less than you have currently.

I was looking for a car insurance quote today here in Eire. Axa - 815 Euro , AA - 1400 Euro, Alians - 1200 Euro, 123.ie - 577 Euro. Shop around and you might get lucky.

The use of capital letters, full stops and commas would probably knock a few grand off the quote...

[i]Interestingly, the issue now appears to be escalating with those from eastern europe over represented statistically, and it seems with its high court compensation awards (we are the second highest in europe, behind Eire) and low standards of proof required, that people "claims shop" ie they actually come to the UK to have their accidents. This is born out by the over representation of people with pw or px national insurance numbers. (signifying non uk born).[/i]

My wife had this; she ran into the back of a van, without damaging her car, but the passenger (afterwards) put in a whiplash claim.

Put it in a parent's name and be a named driver? Might be worth going with a company that allows you to build up no claims when you are a second driver.

Obviously you need to be comfortable with putting someone else as the main insured party, or else you get into difficulty trying to explain to insurer why your Mum is the main insured, but never drives the car.

£5000 does sound a bit ridiculous though.

....does this and Insurers won't pay out if there is an incident. Correctly termed subsequently as fronting. In our office it is classed as a fraud offence.

Taka Iam in a simular situation. Have you tried different cars? My current insurance (29, learner, reasonable postcode) on my car is £1560 (Mg ZR 105+ with modifications) If I were to change it to a BMW 316 worth £8000 I would pay £1000ish, were as a fiesta 1.4 worth £5k would cost £1400ish, a new Fiat Panda 100hp (£8.5k) £1100. It all seems inconsistent.

I'm in the same boat, got my Dad's old '97 Golf GTi to drive, 2000cc, Group 14 (old system), and haven't had a quote less than £3000. I know it's a high risk car, but I've been quoted the same for 1.0 Peugeot 106s and VW Polos as well.

Considering motorcycle now, as it's cheaper until I can insure the Golf, and I've been watching Long Way Down! I just turned 18, about to pass test, but I'm not excited in any way because it's just so damn expensive.

Sometimes being a student sucks, then I remember the bike in the shed 😀

Jujuuk68 certainly knows his stuff, and the sorry situation we're in is quite clear. But insurers often don't help themselves - many of them sell accident details where a third party is at fault to claim management companies and law firms. Rather shortsighted, but the thought is that they'll get stung anyway when everyone else does it so they might as well take some cash now to soften the blow.

I think the phone route may be the best option. Try brokers like Adrian Flux and Endsleigh. Or try and find out anyone who has Sabre on their underwriting panel as they seem keen to play in the shit that nobody else will touch (and were actually one of the most profitable insurance companies in 2009).

Another route might be to experiment with different cars. It may seem illogical but a bigger car might actually be cheaper since the 106 is quite a favourite with younger drivers. Or try something that's deeply uncool - a cheap Daewoo, Kia or even a Honda Jazz perhaps?

brad if you've done your cbt and been insured for abit motorbikes are cheap, ive been looking at motorbikes when i passed my test to move onto bigger bikes there about £350fully comp for a 1000cc Honda fireblade or £250 for a Honda crf450 supermoto and get them limited to 33bhp looked like i might be on 2 wheels for abit longer..

If you are in a Bradford postcode as suggested above, not being in it will significantly reduce your premium. Mate just moved from there to Leamington and halved his premiums on a Cooper and modified Evo. Maybe not the easiest solution for you.

Statistically, your age group and that car are synonymous with accidents = risk.
Pick some old duffers car, the odds reduce and it gets cheaper. My first car was a lot less to insure than a mates 1.0 fiesta, mine was a 1.6 nissan bluebird, comfiest seats ever, like a 3-piece suite in a car.

ive also got a hx7 postcode but there's not much difference in the prices

My brother drove a Skoda Felicia 1.3 and paid 300 fully comp. Got a Punto 1.3 3-door 1998 and got quoted 600 fully comp. Why? Cos small cars are used by inexperienced drivers a lot more than large ones.
Same with a mate whose old Polo 1.9 diesel worth maybe a grand was quoted at 1.5k 3rd party. When he changed to a Nissan Almera 5-door 1.6 (waaaay more powerful a car) the premium was down to 999 TPFT.
BTW Check TPFT policies as they often are cheaper than 3rd party only.

WOW!!

im 23 i drive a citroen c2 GT 1.6
got my dad on there 10+ NCB an my girlfriend (21 3 years NCB) both named drivers

im the main driver 2 years NCB, insured in south london (croydon)

£443 fully comp with break down cover.

WOW!!

im 23 i drive a citroen c2 GT 1.6
got my dad on there 10+ NCB an my girlfriend (21 3 years NCB) both named drivers

im the main driver 2 years NCB, insured in south london (croydon)

£443 fully comp with break down cover.

As others have said, try other cars such as the undesirable Micra, also go big and try some quotes for a big old estate car like a Mondeo. You could also try a small van, traditionally commercial insurance is more expensive but as a young driver, the quote could go the right way. One I would not advice is the classic car route, yes you may save some cash but you will regret it (or possibly not) when you have the accident you are statistically 50% likely to have in the first year!

Last tip I heard was to try different job titles, this can make a big difference. I'm not saying lie, but if you could reasonably give your job a different title give it a go. Try putting your age as 18 and see if it is worth holding off a year.

Oh, and the obvious one, put your voluntary excess as high as you can as this makes a claim from yourself less likely.

Taka - So they're legal as long as they're limited to 33bhp? Will have a look at that cheers! 😮

You are approaching your insurance quote from the wrong direction.
You may have been given the Pug but it is still an insurance group 7 car.
Find the lowest insurance group car that you can.Many places on the net have tables of the group applied to each model of car-the group is not just dependant on engine size. AA has this information
Volunteer for driving restrictions eg night driving, limited mileage.
Advanced driving test can give you 10% off with some insurers.
BBC Radio 4 had a lot of good information for gaining a good quote as a young driver on the website.
Try very hard not to "fib" on you insurance quote. If you need to claim many reasons can be used to invalidate your cover.
Dependant on where you live a quote of around £1000 to £2000 should be possible.

Changing anything other than your postcode will make little difference.

JuJuuk68's summary is correct and combined with the insurers inability to cover premium to cost deficits in the markets results in the premiums taka is quoted.
The only way to get it substantially cheaper would be if you find some one incorrectly rating the risk.

Its not really the insurers fault they merely do the sums, politicians make the choices that shape society.

Get a bike for a year or two, it'll keep you fit!