Looks like we'll be getting a camper van. My last van was a mark one Transit with a mattress on the floor and a petrol stove, the new one will be a bit more civilized. I know bottled gas is now normal for cooking but I was wondering if anyone's tried an induction hob running off a Lithium Ion power station thingy?
This mob in Sheffield push electric hobs and huge batteries as one of their SPs. They'll have loads of of info
https://custombuiltcampervans.com/
Can't see why it wouldn't work in principle, but the inverter on the lithium-ion battery will need to be a true sine-wave output, not a square-wave as the cheaper ones tend to be.
It seems to be a growing trend in the yacht cruising market - but they have potential to very large battery banks, big inverters, huge solar panels etc.
So I’d be asking myself: what will I be cooking? How much power does that need at peak and typical load? What other electrical demands do you have? Eg if you want to run the hob for 30 minutes, boil a kettle and run your laptop with the lights on its different from bringing a pan to the boil and keeping it on simmer whilst browsing STW on you phone. How long between access to mains power? How much solar will you have (if any)? How quick can you recharge your power? Will the batteries be recharged by the vehicle - how quickly and how far will you drive? Do you expect to use “electric hookup” - how often and will you wire it to give you direct access to the hob etc or just to recharge the lithium.
whats your motivation for getting rid of gas? If it’s safety then lithium batteries don’t have a great reputation (rightly or wrongly).
I have been on a campsite this weekend where there was an issue with the electric supply. We are not sure if a frequency stability, dodgy earth or something else, but it fried most of the campervans or caravans electronics, batteries and many devices plugged in. Possibly an extreme example, but it did seem that the caravans and campers worst hit were the ones reliant on huge batteries and multiple electrical devices. The caravan over the way from us was using at the time an induction hob, a microwave, an air-fryer, central heating controller, full lights internally and exterior flood lights etc etc - seems every live device with some electronics in got zapped..
Two thoughts followed: I was glad that our and our friends electrics tripped properly and prevented any significant damage to us, and secondly I was glad of a 'dumb' gas stove and diesel heater.
its a valid concern as calor cylinders are getting to be a pain in the hoop to get replaced - especially if like me you ran a "caravan 6kg"
We went Refillable LPG 10 year ago and its was great (as our heater , stove and fridge ran off the gas ) - I've still got the LPG kit, the stove and the heater but a quick look at autogas and the ever decreasing options has me doubting if ill reinstall it on the new van.. Positives - are it provides a lot of fuel (weeks) for very little weight....
I don't want a diesel heater though which limits my options.
I follow Australians TJ&Mac as they build overland / circuit of Australia Toyota Landcruisers. They run a lot of induction cooking but as mentioned above their 12v and lithium system installs are large, complex and expensive.
Thought about it in my latest campervan build but even a big dc to dc charger doesn't recharge the battery that quickly when you are driving, and even with 400W of solar on the roof you don't get much off it in the winter in the UK. Glad we stuck with gas. We've got a 300ah lithium battery and a 1600W inverter I would've also had to get a much bigger inverter, probably 3kw which are not cheap either.
The caravan over the way from us was using at the time an induction hob, a microwave, an air-fryer, central heating controller, full lights internally and exterior flood lights etc etc
Theres your problem right there. The lights are probably irrelevant now as LEDs are all low power - even flood lighting is minimal power draw. But at a rough estimate that caravan alone could have been drawing close to 30A. The supply are usually rated at 16A at most, often less.
induction hob - up to 13A
Microwave - up to 5A
Air fryer - up to 10A
but more to the point, if you've got multiple hook ups drawing that sort of current you're going to put a load of pressure on the supply to the whole campsite. I'm pretty sure they don't get the equivalent of a residential supply to every couple of hookups. People used to charge their 12v battery and run a bit of lighting/TV etc - not run a domestic kitchen off them.
I put an induction hob in our van. I didn't think we'd use it much (I thought we'd mostly cook outside), but it's awesome - we use it all the time.
I'd say that if you intend to run proper electrics, it's worth considering a more serious setup than a power station though.
Theres your problem right there. The lights are probably irrelevant now as LEDs are all low power - even flood lighting is minimal power draw. But at a rough estimate that caravan alone could have been drawing close to 30A. The supply are usually rated at 16A at most, often less.
induction hob - up to 13A
Microwave - up to 5A
Air fryer - up to 10A
but more to the point, if you've got multiple hook ups drawing that sort of current you're going to put a load of pressure on the supply to the whole campsite. I'm pretty sure they don't get the equivalent of a residential supply to every couple of hookups. People used to charge their 12v battery and run a bit of lighting/TV etc - not run a domestic kitchen off them.
While there was an issue with that, the circuit had been replaced a few months ago and could cope. The sparky found some iffy earth connections and was also talking about cheap Chinese LED, solar panels and invertors, and other kit/appliances that can play havoc with the frequency of AC somehow as well...
Another option, which is what we had in our van in our 14 years of owning it, is an ethanol stove.
Compass spirit stove, 2 burners
No worries about carbon monoxide like you have with gas (they just give off water vapour when burning). They give a great steady heat that is superb for cooking on, it's not as quick to boil water as others but it's not shocking. We found a combination of the stove for cooking and a travel kettle for brewing up when on hook-up was perfect.
The Panama P10 e based on the Ford Tourneo (Transit) PHEV has induction hobs (and electric heating). This uses the vehicle Hybrid battery and the Ford 'Pro Power onboard' system . There was another converter at the NEC show last year with a prototype gasless campervan. Again using the hybrid battery via Pro Power onboard. IF you are specing a van on the Ford Hybrid that that might be worth investigating
Also seen video of an induction hob being used via the vehicle to load plug on a Kia PV5 (full elec van)
No worries about carbon monoxide like you have with gas (they just give off water vapour when burning).
Do they use hydrogen as fuel?
If they produce carbon dioxide, they can produce carbon monoxide - it's just an incomplete burn. The risk is lower, but not zero. You should still take appropriate precautions if you intend to use them in a confined space.
I've been living full time in my van for the last 3,5 years.
Originally wanted to install an underslung LPG tank, but was advised by the guy who converts large Unimog type things and installs gas tanks to have a look at a diesel stove.
We ended up buying a Wallas XC Duo. It doubles up as a heater, too.
Advantages being that we've always got diesel onboard and there's no gas test necessary every two years (German rules 🫡). Other advantage over has is that it's a dry heat. Gas releases moisture which you generally want to avoid inside a van.
It sips fuel. On highest setting it gets through a litre of diesel in about 5-6 hours. On low (which is than enough to keep the chill off in winter) it's hot like ten hours/litre.
You'll need a decent size battery bank to run an induction hob which eats into your carrying/load capacity.
is an ethanol stove.
Compass spirit stove, 2 burners
No worries about carbon monoxide like you have with gas (they just give off water vapour when burning).
What happens to the carbon atoms? They may be less likely to give off CO but I am sure if you try you can make CO from an ethanol flame.
I refer the gentleman to my previous answer
Limo containing Nobel Peace and Chemistry Prize judges executes a swift U turn on the M60 and heads directly away from Disley.....
aye, I’m not sure why I didn’t see them - I’m blaming the forum because there’s a good chance it was to blame! But it may be operator error - like the sort of thing that causes CO poisoning!I refer the gentleman to my previous answer
have a look at a diesel stove
I've wondered about that. Converter who did our previous van started offering a gas-free option not long after we had ours done (with gas hob...). If I was planning a gas-free camper that's what I'd look at over an induction hob and big battery/power solutions. Unless I ended up with an electric/hybrid/petrol van...
We almost always have electric hookup when we're (big tent) camping and bring a portable induction double-hob. It's superb. Always have a small gas stove as a back up in the van though.
Limo containing Nobel Peace and Chemistry Prize judges executes a swift U turn on the M60 and heads directly away from Disley.....
Still, there's always next years FIFA Peace Prize.
Honestly, it's brilliant. It draws ~7ah for a minute on start up, but once it's running is uses naff all electric.
We were running a 160ah lithium battery for the first two years without any drama. Upgraded last year to a 330ah just because the GF was working more and more and needed more juice for her laptop.
I often make stews and curries (and even bread) on the hob, leaving it in for hours on end.
No idea how big a battery you would need to run an induction stove for an hour or more.
The fact we never have to worry about finding a gas dealer and swapping bottles or finding an LPG petrol station has saved us hours of wasted time over the years (different countries also have different deposit systems and connectors).
https://wallas.fi/product/xc-duo/
an ethanol stove.
Compass spirit stove, 2 burners
I went and bought one thinking it would a be cheap and simple solution and give us the option of cooking outside.
After one test run in the workshop I put it on eBay. The smell of the fumes made it a complete no-go..... And that was in a big workshop, not the confined spaces of the van.
You also need to carry around several bottles of very flammable fuel.
If it works for you then great, but it simply wasn't an option for us.
Blake Samson has his own YouTube channel and he is building an off-road trailer. He has added an induction hob.
Looks good and I like the idea but I can't be using one as it can ruin my insulin pump (or damage a pacemaker)...unsure how close you need to be but it isn't something I'd be keen to find out.
if you've got multiple hook ups drawing that sort of current you're going to put a load of pressure on the supply to the whole campsite.
I put in a six-pitch supply last year. Had to be three-phase. Each pitch has its own earth rod and a voltage monitor to cut the power if things go awry (though I freely admit it's actually to enforce the 16A limit which an RCBO doesn't).
We've got a tefal one that we bought from Argos.. £85 - we use it when on a hook up.
Otherwise we're on gas the rest of the time - mostly we're on a hookup though...
We’ve got a Clayton battery system that can run the induction hob. It works well. If off grid, we can normally get evening meal and breakfast out of the battery before needing recharging. That’s including running the diesel heater, compressor fridge and lights. It allows us to cook safely inside of the van if the weather is foul.
solar powered bacon!
https://youtube.com/shorts/WAe3olsyg0M?si=yw6g-wBvcuJG1P6V
It’s fashionable to have massive batteries and electric everything in vans at the moment. It’s an expensive way to cook.
If your usage works for allowing you to charge either by driving, solar or hookup then great, go for it. The odd weekend with a bit of cooking is easy to do. Beware that in winter in the UK solar is next to useless so you will need other means of charging.
I have diesel heating, a relatively modest LiFePo4 battery and a spirit cooker. I find the spirit cooker excellent for my use, it does need a vent open / fan running when in use and it’s not *quite* as hot as gas. If I was starting again I would definitely go for a Wallas or similar diesel stove, with the advantage of backup heating as well (or your main heating in a small van).
We spend holidays away in the winter in the Alps often without hookup and can easily last 5 days without any charging, electric cooking wouldn’t work for us. In the summer with solar and not running the heating it would be fine.
A question from a non van owner here - do you really cook in your van much? Surely even if it's electric you're adding a load of water vapour to the inside of the van along with grease and making everything you own stink of whatever you've cooked (I don't think I've seen extractor fans in any van build)?
Surely you really want to cook outside under an awning nearly all of the time?
A question from a non van owner here - do you really cook in your van much? Surely even if it's electric you're adding a load of water vapour to the inside of the van along with grease and making everything you own stink of whatever you've cooked (I don't think I've seen extractor fans in any van build)?
Never been an issue for us. - we just open the roof vent and the window.
Ideally it’s cooking outside, which I’d guess is 90-95% of the time. Not a disaster cooking inside though
I've not owned a camper for years but why the move away from gas? We lived in our van for 7 months solid and used maybe two or three bottles over that time - mainly cooking, occasionally fridge.
We cook most nights and breakfasts in the van, plus multiple cuppas.
Open window and open roof vent = very little issue with damp or smells.
Sleeping overnight can create more damp.
We cook most nights and breakfasts in the van, plus multiple cuppas.
Open window and open roof vent = very little issue with damp or smells.
Sleeping overnight can create more damp.
Ours has an extractor fan......but we open the window a bit as well....
Always cook in it -- typically one pot type meals but every day...
come to think of it - I'm building a newer van and I'm prioritising cooking over sleeping tbh.
We used out current van MORE as a day van to prevent spending a fortune in cafes as a 4 for food that invariably the children wont eat.
A question from a non van owner here - do you really cook in your van much?
I didn't think we would, but if we're cooking with the van, we cook in the van more often than outside it. Convenience factor of being able to just turn things on without having to faff with all the setup makes a real quality of life difference.
I've not owned a camper for years but why the move away from gas? We lived in our van for 7 months solid and used maybe two or three bottles over that time - mainly cooking, occasionally fridge.
I've not had a van with gas in, but I was fairly deliberate about not putting it in. Gas bottles take up a load of space, and it's a whole extra type of fuel you have to worry about. Leisure batteries/inverters if you want to cook on electricity do take up more space (but less than gas bottles), and having a better electrical system has other advantages.
If off grid, we can normally get evening meal and breakfast out of the battery before needing recharging. That’s including running the diesel heater, compressor fridge and lights. It allows us to cook safely inside of the van if the weather is foul.
Currently been parked up for ten days completely off-grid, using the stove several times a day, some days the standard parking heater was running all day and recharged the GF's computer at least once a day..... All that on a 330ah lipo battery that is at 44% despite only today being a net solar day.
I took the Bob Yak trailer to go and pick up water yesterday and today to avoid having to move the van.
Surely you really want to cook outside under an awning nearly all of the time?
In most locations* you can't put up and awning (or set out chairs and table) even if the weather allowed it as that would be "camping" as opposed to simply being parked.
I'll cook sausages or steak outside, bit otherwise an open skylight and/or door and it's all good.
*Assuming you're not using campsites
Alpin what size van do you have and are you heating it in Northern European winters with the XC Duo. It looks like a very simple solution for off grid campering about.
Surely even if it's electric you're adding a load of water vapour to the inside of the van along with grease and making everything you own stink of whatever you've cooked
It's not just smells, as with gas hobs in homes, people are only just starting to think about the fumes that are given off by burning gas - and you're generally standing right over it sucking it in!
(Induction is more efficient outdoors also)
Alpin what size van do you have and are you heating it in Northern European winters with the XC Duo.
XLWB H3 Ducato.
Basically the highest and longest Ducato. The last bottom third of the van is given over to bikes.
We've the Walls stove and an Autoterm 2D diesel heater.
The last three winters have been spent in northern Italy, Bavaria and Bavaria/Switzerland/UK respectively. In January this year it got down to -18°C in Switzerland.
The van is lined with between 32 and 44mm Armaflex foam stuff
Tend to always sleep with a window open, although when it's -5 only the front windows are cracked open and if it's -8 then I'll run the diesel heater on low overnight to keep the chill off and stop the water lines from freezing.
We have gas hob, oven and grill in ours but most of the cooking is done on a pull out hob/griddle from the side of the van.
Have the electrics set up for full off grid but cant see the benefits that an induction hob would bring.