Subscribe now and choose from over 30 free gifts worth up to £49 - Plus get £25 to spend in our shop
Mattyfez comments underline my view and people just simply dont even have the most basic grasp of how our world functions (this not an abstract view)
I am convinced that no matter how crap it gets people will accept what they are told and if they are told its "just the way it is" then they will soldier on.
You would literally have to starve these people, (i dont mean foodbank starvation) shut wetherspoons and turn off the power to get the dumb *ers to sit up and take notice.
I know that the Cummins of this world absolutely understand the limit of the great unwashed, as long as they are living in the same house tgey have always lived in, drinking the same amount of beer, eating the same amount of food they will tolerate any amount of shit and lack of opportunity- i know from my own family the extent of people's horizons.
I have had some of the most ironic things said to me by my brexit voting family and friends " my kids dont have the same opportunities as yours" yes they *ing do you chose to go to the pub rather than helping your kids with GCSE revision, you told your kids University was a waste time, yout told me that this exchange rate thing had nothing to do with the price of petrol... i could write pages of this.
The furlough scheme has "proved" to many that the gov is finally looking after them ffs
‘No Deal’ then the tariffs slapped on food will see a big rise in household bills.
I have to say the in general we in the UK have had it easy when it comes to the cost of necessary items such as food and utility costs.
I consider myself as being European in the sense that I embrace the wider culture exchange that goes on between the European community. I have lived over there and intend to go back once kids fly the roost. Now before someone chimes in and says I was born with silver spoon in my mouth, you'll be very wrong. My circumstances are the same as Oldmanmtb2 has said above.
In all my years of traveling backwards and forwards between the UK and the rest of Europe, one thing that became obvious to me is that we in the UK pay a great deal less for our food and in general the quality is lower. I see/saw that there are/were less supermarkets and more grocers, like in the UK you would expect to pay more and get better quality from a grocer.
Speaking to my wife's family who live in France, I am astounded at the cost living in France, their utility bills would make your eyes water and their weekly shop is almost double what I spend on ours.
Brexit will bring those pricing levels to the UK for sure further affecting those communities left behind. Those who thought voting Brexit would bring some sort of utopia for them. I'm afraid it will only get worse for them.
I don't blame them to be honest, the vote leave campaign was very well organised and the vote remain.... Well I can't even remember what they had to say..
The costs of exporting to the continent are going to increase massively for UK businesses, thus becoming unviable.
This is my biggest fear... If I were running the business I work for I'd be looking for premises in mainland Europe.
one thing that became obvious to me is that we in the UK pay a great deal less for our food and in general the quality is lower.
Totally agree with that. And it's about to get a damn sight worse. Imports of higher quality foods from Europe will go up in price considerably.
Meanwhile, a cheaper alternative will be available for the plebs. By jettisoning EU food and animal hygiene standards and signing a trade deal with the US, it'll open the floodgates for American Corporate Agribusiness with their chlorine-washed chicken, hormone injected beef and GM crops.
There will then be an even bigger divide between the middle classes nibbling their organic fairtrade olives and a working poor eating turkey twizzlers. To add insult to injury, the government who caused all this will then berate them for being obese
When I clicked Google on the phone this morning the first article proposed was;
https://fr.reuters.com/article/gb-brexit-france-idFRKCN26G0J2
The British government might be fooling enough of the British people to stay in power but they aren't fooling the people they're negotiating with.
The costs of exporting to the continent are going to increase massively for UK businesses, thus becoming unviable.
I'm from a farming background. A while ago I was looking at the figures for UK lamb production, sales and import/export. (Can't remember why now - I think it was to do with the government stating they'd buy up carcases and store them and there actually not being enough storage).
Very roughly UK lamb production is worth £1bn wholesale of which around a third is exported to Europe. We import some, a similar amount - around 30% of total consumption, from New Zealand but that's mainly because there's an increase in lamb consumption around Easter and our lambs aren't ready for slaughter then.
If, as is looking likely, we end up with no deal then lamb imports to Europe will have a tariff imposed. It's not as easy as saying X% since there's a certain volume that is allowed in tariff free but New Zealand uses up about 80% of that allowance about half of which comes to the UK so presumably will get reallocated to another country with an EU trade agreement. The current FTA tariff is just under 13%. The WTO tariff, which is being touted as a good thing remember, is between 40% & 90% depending on the exact product.
Since we won't be having an FTA then the UK's lamb exports will be subject to that minimum 40% tariff. Short term result? A glut of cheap lamb for maybe a year until the farmers have sold everything on and then reduced their flocks or gone out of business.
That's been clear from the start Edukator. Barnier in particular has impressed me refusing to buy the bullshine or fall into the big pits marked trap
Its adults v petulant children
A summary of that article would be handy tho Edukator
"That’s been clear from the start Edukator. Barnier in particular has impressed me refusing to buy the bullshine or fall into the big pits marked trap
Its adults v petulant children"
It's not really though is it? Or do you really believe that? What specifically is it about Barnier that has impressed you? Problem with this thread is that, entertaining as it is, it is one massive echo chamber
Barnier has been consistent. Has avoided rhetoric and cant and has exhibited patience in the face of utter nonsense from the UK government who will still not say what they want or produce written positions and who keep shifting the goalposts and posturing
The EU, and Barnier, have been very clear and concise from the start, about what can and can not happen/be agreed on. The UK on the other hand has swapped between signing agreements, and asking for the moon on a stick.
Instead of the "echo chamber" charge... lay out what you think the EU representatives and negotiators should have done differently... and... here's a bigger challenge... what the UK ones have got right... assuming their task really was/is to get a trade deal (and other essential agreements) in place before we lose all the current arrangements.
To be honest, one of the main issues that is being faced in the discussions at the moment is that the EU has got used to trying to be firm and watching the Theresa May era team cave in and make changes. Possibly an issue with her wanting to be in control and not listen to others (something she is apparently well known for) and possibly because she was a remainer at heart. The difference now is that the negotiating team are standing their ground and not backing down when the EU team were expecting them to.
From what I have read around the topic it seems that the Govt's decision to push for the recent legislative change is actually prudent preparation for the potential eventuality of a no deal when we would end up in a situation of the EU being in breach of international law. In a bigger way than the UK is. The fault is with the Withdrawal Agreement that, in fairness, both sides agreed. The biggest problem with it is that the UK Govt has made a complete hash of explaining what they are doing and why.
The biggest problem with it is that the UK Govt has made a complete hash of explaining what they are doing and why.
Quite the reverse of that is the case. What the UK Government actually are actually doing, and why, is to crash us out with no deal so that their disaster capitalist mates can make a killing on the positions they've already taken against the pound, then those right-wing headbangers in power can use the 'opportunity' created by the resulting chaos to tear up workers rights, environmental controls etc and privatise the NHS
For some bizarre reason, I can't imagine why, they're reluctant to actually come out and say so though.
They aren't making a hash of anything. This was always the plan and they've executed it pretty much perfectly. We're now at the endgame where they shift the blame for the impending catastrophe onto the EU.
From reading your post, it seems thats going well too
We've caught a big one.......
On NI its has always been impossible to have it out of the EU and no borders either on the island or ireland or in theIrish sea.
When what you want to happen is impossible you have to compromise. On NI Johnson decided to compromise on the Irish sea border - the only practical solution. he signed a treaty to this effect.
No not only does he want to renage on this he is gaslighting as to why. Its nothing to do with being prudent. its everything to do with being a unionist and not wanting a reunited irelans which is the end result of the border in the irish sea. The fact his is so dim and illprepared that he did not realise what the WI meant is his problem and his fault - not the EUs
You do realise that the UK keep on asking ythe EU for things that are impiossible under EU law?
The EU's position hasn't really changed hugely since 24th June 2016.
They've been pretty consistent. It became apparent immediately after the referendum result that it was an utterly stupid thing to do and would cause huge ructions down the line.
It is the UK's problem to resolve. That 'we' can't is because it was sold on the basis of a pack of lies.
The difference now is that the negotiating team are standing their ground and not backing down when the EU team were expecting them to.
You've taken the drugs. Waiting for the UK to come up with radical alternatives stopped long ago, and there is nothing new that can be proposed, agreed and implemented before the year is out. When we nuked the extension, we were telling the EU that we'd either go along with any agreements they propose, or go with no deal/minimal deal. A whole new 'comprehensive free trade deal' that also covers everything else that normally is well outside the remit of a normal FTA is not possible in the time left. We started too late, and set our own impossible to meet deadline to finish. An FTA+ agreement before we leave the SM&CM+ is now dead.
Businesses in Ireland, Holland and France were prepped (and subsidised) by their governments to be ready for no deal... LAST SUMMER. It is UK companies and public bodies that are left unprepared, and unable to prepare, for no deal. What help has your company had to be ready from the UK government... name me one thing... beyond being advertised at saying that they need to be ready? When do they get access to the government systems required in order to trade in the New Year? Isn't it currently March 2021 (and slipping all the time)? Why are the Irish, Dutch and French systems already available to their companies... how come they were testing them in the field LAST YEAR?
The fact his is so dim and ill prepared that he did not realise what the WI meant is his problem and his fault – not the EU.
Boris Johnson is neither dim nor ill-prepared, though it would suit him for everyone to think both those things true
What he most definitely is though is a scheming, untrustworthy liar. To that end he knew full well (and had apparently privately assured the ERG headbangers) when he signed that Withdrawal Agreement that he had no intention whatsoever of honouring it. He was always going to pull a stunt like the Internal Market Bill. It was just a case of when
He's always wanted No Deal*. That was always the final destination. And barring a miracle, thats what we're all going to get. Not by accident, but by design.
* Actually, he doesn't, personally. He doesn't believe in Brexit any more than I do. He doesn't actually believe in anything. But his paymasters have let him have his fun and get to play at being prime minister. Now it's payback time. And that payback is a No Deal Brexit
Sadly, I think binners is right about BoJo.
To go back to the comments about voting as an emotional reaction, my sister and husband both voted out. Why? He personally felt aggrieved by a Home Secretary called Theresa May over contract changes for him as a police officer. My sister as she wanted a change in the Westminster Call Me Dave government. Both are open that this was an emotional response - yet both still are in denial about leaving. They are doubling down on the 'it is the right thing'. Facts are an irrelevance (still).
the EU being in breach of international law
How so?
Another sector under threat because of Cummings' hate for gdpr and European data security laws
How so?
He's probably bought into the "not negotiating in good faith" nonsense... ignoring all the arbitration process written into the WA that is specifically there to be used if it really is the case that good faith has broken down. Will the UK trigger it... or tear up the agreement because "the big boys won't let us have the cake that they warned was never going to available"?
What! Like moaning about about someone who's dropped a couple of apple pips having just fly tipped 20 tonnes of building rubble oneself. 🙂
The UK accusing the EU fo not negotiating in good faith, that really is a laugh.
It did amuse me Edukator. Projecting I believe its called
Johnson is dim - thats his problem. He is a dim man pretending that he is pretending to be dim to hide his intellect but actually he just is dim
I'll go with lazy and a sophist. He's not dim, but he's the kind of bright person that is entirely unsuitable to lead anything, never mind a country.
The fault is with the Withdrawal Agreement
The one that Boris Johnson signed himself and presented as a triumph? And is now illegally reneging on. That one?
And the bit he wants to do away with… that’s the bit that the last PM said we couldn’t sign up to, and when she did he used that to get rid of her, become PM, and then fight an election based on what he wanted. He literally became PM, and won a majority, based on his changes to the WA that he now says needs scrapping, and his supporters now say is the problem.
Ian Hislop on Johnson
Boris Johnson, people always ask me the same question, they say, 'Is Boris a very very clever man pretending to be an idiot?' And I always say, 'No.'
He clearly is rather dim. Well educated but dim. Just look at some of the things he has done like quoting Kipling in a temple in Myanmar or failing to understand his own agreement with the EU or catching covid by shaking hands with covid positive people
the supermarkets are saying in the event of ‘No Deal’ then the tariffs slapped on food will see a big rise in household bills.
Just going back to this...
As someone who works in the industry, we've had internal warnings about this since the referendum was announced. It was reported on, debated and thrown out by the leave campaign as "we'll get a deal, so don't worry about it".
After the referendum costs of food wholesale went up for my buisness by around 5 to 10%, yet the rrp on the product remained the same. Margins which are typically around 20% in food retail were seriously squeezed. Thankfully over the last 4 years rrp's have increased (although most consumers haven't noticed), but margins haven't had a similar increase. Example, Heinz beans were price marked at 59p in 2016, 89p in 2017/18 and now 99p a can....
All I can say is if we still sit with no deal in Dec I'll be emptying the bank account into European stock, as food inflation in curtain areas (olive oil for one) will be hitting 40% rises.
So, all you you incredibly intelligent, well read and articulate people (who are quite quick to judge others for not being so) what is the UK legislation attempting to do? Is it reneging on the entire WA? And why has it been enacted? As you are so intelligent and well read, it's not going to take very long is it...
Deleted
The aim is no deal and put blame on the EU for no deal
I'm sure that there are more intelligent people on here than me and there's probably errors, but from what I understand..... The legislation is trying to make sure that England Ireland Scotland and Wales can trade with the EU on equal terms, and not one country within the uk has preferable conditions...
The problem is that we've signed up to the legal framework that under curtain conditions, doesn't do this and effectively gives preference to NI. By over writing the withdrawal agreement we would brake international law and set a very very bad tone for future agreements.
Basically either BJ didn't read the small print or he did and wants to Scape goat this for no deal.
what is the UK legislation attempting to do?
It gives the UK govt the power to change rules on movement of goods that should be set out in the WA.
what is the UK legislation attempting to do?
The WA basically says that without new arrangements being agreed that minimise border requirements between the UK and the EU... some of the new border arrangements (that would be required both to satisfy international law, and EU law and WTO rules) will be implemented on the island of Ireland, and some will be down the Irish sea. A fudge like this (or a different one agreed by all parties) is essential to ensure that No Deal doesn't completely wreck the Good Friday Agreement. The new legislation is putting two fingers up to all that, and saying that we won't put in place the arrangements required between GB and NI that we signed up to in the WA... and instead will leave Ireland to find some magic way to put all the arrangements in place on the Ireland of Ireland... which they can not.
There are people now running the UK that not only want the UK to be able to operate outside the EU, but want other countries to be pulled out of the EU as well, notably, if possible, Ireland... and they do not want the Good Friday agreement protected, and give not one damn about people living in Northern Ireland who are Irish... actually, that's too charitable... they give not one damn about anyone living in Northern Ireland.
To be honest, one of the main issues that is being faced in the discussions at the moment is that the EU has got used to trying to be firm and watching the Theresa May era team cave in and make changes. Possibly an issue with her wanting to be in control and not listen to others (something she is apparently well known for) and possibly because she was a remainer at heart. The difference now is that the negotiating team are standing their ground and not backing down when the EU team were expecting them to.
FFS, thats the opposite of what actually happened!
Johnson caved completely on NI , something May had steadfastly refused to do for her entire time as PM
Johnson folded in the WA & will fold to get an FTA, he will fold on state aid, he will fold on food standards (so he can declare ending the made-up food blockade of NI a victory) & he will fold on fishing
(& then in 6 months time he will try & get out of those promises too)
The legislation is trying to make sure that England Ireland Scotland and Wales can trade with the EU on equal terms, and not one country within the uk has preferable conditions…
Nope - on the internal market its to make sure that Westminster sets the rules and that pesky Scotland cannot stop the import of substandard US food.
Its sold as a level internal playing field but thats actually what its about
Oh, that's exactly what it is... "taking back control" to Westminster, and specifically to the executive there.
The Internal Market Bill is a naked power grab to centralise power and neuter devolved government.
But its more specific and targetted than 'Taking Back Control' to Westminster. It's being taken back to a specific address. No 10 Downing Street.
The Gruesome Brexiteer trio of Cummings, Johnson, and Gove have nothing but contempt for parliamentary democracy, as they have demonstrated continually since they got into number 10 with their proroguing etc.
Once we're out of the EU, they get the chance to re-write our unwritten constitution and they want to do that with no interference from parliament and certainly not from Brussels or Holyrood or anywhere else.
The arrogance of Cummings is staggering. He's our de facto PM already, but he'd happily tear up all our democratic checks and balances in a heartbeat. That's what all the threats and bullying of the civil service is all about. He doesn't think anything should interfere with the executive (ie: him) and its (his) power to do whatever the hell it (he) likes
I’ll go with lazy and a sophist. He’s not dim, but he’s the kind of bright person that is entirely unsuitable to lead anything, never mind a country.
Yeah, he's basically a very successful blagger. He never believed in Brexit. I am pretty sure he wanted a 55/45 remain/leave result so he could shout loudly and get to challenge for the leadership on a eurosceptic ticket, but with the safety net of not actually being forced to actually 'do' Brexit. When Leave won he simply switched to plan B which was to go all Brexity until he was the only one left to be PM.
He doesn't give a **** about anyone or anything but himself. Kids all over the place that he's walked out on, sticking his todger wherever he fancies, making up quotes in newspaper columns, nailing his colours to the Brexit mast out of sheer opportunism. The list is endless.
He is a freewheeling jazz hatter who just takes the easy option to advance himself whenever he can.
end up in a situation of the EU being in breach of international law. In a bigger way than the UK is. The fault is with the Withdrawal Agreement that, in fairness, both sides agreed. The biggest problem with it is that the UK Govt has made a complete hash of explaining what they are doing and why.
I'm really struggling with your logic here...
Borris Cummings want to break the withdrawal agreement.
Borris Cummings want to break an international peace treaty (the Belfast agreement).
The conservatives want to break 2 international deals, one historic and monumental, and the other to be fair was a compete farce, and unachievable but they are just plain untrustworthy.
These are the sort of people I'd learn quickly never to buy a beer for, because I'd know I'd never get one back as they've demonstrated that they are scroungers and liars.
Europe is thinking the same, and the rest of the word, too.
That's not a good way to make friends and gain trust.
The EU has been completely measured and pragmatic in its responses to the UK hissy fit.
To go back to the comments about voting as an emotional reaction
At least they had something to be aggrieved about... My mum voted out because she wanted to see a certain thing on the robinsons jam jar for FFS..... My dad's reason was far more sinister.. Blaming it on the Germans
Here's an example of his skills of diplomacy
You need to think through your logic again. In actual fact, the recent UK legislation is precisely to prevent breaching the Good Friday agreement. If we keep to the WA and end up with a no deal, there is the potential then for the EU to invoke / exercise "direct effect". Which effectively then interferes within the sovereign jurisdiction of the UK through applying tariffs to goods passing between mainland Britain and Northern Ireland. This contradicts article 4 which states that “Northern Ireland is part of the customs territory of the UK”. The basis of the WA is that we would agree and reach an FTA with the EU. However, if that doesn't happen then we get a problem with the WA. And that then potentially leaves us in the position of an entity (the EU) appearing to interfere with the affairs of a sovereign state (the UK). The purpose then of this recent legislation is to prevent that happening - in the event of a no deal.
Quite possibly / probably BJ wanted a no deal Brexit all along and the strong negotiations stance over the recent months has been part of that plan. We don't really know. It is also arguable that the EU still can't quite get its head around the fact that a member state would wish to leave and still wants to be able to meddle / interfere / influence UK affairs. But the point of leaving the EU is to prevent that.
The basis of the WA is that we would agree and reach an FTA with the EU. However, if that doesn’t happen then we get a problem with the WA. And that then potentially leaves us in the position of an entity (the EU) appearing to interfere with the affairs of a sovereign state (the UK). The purpose then of this recent legislation is to prevent that happening – in the event of a no deal.
No… the WA sets out exactly how NI will be dealt with in the absence of a FTA+ to reduce border friction… and ‘we’ signed up to that. To retrospectively change that, without involving the Irish government, is ripping up the Good Friday agreement, and putting Ireland in the impossible position of implementing border controls on the island of Ireland to make up for our own lack of will to do as we said we would, agreed we would, signed we would, and legally bound ourselves to do.
In actual fact, the recent UK legislation is precisely to prevent breaching the Good Friday agreement.
By knackering trade completely and plunging the whole of the uk into (more) poverty? that's what I meant by logical fallacy. It's not a strategy for growth, lets be honest. Don't forget, the WA was borrises 'oven ready' deal. He now says it's ridiculous.
Quite possibly / probably BJ wanted a no deal Brexit all along
I don't actually think he did, he's just playing his cards and lining his pockets before he gets the hell out of dodge, leaving the country to burn... that would be in line with his previous form. You can see it in PMQ's , he just doesn't care as long as he delivers brexit. Then he'll high tail it into the sunset shouting 'I succeeded'!
Keep drinking the Kool Aid!
The EU hasn't interfered with UK jurisdiction, it's the current executive who are playing around. When BJ stripped out the safeguards from the WA and presented it as his own it was pointed out to him that it meant an internal border in the UK. Of course he then blustered and moved the subject on, such is his way. What Cummins/Johnson are now doing is tearing up an international agreement (that has nothing to do with the EU) that they find inconvenient.
Of course the UK reneging on the GFA also means that there'd be no trade deal with the USA - Congress has stated as such. Also odd that Cummins/Johnson seem so keen on a trade deal with the USA at a possible benefit of 0.16% of GDP over five years yet not so keen for one that prevents a massive hit to the UK economy.
The EU's stance throughout this reminds me of the Black Knight scene from Monty Python and the Holy Grail:
EU: "you've shot yourself in the foot!"
UK: "'tis only a scratch."
EU: "Now you've cut your leg off!"
UK: "'tis but a minor flesh wound!"
Etc.
the point is that Johnson knew all of this when he signed
it was specifically flagged up that it was a problem at the time
https://www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/explainers/brexit-deal-withdrawal-agreement
In actual fact, the recent UK legislation is precisely to prevent breaching the Good Friday agreement.
No it is not. Jeepers. the GFA mweans no border on the island of ireland. By reneging on the Irish sea boarder they are forcing a border on the island of ireland thus breaching the GFA
We've agreed to mutually incompatible things. Whose fault is that? It's not the EU's is it? It's no good pissing and moaning at them.
It is also arguable that the EU still can’t quite get its head around the fact that a member state would wish to leave and still wants to be able to meddle / interfere / influence UK affairs.
The EU will always have ‘influence’ as regards NI, while Ireland is a member, because the Good Friday Agreement says that the people of Northern Ireland can choose to be Irish, without having to move South. The people of Northern Ireland have rights granted to them that the rest of us in the UK do not, some of those rights are as EU citizens, even if they have never lived outside the UK.
NI is not Kent.
The Good Friday Agreement is a legally binding international treaty. A *ing important one too.
The EU is a signatory to that. As is the UK. Only one of those parties is presently taking it’s legally binding duties as signatories seriously.
Guess which one?
The other party has a dimwit like Suella Braverman engaging in legal gymnastics to seek to justify breaking international law
If you want to refer to that as interference and meddling you may want to lay off the Farage speeches/rants for a while.
And this government need to stop acting like petulant *s and take their legal responsibilities seriously
@Binners - actually the signatories to the GFA were the UK and Eire so not really the EU. Your other points stand.
Fair do’s @whitestone. I’ve just had a read up on it. More than Dominic Raab managed 😂
I thought the EU and the US we’re co-signatories too. Sort of guarantors?
They’re clearly both taking the matter of legal obligations seriously. Unlike our shower of a government. The EU is simply representing the interests of a member state, and in doing so demonstrating admirably the advantages of EU membership
The irony.
Having spent a lot of time in Northern Ireland during the troubles, the flippant manner with which the GFA is treated by these idiots - as a mere inconvenience to be got round - is the thing that annoys me most about Brexit. And there are many, many things that annoy me about Brexit. Pretty much everything about it, in fact
I had to look up (Wikipedia) who the signatories were.
The Wikipedia article has this telling paragraph:
Because the Agreement commits the government to enshrine the European Convention on Human Rights in law and allows Northern Ireland residents access to the European Court of Human Rights, it required enactment of the Human Rights Act 1998. Consequently, the Agreement was a significant factor preventing the repeal of that Act and its replacement with the proposed British Bill of Rights that Prime Minister David Cameron had promised.[29]
Which is very telling - get rid of the GFA and the government could remove protections for human rights.
Brexit being (partly) about control of borders there are basically there are three options:
1. Northern Ireland remains in the UK with a hard border between NI and the Republic.
2. Northern Ireland remains in the UK but with a border in the Irish Sea.
3. Northern Ireland is ceded to the Republic and unification takes place.
1. would breach the GFA
You could just Read the actual document:
Its an international agreement between the UK, and Ireland, it says so at the bottom.
TJ - I know. Going that route would mean little to no chance of getting favourable trade deals with anyone (with any sense).
No ‘infrastructure’ to be on the border
I seem to recall intellectual heavywight David Davis saying they would get round this by ...erm... something, something.... ‘technology’
That went well.
And if Dave can’t find a solution, what hope for the rest of us?
the problem is that there is no other place in the world that the GFA could exist where 2 countries share a border but are able to keep it entirely open for the residents to move goods & people across freely, the CU & SM underpin the agreement as it was negotiated
RIGHTS, SAFEGUARDS AND EQUALITY OF OPPORTUNITY
• the right to equal opportunity in all social and economic activity, regardless of class, creed, disability, gender or ethnicity;
I guess this is the paragraph that really sticks in the conservatives throats...
The problem is that Vote Leave/The Brexit wing of the Tory party have lied and lied again about NI - claiming that somehow you could have it being both still fully in the UK and having no border with the republic/the EU.
There was some muttering about a magical tech solution that seems to have been forgotten about, but AFAICS there is actually no way of resolving this - let alone their claims that it can be done without extra costs/hassle/red tape.
The richest person in the UK - Jim Ratcliffe - head of Ineos and a big vote leave supporter has just moved to Monaco to save £4bn in tax payments.
Cheers pal
Came here to post that. What a total scumbag.
'We send 350m a week to the EU - why not use that to plug that taxation black hole left by that Ineos ****er?'
But you just have to remember how much money his UK based businesses will save once they no longer have to worry about the environmental controls and the rights of their workers, presently seen as a cost imposed on them by the EU.
That’s why him and his mates supported Brexit. They’re going to make a killing from the race to the bottom it will usher in
Until the EU decides to ban the import of petrochemicals from plants that more polluting than those that comply with EU regulations. I'd like to see that happen, it might be Brexit that provokes it.
Where is his Grenadier going to be produced now? Still Wales? Or elsewhere, to avoid the Brexit mess he encouraged the rest of us to trap ourselves in. Sticking it to the elites again... they can always step out of the shit they convinced the average Joe to saddle themselves with for the rest of their UK* bound lives.
*England&Wales long term... not taking any route out of this would be madness for the people of NI and Scotland now... especially as most of them were wise enough to vote against this self imposed destruction of life chances for all but the elites.
That could stand as a metaphor for the entire Brexit project
Rich British Brexiteer tax-avoider moves production to France
That could stand as a metaphor for the entire Brexit project
Rich British Brexiteer tax-avoider moves production to France
Sooner or later there will be a backlash and someone like him will be found in his mansion having been slotted by one of his ex employees.
Hey, remember when Ineos engineered a massive strike at Grangemouth purely to strongarm BP in their negotiations to buy the Forties pipeline? This isn't even #1 on Radcliffe's list of thunder****ery.
someone like him will be found in his mansion having been slotted by one of his ex employees.
Drivel.
I suggest you google "businessman killed by employee" or similar, Frank, people like him have suffered such a fate on many occasions.
Just pointing out that it's not drivel rather than condoning such actions.
Drivel
Time will tell.
But you just have to remember how much money his UK based businesses will save once they no longer have to worry about the environmental controls and the rights of their workers, presently seen as a cost imposed on them by the EU.That’s why him and his mates supported Brexit. They’re going to make a killing from the race to the bottom it will usher in
The billionaire boss of JCB was another prominent Vote Leave supporter.
Knock out all those expensive worker's rights, environmental regulations and so on. What bugs me is that's more money than anyone could reasonably spend in a lifetime. But no, they want MORE. And they have the funds to just do whatever the **** they want, sod the rest of us. Buy yourself a residency visa somewhere in Europe - no problems! Move a bit of currency around, buy a load of nice cheap Euro - easy peasy! Disappear off abroad to save hundreds of millions in taxes - that's fine, you just continue asset stripping the country, keeping the workforce not far off slave labour, bollocks to the environment.
****ers, the lot of them. Parasitic ****ers.
I rarely post these days but thought I'd share my predictions with you, I don't think there will be a no deal, I don't think it will be a good deal by any stretch of the imagination either.
However I expect around the 15th October an announcement saying that sufficient progress has been made to extend talks and then some marathon sessions through the night towards the end of the month with a deal announced hours before the deadline, Boris attempts to take all the glory for his skillful brinkmanship, fisherman etc. get thrown under the bus but onside media outlets report little of it.
1. Hard Brexit = customs border required somewhere between EIRE and UK.
2. GFA = no border infrastructure allowed between NI & EIRE.
3. Tory hard-on for unionists = border can't be in Irish Sea.
4. 'We' voted to leave the EU, the EU didn't kick us out.
It is almost as if Leave voters didn't think about possible ramifications, isn't it?
Blah, blah, blah, blah, technology, blah, blah. Bollocks. It ain't gonna happen.
So all Johnson and his rag-tag rabble have to fall back on is cheating, lying and trying to kick the can down the road and distract attention.
This is 'our' mess. The onus is on 'our' 'government' to sort this.
I'm having to use so many quotation marks to convey the fact that I don't consider any of this to represent me or any other right thinking grownups.
'Government' is in quotes because this is a GINO.
Bazz has it nailed
BUT Cummings misjudged massively the blowback from the EU after the internal market bill, we've still got the finance bill to come.....