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He promised his back benchers last night it would to stop them writing the letters now.
I don't care what he said to them. He'll just be lying to get through this week. It means nothing to him, he won't be held to it. He'll promise them something different when the full report doesn't appear. Jam tomorrow for his MPs... it's all he ever gives them. We'll get a carefully restricted "update" at some point... but the full report... while it's Johnson's call whether we get it? No chance.
The problem is that getting booted out plays into the tories hands – they would continue without opposition for the day.
They can't do much (more) damage in an afternoon. The Parliamentary timetable is pretty fixed
I’d rather MPs turned up and spoke for their constituents, not leave the Conservatives to crack on without any difficult questions (even if those questions go unanswered).
You've contradicted yourself. If they don't answer the questions and Johnson and the tories feel free to lie and mislead, then there's no point being there, and the opposition MPs should say that and take action. There's a prime opportunity to remove the ridiculous parliamentary rule that is currently protecting Johnson and his supporters. If Johnson was forced to answer the question and was required to be honest he'd be gone by now.
if you missed it....
Cummings doing a 2hr Q&A this evening for substack subscribers.
Cummings is responsible for a large part of this complete shitstorm! He was more than happy to enable Boris throughout all of this, he's basically a "disruptor". One of the Elites who sees himself as outside the Elites.
He's one of the main architects of Brexit, he was critical to getting BJ elected in the first place. Also seemed happy enough in the "cheese and wine business meeting" held in May - that's definitely him sitting there opposite Boris and Carrie. Then his own pathetic lies about the lockdown breaches he committed.
The idea that he's now suddenly found some sort of conscience is laughable. He just loves the chaos he's causing. He can get in the sea along with the rest of the utter scum that inhabit the Cabinet.
If Cummings didn't position himself at the centre of this I think it would be more damaging. He is an easy bogey man to rally against for Tory MP's
The idea that he’s now suddenly found some sort of conscience is laughable. He just loves the chaos he’s causing. He can get in the sea along with the rest of the utter scum that inhabit the Cabinet.
Who cares he's serving his purpose now. I have no problem with the chaos he's causing, the more the better IMO. The core problem has always been that those within the establishment operate to different rules to everyone else. If Cummings now wants to challenge that by using his inside knowledge and experience then he should crack on.
The idea that he’s now suddenly found some sort of conscience is laughable
Aye. This current shit storm is because a man’s wife didn’t like an employee and had him sacked. That employee is now hell bent on revenge
End of days stuff
Don't worry Liz Truss will save Ukraine...oh no she's got Covid and is at home, so is Zahawi. How convenient!
Even now they're gaming the system to limit how much shit sticks to themselves
I have no problem with the chaos he’s causing, the more the better IMO
with this particular chaos, perhaps not. But he’s not on your side Dazh
I struggle to put into words the sheer level of contempt I feel for Johnson and those who continue to support him.
If we had a PM who didn't choose to employ a chaos-merchant like Cummings, or didn't allow his wife to interfere with the tenure of civil servants, I guess it wouldn't be an issue.
It's just another example of his lack of judgement and forward thinking, and now it's started kicking him up the chuff, I can't be too unhappy about that.
Yep, if Cummings wasn't doing it no-one else, press or politician, would be. His motives are probably completely nuts and/or narcissistic but if it hits the spot then game on!
The thing is... if Cummings wasn't such a vindictive little shit, would we actually know about these Downing Street parties at all?
I doubt it, given that they'd successfully covered them up for so long
Makes you wonder what else is going on we don't know about
Oh Cummings is a turd of the highest order, I doubt anyone would deny that. There's probably some phycological term to describe the way he acts and I doubt it's pleasant.
I don't know if it's "My Enemies, Enemy is my Friend" or just a case of schadenfreude, but it reminds me of Trump's downfall, does it fix all that's wrong with Westminster? No, will the Tory Party elect someone as bad, or even worse to replace him? Probally, but I be dammed if I'm going to miss an opportunity to enjoy the fireworks and it's another big and important step towards the end of this style of right wing populist politics.
I doubt it, given that they’d successfully covered them up for so long
Some came out without him. The one on the 20th was announced by him but in an attempt to divert from the photos of him chilling out.
He is adding to the damage but giving him all the credit seems somewhat flawed and plays into his political grandmaster image.
Pippa Crerar broke several of the stories and I think its fairly safe to say she isnt one of his favoured conduits of information.
I'm in my office today and a couple of my colleagues are bending over backwards to downplay this whole debacle. They're happy to have a liar as PM because he's not Corbyn - Yep they still bang on about him all the time.
This is the same colleagues who complain about not getting paid enough (public sector) yet have continually voted tory despite 12 years of austerity eroding their wages.
However much this should be an evisceration of the Tories, it won't be because there's always delusional idiots who will vote against their own best interests.
I will start that I didn't like Cummings however he was employed to do a job that he done extremely well (I will add I didn't agree with the job he was doing (he sold his soul to old nick) so don't shoot the messenger)
The job was to get Johnson into no 10 and get him a cabinet full of nodding donkeys with even less going on between their ears than him(bozo) and take on red wall tories that pledged their allegience to their glorious leader, the ERG nutcases were already on board his big bus of lies. He also got rid of a load of long standing tories who at least had principles (again not neccessarily principles shared by me) .Problem being Bozo could only keep the juggling act going so long and was stupid enough to sack his chief architect who knows where all the bodies are hidden. So I for one am glad he is delivering a death of a thousand cuts to him but am also torn between him destroying the tories for years whilst causing the country irreperable harm. (I honestly think the clown would do anything to stay in charge).
And here is the problem - while our PM, cabinet and party are arguing and deflecting whether they had a party a year or so ago, the sh*t is getting real.
Start at @45s in.
https://twitter.com/AlynSmith/status/1488461102522552323?s=20&t=lNp7C4fnUOkO-JXGQV5Wlw
What I also resent is the loyalists presently happy to debase themselves defending Johnson now implying that things like the aborted call to Putin are apparently our fault for having the temerity to want answers to all this bullshit about parties
The nerve of the ****s is off the scale
Completely agree he is being distracted from his job owing to his own failings so the only way to sort it is with him walking as nothing else will be accepted.
I'm perfectly happy for Cummings to continue his attempts to destroy johnson and his wife; it's what they deserve.
This doesn't change my general loathing of him - principally for his involvement in vote leave.
I cannot believe even Putin could summon the energy to have a conversation with Johnson.
What is the point of discussing anything important with a liar?
Johnson sees the direction of the drift then gets in front of it. I think there's little chance of the Ukraine being invaded so that gives him and Truss the chance to distract and play at 'diplomacy' and facing down the Ruskies.
Just heard Starmer’s turn at the dispatch box again from yesterday. Measured and heartfelt, and utterly damming of Johnson. And his MPs. I recommend listening to it again. So good.
Just imagine how much of a brass neck Johnson has, to sit opposite and listen to both Stamer's & Blackford's statements.
Don’t worry Liz Truss will save Ukraine…oh no she’s got Covid and is at home, so is Zahawi. How convenient!
This Liz Truss?
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/liz-truss-covid-maskless-commons-b2004794.html
Just imagine how much of a brass neck Johnson has, to sit opposite and listen to both Stamer’s & Blackford’s statements.
His 'looking into his lap while shaking his head' act is infuriating. It's like a little boy sent to the headmaster's office claiming a bigger boy did it and ran away.
Just imagine how much of a brass neck Johnson has, to sit opposite and listen to both Stamer’s & Blackford’s statements.
Yeah, but did you see him?! He honestly doesn't look well. He looked like a half-collapsed suet pudding in the Commons, slouched on the bench, vacant expression on his pale face.
I cannot believe even Putin could summon the energy to have a conversation with Johnson.
What is the point of discussing anything important with a liar?
Surely Johnson needs to check in with his boss every once in a while?
"Am I still a good little patsy for you Vlad? Would you like me to destabilise the country any more? Can we offer you any more corrupt investment opportunities to hide all your dirty money? Do let us know if there's anyone you don't like hiding out in the UK - we have some lovely cathedrals your chaps could come and visit if that's the case."
Makes you wanna puke.
Liz Truss was sat next to Patel, is it to much to hope for.......
What I also resent is the loyalists presently happy to debase themselves defending Johnson now implying that things like the aborted call to Putin are apparently our fault for having the temerity to want answers to all this bullshit about parties
The nerve of the ****s is off the scale
It might actually have been beneficial that Boris wasn't able to have his chat with Vlad, I can't really see what useful input he would have given, and It's entirely possible that the great waffling cock-sock would have inadvertently angered the Bear-wrestler in chief into invading Ukraine sooner...
Worse yet He'd probably have asked if Putin could set 'Fancy Bears' loose on all who oppose him just so he can keep his job another few weeks...
Big boy, grown-up international politics should really be reserved for politicians that demonstrate they are capable of handling a bit of responsibility at home; naughty boys have to go and explain themselves in the commons...
Interesting - TortoiseMedia.com has this excerpt as to why he wasn't on the phone to Vlad (sorry it's behind a paywall, but I was intrigued enough from listening to a R4 podcast where it was spoken about to sign up to Tortoise. Seems good so far...):
Kissinger’s problem
Putin sometimes has the same problem Henry Kissinger used to complain of in relation to Europe; not knowing whom to call. Boris Johnson has put in a bid for a telephone conversation with the Kremlin but when Putin had to choose on Friday he chose President Macron. They spoke for an hour and agreed on the need to de-escalate the stand-off on the Ukrainian border. Putin said he wanted to implement the Minsk Accords – a four-way pact involving Russia, Ukraine, France and Germany but not the US, Nato, the EU or the UK. Macron then spoke at length to Ukraine’s President Zelensky too. Put aside the risk of war for a moment and the Ukraine crisis becomes, among other things, a stage for yet another Franco-British arm-wrestle for diplomatic clout. For now it’s clear who’s winning.
I've just written my second email to my Tory MP, who to be fair, is a decent constituency MP. Whilst I don't expect it to make any difference on its own, it may help to tip the weight of his inbox.
That's a good analysis Blob.
Even without the distraction of partygate I'm not sure what influence the UK could have on proceedings anyhow. Putin wants to sideline NATO and the EU, and in that he has been ably assisted by Trump in the first instance and by our Tory government in both instances.
I was reading the other day about how for 300 years British foreign policy revolved around making sure no single power dominated on the continent.
Speaker has now issued a feeble rebuke to Johnson over the Savile smear aimed at Starmer. I was hoping that he would be told to withdraw, which would be a first given his procreational history.
I've just emailed my MP.
She's the charmer that recently thought that 'n***er in the wood pile' was suitable language for a serving MP.
Not expecting too much.
I was hoping that he would be told to withdraw, which would be a first given his procreational history.
Given his porcreational history, he'd ignore it anyways 😉
I've written to my MP, I expect nothing as she was lobby fodder who was quickly put up for election after they got rid of the old one.
She's also posted this on Facebook...
Yesterday was a difficult day in Parliament. I have read the report and I feel we are no further forward.
Clearly, there are some areas that need addressing.
I wholeheartedly support any recommendation for greater scrutiny and I am pleased to see the Prime Minister introduce plans to scale down the Prime Minister's office at Number 10 Downing Street and ensure much more engagement with MPs.
It is not appropriate for me to comment any further ahead of the Met Police investigation.
However, it is my sincere wish that Westminster would stop talking about itself and allow me to concentrate on delivering for the people of Truro & Falmouth.
My letters contain many references to the queen and patriots, saying that he is a disgrace and should be sent to the tower.
I should imagine a gammon's opinion counts for more than a whiney cyclist.
Boris won’t go. He will survive this crisis and other until 2 things happen. The first is the Tory party decide he is an electoral liability which I don’t think they do yet given his majority. That might change after the local elections in May. The second is that someone else wants the job at the moment. They might decide to leave him swinging in the air for another year and get rid a year out from the election so his replacement can do play the new card and pre election give always
Is it better to sit back and allow the Tories the luxury of replacing him at a time of their choosing, or to push hard enough that they have to cut him loose at a time which is inconvenient and potentially damaging for his successor?
For the first time I have had a personal reply (rather than generic platitudes) from my MP.
I had written two him ten days ago or so saying that I was ‘ disappointed’ with the parties at Downing Street and he had given the generic ‘we have to wait for the Sue Grey report’ reply.
He emailed me with a link to the Grey update within about 10 minutes of it being published.
I replied saying that it was a bit of a cop out as I had asked for his personal opinion in the original email.
To cut a longer four or five email exchange short, he basically said that we had to wait for the Met report but, interestingly, he made no attempt to support Boris as he has done in the past, and when I pointed that out he made no comment.
Is it better to sit back and allow the Tories the luxury of replacing him at a time of their choosing
I'll repeat what I've said before. Forcing the resignation of a sitting PM either by a VONC or forcing his party to dump him is a massive victory that any opposition would be stupid to pass up. All these questions about the right time etc are overthinking the problem, and they run the risk of the public thinking labour's only concern is their own politcal advantage.
Whoever replaces Johnson, and lets be honest the candidates are very poor, will have a massive uphill battle to reverse the reputational damage and heal the internal wounds, let alone solve the intractable problems like the cost of living, brexit, the NHS etc. The tories know it's a poisoned chalice, which is why no one in the cabinet has made a move.
It has been a poisoned chalice since the day after the referendum on EU Exit, which is why we are only getting chancers.
Latest evisceration from Marina Hyde:
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/feb/01/wine-fridges-tory-party-kool-aid
Liz Truss was sat next to Patel, is it to much to hope for…….
I think their faces would still have maintained a 1 metre gap.
I believe Gray has said that she will not name names of junior people involved, but will name more senior civil servants (?and politicians). The Met are not the ones preparing a report, she is, and she appears to have pretty much all the evidence as she gathered it and passed it on to the Met. All she needs from the Met is them to finish the process.
All those calling for Boris to go may regret it. There are some nasty pasties much further to the right than BJ that could take over and take us even further down the "little britain xenophobia" journey we seem to be on. BJ may be a self interested berk but he does like to spend more than most tories do.
(?and politicians).
Cite? I'll put money on the PM not being mentioned directly in any cut down "update" or "report" to come from Gray or anyone else.
BJ may be a self interested berk but he does like to spend more than most tories do.
Spend it on what? This whole idea that Johnson is pro-investment, or anti-austerity is bogus. He loves talking up a big project or two (and then cancelling them). Or promising money to seats (and then cutting it). Or announcing new plans using existing money (it's schools today... pay more to retain teachers in struggling areas, and created new Free School sixth forms... but no new money to pay teachers or for Further Education provision after huge cuts to A-level and BTEC education funding in recent years).
BJ may be a self interested berk but he does like to spend more than most tories do.
Shame that most of it is on wallpapering, supporting mistresses, donations to mates and feasibility studies into wildly impractical infrastructure schemes like garden bridges, tunnels to Ireland...
Reported by the Good Law Project:
The Government has wasted more than £9.9 billion on PPE, which is more than it would cost to give every nurse in the NHS a 100 per cent bonus on their salary.
The figure comes from the Department of Health’s Annual Report, which reveals it spent:
<li aria-level="1">£673 million on PPE “not suitable for any use”
<li aria-level="1">£2,581 million on PPE “not suitable for use in the NHS”
<li aria-level="1">£4.7 billion paying inflated pandemic prices for PPE we didn’t need to buy
<li aria-level="1">£750 million buying PPE which will pass its expiry date before we can use it.
It has also “written down” the value of £1.231 billion in PPE, which is still yet to be delivered.
The Department also reports that some of the PPE will need to be recycled and it’s now contracting “waste providers”. Some of it is too complex to be recycled and so will need to be burned.
Thanks to an FOI response, Good Law Project can also reveal that, between April 2020 and August 2021, the Government spent £677.6 million storing excess PPE. It continues to spend £500,000 a day on this.
Civil servants complained at the time that the need to service VIPs, the majority of which were introduced by Government Ministers, was interfering with good procurement. It is unlikely we will ever know the true cost of this taxpayer-funded feeding frenzy for the friends and associates of Ministers.
...he does like to spend...
His position on investigating historic sex offence cases seems somewhat confused as well given her said:
“You know, £60m I saw was being spaffed up a wall on some investigation into historic child abuse and all this kind of thing. What on earth is that going to do to protect the public now?”
The audit report that highlights that DHSC misspending has also been qualified because of possible fraud.
The Government has wasted more than £9.9 billion on PPE, which is more than it would cost to give every nurse in the NHS a 100 per cent bonus on their salary.
But it wouldn’t have help party donors and chums, it wouldn’t help buy support at the next election so a waste of money in Tory party logic
Boris has come out today and said he stands by his Jimmy Saville remark about Starmer and won't apologise, and in answer to that the Speaker, the completely useless Lyndsey Hoyle, has said this
https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1488492460754051077?s=20&t=nCvHAcSDjwkLlDfKS59qiQ
So Ian Blackford is kicked out of the House for stating a truism: that Boris is a liar, but Boris comes out with a bare-faced untrue slur to Starmer at the despatch box and the speaker just says he's 'not happy' with that.
When dealing with Johnsons endless lies, it seems Hoyle is like the refs we like to refer to as a 'homer', who are so spineless they always give decisions to the home team
Absolutely pathetic. Bring back Bercow. He wouldn't have stood for this
Hmmm, well, apart from the fact that Bercow's best man Julian Lewis (current chair of the intelligence and security commitee) was the man key to the cover up of organized abuse in North Wales children's homes...
Or that Sir Roger Gale, the man who stood in for Hoyle when Brexit was passed:
https://twitter.com/BBCParliament/status/1208048294120828928
was in charge of BBC Children's programming when this was was filmed:
Course, Boris was Mayor of London when the shady dealings around Elm Guest House and Dolphin Square were deftly swept aside with the help of top brass in the Met...
For some reason, I get the feeling that we won't be hearing a peep from (leader of Her Majesty's most loyal opposition) Sir Keir Starmer about that though
Oooo... "Number 10" says that Johnson will tell us if he is fined.
Two things...
- what if the Met decide he broke the law but a fine isn't issued, we need to know if that happens
- what's the point of relying on Johnson telling us what's happened, he's a liar
And... all this bumping it up to a legal issue is utterly irrelevant anyway... he told us not to socialise, not to meet up with loved ones unless we lived with them, not to see our dying relatives, not to travel to their funerals if they weren't local... and he and his team socialised, and he lied to cover it up. He is liar. He couldn't live up to even the easiest bit of the rules he asked us all to. He should go. What the Met has to say about it is irrelevant. He's taken us all for mugs.
And... there's still no mention of why he and his family were moving between two homes, when we weren't allowed to. Or what went on in that second home (Chequers), or who they mixed with there.
I get the feeling that we won’t be hearing a peep
Good. Nail Johnson on his character, his lies, his wrong doing. Don't get distracted by all this Savile nonsense and start issuing counter claims. I can't see Starmer being that easily led, or deviating from his focus on Johnson, his cabinet, and the Tory MPs shoring them up. If you think Starmer is the one getting it this wrong this week, rather than focussing on our PM soiling himself, his government, his party, our parliament, our country... and taking us all for mugs... you're one of very few people seeing it that way.
Say Keir Starmer nailed Johnson and became Prime Minister... how much do you reckon would change?
Not only in terms of quality of life for us commoners here in the UK, but in terms of foreign policy and such...
https://twitter.com/Channel4News/status/872075827575492609
You would've thought someone would bring these things up so Her Madge could have a word in their weekly meetings!
If you watched yesterday in Parliament, and came away thinking, "Yeah Starmer and Johnson, two peas in the same pod"... then I'm surprised. If this is about to become a thread about "establishment" cover ups of sex offenders and middle east politics... I'm out. There's enough of the internet dedicated to that stuff.
It's also what Johnson wants... it's why he threw the Savile comment out there... let's not oblige him.
And in so doing, let's perpetuate the status quo that allows these travesties to continue unabated, whilst we cower in our homes at the behest of the media.
The Saville comment is a blatant dead cat. Ignore it, don’t get drawn in.
whilst we cower in our homes at the behest of the media
I’m sure that all makes sense to you.
I blame the internet. Everyone’s just four YouTube clicks away for Qanon and plandemics.
Johnson has thrown this Savile quip out there to feed conspiracy theory addicts, put shade on his opposition, and distract from a mess of his own making. Don’t run with it, just ignore him.
whilst we cower in our homes at the behest of the media.
No-one was doing that. We were staying home quite relaxed, at the request of scientists who know how diseases work. Really big difference. Don't talk bollocks, seriously.
I'm sure it all makes sense to you too, but it hurts too bad to admit it, so you fall back on cheap insults and try to trivialize huge issues that effect us all and will continue to do so, regardless of who anyone votes for.
It's a shame, because like it or not, unless things change, the future of the entire planet is dire.
<rolls eyes at the usual suspect>
We were staying home quite relaxed, at the request of scientists who know how diseases work.
That being the case and considering Johnson himself apparently spent time in a fairly serious condition in hospital it brings into question not only how those that make the rules could be so stupid as to have mass gatherings, but furthermore, how they can be trusted to ensure the safety of any of us, in any scenario...
Unless of course, they knew something we didnt?
Oh great. The resident troll has appeared. JHJ - please resist the urge to trash the thread.
Interesting discussion on 5Live about the Saville comment - apparently it was a smear used against Starmer in the past that was quickly refuted but has recently resurfaced on QAnon link channels.
Incompetent leader with bad hair quoting QAnon bollocks....seems familiar....
Always love the welcome I get when I chose to make an appearance here!
And my ex-kipper Tory MP Jenkinson is gleefully re-tweeting the Saville comments. It'll probably shore up the core tory support though.
Bloody socialist nonce lovers.
please resist the urge to trash the thread.
Gladly, please follow the urge to ask questions of not only your elected representatives, but also the entire apparatus of Her Majesty’s Government
Incompetent leader with bad hair quoting QAnon bollocks….seems familiar….
All too true... QAnon have done a wealth of bad in muddying the waters on getting some very serious matters investigated
Much like the repeating of flawed accusations, could that be by design?
"Say Keir Starmer nailed Johnson and became Prime Minister… how much do you reckon would change?"
This forum would be a happier place for starters.
Glad Starmer isn't taking the bait saville wise. That speech was eviscrating, for those wanting a more animated leader of the opposition I'd argue that sticking to the script is working, especially when dealing with someone who isn't very good at sticking to the script.
Starmer is playing the Tory backbenchers like he's conducting an orchestra. and just look at the faces of those sat opposite on the front bench!
The Labour strategy seems to be leave Starmer to do the talking, other prominent Labour MP's aren't sticking the boot in as much as could be expected, they're leaving it to the other opposition MP's to go in with the sliding tackles and risk the red cards.
“Say Keir Starmer nailed Johnson and became Prime Minister… how much do you reckon would change?”
Well things would actually get done as they'd get to work rather than ****ing about preening themselves all the time.
When someone posted earlier about how were spending half a million a week on simply storing excess PPE, my first thought was 'I wonder who is collecting the rent on those storage facilities? Do they donate to the conservative party and/or have contacts with ministers? How were the contracts for storage procured?
The answers to those questions could point to wether the government can be bothered or not with getting to grips with the problem because the right palms are continuing to be greased.
That speech was eviscerating
Totally.
Normally there's jeers and catcalls from the tory back benches, but this time the entire lot sat stony faced and never uttered a sound.
My first thought was ‘I wonder who is collecting the rent on those storage facilities? Do they donate to the conservative party and/or have contacts with ministers?.
Thats exactly it, and no doubt via a company set up in some offshore tax haven and all arranged through an intermediary who used to be in the party
insurers- I think your question about PPE storage was answered domewhete on the PPE/dodgy contracts thread.
Alternatively, search the Good Law Project website.