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this is a great example of how we ended up with so many kids in school. Everyone thinks their role is ‘critical’ yet in reality few are.
In fairness, maintaining (nuclear?) subs does sound reasonably important.
I think the assessment of what is "critical" depends a bit on timescales.
If we're talking say a few months last year, then obviously you want to keep the lights on, keep food arriving, keep healthcare services going sufficiently to stop people dropping dead, ensure the bins get emptied and waste water gets treated. Maybe you can put back scheduled maintenance on subs, or whatever.
But now we're in Lockdown Three, I imagine there are all sorts of less-obvious jobs which are becoming increasingly critical lest various more-or-less Important Things start failing (or failing to materialise when required).
I'm not suggesting that there are not some people taking the piss, but I reckon there will be many more people in increasingly critical-looking roles simply because we're on the bones of our collective arse somewhat from the past year or so of cutting/reducing everything we can.
FWIW, my kids are at home 😐
but I’m an academic with a research lab and do need to be in a few times a week to provide support.
Do you? Do you really. I think there are a lot of people who are saying things like this (my wife's just gone to site for similar arguments), and some employers (and government services) who are lacking imagination about how it might be possible to deliver services remotely - I know of a GP who goes to the surgery for a day of purely video calls, courts which can do civil work remotely but criminal work is in person - even when the accused doesn't need to be there, and within our business accountants and project managers who gravitate towards the office because its easier to see whats going on. Which bits of your support cannot be provided by video call?
I know of a GP who goes to the surgery for a day of purely video calls
if my video calls get interrupted by my son/wife/cat its no real biggy.
I can see that video consultations with a GP might require a little more privacy. if they are in a room on their own at the surgery with access to all the information they require, whats the problem?
2 primary kids at home. i dunno whether were doing it wrong or the school are particularly adept but we dont find home schooling difficult at all.
Just for clarity this is the government's list of who is a key worker. If you are on the list it doesn't really matter if other people don't think your role is critical or not. If you are not on the list and come up with creative reasons why your kids should be in school (other than vulnerable kids) you are gaming the system:
As an example someone apparently claimed they were a key worker as they were a dog worker and many of their clients were nurses so they had to carry on working also...
My son isnt at the moment as we are pix ridden, once we rejoin the clean world he will be going in as we both have to do in school work and our respective schools dont want to plan in advance enough for us both to ensure we are not in at the same time so another school gets more work. Sons school have said they want him in full time if he is in...
This week is a little different as I'm shielding before an Op on Weds.
Youngest (6) is in school most of the time though, Eldest (15) is home and supposedly doing school work, but is struggling with motivation. The rules in here are are stricter than most areas, we had to complete a couple of forms, have a telephone 'interview' and our bosses had to confirm our role etc. Less than 10% of the school is currently in, it's about 20 kids spread into 2 groups. I don't know what the spread between Essential Workers kids and Vunerable Kids is, and I can't imagine how anyone outside of the school / council would know.
Mrs is a Community Nurse, and will be vaccinating at the weekends, as soon as she's got through all the paperwork etc.
I qualify as an essential worker in Wales as we're IT support, our work allows around 2500 people to WFH who couldn't before. I don't know if I'd qualify in England.
I can WFH, but it's hard and I'm really limited on what I can do, I have to pass a lot of tasks onto my Boss as he's the only other person in the office and things start to get strained and go wrong. So I work from the office (when I'm not shielding).
I don't envy anyone who's trying to juggle WFH with Home Schooling and the decision to send our youngest into school was a hard one to make, especially given the 'English Strain', but I refuse to feel guilt for it, and I don't think it's fair to make parents who have sent their kids to school the latest Covid whipping boy.
Mine aren't in at the moment but the young one (age 11) will be in this week once the school reopens post-snow.
We have been keeping him off just to be on the safe side as my father passed away and I really didn't want to be told to self isolate before the funeral.
He is officially "vulnerable" as he has an EHCP due to his Autism and the school have been pestering us to send him in. He struggles with home schooling and needs the routine of school or his mental health suffers.
I have mixed feeling about him going in but apparently there are only 6 other kids in his class at the moment so it's not too bad.
My eldest (13) is just getting on with his schoolwork.
Yes, as we’re both essential workers they are both going this time, my eldest has her A levels year so is working hard on those. My youngest found not being at school difficult last time towards the end.
We have 4 kids, I'm doing the 3 youngest - primary
My wife's dealing with older 2, luckily? She's out of work
I start work at 2pm
So feels like I'm doing 13 hr days + 2hrs of comuting
Its hell but, I know there's other kids who's parents for various reasons can't do what we are doing, I'd rather those ones were in school
Wife is a Dr, I'm "Critical Worker" doing WFH. Two kids in nursery - if I had them at home I'd be starting work when Wife gets home from work at 6.
If we felt like we needed to keep them home, I'd probably have to try and negotiate to drop some hours.
Only one case been round our (small and well run) nursery back in August. It's an affluent area so there's a mix of Doctors (risky) and other WFH professionals (safer?) so we're sticking with it. However a nearby nursery is completely shut down after ALL their staff tested +ve.
We accept there is some risk. If there's a route for Covid in to our household, it's through nursery and while I really don't want Covid, I'm mostly doing what I'm told - either by the Gvt. or by the Wife.
Well played to everyone who's making it work and doing their damndest to keep going. Gladly buy you all a pint when I can.
Critical workers are;
Parents whose work is critical to COVID-19 and EU transition response
Health and social care
Education and childcare
Key public services
Local and national government
Food and other necessary goods
Public safety and national security
Transport and border
Utilities, communication and financial services
Basically EVERYONE! I work in HR but for a utilities and finance company. So I'm critical right?
Oh and my kids way to old for school but grandchildren are going 2-3 days a week based on their mum and dads shifts at the hospital.
My two are both at home - they're Y10 and Y13 so more than capable of getting their work done without any help and sorting their own lunch out too.
We're both teachers (wife is a primary teacher and in school 50 hours a week as usual, but I'm teaching sixth formers from home). I'm in awe of those with younger kids managing at home.
We have an Amazon fulfilment centre in town, so lots of the kids in school have parent(s) working there. I'd question how much of what's being shipped through them is essential...
We have 4 kids, I’m doing the 3 youngest – primary
My wife’s dealing with older 2, luckily? She’s out of work
i hope she does the maths lessons
I’m a Project Manager for a company who builds and maintains equipment for Navy ships and the entire UK Submarine fleet.
I’ve been going into work 2-3 days per week as needed as i’m managing a lot of critical work in our build facility.this is a great example of how we ended up with so many kids in school. Everyone thinks their role is ‘critical’ yet in reality few are.
Well, i'm impressed you have such an insight into my job considering most of it is pretty sensitive.
I have a letter from the Secretary of State for Defence confirming i am a key worker in case i'm asked for evidence..
There are some absolute piss takers at my kids school this time, no idea how they can send them in with a clear conscience.
Agreed - same situation at my youngest daughters school..
Anyhow - the Government are to blame for this - if kids who either don't have a Desk at home or who's Broadband is a bit slow are allowed into School i'm happy to send mine in with a clean conscience.
My eldest is off today. Called and told not to come in. He's a Graduate Classroom Assistant and has been taking lessons (on his own as teachers are WFH preparing materials) for the children. One parent called in to say their son has tested positive. And Boom! Bubble down. School closed today. He's had a test this morning.
WE have 2, one is 10 and we keep him at home his school this time around have been great and have almost a full day of on line lessons.
The youngest (6) does go in as he is autistic and need the structure, last year we could not get him to do anything at home, but now with the smaller class size (they only have 15 per year group even when fully open) he has come on leaps and bounds.
We could send both in as the wife is a key worker but it just does not feel right
this is a great example of how we ended up with so many kids in school. Everyone thinks their role is ‘critical’ yet in reality few are.
@sgn23 Actually the government has explicitly defined this as a critical role so wind your neck in.
This is the relevant bit:
"identified as a Critical (Key) Worker under the “Public Safety and
National Security” category as their work is critical to the delivery of key defence outputs."
The threat to national security hasn't gone away (just the opposite in fact as regularly reported in the news) just because there is a pandemic on which is why there is absolutely no slip in delivering defence contracts.
I do exactly the same as @freeagent but on the technical design/delivery side and therefore the majority of time cannot work from home as we need access to information that is forbidden (under law) to be removed from site.
I guarantee you that social distancing rules that we apply outside the school context are not being following inside at some time or another. Not the fault of the staff and some of the students. Rhetoric that schools are safe has not changed so I cant see this improving. I havent seen any updated RA from schools regarding the new version of the virus despite the the scientific evidence.
Bubbles dont protect the kids or the staff. Sorry for the rant, fed up having seen 6 out of 11 teaching staff infected due to one infected member of staff came in. A result of insisting all staff should come in.
Sure send your kids to school, your kids, your choice. Mine? Happy at home with laptops.
Do you? Do you really.
Yes. I have to train researchers to use equipment and conduct their work safely whilst providing safety oversight. When I’m not there, a colleague provides safety cover. When I am, I provide the cover for my colleague. You cannot use covid-19 as a reason to abrogate safety responsibilities so that you end up with labs full of inexperienced researchers handling potentially dangerous equipment and chemicals etc with no checks and balances. The only reason I wouldn’t need to be there would be if the labs were closed. But they’re not - research is continuing, in my institution as it is in most. Oh, yes, and as I said, my kids are at home... So I’m not claiming critical worker status.
Which bits of your support cannot be provided by video call?
We have to have a minimum number of experienced staff on-site in order to be compliant with our emergency planning and health and safety policies, which includes sufficient numbers of fire wardens, first aiders, and staff competent to deal with emergencies arising from laboratory accidents. I can, and do, deal with many routine queries by video call, but ultimately I’m the most competent person when it comes to the equipment in my lab.
Do you? Do you really. I think there are a lot of people who are saying things like this (my wife’s just gone to site for similar arguments), and some employers (and government services) who are lacking imagination about how it might be possible to deliver services remotely
a research lab is work that cannot be done at home, unless you think you can have microbiology cabinets or Genomics equipment in your home office
I do exactly the same as @freeagent but on the technical design/delivery side and therefore the majority of time cannot work from home as we need access to information that is forbidden (under law) to be removed from site.
Yeah, Cyber Essentials has made remote access a bit difficult..
As suggested above - the Defence Industry has not closed down over COVID-19 - the stuff we Design/Build/Test needs to go into a ship/Submarine/Module before they weld the lid onto a compartment - no parts of this can be done from home.
a research lab is work that cannot be done at home
Most people do work that can't be done at home. Should most kids be in school?
Without reading through all the froth and boiled piss comments, I'm starting to feel like the topic of kids going back to school is being set up as the next "Divisive issue" by the Press and some MPs.
Really getting kids back in school is not the driving issue, the driving issue (IMO) is still Vaccination, and minimising the likelihood of infections, deaths and subsequent stress on the Health service.
No home schooling isn't ideal, but Schools are unfortunately an excellent vector for infection to spread throughout the wider community...
The question now is essentially the same as the one had almost a year ago; are we as a nation willing to put productivity ahead of public health?
Additionally the fact that the Government are talking about pushing the timescales for 2nd shots out seems to be getting missed, those most vulnerable still aren't fully vaccinated yet, and the timeline for them to be sounds like it's getting longer.
Plus those of us in the categories 3/4/5, under 50s, "parenting age" types are still quite susceptible to infection...
The discussion seems to be getting steered back towards angry "when will everything be 'normal' again" rants rather than, what are the potential consequences if we relax measures and resume schooling too soon? Those consequences are still potentially quite serious IMO...
I don't think we'll be sending our kids back after half term whatever the Government says.
And I'm not personally expecting to be fully vaccinated before May myself...
My mate is governor of the local school.
He confirms they are at their wits end and have a good number of parents taking the piss: he mentioned a family where the mum works part-time and the dad is furloughed at home but they still send their kids to school!
On the flip side: he said some people are going too far the other way, citing a local family where both parents are frontline doctors but are frantically coordinating shifts and clinics so one of them can stay home with the kids.
In Newcastle there are 21 times as many kids in schools as during the first lockdown - https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/north-east-news/21-times-more-newcastle-children-19697906
Got to wonder at the frothing and self righteous comments from the people above saying they are key workers...
From what I can see, apart from the obvious shop & hospitality exceptions, a huge number of people are deemed critical. I know me and the missus are, but we wouldn't dream of sending our kids to school at present.
Got to wonder at the frothing and self righteous comments from the people above saying they are key workers .... but how wonderful they are for having the opportunity and good fortune to be able to keep their kids at home full time and their implied criticism of those who can't due to their working circumstances and are deemed critical workers by the Government.
In Newcastle there are 21 times as many kids in schools as during the first lockdown
Yeah I'm just outside Newcastle so that fits with what my mate was saying.
We've had letters from both first school and middle school saying they are at 50% attendance 😲 and struggling for bubbled-space so please review guidance and only send kids if you absolutely have to.
My wife and i are both key workers. I am in defence and she is in food retail. Kids 2 and 4 normally nursery + childminder and wife normally works afternoons, so both home at night.
I work 0730 to 1630 from home, wife leaves for evening shift at 1700 and half day on a saturday. This is obviously not ideal as we barely see each other and have virtually 0 free time bar a Sunday which is family day.
I have a letter saying my kids can go to nursery but the local one has a firm policy if either parent can wfh then no thank you.
I am fine with this for now but cannot do forever. I support it fully but it is definetly sucky and finding my stress levels and waist circumference are growing in equal measures!
The nursery is now closed after 5 workers have tested positive. With the youngest at home we can't work from home and we don't want to put others at risk if the youngest has passed it on to her sister who was going to school so she's being homeschooled. Back to 18 hour days for us.
Nope.....
Daughter could be as we are both key workers, however because wife is in most vulnerable cat. We decided to take a hit and she is home schooling the daughter while I work longer hours.
Got both mine at home (6 & 8). I am working from home, have been since March. Not ideal as I have a mechanical engineering development role so building and testing of prototypes has to be communicated to others where I would prefer to be more hands on.
My wife is a nurse full time, normal day hours so we did have the option of Key Worker club.
I decided to keep them at home as I feel the Key Worker club privilege is being abused a little. Also, if you have 30 or so kids whose parents are actual front line key workers, they are more at risk no? If they transmit the Corona to their kids unwittingly, who then take into school you effectively have 30 key worker families forced to self isolate. It must be a firkin Petrie dish in there!! Fortunately the company is very understanding and see my point of view. There are some very hard and challenging days though, particularly this time of year.
The big problem in all this isnt the schools, or key workers its the employers still wanting their pound of flesh.
The big problem in all this isnt the schools, or key workers its the employers still wanting their pound of flesh.
I am finding this is true way more than last time which was "do what you can...we understand".
The message has changed to "Do your role. Flexibly." I said I am struggling with what is a 45 hour week at the moment AND trying to help my wife home school. The option was work weekends or start at 6am. Or something. But you get paid to do your job.
Big (Financial Services) Blue chip that prides themselves on being big on the family side of things. I guess it doesn't help that neither my leader nor hers have kids and can happily sit uninterupted all day.
And my p1ss is still boiling that many people that work there consider themselves critical. They can all work from home. Well...no exceptions. They even closed our office.
I am finding this is true way more than last time which was “do what you can…we understand”.
The message has changed to “Do your role. Flexibly.”
Very much this. For both the wife and I.