[Closed] Anyone else not feeling sorry at all for Andrew Mitchell?

We expect politicians to be corrupt. Less so, the police. I think.

Would you have the same point of view had he been a Labour/Lib Dem MP?

hmm the police lying to get one over someone they don't like and in true stw style its mitigated by him being a Tory... who'd have thought it...

According to R4, one of the 'details' that CPS picked up on in all this was that Mitchell's statements had varied, as the CCTV came to light.

Not been following it to closely. In between the he said she said it appears the police were wrong. But I'll let them off this one 😆

If only he'd finished his statement with 'this sort of thing is only supposed to happen to poor people.'

If he had, then your post may have are more sense.

But... He didn't, did he ?

currently doing to the disabled, ill and unemployed....

Drama Queen.

Rozzers in being proved to be dishonest to suit their own purposes is despicable. As proved at Hillsborough. The political leaning of the target is irrelevant; it's so far from being OK as to be ridiculous.

Half justifying it as 'it's OK, he's just a Tory' is spectacularly naive.

When it's you, funny it won't be.

"I lost my job after a career spanning more than 25 years in parliament. What does all this say about our police and about basic fairness and decency in our country today?"

If the police will attempt to do this to man of his standing, power and influence what will they do to an actual pleb who would not have had the resources to fight them?

It does seem strange that the CPS feel they can only establish evidence for one prosecution, but the IPCC are confident enough to recommend misconduct proceedings against another four, including two for providing inaccurate statements...

Where is Junkyard and what have you done with him? 🙂

Very well put!

Fixed it for you.

Mitchell also described the emotional fallout of the dispute on himself and his family. "I have told the truth about this incident. The police did not. My reputation was destroyed. I was vilified, relentlessly, over 33 days, with over 800 hate emails received during the course of that first week.

"I and my family were driven from our home, to our second expensive home in the country, with as many as 20 journalists and photographers camped outside,sadly i didnt have enough cups, and soon ran out of milk, after supplying the media hacks with tea and coffee, must keep them on my side, My children were followed by the press, so they say, they do have a very vivid imagination,just like their dad, my 92-year-old mother-in-law was pursued in Swansea, for a few pence by an unemployed homeless pleb,nice to see Davids policies are working so well. I was spat at in the street, obviously a work shy unemployable labour votor or ex police officer.

"I lost my well over paid job after a career spanning more than 25 years in parliament, some people just cant vote for anyone else thankfully. What does all this say about our police and about basic fairness and decency in our country today?"

Im now going to be a media celebrity, and will soon be on the sofa on bbc1 and numerous other right wing bbc programes.

Thank you, Junkyard. I have followed this case from the start and you have come to exactly the same conclusion as me.

how can you not feel sympathy for him he was set up by the police?

I don't feel sympathy for him as he and his party are quite happy to inflict far worse on people with nothing, so he's just getting a taste of his own medicine. Long term, he'll be fine, he's rich, well educated and more importantly very well connected.

If the police will attempt to do this to man of his standing, power and influence what will they do to an actual pleb who would not have had the resources to fight them?

Almost certainly worse, but like I said in my OP, I don't condone their behaviour, but nor am I particularly surprised by it. Just in this case, the victim couldn't be more deserving.

No victim is deserving of having his life destroyed by deliberate vindictive lies by police officers wether you are on the left or the right we are all entitled to better from our police than this. If the police wish to retain their credibility they need to hound the three fed reps out of office and support the prosecution of those who allegedly concocted the false statements of the incident.

The behaviour of the police is appalling - frightening actually - but I can't say a bit of me's not enjoyed seeing him being treated like a pleb by them

No victim is deserving of having his life destroyed

Only he hasn't. It's a minor set back in his political career which is far from over and even when it eventually is, he'll walk into a whole suite of non-exec positions / consultancy jobs for banks and have a VERY comfortable life.

f the police wish to retain their credibility they need to hound the three fed reps out of office and support the prosecution of those who allegedly concocted the false statements of the incident.

I don't disagree. However, unsurprisingly it looks like they'll all walk away with no more than a slapped wrist.

I bloody surprised by it, if you can't see that this heads us back down the road of "let's round up some ( insert you group of choice) they are all guilty..." then I feel sorry for you. what he or his party have done / doing is irrelevant in this case what is relevant is that there are still those in the police that believe that behaving like this is acceptable. to be honest I don't give a rat's ass about the man and his politics, what I do care about is that the law in this country is consistent and fair REGARDLESS of who you are. most people in this country wouldnt have stood a chance under similar circumstances and for that the the police officers involved should be ashamed.

If he hadn't been such an arrogant tory twunt in the first instance he wouldn't have thought he was above complying the directions the coppers gave him.....etc

I have no confidence in or respect for the police so am not suprised by whatever they do however I have no sympathy at all for this man who was clearly at the root of his on undoing.

If the police will attempt to do this to man of his standing, power and influence what will they do to an actual pleb who would not have had the resources to fight them?

I don't believe for one moment that the first person they falsified evidence against was a member of government. I have no doubt that they have had previous success against mere mortals that emboldened them to abuse the system again this time.

If I were an enterprising lawyer, I would be searching through previous cases where the evidence of these officers had been pivotal in gaining a conviction, and getting them overturned.

I have no confidence in or respect for the police so am not suprised by whatever they do however I have no sympathy at all for this man who was clearly at the root of his on undoing.

Given everything we now know, it seems much more likely that the police were being deliberately obtuse in order to get a reaction.

Me. Mitchell is still a tool.

A tool with a big ego who expected the big gate to be opened for him.

If the police aren't to be trusted, let's see G4S doing the security around Downing Street and Parliament.

I think the government and the police are corrupt and it's situations like this that just confirm that fact.

Initially I didn't feel sorry for him at all... Thought he was pompous and up his own fundament.

But as it came out it is clear just how far the police will go to cover up silly lies.

He did lose his career. His name will never be separated from this. Being a Tory doesn't mean he deserves this. I'm disappointed some can only view this in terms of class warfare. Do only the poor deserve justice?

they may have stitched him up proper but did they advise him he should be wearing a helmet and hi viz?

[img] [/img]

the coppers involved should definately face the consequences of what theyve done but it was his own undersecretary (and bitter rival)that escalated the complaint, the police Fed that called him a liar and David Cameron who fired him long before any investigation had been carried out.

Tory or not, elements within the Metropolitan Police felt confident enough in their ability to stitch up a government Minister. Imagine what they might be willing to do to the likes of you and I?

dunno but that tie is a shocker...

Mitchell?

Cry me a river sugar-tits. 🙁

Accepting police behaviour below expected standards as you don't like or care for the recipient of that behaviour? Ok.... Real nice, let's open the floodgates.

It's not as simple as one or the other is it? I can reconcile believing that the police action is totally unacceptable, with also having no sympathy for Mitchell as he's been part of the party that's inflicted misery on so many. It's not all goodies and baddies, sometimes both "sides" are scumbos.

Exactly NW! 🙂

It reminds me of the day at secondary school when two of the biggest bullying cocks at school finally clashed. Everyone watched fascinatedly hoping they'd just keep going until they'd done permanent damage to one another.

I don't like Mitchell and the way he behaved. The thing we all need to remember is that he resigned. HE RESIGNED! If he was right, and had treated the cops ok he would have not resigned as he would have done nothing wrong! None of it makes any sense..

33 days he said, was that the time it took to release the video?

The thing we all need to remember is that he resigned. HE RESIGNED!

This is politics, once the PM explains that you are a liability to the party and will be resigning tomorrow, you don't really have a choice. Remember that plenty of politicians have resigned in disgrace only to re-appear a few months later e.g. Mandleson springs to mind. Resigning is never the end, just the start of a new chapter.

[quote=metruscan said]I don't like Mitchell and the way he behaved. The thing we all need to remember is that he resigned. HE RESIGNED! If he was right, and had treated the cops ok he would have not resigned as he would have done nothing wrong! None of it makes any sense..

Political registration are usually not the decision of the resignee 🙂

Well, yes, what's happened to Andrew Mitchell has been pretty crap for him and he's well entitled to feel aggrieved!

Do I feel sorry for him?

I suppose he's on the list, but some way down it. Even if you restrict the list of people I feel sorry for to people done up (or worse) by the police he's a lot lower on the list than, off the top of my head:

Blair Peach (and his family)
Hillsborough victims (and families)
Orgreave victims..
The guy that went to prison for murdering Rachel Nickel (but hadn't)
The guy in Hull who choked to death on the floor of a police station while cops stood drinking tea.

That's not to have a pop at the police, by the way, there's people being failed by "the system" or by bad people in "the system" all over the place who I feel greater sympathy for than Andrew Mitchell:

People dying of cancer being told they're fit for work and losing their benefits literally days before they die, old women in hospitals drinking water from flower vases, you don't have to look far...

... for people you can feel sorry for more than for a very rich man who's lost his job and career.

I imagine there's quite a few coppers who must have had a wry smile when the worst thing was being spat at. The average beat bobby I would think would be happy if the worst thing that ever happened to them on the street was being spat at. I feel sorry for non-bent coppers more, his comments about "the police" are not fair to them.

There's a vast number of police who do the job for the reasons the rest of us would like them to - genuinely working for the common good. Come to think of it, unfashionable as it is to say it, there's actually a fair number of politicians the same, they're not all in it for the moat cleaning and duck houses.

So, yes sympathy for Andrew Mitchell. But only a little bit.

And a tiny bit more than that for his family.

I am vehemently anti tory policy ad infinitum etc...etc....but i'd be willing to stand side by side with mitchell on this one, I've been stitched up by the police before in court and despite my protestations i went to jail until video evidence was released that proved my innocence in a retrial. Personally i don't trust them one bit and from my lawyers advice if i'm i've ever stopped whether that be in the car or otherwise i inform them before they utter a word that i am recording all proceeding conversations which is within my right to do so.

Some Tories do things you don't like - so therefore it's ok to bully one of them out of office although there was no evidence of any wrongdoing by him at the time...

vs

Some cyclists do things you don't like, so therefore it's ok to bully one of them off the road although there was no evidence of any wrongdoing by him at the time...

Footflaps get over your political prejudice. Deal with it as thought he guy was just another bloke in the street.

Now, is it really ok that what happened, happened ? No ?

Think on.

Nipper99 , why does it matter that he was a Tory ?

Northwind, I don't see that this current government is any more liable for the current situation than the previous one. Let's face it the current lot have only been around for 3 years or so. Blair / Brown etc were around for over a dozen - which government do you think had more impact on the current situation ?

Some Tories do things you don't like - so therefore it's ok to bully one of them out of office although there was no evidence of any wrongdoing by him at the time...

vs

Some cyclists do things you don't like, so therefore it's ok to bully one of them off the road although there was no evidence of any wrongdoing by him at the time...

Rather a poor analogy, as Chief Whip his job is to ensure MPs tow the party line i.e. persecute the poor whilst keeping their millionaire chums rich i.e. he has blood on his hands. The bike analogy is somewhat more tenuous, e.g. I'm sure at some point Hitler rode a bike, so maybe all cyclists should be executed for war crimes?

🙄

pymwymis - Member

Northwind, I don't see that this current government is any more liable for the current situation than the previous one. Let's face it the current lot have only been around for 3 years or so. Blair / Brown etc were around for over a dozen - which government do you think had more impact on the current situation ?

Again, it's not goodies vs baddies. Maybe Labour has as much or more responsibility, it's not relevant.

Good post edlong

pymwymis - Member
Footflaps get over your political prejudice. Deal with it as thought he guy was just another bloke in the street.

Now, is it really ok that what happened, happened ? No ?

We are innocent until proven guilty.
Guilt should be evaluated on the evidence

I don't feel particularly sorry for him as he seems to be a fairly odious individual, and playing the contrite victim leaves a bit of a nasty taste.

However being an odious person is not a crime in itself. Falsifying evidence is.

The thing which struck me is that he seemed surprised (in his statement on the radio earlier) that the police fit people up, and spoke as if this was uncommon, and not normal, when I would consider the opposite to be true - the police hold the legitimate monopoly on violence, of course they are going to be corrupt.

And when you consider all of his party colleagues displaying their support of him so publicall...

oh no, sorry, they all think he's a t w at as well - by all accounts a thoroughly unlikeable person even compared to other previous whips.

ficticious police evidence is well out of order, but it seems to me there are too many things we just don't know about this

Nope.

All part of the game for Mitchell surely: as above, this is just another chapter in his career and there are still plenty of opportunities and doors open to him that are not open to brighter, more capable, more experienced but less well connected people.

As a party/chief whip of any political party, I'd have thought Mitchell should be understanding of:
1) the need to cut off a bad branch for the good of one's party even if it is the press and the public's understanding at the time which is at fault, not the individual being instructed to resign.
2) the myriad ways in which one might be stabbed in the back, and the range of people who might be holding the knife.
3) you just don't start messing with the police's funding, conditions and pensions! Has he not seen [url= http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1701920/ ]The Shadow Line[/url]? 😆

Also the man is reputed to be a proper bullying nasty piece of work, even for a party whip. The political party he happens to represent comes a long way down the list for me.

I feel sorry for the folks standing up for the police in this.

Corruptable police is a legacy that lasts a long time.

I wouldn't say I feel sorry for him but I would say the police offers concerned should be fired and Mr Mitchell should be compensated for the loss of his career earnings.

Umm an argument between a politician and the police. It's hard to know which will be lying the most in this circumstance

I agree that it is appearing more and more a case where members of the police have closed ranks and behaved negatively in order to drive their own agenda. However, I believe he admits swearing at officers - which I am sure would land the rest of us in trouble if we tried it...

It's certainly not ok because I don't like him - but I don't feel sorry for him and that is because I do not like him. I find him odious - not a feeling I limit to Conservative MP's either.

Well as one of the supposed plebs, albeit north of the wall, I have to say I am saddened and disappointed that lies have been told. A lot of us do want to do an honest job and help people despite the brush we're routinely tarred with. It may have had less impact telling the truth about the circumstances but at least it would have been an honest impact and above reproach. All at a time when we needed our Federations to stand together and fight our corner. Shame on them and hope they get what's coming fair and square as a deterrent to others in the job to lie.