Lorry drivers must love you
I'm easier to overtake than the other lorries that they try to overtake 🙂
Meh, the Tesco trucks do 50. They also pull away so slowly often only they get through the lights.
It saves fuel, for them and causes more fuel use for everyone else. I am aware drivers for large firms will get pulled up if they use too much go pedal and are strictly monitored.
Retests are hypothetical at best anyway. We barely have the infrastructure to test the learners we already have.
That's a political choice though, not a fact of life.
I’d stick to 50, saves huge amounts of petrol.
Honestly, don't do this, it really ****s the system up for everyone else. Do 58mph with the lorries, you'll still save loads of fuel (perhaps even more than at 50) and traffic will flow so much better.
your rolling roadblock is single-handedly forcing all the regular traffic doing the speed limit into one lane of a three lane motorway.
Very melodramatic.
If we are going to limit cars to 70 then what are we going to limit lorries too. If it’s about getting rid of the kinetic energy in an accident HGVs would have to go much slower than their current limit to get the energy to manage down to that of a car.
Very melodramatic
accurate though (although plenty of trucks run at 50).
but it would sure as hell weed out a lot of people who shouldn’t be on the road with or without additional training.
And again, where is the evidence for this? If testing came in what do you think people would do? They would learn the Highway Code again and they would get a couple of lessons as keeping their license may be one of the most important immediate things to them.
They could then pass the test and within weeks continue to drive as they did before the test or they could drive like angels. I think the former, you clearly have faith in the latter. Needs a bit more than faith...
And again, where is the evidence for this? If testing came in what do you think people would do?
Are you saying that any jobs that require regular certification or training is all just a waist of time ? Let’s hope pilots don’t do this
IMO your statement comes back to the route of the problem. It’s almost like driving is a human right rather than something that requires a standard to be met and maintained. A speed limit is a token gesture to saying that driving a car can be done safely by any numpty.
Would this training involve learning how to drive a car across a stream without wrecking it 🤔
Would this training involve learning how to drive a car across a stream without wrecking it 🤔
touche ! But a good one yes if I had known in advance that it had a shite wading depth then I wouldnt have done it.
Besides which I was going about 3 mph and that didnt save me or the car 😂
Yet no country in the world, as far as I know (despite what Brexity types might say) have felt the need to mandate speed limiters on private cars.
You sure about that?
And a couple of years later the car ****ers are naturally enough up in arms trying to pick holes:
TBF implementation has been a bit underwhelming.
In the future when I'm king, and everybody has to do what I say, rather than limit cars to 70mph, I'd limit licensing. Do the test as it's run now, and it entitles you to drive say; a 1.5lt car. with restricted dimensions (4 people and their luggage kinda size) and encourage tax into lower emissions, You want more than that? Well, to get to 2.0lt it's a £500 additional test, and extra insurance and tax, more than that, again, and additional test and another £500 and increased insurance and tax, and maybe some retesting (at a cost) and so on and on, want a 4*4? show us you live on a farm, or up a dirt track or it's a test with a £1500 price tag, if you live in an urban space you can't have one at all. Want a car that weights more the 2 tonnes?...well, you get the picture
Force folks into smaller cars that are more efficient, and away from status cars, with added benefit of getting rid of the caravans, which I think is something we can all agree on (Molgrips aside, obvs)
Force folks into smaller cars that are more efficient, and away from status cars, with added benefit of getting rid of the caravans, which I think is something we can all agree on (Molgrips aside, obvs)
No we dont all agree. I would prefer someone to have a caravan any day over a campervan/motorhome
My car weighs over 2 tonnes, has many safety features and is more economical than most 1.0 small cars.
Not saying you can't drive it, just that you have to pay for the privilege. Plus all the car manufacturers will start putting building and fitting all that stuff into the smaller cars that everyone will want. (and my Govt will incentive car manufacturers to do it)
If we are going to limit cars to 70 then what are we going to limit lorries too
You mean that thing that already has happened since 1988?
https://www.transportsfriend.org/road-transport-regulation-cu/construction-use-regulation-3/speed-limiters/
But as has been seen many times with lorries, it's not really speed that does the killing. It's long hours, tiredness, lack of concentration, unreasonable demands of employers, etc., etc.
Nah, I don't want that any more than I want manditory Helmets and reg plates for my bicycles.
Motorways are incredibly safe realtive to every other road type, most problems are caused by inatentive drivers who can't be bothered to give enough attention to something they find a chore.
They could then pass the test and within weeks continue to drive as they did before the test or they could drive like angels. I think the former, you clearly have faith in the latter.
People likely drive poorly for one of two reasons: either 1) deliberately or 2) due to ineptitude. Just because driver education and extra training may make little difference to 1) doesn't it's without merit to try to improve 2).
Are you saying that any jobs that require regular certification or training is all just a waist of time ? Let’s hope pilots don’t do this
Pilots have a crew of co-pilots, engineers etc and ATC monitoring them, all of whom would report them if they were observed ignoring procedures. So they'll always do things by the book and CPD is in their own interests.
The issue with re-tests is it would weed out people who are maybe incapable of driving for whatever reason. But wouldn't stop people who can drive perfectly, but willfully don't. They know how to pass the test, they know they should give cyclists 1.5m, they know they should stop before the stop line at lights, they know their exhaust shouldn't pop and bang, they know the speed limit is a limit.
And the next day could go straight back to driving at 90 with one hand on the wheel, not indicating, close passing, making progress and 'enjoying' their own exhaust note.
It's exactly the same in motorbikes. You can have all the graduated licensing, IAM, roadsmart, RoSPA, and whatever else. It won't stop the roads around Ribblehead and Wensleydale being closed seemingly every weekend so far this summer. They know how to ride safely, then they don't.
My car weighs over 2 tonnes, has many safety features and is more economical than most 1.0 small cars.
FWIW, no it's not. The absolute epitome of efficiency (an electric car?) might beat a 2-stroke go kart, but that doesn't mean it beats a similar car in an apples to apples comparison. And all the safety features in the world don't change the physics of a heavier car in a collision or braking to avoid one.
But as has been seen many times with lorries, it’s not really speed that does the killing. It’s long hours, tiredness, lack of concentration, unreasonable demands of employers, etc., etc.
You are conflating incidence and severity.
the other factors you mention influence incidence ie how likely an accident is to happen. speed influences severity ie what the consequences are
But we've already established that lorries are speed restricted and often have trackers! 😜
Do you want them to go even slower on motorways?
The issue with re-tests is it would weed out people who are maybe incapable of driving for whatever reason. But
But, as I said, is that a bad thing?
As the punchline to an old joke goes: "ever go fishing?" - sure - "ever catch all the fish?"
You mean that thing that already has happened since 1988?
https://www.transportsfriend.org/road-transport-regulation-cu/construction-use-regulation-3/speed-limiters//blockquote >
So doing some simple maths. A 40,000kg HGV doing 90kph (56mph) has a kinetic energy of 25,000,000Joules of energy to get rid of in an accident. A 2,000 kg car doing 130kph (80mph) has a kinetic energy of 2,592,000 Joules of energy to dissipate. That goes upto 3,888,000 Joules if the car weighs 3,000 kg which is a very very heavy car. So if it’s safe for lorries to do 90kph why is it not safe for cars to do 130kph in the UK?
I suppose if you're also proposing additional testing, tachographs, lane restrictions, mandatory rest periods etc required of people who want to drive at 80mph, then sure, I suppose I could be convinced.
It's not as easy and cheap are requiring 70mph speed limiters on all new vehicles, of course.
So doing some simple maths. A 40,000kg HGV doing 90kph (56mph) has a kinetic energy of 25,000,000Joules of energy to get rid of in an accident. A 2,000 kg car doing 130kph (80mph) has a kinetic energy of 2,592,000 Joules of energy to dissipate. That goes upto 3,888,000 Joules if the car weighs 3,000 kg which is a very very heavy car.
how much will kill a pedestrian or even the occupant of a stationary modern car? A lot less than any of those figures I'd guess. There's no prize for being more dead (it might actually be less painful).
more important is the stopping distance. which will be greater in a HGV at the same speed, but possibly equivilent when looking at HGV@58 vs car@70... maybe.
<p><span style="font-family: Roboto, 'Helvetica Neue', Arial, 'Noto Sans', sans-serif, -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, 'Segoe UI', 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol', 'Noto Color Emoji'; font-size: 16px; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%;">There’s no prize for being more dead (it might actually be less painful).<br /></span></p>
In which case there is no point in a speed limit then is there as dead is dead.
Unless of course you propose slowing all traffic down to a survivable speed. For an hgv to have the same kinetic energy as a 2,000 kg car at 50kph it can only do 11kph.
You sure about that?
I was aware of that and also aware it’a limiter you can accelerate past, so not really a limiter at all.
But as has been seen many times with lorries, it’s not really speed that does the killing. It’s long hours, tiredness, lack of concentration, unreasonable demands of employers, etc., etc.
Dunno, it's much harder for a sleeping lorry driver to kill people if they nod off in a stationary cab than if they do it in one moving 60mph towards the back of a traffic queue, of course if you take the limiter off they could wipe out even more people. Brexit bonus?
But we’ve already established that lorries are speed restricted and often have trackers! 😜
Do you want them to go even slower on motorways?
Yeah, why not? they're probably the most dangerous things on the motorways... maybe it could reinvigorate the rail freight industry in the UK? 😉
I was aware of that and also aware it’a limiter you can accelerate past, so not really a limiter at all.
So your previous statement was just a bit untrue then, as you were well aware governments (including ours) had at least considered mandating speed limiters, and just been crap at implementing them...
