But they are based on a false premise i.e. that the alternative to a new EV is a new ICE car
Well not necessarily - every car is new at some point. Your decision to buy used is independent of your decision to buy EV or ICE no?
When you buy new instead of used, a new car comes into the chain at the top and an old one pops out of the bottom and gets scrapped. If you buy new EV, it's replacing an old ICE so there's one less ICE on the road.
I was getting confused by the reports about how many miles you had to drive to make an EV environmentally beneficial. But they are based on a false premise i.e. that the alternative to a new EV is a new ICE car. So they are only looking at the “extra” CO2 required to produce the EV. If your comparison is keeping an existing car (i.e. not buying a new car at all) then you have to look at the total CO2 required to make the EV not just the extra bit and you pretty much never pay that back (at least not with the current energy mix). So keeping the existing car running is indeed the more environmentally responsible thing to do even if it is emitting more CO2 per mile than a newer EV.
the EV gets made whether you buy it or not. The car you’ve got keeps being driven whether you keep it or sell it.
we all live in the same environment no matter which of us is driving which car. We’ll transition to EVs in the time that takes to happen no matter who buys the first one and who buys the last one.
My car is 22 years old on about 160k. I've had it since 10 months and 10k. Runs fine, just flew through MOT. Has a little rust on a front wing that I keep in check, but that's it really. Sat nav, climate, reversing camera. Comfy motorway cruiser. Carries 4 bikes on top and 4 adults.
I am looking to change for a van size people carrier, but that's to do with some plans we have (camping/trips etc). We'll see how this year pans out, before I think of changing.
I've always paid attention to the underside, so everything's been coated from fairly new and is 'topped up' occasionally - same with MrsF's car - that's 12 now and only has 65k on it.
I'm only driving 3k a year, and that's mainly weekend trips. Is it worth committing £25k to another car for next to no use ? Tough decision.
thinking 130k as "high milage" is not quite right, in the US you get some cars rattling through 100,000 miles a year for the first few years of their life, end up looking brand new. eg
My brother lives in Australia. 100k miles to them is brand new delivery mileage.
Best thing you do for your 'Zuk is to wire brush as much rust off the underside, paint any remaining with Fertan rust converter, then spray Bilt Hamber S50 over and into everything.
Don't waste your time with Waxoyl or Lanoguard.
I used to live in the north east, They had roads there then and when I visited recently they still do
Observant but that's not the issue with driving in the north east
Well not necessarily – every car is new at some point. Your decision to buy used is independent of your decision to buy EV or ICE no?
Generally yes. In most cases, it probably isn't going to matter is you buy new of second hand. Even if you bought a second hand ICE car the net result may well be that a new EV comes in at the top of the chain and an old ICE car gets scrapped. But, of course, if you are not the one buying the new car you don't really control what happens. You could buy a second hand EV and then the person you bought it from goes out and buys a new Range Rover. It's also possible that the person at the bottom of the chain doesn't scrap their car so the net result of you selling yours is just one more car on the roads.
the EV gets made whether you buy it or not
I'm not sure that's true. Surely the EV only gets made if there is a demand for it. If you don't create the demand then the supply should reduce. Of course the actions of one person make very little difference, but I still reckon it's worth trying to work out what the effect of your actions are likely to be and trying to do the "right thing". But that may not be what seems obvious at first.
I thought that, since I drive in excess of 20k miles/year it would be better if I did those miles in an EV rather than an ICE car. But looking at it more closely it seems that it really is better for the environment to keep doing those 20k miles/year in my old ICE car rather than buying a newer EV. Of course it's better not to do them at all and if I am going to replace the car anyway switching to an EV is better, but I shouldn't kid myself that buying a new(er) car is actually benefiting the environment.
thinking 130k as “high milage” is not quite right, in the US/Austrailia...
Not sure about Oz, but the US situation is a bit different. The only car that I've ever actually driven beyond 200k miles was an old 8-cylinder Pontiac that I bought for the princely sum of $200 when I moved to the western US and then drove all over that side of the country for five years. It was a big naturally aspirated engine though that barely broke a sweat in normal driving. The Americans also change the oil every 3,000 miles (or did back then) with places that do it while you grab a coffee/bagel. Rust isn't much of a problem in a desert either 🙂
Best thing you do for your ‘Zuk is to wire brush as much rust off the underside, paint any remaining with Fertan rust converter, then spray Bilt Hamber S50 over and into everything.
Don’t waste your time with Waxoyl or Lanoguard.
Not sure what any of that means but I'm sure you are right 🙂 I'm also sure that there is no chance of me doing that myself. Not while there are still mountains I can explore instead.
it really is better for the environment to keep doing those 20k miles/year in my old ICE car rather than buying a newer EV.
It starts to get pretty hard to predict, as if someone cannot get hold of a good car in a lower price bracket (i.e. yours) they might stretch to a more modern car and that could ripple up the chain resulting in someone else buying new 🙂
The other thing to consider is that someone else who buys the EV off the production line probably isn't going to do the miles you are, so the EV your hands is saving a lot more CO2 emissions than it might be in say mine. Or, whoever buys your car probably won't do as many miles so the car will stay on the road longer than if you were to drive it.
In any case, you haven't got that many years left at 20k a year before you'll need to replace anyway.
