[Closed] Abu hamza needs an MRI

Oh yes... one of those 'on holiday' from Birmingham, in the mountains between ****stan and Afghanistan, in the middle of a war, who just wandered inadvertently close to a terrorist training camp?

Oh dear, your ignorance really is staggering on this one. Begg was arrested in the ****stani capital, Islamabad (I'd already mentioned this). Last time I checked, it wasn't a 'war zone'. Begg was released without charge, never having stood trial.

And Begg has never been convicted of any criminal offence, here in the UK or in the USA. So whilst you may have your prejudiced opinions of him, he is, in the eyes of English law at least, an innocent man. Feel free to prove me wrong.

He may have been in Islamabad when he was picked up. Where had he been prior to that Mike? According to his own book? A clue for you: see my quote above

Oh... and details of how Osama was framed while you're at it please 😆

Did Osama bin Laden get a fair trial

The problem is , and I do get your point, but there is something uncomfortbable about extending western rights and liberties to folk who attack and despise these very same rights/liberties. When they fight to excercise theirs it is hard to sympathise as they are , frnakly, just taking the piss

I dont like having the piss taken out of the system in this way

Did they/will they get fair trials , probably not but there is probably something in their world view about an eye for an eye and those who live by the sword

Yes officer... I may well have attended 2 Bank Robbery training courses recently. And you may well have caught me outside the bank vault with a large haul of high explosives, and my "idiots Guide to Safe-Blowing' handbook, but I can assure you I was merely passing, and bank robbery was the furthest thing from my mind

Mike - if you ever want to buy a used car, will you buy it off me please?

He may have been in Islamabad when he was picked up. Where had he been prior to that Mike? According to his own book? A clue for you: see my quote above

so, he wasn't in a war zone then? Glad to see you admitting you were wrong, thanks.

Again: Do you have any proof to prove that he is guilty of any crimes? Proof that neither the UK or US authorities could find?

Th eproblem is , and I do get your point, but ther eis something uncomfortbable about extending western rights and liberiotioes to folk who attack and despise these very same rights. When they fight to excercise theirs it is hard to sympathise as they are taking the piss

If we deny human beings the rights we believe they should have, then we descend to the level of barbarism. Better that some 'take the piss' tyhan to be denied equal rights under law. by acting with dignity, we prove ourselves to be better than those who wish to attack us and deny us our fundamental rights, no?

Mikeconnor = Fred

Mikeconnor = Fred

Shhh...
We all know that but he runs away when it's mentioned

Hence the mention.

Mikeconnor = Fred

West? Flintstone? Perry? care to explain please? or is this some attempt at an insult?

Mikeconnor = Fred

West? Flintstone? Perry? care to explain please? or is this some attempt at an insult?

Is it a known thing? This thread is the first time I'd considered the possibility. But yes, he is.

Would you allow someone into your home and let them trash the place, make a mess and take your money without giving you anything in return?

You know we are a democracy but when do you stop someone soiling and disrespecting your house?

In addition, the US aren't savages who live in the hills.

Again: Do you have any proof to prove that he is guilty of any crimes? Proof that neither the UK or US authorities could find?

Lots of people are arrested as suspects all the time on suspicion of all sorts of things from littering to murder and freed at a later date as there's no case to answer, that's how it works

Imprisonment without trial is something the ECHR is against, but Gitmo isn't on US soil, so doesn't count.

Again: Do you have any proof to prove that he is guilty of any crimes? Proof that neither the UK or US authorities could find?

I don't know. Perhaps it was a bit difficult dusting for fingerprints in the Tora Bora mountains in between the carpet bombing Michael.

BTW.... Have you ever thought about any investments Mike? Plan for your future? You seem like a man of sound judgement. I've got some you can't possibly lose on. I have some friends in Nigeria trying to extract their perfectly legitimate money from the country. You could help. If I could just have your bank details.... 😆

I thought the sad little misfit was baned?

Lots of people are arrested as suspects all the time on suspicion of all sorts of things from littering to murder and freed at a later date as there's no case to answer, that's how it works

And lots of people are innocent of the crimes/offences of which thay are accused. and yes, sometimes the guilty go free too. But cases like the Jill dando murder show that we must do our utmost, as a society, to uphold justice, whatever the cost. In that case, and innocent man was convicted for a crime he did not comitt, because of prejudiuce and the public hunger for someone to be held to account. it is vital to ensure that such miscarriages do not occur again. Hence whty hoever nasty a bastard Abu Hamza mosst likely is, we must be seen to exercise due process and legal dignity.

whatever the outcome from this case, whoever unpleasant the taste it will leave, at least we will be able to say that our nation's legal system worked as it should, and offered the defendant every possible opportunity to get justice. |Isn't that what's most important here?

Do you have any proof to prove that he is guilty of any crimes?

You do know hes spent the last few years in a UK prison for a crime don't you?

In addition do you think someone in the US wakes up and says 'lets get us some Muslims, British businessmen, hackers who look merely guilty'. 🙄

mikeconnor - end this masqueraded farce now and confess. YOU ARE FRED!

I won't mind. 😆

What is rthis 'Fred' thing? i'm all up for a discussion/debate, but if people chiose instead to try to bait me, then i think it reflects rather sadly on them. hence i'm now going to ignore what appear to be deliberately provocative/insulting comments.

offered the defendant every possible opportunity to get justice

I beg to differ!!

In addition, the US aren't savages who live in the hills.

[img] http://search.loku.com/image/3735485/330x235/?upsize [/img]

hence i'm now going to ignore what appear to be deliberately provocative/insulting comments.

Every man, no matter how deeply offensive his statements, deserves a fair trial before being labelled as Fred.

Just wondering if anyone who has contributed to this debate, has had their opinion or view altered by anything anyone else had put forwards?

[i]Just wondering if anyone who has contributed to this debate, has had their opinion or view altered by anything anyone else had put forwards? [/i]

are you new here?

😉

mikeconnor - you're [b]him[/b] aren't you?

Just wondering if anyone who has contributed to this debate, has had their opinion or view altered by anything anyone else had put forwards?

I never twigged that mikeconnor was fred / paddedcell!

Just wondering if anyone who has contributed to this debate, has had their opinion or view altered by anything anyone else had put forwards?

There's only been 2 positions here .... [strike]F[/strike] Mike's and everyone elses'

I've analysed Mike and Fred's Handwriting, and they are exactly the same.

Case closed.

he is never Fred

mikeconnor - you're him aren't you?

Lance Armstrong? 😕

grum - Member

mikeconnor - you're him aren't you?

Lance Armstrong?

are you saying he only has 1 testicle?

What is rthis 'Fred' thing? i'm all up for a discussion/debate, but if people chiose instead to try to bait me, then i think it reflects rather sadly on them. hence i'm now going to ignore what appear to be deliberately provocative/insulting comments.

I'll tell you what I'd do, right here, right now [©Norman Cook] is get onto the mods about it.

Nick - Member

Just wondering if anyone who has contributed to this debate, has had their opinion or view altered by anything anyone else had put forwards?

I agree with Nick!

I have no problem with him having a MRI.
The results should be put into an envelope which he can take with him on the plane. Perhaps some light reading over the Atlantic.

Will he fly Ryanair?
Do they do 1st class?
Will have to take his own food and drink?
Will he be checked going through Passport control?/Immigration?

I have no idea what this blokes supposed to have done BTW.

bikebouy, now then. Imagine hes a sports agent. He gives talks, finds talent, attends fairs and gives out information. Then he selects good players and sends them off to be trained by the best overseas. Sometimes whilst overseas they might get into abit of trouble. Nowthen, I don't mean roasting a young lady or drink driving. No something abit more severe than that.

I see...

Does he get paid for what he does, seems like a lot of work and effort that.

Just wondering if anyone who has contributed to this debate, has had their opinion or view altered by anything anyone else had put forwards?

Actually yes, I have.

I didn't think Mile was Fred previously.

Now I'm almost sure of it.

so you didn't think he was Fred before and you still don't.

and this is your view being altered?

I don't think he should have an MRI, because if he ever imagined what the phophet looked like, (and you must have, if you find cartoons of the phophet offensive) the MRI operator might see it.

Junkyard - Member

The problem is , and I do get your point, but there is something uncomfortbable about extending western rights and liberties to folk who attack and despise these very same rights/liberties.

The alternative is to attack those rights/liberties yourself.

If Mike Connor WAS Fred, he showed remarkable restraint with the mockney...

I see...

Does he get paid for what he does, seems like a lot of work and effort that.

No, but he gets a big hand from all his supporters

bikebouy - Member

Will he fly Ryanair?

now that is a violation of human rights

its not hard get him to a doctor if he says he needs one fair enough give hime one and stick him on the plane,
if not stick him on the plane

If Mike Connor WAS Fred, he showed remarkable restraint with the mockney..

If Mike Connor WAS Fred, he showed remarkable restraint with the mockney...

Fred would never have started a thread on how to service pedals.
Fred wasn't particularly hung up on critical mass.
As woppit says, the stylometry is very different.

If it is him then he's a master of disguise.

Fred or not, I can see Mike's point (can I call you Mike?)..

Regardless of what the bloke has done he's entitled to all the benefits a British citizen should receive. If he's guilty of a crime then he should be tried for it, and the appropriate punishment dished out in the appropriate way. I'm pretty sure denial of healthcare/maltreatment isn't classed as appropriate treatment for any criminal regardless of the crime. His failing health and the crimes he has apparently committed are two distinct things.

We get into the 'well he deserves to die after what he's done/said' line of thinking and you're on a slippery slope to capital punishment/Reading the Daily Mail....

EDIT: The bloke has an opinion on something and rather than discuss it in a civilised manner, people choose to argue about whether he's someone else or not. How intelligent. From reading what he has put, he said he wouldn't rise to the baiting, not that he'd flounce from the thread. Considering all the pathetic comments since said post are around whether he's someone else I can see why he's avoided it. FFS grow up....

Will he fly Ryanair?

HAHAH. I was the planespotters viewing platform at Manchester Airport on Sunday morning with hora junior and everytime a plane taxi'd past we'd wave to the pilots. A Ryanair one taxi'd past and I said [i]'no we don't wave at them' [/i] 😆

The problem is , and I do get your point, but there is something uncomfortbable about extending western rights and liberties to folk who attack and despise these very same rights/liberties.

Uncomfortable yes, but it's a pretty key point that everyone gets the rights and liberties, regardless of how objectionable one might find them.

I find it odd that people say stuff like 'you wouldn't be allowed to say that kind of thing in Saudi Arabia would you' - seemingly simultaneously slagging off Saudi Arabia for a lack of civil liberties, while suggesting that those civil liberties shouldn't be applied here.

A Ryanair one taxi'd past and I said 'no we don't wave at them'

Well done you

Surely you have to treat all the same, if they are ill/sick/ they need to be shown humanity, or is it a race to the bottom of barbarism, i always thought you judge a society by the value that you put on human life........

I find it odd that people say stuff like 'you wouldn't be allowed to say that kind of thing in Saudi Arabia would you' - seemingly simultaneously slagging off Saudi Arabia for a lack of civil liberties, while suggesting that those civil liberties shouldn't be applied here.

I don't think anybody is advocating wholesale suspension of liberties, but sometimes temporary or individual suspensions might need to be applied, if only for reasons of common sense.

He doesn't get paid as such Bikebouy. Think of him as a sort of state-funded national treasure. A bit like the queen. We all pay for him. The hook generally means a bit less waving, and his rhetoric can err towards the fiery side when compared to Liz's Chritmas words. And he's probably cost a bit more, per household, for the last few years.

Anyway..... Has he gone yet?

[i]for reasons of common sense[/i]

the problem with common sense is that *everyone* thinks they have it and also that their's is the only sort of sense that's a) common and b) matters.

I'm sure if you asked both the EDL bloke and Abu Hanza if they had common sense then they'd aboth claim to have it in spades.

We should just stick to the rule of law.

note: I am not, nor have I ever been, paddedFred.

A bit of common sense woouldn't go amiss. It's clear as day that he's trying to find any way he can to prevent himself being lobbed out.
I'd just get the mericans to agree to give him a MRI once he arrives.

I still don't see how shipping him to the US now means he won't get essential medical treatment.
Why do we need to postpone it so that the treatment is done here? I can understand that the cost would then fall on the US federal government, but if they are OK with picking up the tab, why does he need to stay here for it?

Well done you

BTW, unless his one-iPhone has a special screen, it won't work with a hook. Capacitive screen, you see...

I also find it perverse that a convicted jihadist with a complete disregard for human rights now seeks to invoke legislation that enshrines those very entitlements ... to protect his own?

This is a grotesque mockery of the law - which has now, unimaginably, been an EIGHT year judicial comedy that has still not concluded ... and conceivably may go on another eight years.

Laws written in such labyrinthine complexity that allow this sort of rubbish to rumble on need to be repealed and redrafted.

BTW, unless his one-iPhone has a special screen, it won't work with a hook. Capacitive screen, you see...

Maybe his hook has a special coating?

kimbers - Member
for balance; I hope he dies soon, the racist, hypocritical, non-Anglo hating c&8nt!

...So by saying this it makes you as bad as whoever you're referring to...well doesn't it? 😉

His hook might not work with his phone but Krispy Kreme were giving away one free doughnut to anyone with an eye patch or talking like a pirate, or a dozen to anyone dressed as a pirate last week, he must have felt as fat as a fool, all that said he could always take that weight off his feet by hanging in the wardrobe.

why is he still here , get rid of him.

Sir John Thomas, President of the Queen's Bench Division and one of two judges hearing the case, said he did not understand how this was a reason to delay extradition any longer.

He said: "There are excellent medical facilities in the United States.

"The sooner he stands trial the better. If he is at risk of a degenerative condition, the sooner he is put on trial the better. I don't see how delay is in the interests of justice.

"On the evidence before us, the risk of a degenerative condition can only strengthen the case for extradition."

😀

Is his flight booked yet? 😀

patriotpro - Member
Even trolling requires consistency -

mikeconnor - Member
So what's the problem with a British citizen receiving medical care?

mikeconnor - Member
Yay, let's laugh at foreigners.

So is he foreign or British 'mikeconnor' ❓ (iyo)

I'm glad I live in a civilised society where people are given good healthcare regardless of what they are deemed to have done. It's was sets us apart from those societies which are not so civilised....

Even when said recipient has, for about 20 years, being expressing a marked preference for 'societies which are not so civilised'.

Practice what you... quite literally... preach. And try getting your ****ing MRI scan in Afghanistan! 🙄

Even when said recipient has, for about 20 years, being expressing a marked preference for 'societies which are not so civilised'.

Ah, "for about 20 years" ....... so that nicely and conveniently excludes the period when we considered him to be a hero in the Afghan mujahideen then. Despite the fact that Abu Hamza's political/ideological views have not changed at all since then - only the language spoken by those he wishes to see killed.

To be honest, I couldn't give a flying one about his views prior to him inhabiting the same country as me.

The fact that Home Office officials seem to share the same view (to the total bafflement of every other European government) is however cause for concern

Back in the 50s to deface the coin /postage stamp of the realm was classed as treason, also any rhetoric against the Crown.

Abu Hamza and his kind have done nothing but preach hatred and harm against the UK and peoples since they so called adopted [sic] our country, they don't mind the freebies though, housing health care etc.

They should be deported forthwith back to their own country or preferably
to any country that requests their extradition.

By their utterance of hatred and treason they have forfeited their human rights.

THEY HAVE NO HUMAN RIGHTS so OUT WITH THEM!

Abu Hamza and his kind have done nothing but preach hatred and harm against the UK and peoples since they so called adopted [sic] our country

Not true. After coming to the UK in 1979 he was on the same side as the British government in Bosnia and Afghanistan, and the British government had no issues with him killing people or preaching hate against them in those two countries.

Like Saddam Hussein before him, Abu Hamza has proved to have been a friend and ally to the US and the UK who eventually turned out to be rather difficult to control.

Of course none of this should have come as a surprise to anyone as the warning signs were clearly visible for all to see. But the West has a long history of supporting extremely nasty pieces of work based on the shortsighted policy of achieving immediate aims which serve greedy self-interests. Something which of course it still does to this day.

I have always associated the ridiculous greed motivated risks which the West takes with some form of serious gambling addiction - the likely consequences are simply ignored. But then we celebrate and richly reward those who we are told "take risks".......even after it all very predictably causes a devastating global banking crises, so I guess nothing will change for a very long time.

ernie_lynch

You are talking about 1979, how about living up to the present, if you like him so much you can leave with him.

I suppose its down to having a foreign policy that amounts to nothing more sophisticated than 'my enemies enemy is my friend'

Nice to see that after the whole Abu Hamza/Afghanistan/Mujahadeen experience we've learnt the grand total of absolutely **** all, and are busy tooling up the next bunch of crazed Islamic nutters in Libya and Syria

Well I'm talking about 1979 because [i]you[/i] referred to when he "adopted our country" which was 1979 - could you not see the connection ?

if you like him so much

You have come to the conclusion that I like him so much based on my comment concerning "extremely nasty pieces of work" ? You think that if I consider him to be an extremely nasty piece of work it proves that I like him ?

if you like him so much you can leave with him.

given you are happy to remove all human rights from those you dislike/disagree with it is probably better that you leave. There are a number of countries happy to treat you this way

And this is why the UK is such a brilliant place to live. We have laws which are uninfluenced by emotion and public opinion. From what I can see Abu Hamza is a nasty bit of work who may well have committed the crimes the US want to try him for. It's cost lots of money and been a long and frustrating process and he will finally be extradited. When you put this in the context of the Aspergers guy who was hacking it's a good thing there is a detailed process in law to follow before a UK citizen can be shipped off to face foreign justice. The rule of law is one of the best things about the UK.

If I was in charge, every terrorist suspect I could find, I'd bring back here. I'd set them up with a house and pay them a couple of hundred a week, and then restrict what they could do.

The alternative is sending loads of soldiers to v dangerous places to get involved in wars and die in their thousands.

Can you imagine what photos of hamza or bin laden doing some shopping at asda or pottering about in a little garden would do for their support? Plus we'd know where there are what they are doing and who they are talking to all the time. And it would cost loads less Than massive armies trampling all over innocent people in afghistan creating loads more terrorists