On the subject of security, how secure are cable locks? I've been using a kind of heavy duty one for years out and about because I can wrap it round my waist like a belt. Just wondering how good they are. It's for 'nipping into shops' duties rather than leaving it locked up somewhere.
Like this but prob about 18mm
8/9 years ago I popped down to the precinct to do a quick food shop in Sainsburys, locking up a cheap (albeit decent looking for its age due to lack of use by better half) Saracen Zena2 MTB with one of those freebie Center Parcs locks. It was market day, so loads of people around, should be fine... Less than two minutes in the aisles and a member of staff comes up to me to say a teenage scroute cycled up, took out a pair of cutters and snipped the cable like it was paper.
If I pop down the preceinct these days on a bike, the Abus (Granite X?) "gold" lock gets used, if I pop to the garage I'll risk another CP cable lock.
Huh, thought as much. Guess I've just been lucky.
On the subject of security, how secure are cable locks
You might as well tie it up with a piece of string
You can get through most of them with some fruity language and a withering stare
😁
Binnerette number 2 is out and about on her bike quite a bit and for when she has to leave it locked up I’ve got her One of these
Much better than a cable lock and doesn’t weigh the same as a car
Cable locks will only deter the most opportunistic thief. They're perfect to whip through with sharpened bolt cutters because you can easily position them in the jaws.
Ever since Aldi and Lidl have started knocking out battery grinders for £20-£25, in particular, it has to be as much about being smart as having the best lock.
And you can actually buy, kosher, bolt croppers with folding handles! Perfect for concealment, because obviously legit users of bolt croppers often need to conceal them, right?
Crazy.
jambourgie
Free MemberOn the subject of security, how secure are cable locks?
Security at my work had 2 tools for cutting bike locks- a grinder, and a pair of really good scissors, which dealt with most cable locks.
And you can actually buy, kosher, bolt croppers with folding handles! Perfect for concealment, because obviously legit users of bolt croppers often need to conceal them, right?
But you can't carry a penknife which you can use safely without risk of it snapping on your fingers.
It's well out of my area of expertise but I think in a fight I'd rather 'go equipped' with the bolt crops.
^^^
I hadn't really thought of the relative merits of them for lamping someone.
It just defies logic that anyone bolt cropping legitimately would want them concealed - except perhaps police. Bailiffs need to advertise their presence and someone just cropping a padlock because they've lost their key wouldn't walk up to their own padlock with the croppers tucked into a jacket.
I use the same Kryptonite. I think one of the benefits is that if you do have to angle grind them, you need two cuts as the shackle won’t rotate to remove with just one cut. I also use a lassoo cable that has to pass through the front two wheels of the trike and back to the D lock. But most of the time I never leave a bike - work excepted as it’s highly secure.
Ooh, cutting!
I thought it was a very abrasive comment. I mean, the shear rudeness of it.
moimoifan
Free MemberAnd you can actually buy, kosher, bolt croppers with folding handles! Perfect for concealment, because obviously legit users of bolt croppers often need to conceal them, right?
Yeah but they're not for concealment, that's just a side effect- they fold up for the same reason just about everything else folks up, to make them easier to carry and store.
If its a replacement you're after I can recommend the Abus Bordo granit Xplus 6500
U locks are good, but if a pole or something you want to lock it to is really wide, you cant. At least the folding type fits round just about everything.
Im thinking of buying another, the alarmed version if I ever have to lock it in the city center, just for that extra bit of security.
There’s always the option of one of these:
Replacing the lock with another one of similar quality is probably the best option imo, in case the OP loses the keys again.
The gap between locking your bike in the garage and wanting to access it can be many days, which can make finding keys that you might have mislaid particularly difficult.
Edit: I would expect a thief who breaks into a garage and is tooled up to overcome a lower quality lock to also be able to deal with a higher quality lock.
Obviously, I’m not a bike thief but bottle-jacks work well with several locks.
Boring fire safety point: clear combustible stuff away from the spark spray if you're angle grinding in your garage, and go back at intervals afterwards for an hour afterwards to check nothing's smouldering/smoking underneath your washing machine or in a box of pads and bikepacking nylon.
Wrecking a frame trying to get your bike free from a lock is one thing, burning your garage/house down is a level up.
ernielynch
Full MemberEdit: I would expect a thief who breaks into a garage and is tooled up to overcome a lower quality lock to also be able to deal with a higher quality lock.
Not actually the case- basically, the generallevel of bike security is so low that a lot of thieves won't bother with heavier duty tools, they'll just move on and find an easier to nick bike. The majority of bike thieves when caught have only relatively basic tools, even now. (there's probably a self selection thing there, good thieves with good kit are probably less likely to get caught, but it still proves the point).
That'd change, no doubt, if most people had good locks but so many people don't lock their bikes at all, and so many that do use crap locks (either because they settled for crap, or because they were sold crap but thought it was good because it was expensive and had all the bullshit certificates like sold secure gold etc).
I wouldn't worry, you'll be arrested for locking your bike up in an offensive manner 🙂
(page 5, para 11 and 12)
and https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/public-order-bill-overarching-documents/public-order-bill-factsheet
The majority of bike thieves when caught have only relatively basic tools, even now. (there’s probably a self selection thing there, good thieves with good kit are probably less likely to get caught, but it still proves the point).
Also expensive tools tend not to be something you want to potentially be throwing away in a hurry.
they’ll just move on and find an easier to nick bike.
Even after they have gone through all the trouble of breaking into someone's garage?
I can certainly see how a high security lock would put an opportunist thief off but I'm not so sure about a determined one.
The reason the OP resolved the lost key issue relatively easily without having to resort to buying specialist tools is because of the lock's relative low quality.
Alarming the garage perhaps and using fairly low quality locks sounds more useful than using locks which prove almost impossible to cut.
Cable locks will only deter the most opportunistic thief. They’re perfect to whip through with sharpened bolt cutters because you can easily position them in the jaws.
Was walking to lunch the other day just in time to watch some scroat steal a moped cropping the cable lock in the train station car park. He'd obviously bypassed the ignition first. Owner had a D-lock but had just used it to join the two ends of the cable lock together. All that was left was the D-lock and two bits of cable lock on the ground. Very brazen theft, surrounded by people, he didn't GAS who saw him steal it and nearly knocked over a couple riding off on it...
Even after they have gone through all the trouble of breaking into someone’s garage?
99% of garages can be broken into, pretty much silently, in a handful of seconds.
Even ones with "heightened security" don't take long.
Very brazen theft
Out for a run one time, down the canal towpath. This dodgy-looking bloke stops me, "hey mate, is there anyone in that boat over there?"
I've no idea, sorry.
"Right. Only, I'm going to rob it."
in a handful of seconds.
I make that 5 seconds!
Yup, that's about right for an up and over with a shitty cable lock.
in a handful of seconds
I make that 5 seconds
Clearly you’ve never been to Bacup
6? 7? Possibly more…
Hammer the d lock back into shape and it should work.
20 seconds leaning on it in the vice and it's good as new!
but given that most thieves are opportunists, rather than pro’s
That may or not to true depending on definitions and stuff but I think most "decent" bikes stolen are increasingly hit by pro's.
To be honest, I think if someone turns up with an angle grinder then all bets are off anyway, whatever the lock is.
You can cut through a alloy or carbon frame in a few seconds with a hacksaw not that much longer for a steel frame .. or take off 80% of the value with a couple of Allen keys... and perhaps T25..
"good as new" is doing some heavy lifting there. 😁
Where was the key?
I park my bikes in central Glasgow quite a lot. Usually while I am having a pint. I tend to choose places where there is a window letting me see the bike though. So it only needs to stop the thief long enough for me to get to him.
But I am parking for relatively short periods of time in busy areas. Back when I dealt with thefts of bike reports in the Glasgow area most were either unlocked, stolen from sheds or garages, or locked in a common close where the thief had plenty time to work on the lock unseen. Talking typicaL value non flashy bikes. High end MTBs all bets off.
I've only once seen someone tampering with my bike whilst I was having a drink. Rocked the bike and saw it was locked to a fence then took my front light instead and started walking off. I did an Alan Wells and got my light back without any argument.
Where was the key?
In his riding jacket pocket 🙂
If by "riding jacket" you mean "winter dressing gown I'd been wearing last week when it turned chilly again", then yeah.
😉
Well done! Sod's law strikes again. 😉
Kryptonite locks come with little codes stamped into the keys. If you lose a key or break it, you can order replacement keys via their website. If you've lost both keys - but you took a photo of the key on your phone when you bought the lock - you can still order new keys.
There's not much that will stand up to an angle grinder. However, the Hiplok D1000 is really impressive because something something graphene - https://hiplok.com/product/hiplok-d1000/ - but, as @damascus' friend found out, pissed off thieves with an angle grinder can still ruin your day even if they can't steal your bike(s).
You can cut through a alloy or carbon frame in a few seconds with a hacksaw not that much longer for a steel frame .. or take off 80% of the value with a couple of Allen keys… and perhaps T25..
I'll admit that this had been going through my mind. Especially given that a frame is probably the most easily spotted / traced bit of a (decent) bike, modern forks, drivetrains and wheels are pretty valuable. At what point does a scrote simply cut the frame and make off with a slightly less valuable haul rather than trying to get through a D-Lock?
Given what a pain underseal is when using an angle grinder - it tends to lubricate the disc and stop it digging in; has anyone thought of wrapping a D-lock shackle in that landlord special stick-on flashing that's a relatively thin foil with a thick, sticky tar layer? Possibly then going over it all with self-amalgamating tape. I'm sure it could be picked off, but if it's enough of a pain to stop a quick theft, it might be worth considering.
A colleague at work got their bike knicked from the work shelter. Someone with a 'bike' had tailgated another member of staff in. Then the staff left, the thief disabled the lock, took own bike out, came back in, then smashed this person's 'lock' off with a saddle (CCTV picked up). Member of staff said, 'it was a fairly secure combination lock'. They were then blaming work security - nothing going to stop tailgating, but a decent lock might.
It's easy pickings in a public shelter - either tail gating or doors that don't lock properly.
The anti-grinder lock does exist, but a bit spendy, reviews I read last week were promising.
https://www.litelok.com/products/litelok-x1
I did an Alan Wells and got my light back without any argument.
The main problem with bike thefts is it's mostly a risk free crime.
Don't get caught and they win.. get caught and the worse that can usually happen is they give it back.
Kryptonite locks come with little codes stamped into the keys. If you lose a key or break it, you can order replacement keys via their website. If you’ve lost both keys – but you took a photo of the key on your phone when you bought the lock – you can still order new keys.
Unless its a particularly expensive one it's barely worth it for 1 key and 2 keys ended up more than I paid for the original lock.
The LiteLok X1 looks like a good compromise of cost/weight vs security.
There's also the even tougher LiteLok X3 and Hiplock D1000 for 250. They took 4 - 5 cutting discs, a mains powered grinder, and a vice to get through...
That's actually really impressive- I want these to work, but I feel like I wouldn't totally trust it til I'd had a crack at it myself, that's encouraging though. Hopefully there's no alternative defeats like there sometimes are, since improving one thing can mean compromising another . But they also look like a good massive lump o too which always helps!
(for comparison, I have a sold secure gold motorbike chain which I was able to cut through a link in 6 seconds with my cheapo chinese grinder and a fairly crap cutting disc from aldi. It'd have needed 2 cuts of course but still. I've not cut my big squire chain, which I have more faith in, but I'd absolutely guarantee it doesn't last as long as either of those locks do)
