Give me wilderness to ride in but urban living space
amen to that
Some of Rudeboy's comments are making me think of Withnail and I in the tea shop in the lakes.....
We're going to buy this place and have it knocked down
Where I live, in a very small town in Wiltshire, the majority of businesses don't rely at all on tourism. I Moved here from Essex 7 years ago and haven't seen anything of the negative attitudes towards outsiders, quite the opposite in fact. I would agree with Rudeboy about the multicultural aspects though. It's one of the few things I dislike about the place, the lack of diversity. I don't really know how you'd encourage people from different backgrounds to move to the country though.
Don't you just love walking into a pub and the metaphorical tumbleweed crosses the lounge bar whilst 10 ruddy faced locals with male pattern baldness and v neck sweaters stare at you in a most unwelcoming way
I've walked, camped and biked all over the west of the country from Devon to lochinver, I've been in a fair few pubs. I've never yet met a bunch of locals looking uninviting, I just stroll in smile and nod and order a drink. There was a time when I was paranoid and thought everyone was out to get me, fortunately these days I've got past that and realised that people just glance over to see the new faces. I've noticed I glance over at new people coming into my local. If you walk in expecting unpleasantness you'll feed that back and you'll get unpleasantness. IME.
Djglover, have you ever thought that your problem with country pubs might be something to do with you? Been in quite a few round here, never had any issues. If people are looking at you, they might be interested in who you are, since despite Rudeboys theories most only really see local trade. I'd recommend talking to them, that normally works 😉
The countryside is not dull, it's beautiful. Cities are, on the whole, busy, smelly and ugly places, but fascinating all the same. There is room in my world for both.
Maybe you've never been to Gloucestershire 😉
Yup, I have 😀
The countryside is not dull, it's beautiful. Cities are, on the whole, busy, smelly and ugly places, but fascinating all the same. There is room in my world for both.
Of course.
And in both, you will find friendly, welcoming people, as well as nasty types.
As for the tourism thing; many areas, like places near trail centres, for example, as well as places in the Lake District and National Parks and that, rely on tourism for a large chunk of their income. So, you want the coin, then you have to put up with extra numbers coming in to your little village. Or, move to a town, and get a job there. As idyllic as it may seem, to want to live amongst wilderness and nature, you've got to pay the bills. You can't have it both ways.
most mountain bikers I know can't tell an oak from an ash or a sweet chestnut from a beech tree, a hereford from an angus, a buzzard from a red kite and so on. There are several degrees to appreciating the countryside.
Wunundred!
You can have it both ways Rudeboy, I've lived in a cottage wedged between farms, about half a mile from the nearest house, at least 10 miles to the nearest town. I worked 15 miles away, I have a car 😉
The national parks are not really typical of the countryside in general. I'd agree in those areas that a lot of trade is tourism based. You have to see it from their point of view as well though. In 2012, I'd imagine that loads of people are going to make it hard for you to go about your normal business. Is that not going to nark you a bit, even if you appreciate why they are there?
I was once in london with someone from Oswestry, travelling in a cab we rounded the corner into Parliment Square - "wow look at that big clock!!!!" she exclaimed, true.
We did piss ourselves laughing at her.
I've never yet met a bunch of locals looking uninviting,
I've been in a couple in Wales where they have been openly hostile, presumably because we are English.
I've been in a couple in Wales where they have been openly hostile,
yeah, ironic considering I AM Welsh 🙁
I have no problem with visitors to the countryside, but could all of those who bring their food in supermarket carrier bags, in the back of the car, please take the empty containers and wrappings home with them in a bin bag in the back of the car to dispose of in a proper bin; Rather than leave it to blow around the "beautiful scenery" they've just visited for said beauty.
It distresses me to think that those who leave rubbish, bagged or not, at their wild campsite/picnic spot really think that someone is employed to trail after their inconsiderate a**e in a bin lorry.
I once got some disapproving looks from several Public School mummy's boys when I re-deposited their discarded MaccyD wrappers into the sunroof of mummy's car which they were eating lunch in.
Made my day.
In 2012, I'd imagine that loads of people are going to make it hard for you to go about your normal business. Is that not going to nark you a bit, even if you appreciate why they are there?
No, actually! As there will be means to get about easily, apprently. And I hope to be at as many of the events as I can get to. Although I am opposed to the enormous cost, and environmental impact of the Games, they are a fact, and I'll be proud to enjoy them, along with millions of others, in my Home Town.
Im pretty sure there'll be a bit of mess to tidy up afterwards. Hey ho.
Well that puts my 2 year old ahead of at least 10% of the population!
What exactly are these big city thrills and spills which I'm obviously missing out on?Granted, just going for a walk needunt cost a fortune, but that seems a bit staid and boring, for many people brought up on the thrills and spills of the big city.
How many city dwellers actually speak any language other than English? Come to that, how many city dwellers only speak one language which isn't English? What a bizarre example of something where country dwellers are supposedly ignorant! Of course they don't speak another language (beyond what they might have learnt at school), but then like the vast majority of city dwellers who don't either, they have absolutely no need to.IME, one of the key areas of ignorance I have experienced, in some rural folk, is of the diversity of ethnicity and culture, within our vast and varied society. The language skills of some I've met, have been woeful.
How many city dwellers actually speak any language other than English?
Ooh, I'd say a million or so. In London alone. [url=
over 300 different languages are spoken.[/url]
I can't speak for cities such as Leeds, Bradford, Manchester, Birmingham, etc...
I thought it might have been obvious that I was talking about those city dwellers for whom English was their first language 🙄
Any thoughts on how many of those people speaking other languages also speak English (I'm struggling to see what's so great about 150,000 speaking Punjabi)?
Come to that, how's your Gujarati, Rudeboy?
I thought it might have been obvious that I was talking about those city dwellers for whom English was their first language
Erm, you simply mentioned 'city-dwellers'. Many of whom happen to have origins other than just British. Forgive my lack of telepathy, for not being able to see such an obvious point...
Any thoughts on how many of those people speaking other languages also speak English
Quite a large percentage, I'd say.
I'm struggling to see what's so great about 150,000 speaking Punjabi
Yes. I can imagine you'd struggle, with such a concept. Mind-blowing, is not it? 🙄
Come to that, how's your Gujarati, Rudeboy?
Non-existant, actually.
Erm, you simply mentioned 'city-dwellers'. Many of whom happen to have origins other than just British. Forgive my lack of telepathy, for not being able to see such an obvious point...
I'm obviously forgetting that not only aren't you telepathic, you're also incapable of reading the context of what other people are replying to (and in this case which you yourself wrote), preferring instead to ignore that and reply simply to what other people have written in isolation.
Or when you wrote "IME, one of the key areas of ignorance I have experienced, in some rural folk, is of the diversity of ethnicity and culture, within our vast and varied society. The language skills of some I've met, have been woeful." were you actually complaining about the lack of ethnic minorities in the countryside who spoke Punjabi natively? 🙄
Back in yer box, aracer. Don't try turning this into something it's not. I've not taken anything you said out of context; you've simply failed to put your thoughts across propply.
The level of education in SOME rural areas can be SOMETIMES quite poor. Plus, with limited interaction with others, SOME local people fail to develop good language skills. By this, I mean they struggle to understand different dialects, and can lack the ability to communicate in a clear and effective manner, with others outside of their local community.
This is also true of SOME people who live in cities.
I'm not attacking 'country folk' , I'm just trying to understand why SOME resent outsiders, and why relations between Townies and rural folk can SOMETIMES be difficult. And I've posted some of my own observations and opinions. OK?
If it's any help, I have some Gujarati:
ek, bey, tron, char, panch = 1,2,3,4,5
cobis mattu = cabbage head - which may be appropriately applied to RudeBoy and aracer
RudeBoy, most of your opinions seem to be that of someone who has never left the "safety" of the Greater London metropolitan area.
Likewise some of the other posters seem never to have visited a city.
I suspect those of us in Scotland and "the North" may have an easier time of this because "the city" and "the countryside" are not separated by a three-hour drive, hence it would be really very unusual for someone up here to have never seen a sheep.
as far as i can tell RB you have simply fallen back on the stereotypical view of country folk as straw chewing 'yokels'. obviously as a highly educated 'city dweller' you are the very pinnacle of sophistication, as your observation that 'city folk' could adapt to life in the country far better than 'yokels' could adapt to life in the city, ably demonstrates.
using quotation marks does not make prejudicial frames of reference any more palatable or justifiable, nor does use of the phrases IME or IMO, or reducing things to 'us' and 'them', despite all your 'can't we just get along' claptrap.
in MY experience, treat as you find, and would expect to be treated, and most people can get along with most others, in most normal life situations.
people are all the same, with differences. 🙂
anyway, i'm getting back to the bike forum, where i belong..
No no no...
I'm NOT stereotyping ALL rural folk; please read my posts propply.
GrahamS; when I was growing up, I would stay with relatives in a small village in Cornwall. Have been there many times. I've also been to several rural areas of Britain, including Wales, the Lakes, Yorkshire Moors, etc, etc.
Notice that I wrote 'SOME', in capital letters, to emphasise that I am not generalising about ALL country folk!
'city folk' could adapt to life in the country far better than 'yokels' could adapt to life in the city,
Yes, I believe many could, actually. City life is far less routine than a fair amount of rural daily life, such as farming. And there is a lot more intellectual stimulus to be found in large metropolitan areas. Likewise, rural life can enable an individual to develop a more finely tuned understanding of nature and ability to cope with the environment they are in. and the ability to be able to identify sheep.
I have friends who come from rural areas. Who tell me about the narrow-mindedness and ignorance of some people they've known in these areas. So, from the Horse's mouth, as it were.
And, coming from an inner-city area, I can vouch for the ignorance, bigotry and narrow-mindedness of many people here.
Notice that I wrote 'SOME', in capital letters, to emphasise that I am not generalising about ALL country folk!
Granted, but when you say it in the context of:
The level of education in SOME rural areas can be SOMETIMES quite poor.
then you are implying that this is a discriminator between rural and city education. Which fails to acknowledge that SOME inner city schools rank very poorly indeed and that [url=
TIMESONLINE.CO.UK rural schools outperform city schools[/url].
I've never yet met a bunch of locals looking uninviting,I've been in a couple in Wales where they have been openly hostile, [b]presumably because we are English.[/b]
Are you sure? Without knowing where you were or how you were acting, it's difficult to comment, but I've never had a problem with taking English friends anywhere in Wales. Obviously, if you were wearing an England football shirt and went into the Ninian Arms in Cardiff on match day, for instance, you might be ready for some aggro, but that would be a separate issue.
From recent experience though, if a group of loud English people walk into a pub in Wales and act like hooray henrys then they are likely to incur some hostility.
From recent experience though, if a group of loud English people walk into a pub in Wales and act like hooray henrys then they are likely to incur some hostility.
That appears to be working is you change wales for Nice, Spain, Poland or any other low cost destination.
The thing is, Rudeboy, given your observations could equally apply to SOME city folk living in SOME urban areas, and that there are plenty of country people who don't conform to your stereotype, your observations are essentially worthless!
FWIW I've always been a country person in a way - where I grew up I could see sheep from my bedroom window, despite the fact I lived in a town. Have lived in three cities though - one of them being London - and the town I grew up in was just on the edge of London, so I visited there extensively. I feel reasonably well qualified to comment therefore (and rather better than people who've never lived outside a city, only visited)!
The King makes good point, you make your own welcome in a country pub. My local is quite remote, being a couple of miles from a classified road road in a village that is population 5 in two addresses.
We all look forward to some new company, and often chat with visitors to the area when they pop in.
But plenty walk in and won't make eye contact, won't return the time of day, won't chat to the Landlord and then sit down with their backs to everyone. Then there's the ****ing cavers (don't get me started...)
These are probably the people who get to work on Monday morning with tales of The Slaughtered Lamb etc.
your observations are essentially worthless!
I feel reasonably well qualified to comment therefore!
So, because you fail to see the point I was actually making, and instead only see what you want, you are 'well qualified to comment'?
GrahamS; my point about education in some rural areas, would also apply to that in some urban areas too. But the kids in the cities do have more access to many more forms of intellectual stimulus, and opportunity for interaction with other people, than their rural counterparts.
Oh, and FWIW; most of my experiences of rural areas have been fantastic, and I've encountered some really lovely people.
indeed. and some of my best friends are gay. 🙄
GrahamS; my point about education in some rural areas, would also apply to that in some urban areas too.
If it applies equally to both then why only make it about one?
But the kids in the cities do have more access to many more forms of intellectual stimulus, and opportunity for interaction with other people, than their rural counterparts.
What "intellectual stimulus"? Do you honestly think the city kids are busying their weekends visiting art galleries and going to the theatre?
And do you think that "rural" kids never leave "the countryside" or visit a city?
I'd guess that it is probably far more common for a rural dweller to visit their local city for the day than it is for a city dweller to visit the countryside. A guess that is apparently backed by this (dubious) report.
I reckon that all but the most insular of "rural dwellers" would still be able to identify the equivalent city flora and fauna.
I can't imagine a similar posting with:
- 10% of country folk can't identify a Starbucks.
- 22% of rural adults could not identify a mad tramp. 1 in 10 thought he was was a telephone box.
- Two-thirds didn't understand a pedestrian crossing.
- 32% referred to the underground train as "the metal worm".
So, because you fail to see the point I was actually making,
You'll need to point it out to me a bit better. I thought your point was that the language skills of some rural folk are pretty woeful, which was an example of a key area of ignorance. Did you mean something totally different from what you actually wrote?
What "intellectual stimulus"? Do you honestly think the city kids are busying their weekends visiting art galleries and going to the theatre?Loads, GrahamS; come on, you know what I'm on about. And yes, many city kids are involved in something stimulating on a weekend. There's loads of yute projects and activities on offer; come down, and I'll show you some. I've got friends in Yute Work, who'd be only to happy to show you what work they do with kids.
Stop being so black and white about this.
Yeah, but there are loads of youth projects available to rural kids too. Though admittedly they are more aimed towards actually educating and entertaining the kids, rather than just keeping them off the streets and away from knives and drugs 😛
Stop being so black and white about this.
Man it always comes back to race with you doesn't it? 😆
Anyway, I'm not. I'm simply disagreeing with your polarised views. I've lived in big cities, moderate towns and little villages. I see the spectrum.
Though admittedly they are more aimed towards actually educating and entertaining the kids, rather than just keeping them off the streets and away from knives and drugs
Of course, you're such an expert on Yute Work in an inner city, aren't you (I've worked in this field myself,and know what really goes on, not just what you watch on telly)?
Cheezuz...
Man it always comes back to race with you doesn't it?
Yeah, course it does. Must be this chip on my shoulder, eh?
Maybe it's 'cos I've never lived in the country. That must be why I'm so ignorant about everything, of course.And why you're sooo clever, eh?
Please, try to read things propply, before commenting.
RudeBoy - Member
Please, try to read things propply, before commenting.
pot calling kettle, pot calling kettle, do you read me?
Chill RudeBoy, you are far too easy to tease. Remember your blood pressure. (Must be all that city stress)
My point was, you were giving a one-sided example again and by doing so you were implying that [u]only[/u] city kids get access to [i]"many more forms of intellectual stimulus"[/i] from youth projects. Which simply isn't true.
Maybe it's 'cos I've never lived in the country. That must be why I'm so ignorant about everything, of course.And why you're sooo clever, eh?
Or maybe it's because your [i]"I'm a cockney: London is the greatest place in the world and everywhere else is shit"[/i] attitude sometimes clouds the opinions that you express here.
And I'm not claiming to be sooo clever. I'm just pointing out that claiming the country is full of uneducated yokels isn't a fair statement.
You cant beat a good stereotype !
My point was, you were giving a one-sided example again and by doing so you were implying that only city kids get access to "many more forms of intellectual stimulus" from youth projects. Which simply isn't true.
Nope. You've mis-quoted me. again.
"But the kids in the cities do have [b]more[/b] access to many [b]more[/b] forms of intellectual stimulus, and opportunity for interaction with other people, than their rural counterparts."
See?
i don't mind a discussion, but please refrain from deliberately mis-quoting me, and taking my comments out of context. You are intelligent enough to understand my comments propply (unlike someone else..), and you will know that I have stated certain facts, and made some good points.
The whole point was to discuss issues of misunderstanding between rural and urban folk. I think this has now run it's course.
Or maybe it's because your "I'm a cockney: London is the greatest place in the world and everywhere else is shit" attitude sometimes clouds the opinions that you express here.
You're just being a Silly Billy, now....
You are intelligent enough to understand my comments propply (unlike someone else..)
The someone else, presumably being somebody who you don't deign to reply to any more because you haven't worked out how to answer without digging yourself a hole?
please refrain from deliberately mis-quoting me
Pot appears to be on the loose again.
but please refrain from deliberately mis-quoting me, and taking my comments out of context.
are these not standard rhetorical techniques ?
I have stated certain facts
say rather 'posited certain hypotheses'. Facts may exist but we only have our own subjective interpretations of events
Me? Misquote? I hardly think that's likely...
The whole point was… You are intelligent… and made some good points.urban folk… do have more… intelligent… interaction with other people
and you will know… I have stated… kids in the cities have more… intellectual… issues… and… I think… Silly… urban folk… have… a… misunderstanding… of… their rural counterparts.
😛