[Closed] Would you ride a Saracen?

yes, I've been looking at that and thinking 'made near where I live, looks nice, might be worth a try'

can you get

my bik r saracin

stickers?

Yes look nice. Bike snobs wouldn't touch it but those of us with longer memories will remember hankering after the original one back in the day.

Yes look nice. Bike snobs wouldn't touch it but those of us with longer memories will remember hankering after the original one back in the day.

I think that's right. I hankered after the (very expensive) Kili Flyer back in the early 90s, so they've never been a downmarket brand to me.

Yes & that one does look nice.

They're also doing a titanium version, but I guess that'll be well out of my price range.

Looks a nice bike but it appears that even the manufacturer is hiding the fact it's a Saracen.

is there a price for that frame yet P Jay?

i would, and have in the past

I want one 😯

I can't see anything about a price for a frame, or even whether it's going to be available as a frame only. There's going to be an 'affordable' (not in my book) £2000 version and a premium model with XTR etc. There's also going to be a cheaper £850 version, but whether this will use an identical frame or maybe a cheaper steel version I don't know. If it comes out in the £300-£400 range then it might go on my list (the Kinesis Virsa Tange Prestige JPN frame is about £350).

Would I ride one? Yes. Would I hanker after one like I did bitd? No. I wish Saracen/Madison all the due success as they try to resurrect the brand but it is just that now, a brand.

I bought a Saracen Blizzard back in 1988, my first MTB. The steel frame was lovely and springy unlike the stiff oversized alloy frames which are prevalent now.

Saracen was a quality brand then and my bike was specced out with Shimano Exage - a middling quality groupset and with that weird Biopace chainset. I quite liked the Biopace, but there was plenty of bits on it that you would scoff at these days. Technology has moved on a great deal since those early days!

I had my Saracen for 15 years and rebuilt it at 13 yrs, converting to a hybrid with road tyres on skinnier Mavic rims (I bent one of the original wheels). I fitted a double road chainset (highly polished Campag), rear mech, new sidepull brakes, a sandblast and powdercoat of the frame, plus a host of cheap, but good functional lightweight polishes alloy bits. I had new brake bosses welded on the rear stays enabling me to bin the weird and heavy brake that was bolted to the bottom bracket.

The reason I sold this bike was because I had also bought a road bike and so the Saracen began attracting dust. A mate now owns this rare bit if semi-retro hardware and he loves it. Of course, hybrids are all the rage now whereas this was unusual at the time i put it together.

Shame "Numpty Hut" got hold of the brand. There is nothing worse than a national chain engaged in selling bikes. I don't think they realise how utterly inept their business model is when catering for enthusiasts. As for the Saracen brand now, well it's synonymous with cheap children's bikes. At least they are better than the £69.99 supermarket specials!

I'd love to ride one.
So far I rode a Saracen Mantra Mk. 1 as a commuter for a year when they came out. I also rode a Saracen Havoc Mk. 1 in the Sudeten Mountains in 2001. Hundreds of miles and no problems at any time. Why not another Saracen?

Ahhhhh Killiflyer [drifts off with fond memories of my old tange fillet brazed Flyer Comp. I regret flogging that the most of all my old bikes]. My first two bikes were Saracens - the first I forget the name of but it had exage complete with bottom bracket mounted u-brake type arrangement. Madness when you think about it - why put that right in the muckiest place on the bike. Flogged it and saved for the wonder that was the Comp frame)

If it was anything like as well made as that then I'd consider it. About time the brand was resurrected I reckon...

Someone rides a Kili Flyer into my work every day. V-brakes, Pace forks with about 30mm travel, tan coloured Panaracer tyres....them were the days.

My first 2 bikes were saracens i even had the tange version with the fluted top tube a great bike rode it for several years till i wanted to get longer travel forks great bikes

I cried when my Saracen Conquest was stolen (I was 20years old at the time).

Good luck to them.

Boy-hood dreams of a Killi Flyer Comp with fillet brazed Prestige - that one above looks beautiful. Would look even better if they did it in the ultra-violet colour that was on the Trekker (I think that was the name of it).

Had a traverse in lilac circa 1990, was the sh1t back in the day, black drive, black rims...pretty cool... so yeah, if ticked the right boxes at the correct time why not?

I think the 'brand' will be marketed with a more classy image this time round...we'll see.

No probs riding a Saracen I do all the time, Saracen Zen2, apart from the shoddy Hayes brakes (replaced with Shimano) it has served me well.

naokfreek - that was it, it was the traverse with the uv/lilac paint. Was the Trekker the one with the wishbone stay and the U break?

Quite curious about Madison's motivation here. You could argue they're already cleaning up the mainstream steel hardtail market with the Genesis name, the Saracen name has nothing like the kudos it had back in the day and I reckon they'll be up against it trying to recapture those glory days of old.

I have still got my nzyme, my gf rides now for college duties. It has had many bits of kit bolted to it over the years. Fox forx, xtr kit and various disk brakes. I have riden worse, i have riden better. I like it and it is now graced with good'ol deore kit for commuting. It's a work horse and I like it.

My first MTB was a Saracen, the steel framed Sahara Elite. Sure by modern standards it's nothing but that bike took me to all sorts of places where people now seem to think that you need 6" travel, 2.3" tyres and a Saint groupset for the XXXC trails...
Even did a few races on it, upgraded it lovingly over the years then eventually gave it away to a local kids cycle club.

I upgraded to a Kili Ultra Ti which Saracen nicely custom built for me. I was working in the industry at the time but couldn't afford the full XTR bling build so they built it up with an XT groupset. Fully rigid, Ti forks it was amazing.
I've still got that bike and it's still amazing. Upgraded over the years to full XTR, 1st generation CrossMax wheels, Ti seatpost and bars. So light and it'll still cope with the same trails I was riding all those years ago.

Good luck to them, I hope their new take on the old works out, they deserve it.

No idea if I'd ride one, but that's a nice looking bike that is.

squin ....that was the tufftrax in yellow, my friend had one at the same time i had the traverse, although his is now chipped blue with yellow as it got nicked and 'disguised' with blue spray paint, but that did'nt stop him spotting it locked up outside the wheatsheaf in ealing about a 3rd of a mile from his house...he still has it!!

yes no problem 😯

I've got one of the magnesium Killis, 2004 I think. Silly light (lighter than carbon Trek 9.8) but a bit harsh and BB very low. Bought the frame NOS in 2006 for £40 so can't complain... Nice bike and never given me any trouble. Painted it myself in VW black touch-up paint so doesn't Saracen anywhere on it, people always ask and look surprised when I tell them.

i did but i wouldn't again! back in the late 90's i was a sponsored rider - not by saracen directly but a saracen dealership. we all rode kili comp's which were 853 frames, by June that year 5 frames had cracked in the same place, the rear wishbone. Saracen beefed it up but too little too late.

Sure by modern standards it's nothing but that bike took me to all sorts of places where people now seem to think that you need 6" travel, 2.3" tyres and a Saint groupset for the XXXC trails...

Yeah but when I was 14 and had shit for brains, my '94 Cinder Cone would take me to all sorts of places that I [b]now[/b] think I need 6" of travel and 2.3" tyres! 😆

I've still got the saracen catalogue/brochure featuring the Kili-flyer and all their models if anyone has an old original bike, and they want it?

I bought the Sahara -= cost £400! in the day 93 I believe, as my foray into mtb - has Tange tubing, still have it and it's original although gears and brakes are almost non-existant!

The Kili-Ultra in ti seems to be the ultimate in the catalogue of 93!

[i]we all rode kili comp's which were 853 frames, by June that year 5 frames had cracked in the same place, the rear wishbone. Saracen beefed it up but too little too late. [/i]

Yeah, I saw a couple of those frames cracked. Shame cos they looked lovely. Mind you that was still fairly early days of 853, they'd only just worked out how to make decent road frames out of the stuff so it was pretty ground-breaking at the time to use it for MTB. Same now with 953 - it's possible to make good lightweight road frames out of it but Reynolds made a 953 version of the Cotic Soul a while ago as a one-off for Cy to show what they could do with it. It was beautiful, a really stunning bike to ride but then it cracked. 🙁

[i]The Kili-Ultra in ti seems to be the ultimate in the catalogue of 93! [/i]

I've got the same catalogue! My Sahara was 1993, my Kili Ultra Ti is 1997.

Would I? I already have, a 2010 Zen. I was very pleasantly surprised.

I've got a Chris Boardman frame, so I kinda am riding a Saracen.

I've not been in this game long enough to have this misty-eyed Saracen nostalgia, and while I wouldn't necessarily [i]not[/i] ride one (if you see what I mean) there's plenty of other comparable bikes I'd buy before this one.

Woodsman - Is the Kili Flyer (not Comp) purple in the 1993 catalogue?

I owned one but memory is hazy and now not sure if it's 1992 or 93.

Think I paid £650 for the bike, which had a fillet brazed prestige (main triangle) frame and full Deore II groupset though.

I had an 1987 Saracen Tufftrax, awesome bike, in fact its still being ridden in its almost original spec by my brothers mate!
The new ones look pretty good.

Had the last of the old Kili-Flyers, and although it was just a rebadged carbon merida, it was lovely. Brand snobbery apart, theyre nice bikes, especially under Madison.

Still got my first mountain bike... A Saracen from 1993....now demoted to Centerparcs duties, but still going strong with mostly original parts and a pair of Rock Shox Quadras....Smart!

Tufftrax here too until 2006. Things have moved on since then mind!

My first proper mountain bike was a Tufftrax. I Remember riding / carrying it over Black Sail Pass and then bombing it down into Wasdale. No fancy suspension in those days just ridged forks and cantilever brakes. All good fun

On further consideration, I wonder if that lovely new Kili is perhaps a bit of a headline grabber.

They can't expect to sell many at £2k off the peg, but it might do a lot to help them reposition the brand.

Certainly seems to have generated more positive comments than Saracen threads usually do on here anyway.

I still have my circa 1989 Trekker Comp in my mum and dads shed, the U-brakes have been replaced with DiaComp Rollcams, and it still has the Deore II groupset, I might have to resurrect it one day.

still have my circa 1989 Trekker Comp ........I might have to resurrect it one day

Yeah, me too. I haven't really ridden it much in the last six or seven years 😉

[img] [/img]

I had a nut-busting 20" framed Saracen Blizzard before the Trekker, back in 1988. (Everyone seemed to ride bigger frames back then). Nearly everything on it was white including the saddle and it looked a bit odd to tell the truth. I tried to fool myself that it was miles better than my friends' yellow Saracen Tufftrax 'cos the Blizzard had the Exage Trail Groupset and the Tufftrax had the slightly inferior Exage Country. However, I don't think they were convinced. There's also one of those old black Saracen limited editions rotting away in my parent's shed. They were almost as popular as Muddy Foxes in the Brighton area back in the day. Of course, what I really wanted was an Overburys.

I remember owning a lovely Saracen Tufftrax elite in an off grey colour and it was my first proper mountain bike. I loved that bike and seemed anything was possible on it until somebody stole it from the garage! I have not seen one since. I like the look of the new bikes and would get one but happy with my 575.

Cha****ng - the Kili flyer is 'Ocean Blue' and the Kili xtr is 'Ultra Violet'(purple-ish), both 'flamboyant' colours, in the '93 catalogue. It doesn't mean a great deal, as the Sahara is listed as red only in the catalogue, when mine came through it was metalic black!

Those look like Specialized Extreme Control/Master tyres wrapped round that frame - the best mud tyres ever!

[i] It doesn't mean a great deal, as the Sahara is listed as red only in the catalogue, when mine came through it was metalic black! [/i]

Same here, metallic black with silver forks (a whole 1" of suspension travel!)

Cheers Woodsman, have now realised mine was probably '90 or '91.

God I feel old.

I would as I had a 87 (or 88) Tufftrax, loved the thing and I'll never forget that first trip into a local wood.

Yep it seems a brave move by Madision, but bringing out a fillet brazed frame is a stroke of genius, and even the the Saracen name has sunk so low, I guess there's still a large proportion of the mtb buying market that have a soft spot for Tufftraxs 🙂

In 95 i had a backtrax which was an amazing bike, handled great and was a superb bike for many years! it was fairly light had a tbh ive been searching the web, ebay etc to find another from that year, thats how great the bike was.

After that my other half did buy a saracen xray for starting to mtb and tbh it was awful, i saw some of the mantra's from the 2005 era and they were shockingly bad. The new range gives me some hope they will be better, im waiting for the urban/road bikes they bring out.

Sold my old Saracen Tufftrax on here to a guy up in Stavely two years ago. Happy memories of the bike and adventures, 20" frame orange in colour with limited standover and center pull brakes, biopace chain ring, 92/93 vintage.
Never gave any problems, brakes useleess when wet/grimey.
Posted a few picks on here whilst out and about, returned comments like a farm yard gate if I remember!!

My first MTB was Saracen Forcetrax back in '95, the thing was a gate but enough to start the addiction...until it got stolen. It had an awesome kingfisher blue powdercoat finish that's still the best colour frame I've ever owned.

As others have said though there's a lot of good quality choice these days and while I wish Saracen luck, they're a long way down the list!

Used a kili flyer for SS duties, it was replaced by an Inbred, which was waaaaay better.

That new Kili Flyer looks like any other by the numbers catalogue frame.

I probably wouldn't buy one these days, not ashamed to say I'm a bike snob.

A Saracen was my first proper MTB over 15 years ago. Black steel frame with elevated chainstays, 21 gears, Rock Shox Quadra elatoma forks and dripping with anodised purple bits and bobs.

I loved that bike, right up until the day some t*at nicked it. Fond memories of a decent bike from brand that produced some good stuff then went down market and seemingly now trying to get back some former glory.

I owned a 1997 853 Kili recently - Lovely bike. Made in Warwickshire IIRC

Gone off the boil with all this aluminium witchcraft but that new one looks on the boil.

Mine in last build before being sold:

[img] [/img]

[img] [/img]

I'd ride this one 🙂 (knicked from the news section)

[img] [/img]

Maybe its time to ditch the Saracen brand given it's confused marketing history. We've had great Saracens and bargain basement Saracens, so the new owners will have to spend a lot of money re-establishing the brand. Might as well call them something else that doesn't carry any baggage I reckon.

My very first trip around the peaks was courtesy of a Saracen Havoc. Despite weighing the same as the Forth Bridge I remember being quite enamoured with it. It certainly wasn't in the same league as my mates' Specialized Enduros but it was honest, basic offroad transport and got me into biking. *tips hat*

Hi folks - and nickc .... this is mostly a copy/paste job from the news section but....

Just to set the record straight – this is our first Cr-Mo prototype.
Its hand made by Mark Reilly of Enigma, in the UK, to our geometry and frame spec. So its not “just a rebadged” Enigma or a catalogue job! We went to Enigma because they build first class frames and are trying to keep UK building skills alive.

We've got real plans to re-build the Saracen brand name with some good quality, focused and well priced bikes. We know we've got a mountain to climb but we're going for it.

As for the "new" Tufftrax, its got an excellent frame that beyond its entry level price point is upgradeable and great for getting people into the sport - like many have been on here at the start of thier riding careers.

So I would say, don’t knock it until you've tried the new Saracen. I should be at most of next year’s Future (dare I say that word on here!) demo days so drop by and say hi.

Cheers,
Simon
Saracen Product Manager and Elvis impersonator

Simon, will the Kili Flier frame be available serperately and what sort of price if it is, it looks a great bike?

I still have my 92 powertrax in the garage, the groupset is carked but i'd love to resurrect it one day. Lovely purple paint job on it.

were still considering the frame only option.... but the cost will be high due to UK manufacture... details to follow!