[Closed] Would you buy a (new) fatbike for ~£1k?

Cheers Guys, I'll start with 10psi and go up and down from there.

Should you have less psi in the front?

Dune Tubeless...

So I totally copied Coastkid's tube-and-foam tubeless method, and it worked really easily, seems reliable after a couple of rides. I was nervous I'd roll the tyres off the rim at first but I've not had any trouble.

I used jiffy foam (£3 for 5m, enough to do most of a Forth Fat rideout- you could buy a smaller roll but I like having uninterruped strips rather than several 1m strips). Then roughly cut strips about 70mm wide, so that the foam doesn't cover the edges where the tyre will eventually sit. Doesn't have to be too precise... I made a wee cardboard template for ease but maybe you could eyeball it.

Three wraps seems to be the right amount- that's about 2.5 metres. 2 worked initially but the foam compressed under the pressure so after a day or so it was impossible to re-inflate. 4 might make it easier to inflate, or better with baggy tyres, but would also make it a wee bit harder to get the tyre on and off.

Then, 24 inch tube, split down the middle. I did one end with the schwalbe downhill tube most people recommend, the 24 inch Schwalbe AV10D 3.0. But it's pretty heavy, and also not that cheap- I think I paid £9 delivered online.

So I've just done the rear with an AV10, which is a narrower 2.5. I didn't actually weigh but it's thinner rubber and claimed weight is 100g less (you can trim the bigger tube down but it'll still be heavier). You don't need toughness in a tubeless tube, you just want a seal so that sounds fine to me. It's pretty much exactly the right width, which does create a bit of extra faff, it needs to be central and you have to be careful not to squint it when you fit the tyre.

Basically, tl;dr- apparently 100g lighter per end, far cheaper- £3.10 each at Halfords, and they're doing a 3 for 2 mix and match so you can get a spare or a tyre for another bike, nice. And seems exactly as good in use. I'll come back to this once I've tested it a bit more with exact measured weights.

But yeah. Inflated easily and stayed up. I used 120ml of sealant, that's not very much, maybe more would be a good idea. My Bud and both a 4.0 and 4.8 JJ sealed up easily

The weight reduction isn't vast- the Maxxis tubes are about 450g each. The foam doesn't weigh much at all, the tube is claimed 165g and the sealant about 100g. I've also replaced the stock rim strips (65g) with a double layer of wide PVC tape (bugger all g, and yellow). I want to recap it and weigh the new rim tape and foam but there's at least a 200g an end saving here. And hopefully less bloomin punctures.

Cheers Northwind interesting read, luckily for me (touch wood) I've not had a puncture yet, seems a bit of faff for 200g and to be honest I could do with losing more than 200g off my belly first before the wheels 🙂

where did you get the jiffy foam from and can you get a proper tubeless rim strip instead of using the 24" tube?

Got to be honest the tubeless weight saving on Fatty's is not worth the bother. However I think tubeless is a must if you are to run them at the correct pressures. I know my wheels have double the sealant NW's do (at least) But the fact i no longer puncture and can run the correct pressures is reason enough for me. I'm sure there are loads of folk who will say they have never punctured a tube at 5psi after 10 years and 20k of fat bike miles, but for me tubeless is the only way to roll. My setup is BR710's with Nates.

I havent managed to find an answer or get a respons yet - I'm keen on the Dune in its supposed new large sizing but have no idea if there has been an update on release date yet?

Whilst the O-O fatty is currently 25% off i'd like to get a better idea of timing..

I've heard March mentioned from someone for the Large Dune, but unsure of the source etc. I'd get the On One fatty with the 25% off

I'd get the On One fatty with the 25% off

+1

By the time you've added more wintery tyres, maybe gone 1x10, fitted hydraulic brakes, it's probably so close in price it doesn't matter.

I was thinking of selling mine (stock except 1x10, carbon fork, tubeless front, carbon bars, reverb, have a bosch hole saw and cutting fluid to drill the rims which I'll throw in), but with those On-One prices I doubt anyone would be interested at a price I'd accept.

@russy, yeah I agree tbh, I reckon I might need to add more sealant and if I do, it'll weigh about the same as a specialized dh tube all in. But it's not so much for the weight, reinflating fat bike tyres with a portable pump is sisyphean 😆

nickgti - Member

where did you get the jiffy foam from and can you get a proper tubeless rim strip instead of using the 24" tube?

Ebay, I'm lazy- you can probably get it in b&q as underlay, or in stationery places but it was so cheap I mail ordered it. No tubeless strips as far as I know?

I like the idea of the Calibre offering up more standard axle spacing tbh, plus easier to upgrade wheels in future. Plus im secretly hoping the large version will be s fluroescent as the medium..

just had a look around only one I can find is american
http://orangesealed.com/shop/fat-tire-kit

I love my Dune but sometimes a wonder if the money I've spent on it already I would have been better off buying an On One fatty.

I think my foam was sold as window sill underlay or something like that. Came on a huge roll but I think I binned the rest.

IME a better option could be double-bubble bubble wrap. It's usually foil backed and made of two layers stuck together so the bubbles interlock and form an almost solid sheet. The foam packs down after a while, and if the bead does come off the hook unevenly it crushes it.

You guys seem to go through an awful lot of hassle to go tubeless when you can just use a dozen wraps of packing wrap and thats it done!
Ive done both my OO Fattys wheels and just did my Clownshoe wheel without any problems and its all done in a matter of minutes, I dont even need to build up the centre as the packing wrap already does that.
[url= http://forums.mtbr.com/fat-bikes/fatty-tubeless-summary-methods-actual-weights-847560.html#post10292858 ]Tubeless, the easy way :)[/url]

There's about 5 different methods in that link, which did you use?

The method I listed is actually really simple btw. Can't say it's the [i]best[/i] but it's certainly not a lot of hassle.

Can't remember if I've said earlier in the thread, I went down the slime inner tube gloop in the inner tubes.........but what I've found with it is you need 20psi+ to get it to seal and if you get five thorn holes in one go you're screwed (as I found out even using CO2 cartridges back to back).... So new tube had to be installed....however proper puncture patches on the tube and whacked it back in.
My mate did a similar thing on his fatty but mixed (contrary to slimes website) the Pro tubeless sealant and the inner tube sealant 50/50. His sealed up a treat.....
I may switch to the slime pro sealant in entirety or at least 50/50 mix as the inner tube version has bigger rubber particles in it or maybe even risk Stans in the tubes and not use CO2 at all.

To be honest, there doesn't seem to be much in it between the Dune and the Fatty for me.

Both come with 2x10 stock so if you want to go 1x you need to upgrade either way.

Drivetrain and brakes don't seem to be much higher spec on the Fatty (yes it's got hydro's, but SRAM, which everyone's always moaning about on here, and entry-level at that).

The ali fork, overall weight difference (3.5kg on paper), tapered headset, bolt-thru dropouts and marginally less offensive colour are pushing me towards the Dune.

What am I missing?

I am a bit odd in that I get calf rub on bikes that no one else does. On my OO I just miss. The Dune with its wider hub probably has wider stays and I reckon I'd rub on that.

I am a bit odd in that I get calf rub on bikes that no one else does

Looking at the different sizes of Big Jon in the shop they all had the same chainstays but the seatstays varied a lot. The M - and to a lesser extent the L - had crammed the rear wheel in (4.8 JJ) whereas on the XL there's an easy gap between the wheel and the seat tube.

So riding it my calves are forward of the seatstays and there's no possibility of contact but someone on smaller bike would be that much closer

The Dune has the more "standard" hub spacing so easy upgrade to a bluto.

Depends if you can get away with the size of the Dune? I'm just under 6ft and with a correct length seatpost it works, although I like a smaller frame to start with.

Drivetrain and finishing kit is better on the fatty

[u]Northwind[/u], I linked to the exact post.
This one -
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[u]thenorthwind[/u],the Dune is 2x8, not 2x10.
I've had my OO Fatty for just over a year and have put 5200 miles on it with the standard DB3 brakes, and have never had any problems. I do try and look after my stuff though.
I am actually still on the original chain/cassette and chainring!

The only reason to go for the Dune would be for the hub sizes which gives you the bigger availability of upgrades should you want them.
With the OO Fatty 135/170 QR, you are very limited in that department, especially in the secondhand market, although, I was very lucky to eventually get myself Rolling Daryl & Clownshoe built wheels secondhand that had the correct hubs and spacing 🙂

For me it was basically upgradability/potential... the Dune's better at the core, the "fat bike specific" bits are better. The Fatty is better out of the box probably but doesn't have the same potential- the fat bike bits aren't as good and it's all a bit less "current".

2 reasonable approaches tbh, the Dune cuts corners on easily replaced bits but has the heart of a much better bike if you put in a little effort, the Fatty covers all the bases but that means it can't cover some of the important ones as well. Or, that's what made me choose what I did anyway.

Re the tyres, yep the JJs are pretty seasonal but they're also high quality and worth good money if you don't like em. You could almost get a pair of Floaters for what you'll get selling one JJ! Or, buy something else. So point to the Dune there I think

thenorthwind,the Dune is 2x8, not 2x10.

So it is. Bit of a strange choice.

Drivetrain and finishing kit is better on the fatty

Can't really argue with that. An upgrade to 2x10 notwithstanding, I'm not sure there's anything I'd immediately change on the Dune that I wouldn't on the Fatty. I guess that's personal preference.

So the upgradability and lower price (even with the 25% discount on the Fatty) wins it for me at the moment.

To be hoenst, if i was buying again now i would of gone for the Dune. Sadly it wasnt available at he time. I have upgraded nearly everything on my OOF. I am now waiting for Smokestone to release their frame which should be released in April. Luckily all my parts will swap over just the rear hub which will require new end caps.

thenorthwind - Member

Bit of a strange choice.

Very very cheap, and functional. You'd rather have 2x10 but what other bits of the spec do you want to drop to do that?

The ali fork, overall weight difference (3.5kg on paper), tapered headset, bolt-thru dropouts and marginally less offensive colour are pushing me towards the Dune.
What am I missing?

3.5kg between OOF and Dune? Wasn't an steel forked OOF quoted at 16.7 and a Dune actually about 14.6, so more like 2.1 reducing to 1.5 with the carbon fork?

Very very cheap, and functional. You'd rather have 2x10 but what other bits of the spec do you want to drop to do that?

I realise it's all about cost.

I would have thought the small price premium would have been worth it, but I guess it's a case of (if I can be a bit snobbish) it being marketed at people who just want a fun bike that goes rather than your, shall we say, more discerning STW set.

So thought i would post some updated pics of my OOF now, i have spent more than a grand on her, but happy with how she now sits and rides. As my above post waiting for The new Smokestone frames to be launched which will save a bit of weight, support my LBS and are shaping up to be a great option. I have recently fitted the Aeffect cranks and a Absolute black Oval ring, with 11 speed XT. Tiny 26t chainring means The thing could climb a wall, but i do run out of gears on long flat fire roads, which is fine by me. Disapointed that the cranks have after 3 rides started to show significant heal rub! But what can you do!

Wheels are BR710's on hope Fatsno Pro 2's tubeless with Surley Nates 120tpi front and rear. Everyone raves on about the nate, but i find them very draggy so tempted to try something slightly faster rolling on the rear. Maybe once this current sloppy waether system passes and things harden up a little.

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If you had time, then I would advise buying a nice frame and just building it up to the spec that you want.
The only reason to buy a complete bike is if you want to ride it ASAP.

I bought a Fatty Trail frame for half price and I plan to build that up as a race bike with the spec I want, within my limited budget though, so it may take a month or two before its finished.

I paid 497 for my dune with a discount code. I added a 63 pair of deore brakes from merlin And a pair of used but near new floaters for 40 delivered.so all in bang on 600 and I've a great lightweight pair of tyres for the summer. A much better deal than the on one I think.

If I swapped to xt m8000 1x11 and a superstar ring it's still less than 800 all in for a fully sorted bike.

I've seen the stock jumbo jims sold on for 80 a pair so that would even it out even more. But I want mine for the summer as they fly on hardpack

3.5kg between OOF and Dune? Wasn't an steel forked OOF quoted at 16.7 and a Dune actually about 14.6, so more like 2.1 reducing to 1.5 with the carbon fork?

Knock off the daft On-One tubes (another 700g saved), and the fact the Jumbo Jims are useless apart from in the summer, so you'll need some, errrr, floaters? And you're pretty much level. I suspect the carbon forks probably offset the added O-O frame weight (and you can lose weight drilling the fatty rims, making it lighter still). OTOH, 8 speed cassette, taper BB and cranks can't be light, and you can buy the O-O fork separately. On the whole I think the weight of either is probably comparable.

Front hubs, mehhh. If a £400 bluto was an option, then a £30 hub and £10 of spokes is neither hear nor there. Rear hubs, 170mm is designed to run with 100mm BB's, 190mm with 120mm and 4"/5" tyres respectively. Now for me the advantage is with 170mm as it allows the narrower Q-factor as I've no real desire to build a bike for specifically riding on fresh snow, I'd like a Lou for winter, but it's a compromise I can live with. I doubt 170mm hubs will disappear so that's not a worry.

The brakes are undeniable though, despite their old reputation they've been faultless for me (and I've killed 2 previous sets of Avids and a pair of Shimano XT's, and the fat bike give the brakes one heck of a beating with all that grip), the DB5's are as powerfull as any other brake and reliable. And we're comparing to no-name mechanicals.

They're both stonkingly good value by the looks of it. If the Dune fits, and maybe you have a spare set of finishing kit and gears, and budget for some wintery tyres then there's a fag packet between them. The Dune might even please some people with an axe to grind against O-O pr P-X, although you're buying from a shop that's (as noted on a previous page when someone went to pick theirs up) unlikely to know which way round the forks go so.........

If you're not 'small' then TBH I don't know why you'd buy the Dune over a choice of Fatty sizes. Yes I could probably squeeze onto a small frame at 6ft, but once wound upto speed the long wheelbase of the Fatty regularly comes into it's own.

Russy that's one of the nicest On one fatty's I've, I do like that.

The 2x8 on my Dune I've found really works much better than I expected, If I didn't get such a good deal on some 1x10 stuff I'd have happily kept it until it wore out.
The brakes really are pants though, but the ability to fit a bluto straight away tipped me towards the Dune as I couldn't justify buying the Fatty Trail.

The classic fatty only comes in boring white, much prefer my neon chubby 🙂

Nice, russyh! I thought the Fatty wasn't Bluto-compatible (straight headtube, tapered steer I assumed) or was that the earlier Fatty frame?

If you had time, then I would advise buying a nice frame and just building it up to the spec that you want.
The only reason to buy a complete bike is if you want to ride it ASAP.

I'd like to do that (mainly as I like building bikes) but if I'd did that I'd still put fairly basic parts to keep the cost down, and it would still work out more expensive. I'd rather have a whole bike, and upgrade stuff when it breaks/gets annoying/comes up cheap second hand. Much the approach firestarter has taken by the sound of it.

I like the look of the Fatty trail frame though.

Jumbo Jims are useless apart from in the summer

ime it takes appreciably longer for them to let go compared to thin tyres and it can be quite entertaining to provoke a long-drawn out slide

As you were.

Thanks Nick, I dont mind the white. It has a nice pearlescent flip to it. But wouldn't be my first or even second choice. Hence why i went custom decal's. Like i say when Smokestone launch the Henderson I will be placing an order. I have seen it through the development process and Slamman knows fatty's! Plus it has some descent features like stealth reverb routing. Have to be honest its taken me longer than others to really like the fatbike. After upgrading to Bluto i really felt i had lost the initial charm, but as i get more miles under my belt I am really pleased with how the bike now rides. I still need to develop my technique as on tight switch backs or fast corners i dont carry enough speed so find the bike slow compared to my other normal bike. But appreciate thats me, needing to learn the specifics of riding a fatty. As per usual for me what started out as a cheap winter play thing has escalated quickly into an upgrade fest. But I do like having something unique to me and when riding with other fatty's they are great fun.

Nice, russyh! I thought the Fatty wasn't Bluto-compatible (straight headtube, tapered steer I assumed) or was that the earlier Fatty frame?

Nope always been tapered i believe. My firs V1 Fatty frame was tapered but cracked. My V2 (this bike) is all but the same other than the new Seat tube and different brake mount. Slam69 do loads of custom OOF, in custom paint jobs to. CHeck out his facebook page.

I did mine myself, i couldn't afford to BUild on all at once straight from the bat, so just upgraded over a few months. That way i could enjoy the bike and understand what i wanted to change.

Jumbo Jims are useless apart from in the summer

They work quite well on ice with gravel in it
ime it takes appreciably longer for them to let go compared to thin tyres and it can be quite entertaining to provoke a long-drawn out slide

As you were.

I don't mind the JJ's I've gone with a floater on the front and kept the JJ on the back. JJ gripped a lot better than some of the comments had be believing.

Nice, russyh! I thought the Fatty wasn't Bluto-compatible (straight headtube, tapered steer I assumed) or was that the earlier Fatty frame?

Fatty forks are straight steerer, the frame is tapered.

To allow them to fit the other fat bikes that were around at the same time, same logic with the 135mm hub, it's what everyone used until the bluto appeared.

thisisnotaspoon - Member

If you're not 'small' then TBH I don't know why you'd buy the Dune over a choice of Fatty sizes. Yes I could probably squeeze onto a small frame at 6ft, but once wound upto speed the long wheelbase of the Fatty regularly comes into it's own.

The Dune's the same length as a medium Fatty- the large is only 15mm longer because of weird on one geometry increments. Neither is a long bike really. The only dimension on the Dune that's really "small" is the seat tube so I think that gives the wrong impression.

But for sure, the choice of sizes is a big advantage.

Ordered three lightweight tubes... stupidly ordered presta. Do I need to return them or will they be okay for rims drilled for Schraeder. I don't want to take them out of their boxes if I have to return them...

The ali fork, overall weight difference (3.5kg on paper), tapered headset, bolt-thru dropouts and marginally less offensive colour are pushing me towards the Dune.
What am I missing?

3.5kg between OOF and Dune? Wasn't an steel forked OOF quoted at 16.7 and a Dune actually about 14.6, so more like 2.1 reducing to 1.5 with the carbon fork?

If you're worried about weight and only looking at a £1k budget maybe fat biking isn't for you.

Don't worry about the weight because if you get hooked on fat biking then you will need deep pockets for upgrades of a new bike.

Here's my 3rd fat bike since 2010
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If you're worried about weight and only looking at a £1k budget maybe fat biking isn't for you.

To be fair John, I was comparing the weight of a £575-10% Dune with a £899-25% Fatty (£775 with carbon fork), both substantially less than £1000 and many enjoy their fat biking that way I am sure.

I was just making the point that the overall weight difference was less than the 3.5 kg stated by the poster I quoted, and 1.5 kg less with a saving of £200 might be worth knowing!

Can anybody tell me the exact spec of the Dune's bb please?

Thanks

Alex I've the same tubes in the same rims the little metal screw on retainer pops in the Valve hole to secure it. You can't even tell

Hey Alex, I've bought these schrader to presta valve hole shim/convertor/reducer for bike/cycle wheel/rim http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/381525094073 and then will use the normal locking ring.

Ta both!