[Closed] Would I be an eejit if I bought a roadie with rim brakes, rather than discs?

At this moment in time, I'd buy a road bike without discs over on with discs. I think it's progress for progress's sake.

I'm not bothered a lab test will tell you that you get x amount of extra modulation and power. Rim brakes have been fine on road bikes for many, many, many years.

One day, there wont be a choice, and that'll suck because it's another old standard that's being fazed out to make money on new bits.

[i]Rim brakes have been fine on road bikes for many, many, many years.
[/i]

That's an argument I don't buy though. The same was said about canti's on mountain bikes before v-brakes, v-brakes before discs, suspension forks...

You can persuade yourself all day that rim brakes are fine but it's not even close, really.

They are fine, they're not as good as discs (no one's saying they are), but they're fine. Particularly for dry weather use.

[i]What bikes have you been looking at IHN?

[/i]

Sorry, just seen that.

A few in an idle, poking about on the web kinda way; Supersixes on offer at Pauls Cycles, I really like the red Genesis Zero (the 4 I think?), various others. And, of course, Hora's new Ritchey Road Logic when he sells it 🙂

That's an argument I don't buy though. The same was said about canti's on mountain bikes before v-brakes, v-brakes before discs, suspension forks...

It's a different application though. Bit like 4x4 off road, clearly better and everyone who drives much off road uses it now. On the road the benefits are less obvious, plus you have extra weight, cost and complexity.

I like discs purely because rubbing rim brakes are a disgusting thing. So I would never buy another bike without discs. The discs on roadies revolution is a fab bit of progress.

I like discs purely because rubbing rim brakes are a disgusting thing.

I agree, but is that really an issue on the road? Never has been for me. 😕

Far more common to get a slight rub on a disc brake, where tolerances are far tighter.

Far more common to get a slight rub on a disc brake, where tolerances are far tighter.

With the advent of road hydraulics this will become far less of an issue with self centering pads - even the bb5s on my commuter (which aren't the greatest tbh & require a bit of fiddling to keep working optimally) have needed less maintenance than the rim brakes on my old commuter through thousands of miles of crap weather every year.

Also - with the disc caliper being near the centre of the wheel any flex / wobbles at the rim are pretty much negligible but with rim brakes can be felt much more so as a few mm of movement at the rim can be easily enough to rub brake pads (or fork legs in the case of my old commuter with rims of cheese)

Having said that - I wouldn't be put off buying a nice road bike with rim brakes if I was only going to use it in good weather, for longevity I wouldn't stick factory wheels with proprietary rims on it though.

For a road bike that isn't used in a seriously hilly or mountainous area, in reasonably good weather, rim brakes are "fine". Plenty good enough for the job.

Disc brakes will be "better" in terms of power and probably modulation/feel. They may be an advantage if you do live in a very hilly or mountainous area or ride in really bad weather.

Just to throw in another option - if you want more power, how about hydraulic rim brakes? The SRAM Red hydraulic brakes look like a good halfway house -

[url= https://www.sram.com/sram/road/products/sram-red-hydraulic-rim-brakeset ]SRAM RED Hydraulic Rim Brakes[/url]

they have superior handling skills than us mortals

😆 no, just no, some have, Sagan certainly has, but Schleck minor? 😆

Commuter/tourer has Avid BB7s, road bike has rim brakes. Most of my road riding is in the Dales where one or two hills might be involved and rain is not unknown 😆 Having rim brakes hasn't been a problem even on descents like Park Rash.

If a bike I liked/was interested in had disk brakes then fine, but equally I wouldn't dismiss a bike just because it had rim brakes.

no, just no, some have, Sagan certainly has, but Schleck minor?

I reckon plumping for rims now, for a bike that I'll also have for probably ten years

Well most likely you will have had to replace the wheels at least once in that time. They do wear out after all, some (alarmingly) faster than others.

I have said this soooo many times but the case for discs on a road bike is far more about what wheel choice it allows than braking performance (which is an added benefit).

You can run carbon clinchers and not worry. When you get mass take up of people running carbon wheels the price will start to come down massively, making them even more affordable.

In five years time I reckon 70% of the sport market will be on discs and carbon rims. In ten year it will be closer to 100%.

On the road the benefits are less obvious, plus you have extra weight, cost and complexity.

No doubt the same retro-grouch arguments were advanced about STI levers.

I'm not a road racer, but I'd be thinking about future resale if i were buying a new bike this year.

The value of 26" bikes on the SH market has plummeted this year. I can imagine the same happening with roadbikes.

Consequentially, why not buy a nice SH roadbike with conventional brakes and minimise the potential loss.

for longevity I wouldn't stick factory wheels with proprietary rims on it though

What would you do then? You can't use (rear) disc hubs in a rim brake frame, so you'll need new wheels anyway, what difference is it if they're factory wheels versus custom builds?

This much worry makes me wonder just how much road riding many of the posters here have actually done.
None of the guys I regularly ride road with are even vaguely interested in discs. that's a mixture of fairly new road riders, sportive riders, club riders and guys who regularly race at various levels.
The one guy I have ridden with with who did have discs on his roadbike used his brake levers far too often and far too early for every single corner during the 40miles we rode together.
Personally I have never ever worn out the braking surface on any road rim. I rode the entire winter last year with only a front brake. plan your route, look ahead and read the road properly and you rarely have to brake at all.

njee20 - Member
You can't use (rear) disc hubs in a rim brake frame

Really? Why?

You can't use (rear) disc hubs in a rim brake frame
Really? Why?

Frame spacing.

Get a rim brake frame and some 26 inch wheels, you'll look a proper eejit then. particulalry at the bottom of the first hill.

I'd get discs if i could, cos they look cool, but \i'd probably end up with rim brakes cos they're a bit cheaper, they'll be fine for years yet.

mrblobby - Member

Frame spacing.

But you can buy 130mm disc hubs without any problems...

But you can buy 130mm disc hubs without any problems...

But you'd be a fool to do so, as the industry has all but settled on 135mm as the standard for disc equipped road bikes. Seeing as the suggestion was that you could future proof your wheel purchase, buying an obsolete standard of hub seems counter productive...

But you can buy 130mm disc hubs without any problems...

I think the suggestion was that you could just use normal disc wheels, which you can't. I guess if you want to get some specially built on 130mm hubs then fine, but what's the point?

njee20 - Member

But you'd be a fool to do so, as the industry has all but settled on 135mm as the standard for disc equipped road bikes. Seeing as the suggestion was that you could future proof your wheel purchase, buying an obsolete standard of hub seems counter productive...

They're easy enough to adapt, I've got a 130mm WI disc hub running in my Pickenflick frame. Just an axle adaptor and disc offset was required...but, I do see your point.

I wouldn't be put off buying a nice road bike with [b]rim [/b]brakes if I was only going to use it in good weather, for longevity I wouldn't stick factory wheels with proprietary rims on it though.

[i]What would you do then? You can't use (rear) disc hubs in a rim brake frame, so you'll need new wheels anyway, what difference is it if they're factory wheels versus custom builds?[/i]

For the avoidance of confusion - I would quite happily buy a road bike which only ran rim brakes, however having gone through 2 sets of shimano factory wheels (rims only - hubs were fine with regular maintenance) in 2 years on my old roadie commuter (which got used pretty much every day in Glasgow through everything except sheet ice), i'd go with handbuilts instead so that after a while I didn't have to retire a whole wheelset due to non-replaceable (well, not economically) worn rims. Plus I like sitting surrounded by hundreds of small pieces of metal with nothing other than steely determination + several bottles of harmfully strong lager to turn them into a functioning bike wheel I can be almost proud of 😕

Also - I have a couple of pairs of disc wheels for my old Charge Filter which use 130mm rear disc hubs (Novatec D352SB http://www.bdopcycling.com/Hubs-D352SB-10.asp) - one pair are built with Alex xd-lite rims which are disc only but the other pair I built with Halo Aerotrack rims for use with 25/28mm tyres so can use those on a road bike at a push (then permanent marker over the wear on the black surface 😉 ) Think White Industries also make one but that's on the spendy side for me!

J

Personally I have never ever worn out the braking surface on any road rim. I rode the entire winter last year with only a front brake. plan your route, look ahead and read the road properly and you rarely have to brake at all.

Fixed?

Personally I have never ever worn out the braking surface on any road rim. I rode the entire winter last year with only a front brake. plan your route, look ahead and read the road properly and you rarely have to brake at all.

I would agree with you in the summer, but I'm not sure how you manage that in the winter. When it's dark, there is slush or maybe ice on the road combined with a lot of run off debris (the roads around the Surrey Hills really suffer from this) and the overall state of the surface is poor, I can't see any other way to be cautious than to brake (and I ride the road a lot - about 300km a week).

As for there not being much evidence for demand/uptake, the road scene has always been reticent about adopting new technology; we're a conservative bunch steeped in tradition and not helped by the luddite attitude of the UCI (OK so I agree with some of their thinking but not all of it).

Again, greatly improved braking peformance is a bonus. Discs = mass uptake of carbon rims, which will only be a good thing.

Im looking forward to the market getting flooded with cheap outdated quality wheelsets 🙂

That said my cx does have discs for crap weather/muddy braking

This much worry makes me wonder just how much road riding many of the posters here have actually done.

I've been a regular road rider for the last 15 years, and mtb for over 20. You?

I've worn out both road and mtb rims to the point that they've failed, causing the inner tube to explode.

Maybe if you only do gentle cruises to the cafe on a nice summer's day, then it's not an issue.

As for there not being much evidence for demand/uptake, the road scene has always been reticent about adopting new technology; we're a conservative bunch steeped in tradition and not helped by the luddite attitude of the UCI (OK so I agree with some of their thinking but not all of it).

Everyone in my road club uses clipless pedals and combined shift/ brake systems. Both are relatively recent inventions in the history of road riding. I'm pretty sure we'll all be on discs in 5 years or so.

I would agree with you in the summer, but I'm not sure how you manage that in the winter. When it's dark, there is slush or maybe ice on the road combined with a lot of run off debris (the roads around the Surrey Hills really suffer from this) and the overall state of the surface is poor, I can't see any other way to be cautious than to brake (and I ride the road a lot - about 300km a week).

Yeah, I too think discs probably make most sense when using carbon rims

Everyone in my road club uses clipless pedals and combined shift/ brake systems. Both are relatively recent inventions in the history of road riding. I'm pretty sure we'll all be on discs in 5 years or so.

I completely agree. I think in contrast though, mountain bikers have been much quicker to take up new technology (and also more radical innovations). We seem to have gone over to bigger wheels in less than two years; full suss took a little while to catch on but I think that had more to do with it being a very long development cycle before it got right; disc brakes on MTBs was very quick but then the benefits are much greater there.

The road initially resisted clipless pedals and there was so much criticism for the combined brake/shifter - arguments tended to centre around what happens if you crash etc. We tend to get there and as I said, I think you're right that within five years, discs will be ubiquitous on road bikes.

didn't realise Surrey was in Europe

Rule #24 😀

I've been a regular road rider for the last 15 years, and mtb for over 20. You?

I've worn out both road and mtb rims to the point that they've failed, causing the inner tube to explode.

Maybe if you only do gentle cruises to the cafe on a nice summer's day, then it's not an issue.

If you do regular club runs in winter I'd still hardly expect much brake pad wear, as if the route is well planned then stopping isn't very regular activity. I'd totally believe you could do the majority of a road ride using a front brake only, as rarely touch the rear brake even on my commute.

Rule #

8)

I don't even like Cake or Coffee as it happens

are you human?

It's urban commuting that kills rims IME. I never wore rims out (or pads particularly regularly) until I started riding through town regularly. I'm sure I could improve longevity by taking a degree of care of my winter/commuter bike too, but sod that.

are you human?

I'm sure he's human but he's definitely not a roadie 😀

I mean that entirely in jest and with a huge sense of irony mtbel. I'm not one for rules either and actually I think the Velomenati's first rule - it's all about the bike - is the only one that really counts. Just ride your bike. Be a 'cyclist' not a 'roadie' or a this or a that. It's fine to identify with one branch of passion more than the other of course.

I'd opt for disc brakes if they came as standard on a new bike. Just for the wet weather thing.

I'm currently using some Mavic Kysrium SLS clinchers with dura ace 9000 brakes and the pads have small lumps of the rim brake surface embedded in them.
I'm sure most are familiar with the grinding sound conventional brakes makes on a wet alloy rim. It's not an illusion, we really are grinding down that rim and so for me, replacing a brake disc is preferable to replacing the wheel/wheel rim, albeit that having to replace the wheel for brake wear is thankfully a very infrequent event in my experience.

It's urban commuting that kills rims IME.

Yes I would agree with that and it would tally with what mtbel was saying without also contradicting other peoples' experiences.

It's urban commuting that kills rims IME

As it was taken GeeTee 😉 I'm the first to admit I'm not really a "roadie", don't even see myself as a cyclist TBH.. I just love riding bikes and really don't identify with any one branch in particular... I'm the one on 100mile clubrides with BMX spd shoes, no lid, gloves or gels. the DHer on flats with no 5:10s or garish colours and bald tyres, the XC rider in a cotton T-shirt and the ancient BMXer who's still shit and can't fit in skinny jeans. Cycling is too fashion driven and cliquey for me really and I'm just as happy riding a 25 year old beater as a 2015 superbike.

Oooooohhh... get you I don't even like Cake or Coffee as it happens. I've already said elsewhere that I ride all year round but just to qualify for your badge of AWESOME that does indeed include all weathers, day and night.

Just so long as it's anti-clockwise and you wash your bike immediately afterwards...

Sounds like fun. Not.

I was looking at a cheap (Lynskey) ti disc frame but I'd need new wheels (I like my Ultegras) and wheels are important aren't they.

more fun than sand in yer chamois by the sounds of it, yes.

more fun than sand in yer chamois by the sounds of it, yes.

Is that what happens when you ride clockwise?