[Closed] What steel roadbike frame

18bikes are doing some road steel stuff.

Mason cycles frames look wonderful from the teaser shots.

budget is key, really.

c£700max for a frame or frameset ok?

That Ritchey road bike is reet nice.

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Genesis Volare 853 for £900 would be the obvious STW answer I guess. Too much?

hora - does this mean you're getting on really well with road biking, or that you're still spending more time changing bits of the bike than riding it?

The Genesis Volare 853 is quite good for the cash - Paul Milnes are doing them for £499 with carbon fork at the mo

one of the equilibrium range ?
mercian ?
something a bit older from retrobike ??

Please don't get that Ritchey!
I've been toying with buying one for the last six months!

Halfords are (were) selling them and at one point just after the Tour they were under £600 notes....

Shand Skinnymalinky?

Not currently for sale but enough teasers on their facebook/instagram feeds that it's going to be available to order pretty soon.

Edit - just seen the budget, it's unlikely to be <£700 🙁

carbon is light (pointless as I'm never going to win anything)

i got mine for comfort over long distances, not winning, it's not just for racers

[i]carbon is light (pointless as I'm never going to win anything)[/i]
[b]i got mine for comfort over long distances, not winning, it's not just for racers[/b]

^ this

I do love the way my 853 bike rides even compared to my carbon bikes. However £700? I guess that you will be looking at something like the Genesis not a custom build. How about this for a deal [url= http://www.ukbikesdepot.com/m90b185s899p11768/GENESIS_Fugio_853_frameset_2014/RS_GB/34332?gclid=CLeSptPF2cMCFefMtAodfzUAYw ]Cheap 853[/url]

Surly Pacer,[url= http://www.tritoncycles.co.uk/frames-forks-c6/road-touring-frames-c47/surly-pacer-frameset-disco-tomato-p2602/s6730?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_term=surly-pacer-frameset-disco-tomato-size-62cm-fmsup61r&utm_campaign=product%2Blisting%2Bads&gclid=CjwKEAiAmOymBRD0_evS4aTh2hUSJAB7FkhyD4j-8mvDF3tUzXM2mJhxKy0xXxgHEUbHzjKy42RfFxoCbrbw_wcB ] £339[/url] for the frame set

does this mean you're getting on really well with road biking, or that you're still spending more time changing bits of the bike than riding it?

They say that ignorance is bliss 😉

£2k for a Ti full build?

[url= http://www.enigmabikes.com/collections/versatility/products/complete-bike-etape ]Enigma[/url]

Or Columbus for £700 incl a carbon fork.

[url= http://www.enigmabikes.com/collections/versatility/products/ezona ]More Enigma[/url]

If I was going to buy a Steel road frame the first and possibly only consideration I'd have would be the off-the-shelf Donohou. However, no idea on the budget and there is probably a waiting list!

does this mean you're getting on really well with road biking, or that you're still spending more time changing bits of the bike than riding it?

If I had test ridden the Pro Carbon X I'd have spotted the weird- firmer rear- flexy front.

But of course you stuck with the same bike frame that you bought.

(Keep on-topic. I stripped down the Pro X and sold the F&F last night so the rest of the bike is ready for a new frame).

My Planet X Carbon Pro is a far more comfortable ride than my steel framed road bike (although the steel frame is a thing of beauty)..................

I saw some of the new Genesis ones in a shop the other day.
The look beautiful, especially the one with Campagnolo (black with gold liverly, like an old JP Special Lotus)

They also do them with disks?

Speak to Jose at Paulus Quiros. I recently had a very interesting conversation with him about the properties of Reynolds 525. Or better still wait until April and go to Bespoked.

Also, consider a s/h Rourke. I got my 853 frame and forks for well under your budget.

Then again, Steve Goff makes frames at amazingly good prices, and s/h they (shamefully) sell for very little money. There was an absolute stonker on LFGSS a couple of weeks ago.

For you SirH, this..

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I think Touring and Audax bikes tend to be heavier for strength and durability... In the case of Touring, especially, you're looking to be able to stick relatively big weights on the frame in baggage.

I must confess I'd always assumed carbon was about weight and performance not comfort. I may have projected aluminium experiences onto it.

Steel cross bike here for ride reasons. The slack geo makes big Road riding a bit of a pain, but I deliberately sized up for my own take on hybrid use. I've never taken it further than 100 on road, but next time I do it'll have narrower tyres than the 35s I left on last time... Bike commutes well, does not too Gnarly trail well and good for spins in the Peaks. One day I may buy a proper Road bike, but right now they're a bit too specialised for me.

It doesn't matter what you buy, within reason (and by that I mean geometry and tubing), they are all going to ride the same, feel the same and weigh about the same. The only thing that will materially change, is the colour and the name printed on the down tube.

Your decision criteria, really ought to be based on the following:

- can I get a perfect set up and fit (this is partly about the bike but mostly about the retailer)
- do I want mudguards
- how convenient is the retail location
- do I like the colour

You say you're not fussed as to whether it's Colombus or 853; not to be too pedantic but Colombus is to Reynolds as 853 is, I believe, to Spirit (but it might also be tripple butted Life). Columbus also do a stainless steel tubeset called XCR and they may do lower tubesets, so when chosing, bear this in mind.

Carbon is an interesting one because unlike steel, the ride characteristic is not inherent to the material, but to how the material is used. Steel has an inherent ride feel and it's difficult to manipulate that without introducing lots of other compromises. Make it stiff and it becomes harsh; make it compliant and it's not as responsive.

Bar far the comfiest frame I've ridden out of a Ti Condor, Ti Indy Fab, 853 and 725 Genesis, and a Carbon Ridley is my current Carbon Condor Leggero. It is sublime. Yes it's heavier than other carbon frames at 1kg, but it's still 500g lighter than my ti Condor was, it's materially stiffer and more responsive and they don't fail unless you crash them.

I only make the point to demonstrate that carbon frames are not homogenous. The fact is though that a decent one, that is light and comfy, is less likely to be found at your price point.

For £700 you're kind of stuck between top of the mid market and bottom of the custom built higher end steel frames. A £700 steel frame is not going to get you much performance benefit over a £400 steel frame.

For example, I've had both the £450 725 Genesis Equilibrium and now have the £700 853 version. The latter is a little lighter in the frame (although the same weight overall because it also has a steel fork that is heavier but slightly more comfortable), but other than that (and we're talking maybe 100g to 200g difference) there is no difference.

I bought the 853 version because I liked the colour more than what was available in the 725 version at the time. Simple as. With hindsight, I would have been better off saving a little more and buying a ti Enigma Etape (because I do want mudguards) which would have been materially lighter and a little more responsive.

The Condor Fratello is pricey but the service, if you can get into the shop, is excellent. You will get a perfect fit with Julian and very well looked after but you do pay a little more for it.

The Genesis Equilibrium 725 is a lot cheaper and while a little heavier, you can off set that against component upgrades. You should be able to get a good fit with a decent retailer.

The 853 Genesis adds the 853 fork, which is a nice touch and is comfier but heavier.

An Enigma in Columbus Zona (?) tubing will be at least £700. Sure it will be nice but if you want an Enigma, I would suggest you go for the Ethos and get a little more customisation and a lighter tube set. The Ezona will so much like the £450 Genesis Equilibrium but with the word Enigma printed on it that I can't see why you would pay £250 more unless you want to deal with Enigma because they are nice people and you can get to their outlet store easily and take advantage of a professional bike fit. And that would be a perfectly good reason in my book.

In summary, at £700 you really are right at the top end of high quality but still mass manufacture steel frames where you're paying a few hundred quid more for something that is only just a little bit different materially (Genesis Equilibrium 853 or Volare 853) or has a lot of service value attached to it (Condor and potentially Enigma).

To get a true custom built steel frame you need to up the budget to at least £1000 (Rourke will do you something very nice) or significantly more.

Hope that helps.

I think we ought to just start filling this thread with sexy steel roadies.. Y'know, just for inspiration...

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Hora, i forgot about your email, in short i would not go the condor route and definitely an enigma in spirit tubing. better value as the condor is a bit overpriced for what it is (lower end tubeset)
cant see the point in looking at stovepipe/lugged frames, fillet brazed or tig only oversized tubes.
if your budget is limited then look at the bowman palace, totally different bike but a very sorted frame and fork.
however if you then went online 6 months later and complained it was ‘harsh’ i expect Neil would find you then kill you.

I have an equilibrium and it is nice but the biggest thing that gives it is 'spring' in the ride is the ti seatpost - replaced with a carbon one and it is much 'harder'

geetee1972- thank you and yes. Food for thought and it helps me jump a couple of paces ahead in my knowledge on this.

It doesn't matter what you buy, within reason (and by that I mean geometry and tubing), they are all going to ride the same, feel the same and weigh about the same. The only thing that will materially change, is the colour and the name printed on the down tube.

absolute rubbish.
i have a pegoretti duende and chesini prima, they are identical geometry and both made with columbus spirit tubesets, they couldn’t be more different in ride quality. while both are oversize the Pegoretti is a magic carpet ride the chesini i can feel what the tyres are doing a lot more (this is swapping wheelsets between the 2)
the stays are similar but different cross sections but looking at them tells you nothing about how they ride.

both are great frames that i would happily ride all day (if i had the time)

It's alloy, but then hey.. nice bike..

[img] ?w=460&h=307[/img]

or this.. it's steel
[img] [/img]

[i]That Ritchey road bike is reet nice.

[/i]

Don't. There was one for sale on here last year, in my size, for an excellent price, near to where I was living at the time. I ummed and aaaahhd, but didn't buy it. I so, so wish I had... 🙁

In the future I might be able to stretch the price however £700 is really my max sadly (and for that it has to include forks). The Enigma Ezona is also available as a frame only for £525 which means I've got abit more room to play with for some decent forks within that budget? (external cup 1/1 8).

On the Ritchey- what steel is it made from? I can't seem to find it?

I've got a Summer holiday to pay for and a bathroom to re-do 🙁

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^Is that a traditional Japanese building in the background? 😀

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Field are from Sheffield aren't they?

So,

I doubt it.

Anyways, what are you doing looking behind the bike? 😛

have a pegoretti duende and chesini prima, they are identical geometry and both made with columbus spirit tubesets, they couldn’t be more different in ride quality. while both are oversize the Pegoretti is a magic carpet ride the chesini i can feel what the tyres are doing a lot more (this is swapping wheelsets between the 2)

Good point. I should perhaps have added that my original statement really only applies to frames at the price point Hora is looking at.

Once you get into the realms of very high end custom built frames (and actually there aren't many that take tubing profiles and customisation of this to the level that Dario does) then you are into a completely different world of ride characteristic.

On the point of the Condor being a lower end tubeset, I'm not sure which frame this was in reference to. The Fratello is built with the exact same tube set at the Enigma Ethos - tripple butted Columbus spirit - but it's £700 versus £1000.

Note that the race oriented Acciaia is £200 more expensive, built with TB Dedaccia steel and is only 100g lighter.

http://www.condorcycles.com/Audax-Commute-Touring/25676-Condor-Fratello-Frameset/flypage.tpl.html bugger out of stock- I'll check. I'll put this in my 3 to shortlist (Ezona, this and another)

Edit Frameweight- 1900gm versus the Ezona 1600gm (and the Fratello would require new callipers).

The Condor is made with the same tubing as the Ethos. Enigma show the Ethos as weighing 1600g, whereas Condor say their Fratello weighs 1900g.

Clearly there is something else going on here. You can't build two frames, from an identical tube set, in the same size and have a 20% weight difference.

Paint, size and fork will all change the weight.

The Condor fork may well be heavy. I replaced the stock carbon Dedaccia fork on my Condor ti Moda and saved about 200g.

Oh and it's unlikely to be out of stock so much as they want to retail it to you in person. Call and speak to Julian.

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Fratello disc looks good http://road.cc/content/news/142438-just-condor-fratello-disc

I doubt I'll be after another steel road frame for quite some time, but I'd probably get an Amaro. He welded in a new stay on my Pego after it rusted through, immaculate job and not easy to spot which one was replaced.

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Maybe over somewhat budget 🙂

2nd hand Indy Fab Club Racer float your boat?

Maybe over somewhat budget

The Indy is a smidge too small on the TT. Your falls 😯