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Still there for me too. Seems Cranked mag have liked the post. Be interesting to hear their thoughts on the whole saga, think they were one of the first mags to run an interview.
I've got plenty of thoughts, but I'm not sharing them here (or anywhere else public for that matter). And no, you can't infer anything into my unwillingness to share...
Iโve got plenty of thoughts, but Iโm not sharing them here (or anywhere else public for that matter). And no, you canโt infer anything into my unwillingness to shareโฆ
Yet taking the time to confirm.
The whole debacle has exposed the absolute low level of competence in any of the online press , as much as the credibility of "Sick" is in tatters the people reporting on it should grow a backbone also and deliver facts rather than run scared of opinion that hurts their likes, or sales.
If a magazine writes a piece informing the reader of the merits of a bike/brand without doing due diligence on the brands ability to produce and deliver goods, are the magazine complicit/culpable in a fraud case?
In NA, if a company (a inc) advertises the service of another (b inc), even without delivering the actual service, that company (a inc) can be named and included in legal proceedings.
In NA, if a company (a inc) advertises the service of another (b inc), even without delivering the actual service, that company (a inc) can be named and included in legal proceedings.
so any website carrying adverts from GoogleAds or the other online ad feeds is responsible for every advertiser that has an ad delivered to their page?
or if a newspaper carries adverts for a car service co and that company fails to service a car poperly the newspaper can be sued?
I've no idea where NA is but is it near LALA?
Iโve got plenty of thoughts, but Iโm not sharing them here (or anywhere else public for that matter). And no, you canโt infer anything into my unwillingness to shareโฆ
Yet taking the time to confirm.
Just being polite, since I was (albeit very indirectly) asked for an opinion.
If a magazine writes a piece informing the reader of the merits of a bike/brand without doing due diligence on the brands ability to produce and deliver goods, are the magazine complicit/culpable in a fraud case?
In NA, if a company (a inc) advertises the service of another (b inc), even without delivering the actual service, that company (a inc) can be named and included in legal proceedings.
Well the question really is what's the difference between an objective review piece on a product and an advertisement or advertorial piece?
So far as I know anything the likes of ST or PB wrote about Sick was on the basis of having had a go on a loaned bike and writing about the bike performed and perhaps their initial impressions of this new company and their products, I don't remember anyone writing that they were stand up guys you could trust with your money, just that they had a new company, and a "punk attitude"...
If a magazine writes a piece informing the reader of the merits of a bike/brand without doing due diligence on the brands ability to produce and deliver goods, are the magazine complicit/culpable in a fraud case?
Dunno about that, but whilst it'd be nice for all reviewers to double-up as investigative journalists the fact that Hannah's piece alone took two months to put together would suggest to me that this would be an impractical expectation on the part of the reader. Plus, y'know, I don't think many review sites have crystal balls.
I donโt think many review sites have crystal balls
I don't think PinkBike showed any balls, crystal or otherwise...
The Sick! company directors *think* they're showing balls...
I'm just surprised no ones gave them a good kicking yet. They just come over as thieving arrogant tosspots.
🤣🤣🥳🥴
I'm torn on the whole thing.
2 quotes come to mind:-
"the road to hell is paved with good intentions"
&
"when you're going through hell, keep going"
& I think both probably apply in the Sick! case.
When they first started, I thought, and I think said at the time, that the first bike looked wrong with the super dropped top tube and fairly silly length and their attitude towards (mostly) constructive) criticism sucked big time. BUT they almost turned it around.
I really don't think there's anything wrong with a couple of born agains trying to tear s**t up in the industry and they should be applauded for, and I fully embrace, their enthusiasm and desire to do something different, hell I very nearly bought a Donut tee (still quite like those). I am however, disappointed to see that their idea of "disruptive" is more fake it till you make it, maรฑana maรฑana & subterfuge if not downright lying.
They won't be the first people to caught up in their own hype and they won't be the last bike company to promise a bike they can't deliver. I'd like to believe they could turn this around and deliver something meaningful if they could just sort out their attitude and deliver on promises, god knows they've had some interesting ideas and a load of help from the industry but I can't help thinking the boat has sailed.
At this point a little humility (If they're capable of it) would work wonders and might even buy them some time.
I'd like to see that big gearbox full sus. I hope the designer's been paid.
dangeourbrain
Subscriber
Just as an aside, why would stock levels not being zeroed or indeed being zero have any influence on preorders for frames that havenโt been built yet?
The โstockโ is just a qty manually assigned to the item (obviously there should be some logic behind it), it wonโt be a fully automated amazon warehouse style operation, itโll be done by hand.
So for example if they knew the next batch would be 50 frames theyโd allocate 50 stock to the pre-order, the system will be set up to refuse orders for which there is zero stock so would prevent people being able to order frames that wonโt get produced as part of the batch.
The stock system has no concept of whether the item is a preorder frame, physical stock of a frame or a t shirt, theyโre just text descriptors.Of course in the particular case the system appears to have been given 10^z stock so that doesnโt hold.
No - it doesn't quite work like that - at least not with the versions of Shopify and other ecommerce software I've used. Generally, you can manually add a number of items that are in stock. Pre-orders or back orders are enabled by checking a separate box. If the quantity is 0 and the back order box is checked it will let the customer order, but will usually display a message (in our case we have something along the lines of 'This is a back order item, please allow an extra 4 days for delivery').
It's possible to change the quantity to 0 and forget to disable back orders, but you'd have to be a complete doofus to do that.
JP
Iโd like to see that big gearbox full sus. I hope the designerโs been paid
Don't hold your breath.
https://www.pinkbike.com/forum/listcomments/?threadid=211801&pagenum=63
points for spotting Hora...
I'm probably missing something but I never could see how exactly they were shaking things up in the industry. Is it cos they have tattoos and use swear words?
Iโm probably missing something but I never could see how exactly they were shaking things up in the industry. Is it cos they have tattoos and use swear words?
I think it was more to do with novel approaches to both frame delivery and customer service...
Any updates? Anyone got a refund? Any progress of any kind?
I can see where their novel approach lies, whereas nearly all manufacturers supply a frame to a paying customer Sick decides to take the money and supply nothing but empty promises.
Iโm probably missing something but I never could see how exactly they were shaking things up in the industry. Is it cos they have tattoos and use swear words?
It seemed mainly to be in making bikes that other manufacturers wouldn't (because the geometry wouldn't hold up to abuse, etc), and in telling customers to go **** themselves. You know, like when kids of a certain age realise that particular words have shock value, so they start to use them all the time to generate a response.
I would've thought that people who like the appeal of buying a bike from a company with a punk attitude should've known what to expect.
You can make radical bikes, and be a bit different without being dicks.
https://www.pinkbike.com/news/article852.html
^i had a Racelink (#128) with Avalanche forks and a Park bike. My mate had an FQ and a Park as well. Awesome bike's, distributor (Ged the Hed) and a great company but the wheels fell off when Pharell Williams invested and Doc left.
See also Superco.
Sick have referenced Brooklyn a few times and their hook up with ex Spooky Frank The Welder gave me high hopes for Sick which obviously hasn't panned out
Anyone else get the sick email selling off old stock frames that are supposedly in stock?
Itโll be a brave or stupid person that clicks buy on those.
Yep, just read through it...... Usual bullshit, running a business is hard, it's not our fault it's just how it is, don't believe the forums blah blah.
My cynical side just can not believe those frames are 'in stock'.... Maybe in stock in Peru and Taiwan.
Canโt imagine how pissed off people waiting for frames are after that, why arenโt they at least offering them the in stock stuff?
Anyone else get the sick email selling off old stock frames that are supposedly in stock?
Ooooh. Do share...
https://mailchi.mp/ab67a5584dfc/deadstock-sale-and-new-garms-for-summer?e=247c187fca
Forum goblins to blame again. We're all terrible people even though we're not sat in folks money ยฏ\_(ใ)_/ยฏ
Ah, so frames that have been built up, or scratched, or with bits missing, or returns. But you wonโt know exactly whatโs wrong until it arrives.
Take my money...
Ah, so frames that have been built up, or scratched, or with bits missing, or returns. But you wonโt know exactly whatโs wrong until it arrives.
If it arrives, shirley?
My cynical side just can not believe those frames are โin stockโโฆ. Maybe in stock in Peru and Taiwan.
Presumably as the trickle of canceled orders became/becomes a tidal wave if there really are batches of frames all over the place that need to be paid for they've got to sell them to stay afloat.
Even if they are telling the truth and really are just having problem after problem. Then there comes a point where you can't just expect customers to keep faith in you having their money if you simply can't run a business.
It's a shame because if they do go to the wall then it's inevitable there's going to be less money in the bank and frames in stock than there are people who've paid up front for them even if the owners haven't paid themselves they'll have had costs.
And the alternative is to believe them, which is believing that they're just incompetent, and continuing to trust them with your money and body. If these frames are vapourwear have they been CEN tested or even ridden by test riders, or are they just the exaggerated sketches of two blokes who by their own boasting aren't established bike designers?
have they been CEN tested or even ridden by test riders, or are they just the exaggerated sketches of two blokes who by their own boasting arenโt established bike designers?
I have seen the answer to this somewhere else and it was not pretty from what I recall the guy refused to build them based on the fact they weren't testing anything.
Has anyone seen any signs they do test? No.
Sick claimed their riders test the product.
"overstock" lol
"customer cancelled before delivery" uber lol
So many gems in their descriptions
โ148mm Boost spacing (but we hear people fit 142 just fine)โ
โ148mm Boost spacing (but we hear people fit 142 just fine)โ
Mmm... flex much?
😂 come on whatโs 6mm between friends?
This thread/sick just keep giving, utter utter trumpets.
Would be hilarious if a load of people werenโt out of pocket.
IIRC, Surly make the same spacing point.
Surly spec the frame at 145 though and design with it in mind. Cotic did the same for 130/135. Quite a difference between flexing 3mm when you've designed for it and 6mm when you haven't. I mean, it could be fine...
Canโt imagine how pissed off people waiting for frames are after that, why arenโt they at least offering them the in stock stuff?
Stating the blindingly obvious, but: Because that wouldnโt bring in more cash?
Oi! Flashโart no! Donโt be coming in here with yer brogues being all moderate & sensible! ๐
Oxfords, not brogues, Bez.
😎
Swanny, that makes sense, thanks. Just remembered something about Surly and spacing. Thanks for the additional detail.
there's selling your version of a story, and then there's this...From the Sale Website
We're working to make sure we can serve customers more effectively and be more transparent than ever (something, I felt we always did well anyway) - We've never been shy at showing our failings, as well as sharing our success, something you have all been part of.
Its easy to get caught up on the internet BS.ย
How many folk are actually waiting on a frame?
By showing their failings do they mean blaming the suppliers for not shipping frames they havenโt paid for? 🧐
This would make a great short series on Netflix.
Does anyone else hear a sneery David Brent voice when reading the stuff they write?
Bez! #flounces# with cane..
Stating the blindingly obvious, but: Because that wouldnโt bring in more cash?
This.