Reports that Avinox has had to create a limited version of its latest M2S motor to meet the governing body’s rules
I'd like to think this would sway development towards lighter motors and batteries within the UCI power cap but, really, I don't think anyone gives a toss about ebike racing and this move will just make that category of racing even more irrelevant. Back in the non racing world power will continue to sell
UCI are dropping ebike racing anyway. If you're on an ebike, you are there for the boost to your output. more is betterer.
Go watch the video of David Turner (of Turner bikes) interviewed by Hannah back in 2018. Apart from his take on e-bikes he raises the issue of human nature and that we are always greedy for more even if we don't need it. Just because you can doesn't mean you should. https://singletrackworld.com/2018/08/david-turner-e-bike-interview-this-is-an-opinion-on-our-nature-which-of-course-is-arguable-to-the-end-of-time/
Said it loads of times but the true genius of Avinox would not be to fit 'more' in the same weight/volume constraints, but they should have made the 2nd generation provide the same output as the first but in a smaller and lighter package.
They talk about the energy density of their battery being class leading but have made it massive still.
More Alpine A110 and Mazda MX-5s ebikes, less Lamborghini Urus and Bentley Bentayga ebikes please.
Couldn't agree more @snotrag
Rode my acoustic bike yesterday (No apologies for that term - I have electric and acoustic guitars on my wall) and it was great. I'm very lucky that I can choose either type of bike to ride pretty much when I want. And the bikes are usually exceptional. I love both electric and acoustic. I love the handling of the acoustic - it's light and agile and I feel in copntrol of every part of it. I dislike the long boring climbs on my rides - I ride for fun not for fitness. Fitness is a byproduct for me.
What I want is some assistance on the tricky parts but I don't want to sacrifice the lightweight feel of the bike like full fat eMTBs do. When Specialized launched the Levo SL I thought we were n the right path to lightweight eMTBS that focus on handling over power. But we've taken a different path towards maximum power. I rarely finish a ride anywhere near empty on a full fat bike. For me the perfect eMTB would come with 300wh battery and a small, very quiet, 50nm motor. With a range extender option if I want to do anything epic.
That's entirely possible right now of course, but the industry is going in a different direction because they can and because more power sells bikes.
UCI are dropping ebike racing anyway. If you're on an ebike, you are there for the boost to your output. more is betterer.
Only XC I think - E-Enduro is still running.
I just want motors and batteries to get smaller and lighter too, yet keep the same range offered by current mid powered bikes (basically the power and range of my 85Nm/630Wh Rise but in a lighter package). Silly amounts of power is of no interest to me.
Orbea appear to be somewhat bucking the trend with their new TQHP40 equipped Rallon RS, so it will be interesting to see how well that sells once released to the public. They do still have their mid power Rise and full fat Wild, which I believe will be getting an Avinox version in the not to distant future. I'm not sure if that's in addition to or a replacement for the Bosch version though. Will also be interesting to see if they stick with Shimano for any future versions of the Rise.
What I want is some assistance on the tricky parts but I don't want to sacrifice the lightweight feel of the bike like full fat eMTBs do. When Specialized launched the Levo SL I thought we were n the right path to lightweight eMTBS that focus on handling over power. But we've taken a different path towards maximum power. I rarely finish a ride anywhere near empty on a full fat bike. For me the perfect eMTB would come with 300wh battery and a small, very quiet, 50nm motor. With a range extender option if I want to do anything epic.
That's entirely possible right now of course, but the industry is going in a different direction because they can and because more power sells bikes.
That works if you're fit and light enough to ride a normal bike comfortably. Even with moderate fitness but weighing 100+kg you very quickly blow through battery capacity even using 1:1 assistance. At 130kg I rinsed a hired 600Wh Bosch system in 1 hour 40 using trail mode at Glenlivet.
I'm another who'd like to see lighter e-bikes rather than MOAR POWER. Until the start of this week I've been saying my 20.6kg eMTB doesn't feel any different descending to my similar travel, 17.5kg normal bike - but I've since had a brilliant ride on my 17.5kg normal bike and it's close, but it still ain't the same. Get eMTBs closer to the ride feel of a non-powered bike via weight reduction, but with a small mid-power motor and mid-capacity battery. Stop this power race pish.
Recently been browsing for a lighter eMTB for Mrs a11y and (as these things happen) I was tempted with a new eMTB for my own use, simply to gain a bit of battery capacity but keeping at the same weight or less. Someone mentioned the Moterra SL and I was bloody tempted! But stepping back from it, the only reason I even considered swapping was for the small number of instances where I'm riding in a group with a few Amflows and feel the need to 'turn up' my assistance to keep up on the climbs. But given I mostly ride mine solo, I'll make do.
A range extender would be the icing on the cake for my current eMTB but **** you, Fazua 😐
I ride for fun not for fitness. Fitness is a byproduct for me.
That's perfectly reasonable, I'm glad that ebikes make riding accessible to more people. Racing is a different thing, though. I just don't see the point of ebike racing.
Is there not going to be a new EU definition because of the power wars of 500W max rather than 250 sustained? ( maybe even a max torque???)
I just don't see the point of ebike racing.
Product Development.
ie making the motors more efficient and the batteries smaller, maybe power delivery smoother etc etc. Development wont be as fast if racing stops.
However it must be a regulation nightmare. How the hell can the UCI tell if the motor is assisting the rider ie the rider might not actually be pedalling that hard etc
I really looked at stopping Strava too. OK I never used it for KOMs etc, but it is a good relative tool for your fitness against others of similar age. However now I am on an ebike, segments and age categories are absolutely meaningless.
I imagine though there are quite a lot of people who bought Avinox v1 who are now cursing Avinox for releasing v2 because all their KOMs will disappear over night
Product Development.
ie making the motors more efficient and the batteries smaller, maybe power delivery smoother etc etc. Development wont be as fast if racing stops.
This is a myth. It's a very common claim about motorsports, and it really doesn't stand up to scrutiny. Commercial pressure (and legal requirements) is what drives product development. The benefit of racing is purely marketing.
And, when I say that I don't see the point of e-bike racing, I mean from a sporting perspective, not a commercial perspective. Cycle racing is about fitness and e-bike reduce the importance of fitness.
Development wont be as fast if racing stops.
You sure?
Who is actually racing E-MTBs anyway?
Many of you lot on here?
Development is still worthwhile as long as people keep buying E-bikes… Hence DJI spunking money at it recently, I doubt the Chinese could give 2 shits about the “competitive” side of E-bikes.
In terms of ebike racing, the development argument doesn't stack up.
The rules are that it has to conform to EN 15194. Just getting a copy of this document is going to set you back several hundred euros. Then there are the IEC/ISO documents that are referenced within it. Just gathering the documentation you need to know what the regulations are is going to cost over 1000 euros. And that's before you send your bike to get all the testing done to ensure it conforms to all these regulations.
It's a shame because ebike racing could be a real source of innovation, with people building in sheds going up against big manufacturers. If the rules were written like a motorsport rulebook where the rules are open and freely available, and so long as you conformed to the letter of the rules you were free to come up with clever ways to work around the restrictions then we could see some real progress.
Like everything, the point is to sell more bikes. But even people who are only in to ebikes don't seem to care about ebike racing. And why would they, it's a realy stupid competition.
