After all the fun of the last 3 weeks I felt it only reasonable we spent some time discussing what as been, what it means and where it leads us.
So your thoughts on the strongest riders
The hero's of the tour.
The disappointments.
The key stages.
And generally whatever else you want to talk about.
A few thoughts from Cycling Weekly to start us off:
An enthralling 2015 Tour de France ended with Chris Froome (Team Sky) claiming his second win in three years.It was a dominant performance by Froome and his team-mates, with its roots in two crucial stages. On stage two in the Netherlands, cross-winds shredded the peloton and gave Froome an early advantage of over many of his principal rivals, including Nairo Quintana (Movistar) and last year’s winner, Vincenzo Nibali (Astana).
Froome was in the yellow jersey by the end of stage three, after a huge crash forced leader Fabian Cancellara (Trek Factory Racing) out of the race. And although Sky’s leader surrendered yellow the following day to Tony Martin (Etixx-QuickStep), he was back in the lead by stage seven after Martin too was forced to withdraw.
The Tour de France was really won, however, as the race entered the Pyrenees. Stage 10 into La Pierre-Saint-Martin saw the first mountain-top finish, and a breathtaking performance from Froome. Almost all of his rivals, including Alberto Contador (Tinkoff-Saxo) and Nibali, were blown away, and the man in the yellow jersey emerged with a lead of almost three minutes in the general classification. Only Tejay van Garderen (BMC Racing) and Quintana remained as possible challengers.
From then on it was a case of defending his lead, and with support from Geraint Thomas and Richie Porte in particular, Froome never looked like losing it. Quintana pulled 30 seconds back on stage 19 into La Toussuire and attacked to force a nail-biting finish on Alpe d’Huez — but in the end Froome was just too strong. The eventual winning margin was 1-12 minutes over the Colombian climber.
Andre Greipel (Lotto-Soudal) was the race’s outstanding sprinter, winning his fourth stage of this year’s edition with a typically powerful effort on the Champs-Elysees, but the green jersey went to Peter Sagan (Tinkoff-Saxo). Sagan failed to win a stage but bagged an astonishing five second-place finishes.
The polka dot jersey was won by Froome, who became the first rider since Eddy Merckx to claim victory in both the general classification and the mountains competitions.
For me at least:
So your thoughts on the strongest riders - Froome, obviously but Griepel deserves a mention, great to see the Gorilla smashing out the victories
The hero's of the tour - GT, so strong, Adam Hansen, still riding those tours, Steve Cummings/ MTN-Qhubeka in general for the general feel good they gave
The disappointments - The French riders, somewhat inevitably, the crowd for their treatment of Sky/Froome
The key stages - Zeeland, the first week in general was awesome but Seeland stood out.
And generally whatever else you want to talk about - Sky were tactically awesome, rare to say that but they were, I also think they dealt with the questioning well.
I'll add more when I've had coffee.
Despite it being the tour where the first African wore polka dot, no one has mentioned it being the first tour an African has won it, Froome only being British for convenience sake after all
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rOcKeTdOg - Member
Despite it being the tour where the first African wore polka dot, no one has mentioned it being the first tour an African has won it, Froome only being British for convenience sake after all
Do keep up.
No-ones mentioned it as a first win, cos he won it in 2013...
And he's British....
Great TDF, Congrats to froome. GT was awesome, gutted for/about Cav.
Quintana for the win next year, if he gets his tactics right from the start.
So it wasn't the first wear in this tour then?
born in Kenya, educated in S.A. has British racing licence, I didn't realise he'd taken British citizenship too?
edit: in 2008 it seems, fair enough, next he'll be playing cricket for Yorkshire 😉
This year I have been mostly descending like/as Roman Bardet.
He's my fave. 😀
A good tour. I never thought I'd say this but I think it lacked a couple of sprint stages in the last 2 weeks to vary things up a bit. The revised points for the polka dot jersey didn't work well either IMO.
Good to see the Yates brothers continuing to make progress. Glad for Gesink as well, he's had a hard few years.
I though the French did okay, started badly but got some great stage wins to salvage things by the end.
So it wasn't the first wear in this tour then?
Is that even English?
Despite all the muttering about Froome's 'Britishness' (which I go along with) he has had a British passport from birth.
For me it wasn't the best tour ever. I like a good grand tour to have a mix of individual time trial and mountain top finishes in the key last week in the race to truly allow a variety of rider styles to battle it out. The stage 1 TT/prologue wasn't 'pure' enough to make a difference and neither was the TTT. A time trial between the Pyrenees and the Alps to allow a tester specialist to catchup or build a lead then watch them hang on up an alp as they are attacked by a pure climber as their advantage leaks away is always superb.
Highlights:
- Nairo's attack on the Alp. Would love the little columbian to win the whole thing at some point.
- Froome smacking everyone round the head on the first mountain stage. Yes Nairo was quicker overall in the mountains, but Froome put himself in a great tactical position that day
- Winning the STW fantasy TDF again for the 3rd time
- Gee
- The way Tony Martin finally got a well deserved yellow jersey...however ...
Lowlights:
- Tony Martin and Spartacus both pulling out whilst in Yellow.
- The sections of the crowd and the media flinging piss around (actual and metaphorical). Incredibly disappointing
- Sagan getting thwarted into Gap after riding so well
Most of the above are highlights for me but two extra ones:
- Steve Cummings blasting past Pinot and Bardet whilst they squabbled over who was going to ride first on a flat bit of road
- Sagan riding like a demon to thwart the ASO's attempts to thwart yet another green jersey win for him
Some incredible moments, I think I'll remember this Tour for the horrible images and absolute double hard man barsteward attitudes shown by Cancellara, Martin and Péraud, Péraud picking up bottles after losing a babies worth of skin was something else!!
Let's not forget the two young French hopes took decisive stage victories despite throwing one away arguing 😛
Highlight for me was the race into Gap- what an exciting day of racing. Sagan is proving to be a really exciting rider to watch on a variety of stages which is nice, you have a popular ride to look for on all sorts of stages rather than waiting to see Cav perform on a sprint stage, the GC guys to perform on a climbing day etc.
Disappointed that Quintana didn't win, and sad we didn't see more of Voeckler buggering around.
sad we didn't see more of Voeckler buggering around.
Given what's happening to Team Europcar it might be the last TdF he starts. He's 36 so unless FDJ or Cofidis want to give him a couple of victory laps, it might be retirement for Tommy
I think that if Movistar hadn't cocked up in the first week we would now be looking at a different winner
Highlights
- Froome winning - I'm desperately hoping he's clean along with the rest of Sky. Time will tell. I thought Sky got it spot on with their tactics and team
- Froome and Quintana's respectful rivalry - no need for bitching, personal attacks, etc, just knocking seven shade of shit out of eachother every day.
- AC and Nibali not winning - different reasons (beef, Astana) but I certainly would be have been putting them down as lows if they had won
- Cummings wins - not because he's a Brit but because the two riders who should have been on for the win deserved to be beaten for their on bike handbags
- Tony Martin winning on someone else's bike - a lesson in focussing on the goal and not bitching when things go wrong unlike some others...
Downers
- So many riders being injured, getting ill - it may not be worse than previous tours but it certainly seemed on a par with any of the tours I can recall
- Valverde being on the podium. He seems like a great personality and he's a brilliantly stylish racer but he's part of cycling's dark history and I'll be happier when he retires
- the media (mainly French) making what amounts to bitchy comments about Froome, Sky and then acting shy when confronted about it or denying that they meant what they clearly did. Paul Kimmage asked much the same questions and put a lot of noses out of joint (mainly on twitter) but I respect him for putting it out there and not hiding from it when questioned.
I think that if Movistar hadn't cocked up in the first week we would now be looking at a different winner
Impossible to tell. Sky may well have raced differently if they hadn't come into the last week with over 3 minutes lead
+1 on that - this kind of conjecture always comes up if it's remotely close and tactics and the pressure of defending yellow (and dealing with all the media obligations) mean it's impossible to say. Pretty sure most teams would race very differently depending on the circumstances.
Woohoo! great thread Sir.
Me? oh I've a few comments to add tot his 😀
So your thoughts on the strongest riders:
Bardet for being just brilliant in the mountains. It's been a good number of years that a French bloke has been able to stick it to the CG climbers of old and he's a stand out classy rider of some great pedigree. Only see him getting better and better and yes one day he will become the great French Climber.
Bargil, another great rider, warrant of a better placing and always stuck it out there to be chased down or blow up, another heart on the sleeve type that I so admire.
Sagan, pretty much in a class of his own, whilst in most of the breaks and out front hoovering up points, he has this licked and licked good. Try as they all might Sagan is a super class rider with a superb sense of humour and tactical brain to leave some experienced CG riders at a loss.
Thomas, what can I write that hasn't already been written. A man of super strong will and determination, tactically superb, worthy of yet more praise and showered with compliments yet humble. A man many French would love to have had in their squad.
Pierre Luc - Perichon, not one you'd expect to be out there in the breaks. And yes we all know, some of us know, that a break is pretty much doomed to failure in a blaze of whimper and good camera angles. But hey, this bloke, well this Team, have lightened up what it means to be French and out there fighting. I'm such an admirer of the Corinthian spirit of cycling that of all the Teams, these guys and this rider above all has it for me. Skill, determination, ability, will and no bother to him being pushed and bawled around in the bunch when it comes to Tour riding. I sincerely hope these guys get called back next year.
The hero's of the tour. DunDatUpDer^
The disappointments. Europcar, never quite made the break, never really made the pace and never quite had it. Was it the overhanging sponsorship demise, the general feeling of being outclassed? I dunno. Saving grace was Rolland, super classy and always up there at the pointy bit. I do hope he goes on to bigger Teams where his skills can be enhanced and catered for.
The key stages. None. I love the meandering nature of this event. They all offer so much for us and the riders that to pull out one would be, to me, disappointing. Each stage has it's own flavour, colour and emotions to contend with, each has it's own AmDram drama within a Grand Performance.
And generally whatever else you want to talk about. Ok, the French Press. Bunch of snidely pointy finger, baby crying whaaa whaa's who ever lived. Gotta love em', gotta loathe em'. Without them the world would be so much nicer and quieter and more respectful. But hey, this is the Tour and without a sour faced grumbling gallic shrug we'd all be here now just "hummming and ahhhhh'ing" to ourselves. What I particularly dislike about them however is their total lack of honour. Too many times have we seen and heard about Honour within this sport yet they have none. Even ex Pro's who should know better and keep their big gobs shut should stand back once in a while and take stock. Take stock of their own misdemeanours and che' che's before launching and insighting hatred within a bike race. Sadly we can not do without them and most have overnight changed their stance and attitudes towards Chris and Sky and yet I expected they would. Another year, another pointy finger pushed back inside the riding mitt, until next year perhaps.
Michael Rassmusen, quielty and unannounced he stepped into the frey once more, this time with a microphone under his skinny elbow. Of all the dopers and ex dopers and continuous dopers he, for me, is the most blatent and most obnoxious rider to have ever graced the Tour. Ok Ricco is up there too, but he's just too stupid a personality to mention, but I have so I've given him more air time 🙄 For some reason and I really don't know why Rasmussen just winds me right up. I still can not forget the day back then when he rode over the top of a mountain at such speed and at such a rate that I sat watching the TV thinking "awe shit, this boys on something" true enough he was. An yet now he's representing Dutch media. Ok, so by default he has insight to the ear of sophisticated drugs and has the knowledge of how and why, but who on earth will own up and talk openly to this guy now? Expecting candid interviews with questions set out by this guy surely leads to tight lipped answers, one way questions and singular verbs.
Bikes. Ok, some nice looking things with wheels on but nothing sparked my interest either in tech nor look. Ok, I love the Look 795 with some 40mm rims and tan walls on in Mondrian flavour but who doesn't? That specialised venge is so ugly even an ugly duckling would shit on it.
Can't think of anymore, if I do sure I'll be back to add more waffle.
Cheers lads, great support for the Tour on here this year, thanks to those that took the time to create the threads and thanks to those that supported with comments. As to those who tied to derail the threads with talk of drugs I thank CFH for creating a happy bin for them to play in. Hope the coloured balls amused you lot.
Ta ta
8)
I thought it was the best Tour for years, especially after last year's flop.
Sagan was awesome - he tried SO hard day after day for a stage win, I was willing him along on that descent. (I did think on a couple of occasions earlier on though, he spent too much time worrying about those on his wheel and threw away any chance of victory, but I guess he's realistic about his chances in that situation.)
Steve Cummings bouncing back to take the stage was unexpected and a real treat.
Pinot, Bardet & Geschke's wins were outstanding.
G is a top dude and destined for greatness & I was impressed with Richie Porte's efforts on the last couple of mountain stages, burying himself for Froome, when he's off to pastures new soon.
Quintana and Valverde working together to stick it to Sky. I was worried for a while, but by the time Sky had re-grouped a bit at the foot of the Alp, I reckoned Froome was just about safe as long as he didn't blow up massively.
I almost wanted Quintana to win, but I'll be happy for him to take next years!
The only thing that spoiled it for me was the behaviour of some of the crowds - booing, spitting at and hitting competitors is disgusting behaviour and not something you'd expect at a cycle race, regardless of what you think of an individual or team.
I honestly don't know why some people dislike Froome so much - he seems a decent guy and has worked hard to get to the top from pretty modest beginnings! I think he fully deserves his win.
The evidence of defending the lead against endless attacks was obvious in the last couple of mountain stages and Chris & G looked knackered. I would have thought that was enough to silence some of the doping allegations.
Looking forward to the Vuelta, again. 8)
My favourite moment has to be an old guy from the Wirral mugging two of France's finest within 1 km of the finish at Mende. Well done Cummings. I was almost in tears with him.
I don't follow the roadie press, does anyone know if any French authorities are trying to identify the guys that spat and threw piss on Froome, or are they not bothering? I'd have thought it would be pretty easy to identify both the spitters from the clear facial shots from the cameras. They need to be caught and named and shamed or everyone will be at it next year.
OK, I've now had coffee adn feel better able to think and drop a few random thoughts.
The route was cracking, it held interest until the last proper stage and also allowed teamwork to come into thereby adding an additional level of intrigue. A longer TT would have been good but it may have killed the last week so overall I think it was spot on, the first week was epic.
Sagan was awesome but never quite got the win, I feel for him and wonder if he/his team needs to re-evaluate what they use him for and how to get he best from him.
Valverde and Quintana showed how a joint leadership can work, both rode well and supported the other in a way, particularly on the last stage.
Cav did not have a good time, I'm sure he wasn't overly chuffed to drag himself over the mountains only to finish 5th in Paris. Is it time for him to start to rethink his role in the team?
Riders had bad days and I think this is good, Froome, Quintana, Bertie and Nibbles all had day(s) when they struggled, no longer do you have everyone at 100% every stage, I can only see this as a good thing.
Do you think that Ryder Hesjedal would LOVE a 4 week tour? Every time he gets stronger the longer the racing goes on, maybe he needs to be racing every day for the 2 weeks leading up to the next GT?
And finally, The Vuelta looks tasty doesn't it?
I hadn't realised Quintana was only 25 years of age. Reckon he'll be one to watch in future tours.
Has a Columbian won the tour yet?
does anyone know if any French authorities are trying to identify the guys that spat and threw piss on Froome, or are they not bothering?
Well it could be a pretty much impossible task given they don't have any clear photo of the person's face (although some side on ones I think), they could be from any country and indeed could already have left France. I think given how hard it'd be to find them and then, subsequently prosecute them, I'd imagine they're trying to deprive them of any attention. Could be wrong tho.
Cav did not have a good time, I'm sure he wasn't overly chuffed to drag himself over the mountains only to finish 5th in Paris. Is it time for him to start to rethink his role in the team?
TBH I think he must be seeing a hard negotiation with whatever team hires him next. He's had a fairly low-key tour and early season. Without smashing some races towards the end of the year, his stock will be quite low I'd imagine. Can't see Lefevre wanting to spank out 3M euros a year for a repeat of 2015.
Has a Columbian won the tour yet?
Nope but it's only a matter of time before he does. Whilst I wanted Froome to win, i would not have been too disappointed if Qunitana had.
My favourite moment has to be an old guy from the Wirral mugging two of France's finest within 1 km of the finish at Mende. Well done Cummings.
Ditto - the only time I was shouting at the telly
Lots of kudos to Sky for executing a well-worked plan, smart riding in the first half, brave defence in the second. It's just a pity that so many people jumped to wrong conclusions after the first stage in the pyrenees - that the tour was over and that sky were so dominant it had to be suspicious. Mind you, I sure some people will be convinced Sky's problems on the last two days were stage managed!
You always feels slightly bereft when the tour finishes, but ITV has lined up the perfect replacement in BBQ chimp 😕
Mind you, I sure some people will be convinced Sky's problems on the last two days were stage managed!
[cynic]Or with all the attention they were getting they were unable to get their blood bags through to the team hotel and the other teams were?[/cynic]
That's not cynical, that's just being a tit.
that's just being a tit.
In what way? Only a fool would not have at least a bit of cynicism about the sport for at least a generation. That doesn't mean I don't enjoy it - but I see it for what it is.
Bardet's descending.
He just seemed to be in another league.
Great thread. For me, one of the real highlights was that the first week didn't feel like a parade. The cobbles, zealand, the Mur de Huy and Brittany enhanced the racing without overshadowing the sprinters.
Agree with BikeBouy's comments on the press. For me this is going to be a big battle over the next few years to prevent the last generation dragging the sport down with invective and innuendo.
Thanks to everyone who contributed to the daily threads, thanks particularly to Mike and Lunge who did most of the work. Thanks also to RealMan for introducing this most excellent of STW traditions.
FWiW, I believe TS are "clean" but there's already a "doping" thread on this forum.
😉
Thanks to everyone who contributed to the daily threads, thanks particularly to Mike and Lunge who did most of the work. Thanks also to RealMan for introducing this most excellent of STW traditions.
+1 Great reading
but there's already a "doping" thread on this forum.
Just the one 😉
I know, it's been done to death a million times already so there's is little point in doing it again. Having said that I've still fond memories of watching the 'dirty' era tours - irrespective of what they were on as a spectator event they were still good watching.
Sorry to say but it has all just got a bit dull for me. Since Sky came along gone are the days of the leader changing everyday. Sky's tactics are just to good at controlling the race and the other teams just haven't worked out how to change yet. It's is getting to much like formula 1 where who ever has the pole ends up winning. With TDF if Sky have the yellow at the end of the first week then the race is almost over.
I have always thought it stupid that they don't challenge the Yellow jersey on the last day and it showed perfectly yesterday. With Froome having to stop and change his bike when the bag got caught in his rear wheel, this could have been a perfect to produce a really chase and thrilling end stage.
I really don't understand why the other teams are struggling with Sky so much. Its not like they have a whole team packed with the best riders
Brilliant tour - so much happened and so many twists. From the yellow jersey poison chalice for both Martin and Cancellara, at the start, to Froomes attack in the pyrenees, Cummings win and the epic battles in the Alps. And not forgetting the Sagen will he, wont he win a stage Saga!
Good to see the etiquette in the sport yesterday with all of the jerseys surrounding the race organisers car to agree to neutralize after all the crashes in the womens race (and I personally dont agree with Nibali's attack when Froome had that mechanical).
Mind you, I sure some people will be convinced Sky's problems on the last two days were stage managed!
Yeah the Tour De France facebook page was full of similar suggestions in French 🙄 🙁
Feel a bit of a come down now. Especially given the news is starting to fill with Wendyball stories 🙁 Bring on the Vuelta 🙂
Watching Sagans descending was pretty entertaining in a heart-in-mouth way. Cobblers like watermelons 😯
I have always thought it stupid that they don't challenge the Yellow jersey on the last day and it showed perfectly yesterday.
I've always thought that even if they could challenge it, the result would be unchanged. Think of it as a flat, sprinters stage, you'd get a breakaway up the road featuring someone from Europcar, they'd get about 5 minutes then the sprint teams guys would real them in with around 2km to go and we'd get a sprint finish. No way would a GC rider get away in the break or would be able to get any kind of time even if they wanted to. All it would do is give the same outcome for the day but with a pile of added stress for all concerned.
Even yesterday with Froome's bike change, he'd have been paced back into the group and lost no time at all.
I have always thought it stupid that they don't challenge the Yellow jersey on the last day and it showed perfectly yesterday. With Froome having to stop and change his bike when the bag got caught in his rear wheel, this could have been a perfect to produce a really chase and thrilling end stage.
It makes sense to me - they've been trying to smash each other for 3 weeks. Having the last stage as a bit of celebration and parade is a really nice thing. I'd hate to see the leader (whoever it is) lose on the last day because of a bag getting stuck in the wheel.
I have always thought it stupid that they don't challenge the Yellow jersey on the last day and it showed perfectly yesterday. With Froome having to stop and change his bike when the bag got caught in his rear wheel, this could have been a perfect to produce a really chase and thrilling end stage.
You'd rather a three week tour was decided by litter than by tactics?
Sagan, pretty much in a class of his own, whilst in most of the breaks and out front hoovering up points, he has this licked and licked good. Try as they all might Sagan is a super class rider with a superb sense of humour and tactical brain to leave some experienced CG riders at a loss.
While I agree with most of this, the bit I'm far from convinced by is the "tactical brain" bit. I know I was in a minority when I voiced this on one the early stage threads, but imho it's the racecraft that has led him to so many second places on stages that, if it was purely down to legs, he could have won.
The epitome for me was one day when he was ideally situated in a successful break, someone went off the front within the last km or so, Sagan sat up and looked round his little group, seeing who was going to lead the chase down, eventually realising that the answer was "nobody, if you want him you're gonna have to chase him yourself Peter" and then off he goes, far too late, and does another fabulous sprint finish into second place iirc.
I'm also struck by the number of post-stage interviews where Sagan himself seemed to acknowledge that the principal reason he'd failed to win yet another stage he was more than capable of taking was that he'd gone at the wrong moment / not gone at the moment he should have.
To be fair, though, he did win the jersey, so hardly an unsuccessful tour. I'm not at all clear whether that is the measure of success he was looking for - is he satisfied with green or would be more / less happy if he's taken a stage or two, but not won green?
Dunno, given that he came in saying he was there to ride for Bertie and any points or stages he picked up along the way would be a bonus, he may not even know the answer to that one himself. It seemed as though he ended up with a lot more freedom that he'd expected to, since Bertie never really put himself into many positions where Sagan (and the rest) could do much for him?
For such an acclaimed rider who everyone seems to rate so highly, perhaps his biggest tactical blunder was contractual, in putting himself into a team where at worst he'd be riding for someone else, and at best his team mates wouldn't be riding for him due to other team priorities. Reminds me a lot of Cavendish's situation at Team Sky in 2012, where he might have taken a lot more if the team had been more available to him than they were.
@woody74
Team Sky's tactics are no different from other teams trying to protect the yellow jersey (see CSC/Saxo, Astana, US Postal, Once, et al) the only difference is the implementation which sky have done very well.
What Sky has brought about is teams having to be clever how they attack it which has brought about some brilliant racing. Movistar riding off as a team last year, attacks on the first climbs to break the sky train etc.
The stages are now contested from the beginning rather than waiting for the final climb
and it showed perfectly yesterday
Really? Clearly watching different footage to me.
You could have repeated that stage a 1000 times and barring accident the GC lead would not have changed hands irrespective of any attack at any time by any of the GC contenders.
edlong - I'm sure he's crying non-stop all the way to the bank 😉 That's why he signed for Tikoff afterall...
the only difference is the implementation which sky have done very well.
In some respects the thing which has been most notable this tour is how disorganised the other teams have been by comparison. It's crazy how little protection Quintana and Contador had at times.
Personally I think it was fair of Nibbles to attack Froome when he did - there's little enough attacking as it is. Ridden through some sticky tar and picked up a stone - trying looking at the road ahead and not at your stem ! Likewise with punctures and mechanicals - how much of that is bad luck, how much down to trying to get marginal gains through your equipment? OK it's different if spectators or vandals are involved.
However greasy cobbles on the Champs is not the place to decide the race, so neutralizing it yesterday was a reasonable call.
I really don't understand why the other teams are struggling with Sky so much. Its not like they have a whole team packed with the best riders
I thought this years Sky team was the strongest they had fielded, which meant they could both keep high pace at the start and then have a number of riders to rotate as cover for Froome in the climbs.
Yeah. I'm probably starting to wish Sagan won more stages.
I feel he's a good prospect for the future. But I also feels he needs a different team structure around him.
Who knows?
For such an acclaimed rider who everyone seems to rate so highly, perhaps his biggest tactical blunder was contractual, in putting himself into a team where at worst he'd be riding for someone else, and at best his team mates wouldn't be riding for him due to other team priorities. Reminds me a lot of Cavendish's situation at Team Sky in 2012, where he might have taken a lot more if the team had been more available to him than they were.
True if you only look at Grand Tours but that's missing the point of the move, which was to win big in the Spring Classics, during which he was the undisputed leader with a strong team at his disposal. TdF and the green jersey is a bit of a consolation prize this year.
It's a race so they should race right up to the last day. Why do we need a celebration and parade on the last day, the TDF is each and every year. Personally I think mechanical issues are just part of it like crashes and bad weather. All of these things make the race more exciting. In downhill you don't get competitors saying,"Oh his chain broke so we should all go again to make it fair and just about skill and fitness".
None of the other teams seem to be able to get close to dominating like Sky do and this can be seen the huge time differences. TDF needs to get back to winning by seconds and one day the leader being smashed to bits and then for him to come back fitting the next day. Granted this happened far more in the days of doping but it made the race so much better.
Watched all of the last week and of course enjoyed it but really we all knew it was a done deal and Froome was going to win. When you are 90% certain who is going to win it just becomes a bit dull.
He'd have gone to a Belgian team if he was that serious about winning the classics. He went to Tinkoff for the money.
TDF needs to get back to winning by seconds and one day the leader being smashed to bits and then for him to come back fitting the next day. Granted this happened far more in the days of doping but it made the race so much better.
You realise this is the tenth closest tour de france in history?
In what way? Only a fool would not have at least a bit of cynicism about the sport for at least a generation. That doesn't mean I don't enjoy it - but I see it for what it is.
Cynicism is one thing, but that's just a completely unfounded suggestion, and with the goings-on of the last three weeks I may have got slightly unwarrentedly hot under the collar about it. 🙂 There's no evidence other than history and matey-boy Sallet's scribbling on the back of a fag packet to suggest anything untoward has happened, you've got people like Davids Millar and Walsh saying they think he's clean, his build and performance are suggestive of a clean rider - I just get a bit vexed at the allegations. Maybe allegations are too strong a word - more "suggestions". I guess we'll find out one way or the other, but otherwise there's nothing to see, as far as I can tell.
He'd have gone to a Belgian team if he was that serious about winning the classics. He went to Tinkoff for the money.
Hard to argue with that! Though I think Oleg was serious about wanting to win in the classics, be interesting to see if he sticks with Sagan and builds a classics team around him.
the leader being smashed to bits and then for him to come back fitting the next day. Granted this happened far more in the days of doping but it made the race so much better.
I'm guessing you mean fighting not fitting - that would be different!
Pretty sure this only happened/happens with chemical assistance. But as you say, it made compelling viewing. Floyd Landis' return from the dead after a little testosterone pick me up was brilliant to watch at the time.
Sagan is still only 24 years of age, IIRC, quite young.
Does anyone feel he could contest GC, one day?
The Boston Globe pictures seem not linked this year within STW. Let me remedy that this year
[url= https://www.bostonglobe.com/news/bigpicture/2015/07/17/following-tour-france/1SzKtdZRGGQDJe9br247xK/story.html?p1=BP_SeePhotos ]Boston Globe[/url]
Does anyone feel he could contest GC, one day?
No chance. Not unless doping makes a major resurgence...
Highlights for me:
++ Froome winning both the MJ and KoM
+ Steve Cummings racing past two squabbling Frenchies to win a stage
+ Cav finally getting his act together to win a stage
+ Fabien Cancellara sprinting to get yellow
- Fabien Cancellara crashing out of yellow
+ Tony Martin breakaway to get yellow
- Tony Martin crashing out of yellow
+ Close run TTT
- Contador fatigued from Giro win
- Nibali not having his head together in first two weeks
+ TvG and BMC quietly up there for the first half of the Tour
- TvG succumbing to illness and pulling out
+ The Tour course mixing it up and not just tons of boring sprint stages
+ Amazing death-defying descents
+ Peter Sagan's antics
- Peter Sagan not winning at least one stage
+ The climax on l'Alpe d'Huez
+ Nairo Quintana's quiet determination
+ ITV4's blanket live coverage and highlights programs
+ Chris Froome's dogged detrmination and dignity in the face of
--- Unfounded accusations and speculation from the French press particularly people like Lauren Jalabert who is a dirty drug cheat himself. This lead to unwarrented vitriol from certain spectators which no-one should have to be subject to not even the several already convicted drug cheats in the peloton. The French people should be ashamed that it has been allowed to taint their great annual spectacle.
All-in-all though a great Tour, probably the best in my living memory.
p.s.
Quintana's going to find it a lot harder to challenge Froome next year as well because the individual time trial will almost certainly make a return and there will probably be less mountain stages as well.
Wood74 you need to get the rose tinted glasses off.
the huge time differences. TDF needs to get back to winning by seconds
4 out of the 10 smallest winning margins have come since 2006. 2006, 2007, 2008 & 2015. Have a look at the winning margins of the likes Indurain, Hinualt & Merckx!!
A couple of more points I'd like to chirp in with.
True enough on occasion Sagan did falter at the last moment, but I reckon he'd achieved all his targets by then and whilst a stage win would have been nice, not overly crucial when 4 years of Green Jerseys are the real goals.. clearly IMO. Tactically, nope I think he's a smart and astute rider, knows where and when to place himself for the good and how to react when needed. Supporting Bertie did hamper him I feel and would have taken the shine of those breaks he had when the shouting in his right ear ensued he backed off then 20k's form the finish got told to hack on.. If only Tinkoff would let the bloke ride and use his brains more and shut up blerting on about him.. Tactically, he chose a team that gave him options for Green and £'000000's.. Can't really say the bloke hasn't got his head screwed on can you.
Biggest disappointment overall for me, and it's tempered somewhat by the fact that accidents took out a few riders was Trek. Now I know all about the heady days of years gone by and Voght and the Slekkies, but really? a team backed by a huge brand only offering up Jungles and Mollema? Cav ought to sign for them, they could do with his get up and go IMO.. and let Etixx sit up a bit and rest on an ageing Belgian (even though I do still love him) whose now cursed with lack of ability and injury.. Yup Boonan.
Oleg seems to be backing Sagan to the hilt now, so I reckon he'll be keen to keep him.
I don't have time for an essay sadly, but my bulletpoints...
Heroes - Sagan, Geraint (its unseemly to call him G apparently), Cummings, Bardet, Tony MArtin and the Colombian dude who tried to follow Sagan down that descent.
Anti-heroes - Barguil, Valverde, Nibali.
No villains really.
Damp squibs - Garmin Cannondale, Contador, Cav a bit TBH.
Best stages - The Belgian (and Dutch?) ones with short punchy climbs at the end and the final two mountain stages. But they were all good in their way. Kudos to the course designer for cutting out the flat sprint stages.
Anti-heroes - Barguil, Valverde, Nibali.
I get Valverde and Nibali but why Barguil? Just curious as he seems to be held in high regard
Sagan is still only 24 years of age, quite young.Does anyone feel he could contest GC, one day?
I'd love him to, but could he do it in the proper high mountains, day after day? Not now, but if he targetted it, could he change his physique? Very possibly, but in doing so, he'd doubtless lose something else - Sagan the climber, but no longer the sprinter?
I think he's showed enough "jack of all trades" potential that it's not a silly question, but whether he'd ever make the top of the top is hard to know until / unless he tries it - he might be next Froome, Merckx or Indurain (hopefully clean though) or he might be the next Tejay van Garderen, pretty much as good as everyone else, but ever so slightly not quite..
As a big Sagan fan, I spent a LOT of time shouting at the telly this year, mainly "Go! Go now! For pity's sake LAUNCH!!!"
I get Valverde and Nibali but why Barguil?
There was a small "racing incident" with Geraint thomas you may remember which he's copped a bit of flack for.
I get Valverde and Nibali but why Barguil?
Riding like a **** (but an exciting ****) and taking Geraint Thomas out.
I agree, he's my favourite of the Frenchies because he;s so aggressive.
Yes. Geraint has certainly earned a mention in dispatches.
I hope he gets his chance.
Oleg seems to be backing Sagan to the hilt now, so I reckon he'll be keen to keep him.
Maybe today. Tomorrow who knows with Oleg! 😕
What could I add to much of the above, nothing really other than. Had Quintana down for the win overall but am pleased that Froome and Sky won it, they worked for it and were not nearly so dominant as has been portrayed by some. Movistar to me were an awesome team and really could have won. Given that Valverde rides for them perhaps its better a Quintana win was not tarnished by him, though Valverde on the podium was a shame.
Am sad its all over.
Excellent tour overall. Agree with the itemisation above by forzaf.
Very good coverage by ITV4, I particularly enjoyed the feature/voiceovers by David Millar. Importantly they don't overdo the emotional musical montage like the BBC these days.
Froome a worthy winner, I'd like to see a non-Sky winner next year, Quintana in particular, or Romain Bardet, who has the most "classic" bike riding style you'll ever see.
Until next year!
I know what you mean about Oleg Mrblobby, but he does seem to appreciate Sagan for his commercial potential as well as his performance.
And while he might be a bit of a sociopath, I get the impression Tinkoff is a capable businessman.
Very good coverage by ITV4
I did have the misfortune to have to listen to some of the Sherwin and Ligget commentary the other day for the first time in years... good god it's awful, even worse than I ever remembered it being. Cliche ridden patronising drivel. Such a shame Ligget didn't quit as promised when Armstrong confessed 🙁
I watched the live stuff on Eurosport and flicked over to ITV for the punditry.
It's a poor state of affairs when Carlton Cole is the preferred option. Can someone please put David Harmon with David Millar
Reading between the thinly veiled lines, ITV are in a contract to use NBC commentary (Sherwin and Ligget) and would rather not, but it would cost them too much to do their own
That's my understanding too, the Yanks want Phil and Paul so we are lumbered with them.
I just zone them out and watch what's happening instead, the pictures and graphics are usually excellent.
I quite like ITV4's punditry team, especially Boardman's dry pronouncments and Matt Rendell doorstepping Jalabert was gold.
Mainly watched the highlights, did you get more than five seconds of Jens Voght in the live broadcasts?
Personally I think mechanical issues are just part of it like crashes and bad weather. All of these things make the race more exciting.
Actually I think they ought to use James Bond Aston Martin DB5's as Team Cars. That would liven things up a bit. I also think that each team should have a nominated domestique who is authorised to attack other team leaders in the way that Barguil took out Thomas. Much more interesting. 🙄
On the commentary / punditry side, I enjoyed Jens Voight's contributions a great deal this year. It reminded me of how he rode the tour - whatever the situation was on the road, when Jensie was asked what he thought someone should do at that point, the answer was always along the lines of "Put it all in and go for the win!"
blah blah 17th century chateux blah blah former mountain biker blah blah chris porte blah blah saxo quickstep blah blah
actually I prefer them to Eurosport
Needs more Jens
[quote=forzafkawi]The French people should be ashamed that it has been allowed to taint their great annual spectacle.
As an actual "French people" I feel ashamed for the human race, not France. Idiots exist in all countries (and we know that one of the idiots spitting at Froome was likely to be Dutch) and I will put odds on that if it had been a non-British team leading the GC with their non-British GC leader, the British press would hardly have been a serene haven of tranquility. Froome was mauled in the British press over the spat with Wiggins (caused partly by their better halves then prolonged by Wiggins refusing to pay Froome his share of the winnings).
On a not totally unrelated note, is there any danger of Liggett and Sherwen ****ing off yet? Not only are they solid-gold doping apologists but they can't even see a rider being knocked off his bike by a motorbike when the incident is replayed 3 times.