A bit late to the party but better late than never. So I am used to tarmac and exhibit the typical roadie lack of skill off road. My gravel bike is quite good off road (Cannondale Slate) with a bit of front suspension and 42mm 650B but it has its limits.
So I want a mountain bike not to ride trail centres for longer off road rides for instance the Mount Keen loop I did last weekend on a borrowed bike or the Burma road or the Cairngorm loop (it’s on my wish list).
I have ordered a Canyon Exceed but is that the right bike for me? It’s light which will be great on the climbs. The tyres are 2.3 inch wide 29ers. Fork is 100mm travel no bouncy bits on the rear. Would I be better on wider tyres? Clearance on the Exceed is 2.4 inch some folk say 2.6 inch tyres are the sweet spot for the rougher stuff.
Looking at the chunkier hard tails with bigger tyres they all seem to be around the 13kg mark. The Canyon is 10.6kg. Am I making a mistake buying the Canyon?
Haven't got a clue where you ride or the bikes you have looked at but my guess is that the heavier bikes are hardcore ht bikes and although fine for most riding they excel at harder riding
If your rides are tamer xc trail type rides I wouldn't worry too much.a hardcore ht bike have slacker angles.
I think being a roadie you’re focused on weight maybe a little too much which is understandable! By the sounds of what you want to ride it’s definitely a hard tail you want. I’d be mostly thinking about how it climbs and is it comfortable and good at riding distances.
You will be fine on a HT.
You will be fine on that width of tyre. You may want something with more chunky tread in the winter.
An Exceed is light, nippy and flighty - and fun because of that.
Don't get sucked into the whole 'you can't ride that without an Enduro 150mm+ FS of LLS geometry'.
I ride everything from local woods, to trail centres, big days and Munro's on a HT with narrower tyres than yours.
I'm sure other bikes would be quicker on some parts (arguably less involving) but on other parts I fly comparatively. My middle son, 15, used to 150mm FE Enduro bike rode my HT a few weeks back and loved the light weight, the acceleration and he noticed how more composed when manualing and moving the bike around.
I think being a roadie you’re focused on weight
Agree with this, weight really doesn't matter that much I have done over 100k on my steel HT 29er which im gonna bet weights a lot more than 13kg. For off road cycling I would want more than 2.3 especially if you're gonna be running narrow rims.
Given that all I know about the mount keen loop is that trail forks has it as a blue run I think the canyon will be fine. As a roadie / cx rider I recently bought one of their cheaper al hardtails for Surrey hills etc - great bike really pleased with it
Most important attribute of an MTB, especially for a newbie is "do I feel safe", therefore stability is key.
A colleague at work was in your position, and I 'pushed' him towards a Sonder Transmitter. He loves it and as he said so different to his road & CX bikes.
Before you buy a bike, go on a training day and odds on you've bought a bike too small.
And FWIW I did the Cairngorm loop last year on my Gravel Bike, pretty much any HT MTB would get you around. A short travel full suss would be even nicer, but there's a cost to these.
Given that all I know about the mount keen loop is that trail forks has it as a blue run I think the canyon will be fine.
REALLY!!! I mean it's not necessarily the most technically challenging ride but the exposure alone (it is a munro and you'd normally be climbing from one glen to another and back again) makes me think that that is dangerously low.
Back to the OP well we all used to ride that stuff on HTs and narrower tyres than that but there is a reason that most people ride FS now! You will be able to ride it but like others have said don't get fixated on weight.
@gonefishin - trailforks ratings are both focussed on technicality of riding and user influenced/generated. This causes so many anomalies.
If you're not racing I'd generally suggest something a little more "trail bike" than the Exceed (it's even kind-of got "XC" in the name).
However, if what you really want is to do slightly rougher gravel riding, it might be just perfect.
Geometry doesn't weigh anything, so a slightly slacker bike, perhaps with a 120mm fork, could feel more confident if you do tackle moderately technical trails (especially as a newbie).
In road bike terms, you're buying a race bike - but maybe an endurance bike would be more versatile without really slowing you down. However, you definitely don't want a Dawes Galaxy (which is the enduro bike in this stretched metaphor).
Interesting. I ride a chunky LLS hard tail (2.8btyres) and a modern trail FS (2.35 because it's a couple of years old so missed the latest fad). Both are great, amazing machines compared to the 90s stuff I started with.
However, sometimes I miss the raw speed and acceleration of those old bikes (although they didn't go round corners at all well) and I look at bikes like a Canyon Exceed with envious eyes.
They're all different - the FS is great for bumpy steep stuff, the hardcore HT is amazing for forest blasting but if I'm racking up miles off road or just want pure speed, sometimes a lighter faster bike (like they were in the 90s and had near road bike geometry) would just be more fun.
But, all of these bikes can ride all of these things. And what's more they're all good fun even when they're away from their natural habitat. You've probably picked the right one to transition with, the sluggishness of heavier machines might put you off before you learn how to get the best out of them.
Just don't be surprised if you find yourself expanding your collection in years to come!
OK, I'd like to add, Welcome 🙂
It's not really a big deal though, it's all just bikes really.
Alex
Also, 2.3in or 2.4in tyres will be totally fine - and will feel amazing to you coming from a gravel bike.
In my opinion, a lightweight FS XC bike would be better than a hardtail for you. Main reason being that there's not a whole lot of difference between a gravel bike and a hardtail. Also, not sure how old you are but I found that the comfort of a FS was much more appreciated once I was out of my 30s. Weight is also important to me (I hate the sensation of dragging a tank around) but there are plenty of lightweight XC FS bikes around, if your budget allows carbon.
Actually, as an ex-MTBer now full time roadie/gravelist/CXer, I'd be looking at full suss! The thing that puts me off getting back into MTB most is the jarring and clattering, I never developed the skills to truly ride the rough stuff smooth, and I hate the feeling now of pedalling getting disrupted and jarring through the saddle (possibly to do with history of lower back injuries!).
Anyway, I'd be looking at sort of 'all day' full susser, or if nothing else be sticking a suspension seatpost on my hardtail, I have one on my gravel bike and it's comical how hard you can keep pedalling over lumpy terrain.
As an aside...
Burma Road
Dovebiker and I rode this on our gravel bikes recently, I would almost suggest they are the best thing for the job unless you were looking to do one of the big singletrack descents. We just did the standard loop up and over and back to Carrbridge (then on to Aviemore via the Sluggan Pass and the Glen More logging track). I'd say as a neatly packaged gravel loop it's almost perfect!
You have to spend a lot of money to get a decent light FS whereas you can get a light HT for a modest sum.
Given how MTB can be so variable in what it is to different people, its difficult to say what you should and shouldn't get.
Seasoned mtbers also forget they have years of experience and a mindset that allows them to enjoy terrain on bikes that others would not. I was reminded of this recently watching my wife and daughter fall off their bikes riding UP a slightly stony doubletrack that I dont even bat an eyelid about.
As a someone just getting into mtb from a roadie background I can only guess that you're focussed on bike weight and how far you can go. The bike you've selected will be fine for that, but will have limitations if you decide you'd like to push into more difficult terrain and technical features.
How far you can go with a given bike in technical terrain is a combination of the rider and the machine. The ratio will change as you progress your skills until you start wishing the bike had certain characteristics for what you want to do with it.
Until then, crack on!
I’d echo inthborders and say stability is really important. One of my son’s mates got an exceed this summer and we were all impressed with its light weight but there is no getting away from it’s Xc race intentions... a bike with a slacker head angle and longer front centre is harder to crash... we went over the bars a lot in the 90s on those lightweight twitchy road bike derived early mtbs. I have the scars to prove it.
I would say that whatever you get, fit a dropper (looks like some of the top end exceeds come with one) as the ability to move around on technical stuff can be the difference between riding a section or getting off (either intentionally or not!)
But, it is all bikes and bikes are ace so you will be fine I’m sure
Aye true, but as a roadie I'd be taking a heavier (within reason) full suss that I could keep the power down more smoothly than a hardtail that I'd be getting bashed around on.
If you're a long term roadie coming to MTB I would recommend an XC race bike, which is what you've bought. The riding position will be similar; the weight and responsiveness more like what you're used to; and the whole vibe will be more suited.
Being a roadie is all about putting effort in and getting rewarded with speed, XC bikes are best for this. Most other MTBs are compromised on that to a greater or lesser extent for the benefit of having more fun on downhill technical sections, which is not likely to be something a true roadie is going to get into, at least not straight away. And it may put you off.
As for FS/XC - I think a lot of roadies would be put off by the lack of positivity, the squish, and the boinging whilst standing. Ok so it's not that bad these days but it's still definitely there. I don't mean pedal feedback, I mean the fact that the frame's not rigid.
How far you can go with a given bike in technical terrain is a combination of the rider and the machine. The ratio will change as you progress your skills until you start wishing the bike had certain characteristics for what you want to do with it.
Until then, crack on!
I would agree with this, from my experience coming from road to mtb, I started with a 2nd hand HT, a year later I bought a new XC full suss bike and as I developed I realised the bike was limiting me, so changed to a really good FS trail bike after a couple of years (and a visit to Morzine) on that I also got myself a DH bike, which now gets used far more than the trail bike.
The first new mtb I bought (Scott Spark 910) I was totally swayed by the light weight, whereas by the time I bought the trail bike I'd realised weight isn't everything......
we went over the bars a lot in the 90s on those lightweight twitchy road bike derived early mtbs.
Yeah but that Canyon Exceed is nothing like those bikes. Bigger wheels, longer wheelbase, long reach and the HA whilst steep now is slack compared to what we rode then.
Agree, the Exceed would be the perfect bike and wouldn't mind one myself.
Another way of looking at it is that as you get more confident you may wish to ride more challenging terrain and wished youd got something heavier and slacker.this as a newbie may also give you more confidence from the off
Yeah but that Canyon Exceed is nothing like those bikes. Bigger wheels, longer wheelbase, long reach and the HA whilst steep now is slack compared to what we rode then.
+1
All things are relative.
I have watched a (skilled rider) take a 29er 100mm travel carbon HT down all the local trails here faster than most on FS, including seriously muddy and rocky drops, 15' gaps and more. Modern bikes are soooo good now, let us not forget that.
An Exceed is a good 'intro' for a road based rider, it can be changed in future as skills and knowledge of what riding the OP enjoys most.
I've just taken a look at the Exceed.
If I was racing, brill - in 2007 I bought a Giant XTC, and this just looks like an updated version.
For trail riding, nope.
Ug, trail geometry for long landrover track approaches to hills? Sounds hard work. I still think for what the OP is talking about that faster geometry would be better.
There's some technical rocky stuff on the Cairngorms loop, but I've ridden some of it on a gravel bike and it's slow enough (e.g. not downhill) that the steep geometry was probably more help than hindrance. I think a lot of the other tech stuff on the Cairngorms loop is borderline unrideable anyway so not sure if having a big trail plougher is going to be much help.
I’m a roadie who mountain bikes. I ride mountain bikes with roadies regularly. We all come from a long time of riding road, I started “proper” mountain biking about 6 years ago. Some of my roadie friends only this year.
Every one of the guys has adapted differently. One of them is now racing as an Expert in XC and that’s after only a few years of riding. He started on an Exceed but now has the new Trek Uber light full sus.
I generally ride a full sus trail bike but I also have a fairly light but cheapish hardtail XC bike. For long days out with the fast guys I prefer the hardtail, it just climbs so much easier. There is a world of difference between an 11kg hardtail and a 15kg full sus.
Going out with genuine mountain biking friends and it’s the full sus without a shadow of doubt!
As I’ve got more confident on the trails I am thinking of getting a more hardcore hardtail and getting rid of my XC hardtail and my full sus. I do find the full sus a bit too much hard work at times. (It’s only a Trek Fuel Ex 8 from 2018, but it is just makes long or very steep climbs so much harder than my hardtail)
I know exactly what you're going through as I went through it a year or so back. The Exceed looks like a great XC bike and will be rapid around the estate tracks in the highlands, local places like Countesswells etc, and rapid on some of the Fungle single track. It'll be much harder work on some of the harder steeper Highlands stuff - Think rock steps/drop though.
However, you're in a good place by, unlike me, not being sucked straight into the Long Low Slack 650b Plus world. I bought a Whyte 905, and although it's brilliant when it gets steep going down, long days are a Draaaaag, especially on forest flattish flowing single track, it just drags it's fat arse/tyres around, catches its pedals on every rock thanks to low BB. It also climbs like a dog. If you're used to the speed of road and gravel bikes and like fast flowing XC, these bikes aren't for you!
Some of the new - ahem - downcountry bikes might also fit your needs - the new Pipedream Sirrus and Merida's on the homepage being but 2!
I'm in Aberdeen too, so depending on how tall you are (I'm 6ft 2), if you want to try the difference between your XC and my Trail hardtail, just from me a message!
I've made this transition myself: road -> cx -> xc hardtail -> [trail hardtail + full suss trail bike]
It can be a slippery slope. But for what you propose to do right now, xc hardtail seems perfect. We'll await your "what enduro race bike" thread in about 2023.
Dont fixate on weight, any mtb will feel heavy and sluggish compared to a road bike.
I see some but not all the exceeds come with a short travel dropper post. If yours doesn't, get one. A road background will mean you are really well trained for pedalling with the seat at proper pedalling height, and probably are terrible at pedalling with the seat dropped even a little. The "compromise" saddle height that some people use will likely feel awful to you, so the ability to drop the seat for descending is very useful.
2.3 tyres will be fine, tubeless with mid 20s psi if you are an average weight bloke. For winter there are XC mud tyres such as the Bontrager mud X; a modern enduro mud tyre like a maxxis shorty will be horribly draggy for your proposed trips.
I think it'll be great. I had a carbon XTC once, it made for a fab trail bike once I'd put a dropper on and some decent tyres. Only reason I sold it was because too stiff for me after 4+ hours of riding. A mate also has an Exceed, great fast bike.
Plenty of sense in this thread. FWIW my tuppence is I'd dump the grav bike (or at least turn it into a winter road bike/touring bike) and get a really nice XC HT. They are hardly slower on the road but infinitely more fun and capable off it than grav bikes. I've got all the bikes but it's the XC HT that would be the one in the garage if I had to choose just one.
Yes, the more you get into riding off road the more you'll fancy an FS, but they are a bit more faff and more limiting water and luggage-wise generally.
Have to say age is more important than weight. Seems once you get on, a fall you dont seem to bounce back up and usually hit the ground like a sack of coal.
In true single track tradition I’d recommend the hardtail I have : a Santa Cruz chameleon. Not too lls but rides brilliantly. The exceed is too race for what you want imho.
I went from MTB -> roadie and have recently just started riding MTB again. I don't regret getting an XC hardtail one bit - it was basically to make some of the stuff that's a chore on the gravel bike more fun to ride.
I'm really pleased I got a dropper post on it. It took maybe 2 rides to remember it's there and start using it but now I really love it. For me it's made far more difference than I think rear suspennsion would have.
Some great advice here thanks folks. You can always rely on Singletrack.
I am an old guy who hits the ground like a sack of tatties.
So a hardtail is probably the right bike for me and I do now realise I will probably buy other mountain bike genres in the future.
The Exceed I have ordered is the CF7 so no dropper post. I can always add one when I get the bike. I’d need to get the next model up which is a grand more expensive to get a fitted dropper.
Interestingly enough I have been looking at a carbon Santa Cruz Chameleon frame. I had wondered if I would be better off buying that and building it up with forks and dropper of my choice and fit a 1 by group set.
If you buy other bikes try and keep your old one too.ditto with your road bike.having different bikes is all about having a contrast if you want a few.
Interestingly enough I have been looking at a carbon Santa Cruz Chameleon frame. I had wondered if I would be better off buying that and building it up with forks and dropper of my choice and fit a 1 by group set.
If you're spending this kind of money, just get a decent short travel FS. Or spend far, far less on something like the On One Scandal.
Although assuming you live in/around the Cairngorms, remember many folk on this thread ride places with no rocks, again go with a FS. Try your LBS's first, they sell decent bikes.