Forum menu
I finally decanted out the remains of my old putoline and poured in the new stuff.
I can confirm that after almost 15 years the old stuff does actually have the same consistency as the new stuff.
All the crap was stuck to the bottom of the fryer.
Also found that new chains (because I had a couple of new ones ready to go on rotation on the nice bike) came out a lot cleaner than the old one. So maybe grease does repel putoline to an extent. I'd not have thought it was particularly fancy grease but some are designed to repel oils so maybe it is worth washing off.
yep, after the chain’s out but while wax is still liquid, put the basket back in, close the lid, turn off and leave it. The wax will solidify around the basket until next time.
I found when I did that the wax must have shrunk with an air gap underneath it, which meant it smoked horribly as the fryer warmed up.
Taking the basket out seems to work much better, then as it warms up and melted around the edges put the basket and chain on top to weigh down the "waxberg".
I just hose my bike down, drivetrain and all. This is a key benefit of the wax since I don't need to relube or clean the chain. Takes 3 mins.
I have used a brush and bike cleaner on occasion, although not directly on the chain, and the wax is unharmed. I doubt Muc Off etc would touch the stuff anyway.
Nothing much new to add, but I Putolined a relatively fresh Planet X Jobsworth chain (rebranded YHA 11 speed, came out in the top 3 'most durable' chains in some test somebody linked in another thread).
Anyway, rode it twice with stock lube, complete with hosings-off afterwards, then Putolined.
Did my usual heat up to 160C, chain in, agitated etc, then cooled to 120C then turned the fryer off (don't know why I bothered with the 120C step, should just have turned fryer off).
I then promptly forgot all about it until about an hour later, went back to garage to find chain in a solidified lump of wax. So I remelted, repeated the usual steps, allowed to cool until a 'skin' was forming on the top of the wax.
Removed chain, just about too hot to handle through some folder kitchen roll so wiped off excess, allowed to cool and refitted.
Looks lovely and shiny but felt AMAZING as I was riding. I don't know how many watts you save with a well waxed chain, and I'm suitably embarassed to be claiming I can feel the difference, but this must be the third or fourth time I've waxed or re-waxed a chain and it's felt this good, so I must be noticing the Putoline.
Either way, I'll be buying hot wax for the summer bike chain as well. Might even just try Putoline but giving it a really good wipe down before fitting, wouldn't do to have big black waxy lumps hanging off the 'summer' chain...
I get virtually silent and super smooth shifting with my Putolined chain. I only know it's actually changed gear sometimes because the pedal resistance changes.
Everyone's talking about deep fat fryers in here. Would an old slow cooker work for melting putoline?
(I only say this because I have an old small slow cooker I'm on the verge of chucking out and I thought it might be worth a punt...)
Slow cooker would be fine - set it on high temperature and let it get good and hot.
I use a small one that I liberated from my mum's house when clearing it when she moved into a home.
Apparently slow cookers take forever to heat up.
I just re-did my road chain. Previous time wasn't that long ago (although it's been very wet), but I used cool temps and it left a fair bit of wax on the outside which had collected some dirt. So I decided to dunk it again to clean it up a bit. I used 130C this time and after a rub-down it's come out much cleaner, so we'll see how it goes. But the weather forecast suggests it's going to last a fair bit longer.
Yes, slow cookers are slow but I chuck the chain on top of the solid wax, turn it on and leave it. Left it a bit long yesterday, turned it on at 17:00 and didn't remember until this morning. No harm done though.
It's really the basket that is the major benefit when using the DFF, then the ability to adjust temp, then the speed. I'd happily use a slow cooker if it had a little basket to lift the chains out.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Chip-Basket/s?k=Chip+Basket
available individually for only a little bit less than the ones that come with a free DFF.
I used 130C this time and after a rub-down it’s come out much cleaner, so we’ll see how it goes. But the weather forecast suggests it’s going to last a fair bit longer.
I think that's the thing. In the winter it needs more wax on and then in the summer you can get away with less. However I would be mindful of the only decent advice the Putoline chap gave (IMO anyway) which is that hotter temps evaporate some of the lighter oils.
I think I am going to aim for 100 ish each time but just wipe more off in the summer if required. My guess is that the ambient air temp will allow more to drip off anyway as it will take longer to cool down. Maybe leaving it in the basket so it's flat would be better than hanging it up if too much drips off.
I was loosing the faith a bit with Putoline in the incredibly wet weather we had Jan/Feb, due to getting rust that I could only really keep on top of either by re-waxing every couple of rides or wiping with quite a lot of GT85 type stuff. This to me sort of defeats the point of putoline as it's as frewquent and as much faff as using wet lube.
But I've realised that that weather was pretty darn extreme and I was going out in it just because I had to get some space in lockdown, rather than my normal decision making to wait for a drier ride to come along.
Since riding in more typical weather in the last couple of weeks it's performing far better again, staying clean, not rusty and lasting >5 rides.
My DFF has a basket that doesn't have a little hook to hang the basket over the oil. This is mildly annoying as you can't shake it dry like you do with chips.
But I’ve realised that that weather was pretty darn extreme and I was going out in it just because I had to get some space in lockdown, rather than my normal decision making to wait for a drier ride to come along.
Same here. I was getting 4-5 MTB rides from one application, but they were in atrocious conditions, especially as my all-weather route has had forestry operations and turned into an absolute shoe-losing-drag-your-bike type disaster for a stretch. However, even though I'd have had to re-lube after each ride with wet lube, that doesn't mean the lube was actually lasting one ride. I would be getting awful grinding noises after about 15 mins of my ride. So it's not 1 ride vs 4-5, it's 15 mins vs 4-5 hours.
What do folks do to clean their bikes without washing the wax out? I like to give the bike a quick go over with bucket, sponge & a bit of soap before putting it away (and would previously give the chain a good scrub with a brush). Do I need to be careful keeping the soap away from the chain or should it be OK?
I got a 2L garden sprayer from Wilko for a fiver, I put plain old tap water in and use it as a sort of weak spray washer to take general grit and shit off the surface of the bike (including drivetrain) if it's been a wet scummy ride as soon as I get home. I then hang it up and dry the chain off with old rags/towels, if necessary I'll run the rag I use to wipe off the excess Putoline over the chain later to address any potential rust spots, I don't attack the bike with brushes or anything, just spray off the worst of the muck, wipe it down and rub an oily/putoline soaked rag over the chain...
Question for those using a slow cooker (as I've discovered an old spare one in the Garage) does it take ages to melt down the Putoline, does it get hot enough on high to penetrate the rollers?
I keep meaning to buy a DFF rather than carry on using a camping stove and living with the associated fire hazard, but if a slow cooker works, I might as well just use what I've already got...
Question for those using a slow cooker (as I’ve discovered an old spare one in the Garage) does it take ages to melt down the Putoline, does it get hot enough on high to penetrate the rollers?
I was kindly donated a small slow cooker on here. It takes about 45mins to an hour to heat up to temp. I'm using graphene wax rather than putoline, but I expect it would be similar heating times. I'm happy to stick with this method, partly because I think this wax may be more temperature sensitive but also because I can just leave it going while I do some other stuff in the garage.
I've had the wax up to 95 degrees C, and it seems to be getting into the chain OK.
New to this chain waxing malarkey but in a first I was sold on a Facebook ad for the Abolsute Black Graphenwax so got some ordered.
Given the chain a thorough clean and then I got one of these off Amazon - https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B08FB994L8/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 - £16 or so and gets the wax to 100c no issues. Used a thermometer gun I have for setting up my snake tanks to check the temperature which worked a treat.
Chain just cooling/drying now so will report back what I think to the wax in due course. Easy enough process though it seems made even easier by investing in a pair of power link pliers 🙂
hotter temps evaporate some of the lighter oils.
I don't think that's the case.
Before it was popular and people started messing about with it I used to just wack the DFF on max (210) and let it smoke.
It might have done something to it, but in terms of consistency, I now have 2 tins soup tins of ~300ml spare 'old' putoline that's exactly the same consistency as the new stuff.
The only thing I've changed in the last few years is setting the DFF to ~100 whilst it's melting and leaving it so it smokes less, then putting it upto ~140 ish.
Got my Argos DFF today so I did 2 chains in the garage. This stuff is sticky, I couldn't remember how people were decanting it so I got 2 tablespoons out of the kitchen drawer and spooned half the tin into the DFF. Stuck it at 130° and dunked a chain in for a few minutes and closed the lid, absolutely stinks compared to MSW.
First chain I just put in the basket, made it a bit tricky to get it out, so used some paper towels to grab it and wipe it down. 2nd chain I used my swisher (bit of coat hanger) from the MSW, which made it easier to get the chain out to wipe down.
Looking forward to trying it out this weekend.
Looking good. 😎
I couldn’t remember how people were decanting it
I used a heat gun on the tin and held the tin over the DFF, until the remaining chunk was small enough to lift out and stuff into the fryer.
That is a clean and well wiped chain. You should find a few bits of black squeezed out after the first ride, so then wipe those off again and it'll stay like that for ages.
And here's one I did earlier:
So initial thoughts on this whole new fangled waxing... I am not nearly fit enough or strong enough to comment as to whether I can feel all the free watts I am supposed to inherit however I will say that on my ride today my drivetrain was totally silent - I have never known it so quite and shifting was the quietest it has ever been too.
I am guilty in the past of somewhat neglecting the mechanicals and rarely cleaning them all however I can see me keeping on top of this 🙂
I got the DFF and tin of Putoline a few weeks back but only managed to get round to trying it today:
1) I don’t remember reading how hard it is just to get the lid off to putoline tin.
2) decanting it was a mess, but I just scooped it using a pallete knife and a screwdriver (as they were the cleanest tools to hand). It had been in the garage which has been cold for weeks so it was pretty solid.
3) smell isn’t too bad, but I’m glad I did it in the garage.
4) 140 degrees with a Gold KMC 11 EL chain (and quick link) for about 15 minutes with some shaking about was what I tried. Took out with pliers and wiped down with an old Sealskin sock (again, the closest the thing to hand).
5) all seems well, but not ridden it yet. Will update next week.
After couple of shake down rides on the new road bike I came to remove the chain and putoline it last night......to find that there's no quick link! Didn't even cross my mind as always built up my own MTBs so there's always been one installed. Had to order as it's the only 11 spd bike in the house (roll eyes).
I ordered KMC but as an aside has anyone used those cheap unrecognised-brand quick links they sell on amazon wiht any success?
If you're committing to Putoline, get one of the re-usable Wipperman ones! £17 right enough but my OCD/paranoia is much happier knowing I'm breaking and rejoining a link every month that is designed to be re-broken/re-joined...
I've just always used the SRAM or KMC ones - seem fine, but I'm still on 10 or 9 speed for the family fleet - life is simpler.
You're not wrong with getting the lid off! I reckon it's the extra diameter.
Be interesting to heat how people who are comparing to to MSW etc find it. I still think it's 99% down to the wax and the way it's applied and any differences will be minor, but we'll see.
I ordered KMC but as an aside has anyone used those cheap unrecognised-brand quick links they sell on amazon wiht any success?
I've bought various off-brand links over the years, they've always turned out to be KMC or YBN branded inside the packet though. that was clarks, decathlon, and various other shop or bike brands though, not completely random stuff.
Can't recall ever having an issue with one coming apart either.
3) smell isn’t too bad, but I’m glad I did it in the garage.
Oddly I remember my old putoline stank. The new tin, I melted in the kitchen to pour into the fryer, and it didn't smell at all, although it wasn't that hot (viscosity like engine oil rather than the diesel it usually gets up to in the fryer.
Either that or I've got Covid.
I had a KMC "reusable" quicklink fail within 100 yards the other day after taking the chain off and connecting it back together again for the first time (after another dunking).
I've since bitten the bullet and bought x3 Wipperman Connex for my 3 bikes. My wallet cringed a little though...
Be interesting to heat how people who are comparing to to MSW etc find it.
MSW looks like hard candle wax in the pics. I'm not sure I'd want to handle a block of Putoline like that, it's more like cold butter or boot polish or something. So guessing there's a difference there. But I'd also guess that the slight stickyness of Putoline would be an advantage.
@r8jimbob88 how did it fail?
I had a KMC “reusable” quicklink fail within 100 yards the other day after taking the chain off and connecting it back together again for the first time (after another dunking).
I’ve since bitten the bullet and bought x3 Wipperman Connex for my 3 bikes. My wallet cringed a little though…
actually the only quick link I've ever had fail on me was... my new Wipperman! I think I just did it up too hastily, or maybe there was too much wax coating the links or something! Anyway, quickly fixed roadside and has given no problems since including some uphill sprints.
@molgrips - Looks like one of the links became detached somehow and bent backwards. I suppose it could be user error but i'm not sure how exactly.
the Putoline tin was a nightmare to open. I keep the lid fitted just loosely now. I use a briefcase stove to warm it up
I also didn't realise you were supposed to wipe, I just let it drip dry. will wipe next time!
Got all the gear (not quite no idea) and had the same issue on my road bike as pedlad. Ordered some 9 speed KMC quick links which arrived yesterday. Will also be chucking in a spare brand new 9 speed chain from my old Hardrock Pro I had lying around which will be useful - have a 2nd spare for some reason too.
Tin lid was a bit of a faff to remove but not too bad. Will give it a go by the weekend hopefully now my ebike is also back from the shop
I got the DFF and tin of Putoline a few weeks back but only managed to get round to trying it today:
1) I don’t remember reading how hard it is just to get the lid off to putoline tin.
2) decanting it was a mess, but I just scooped it using a pallete knife and a screwdriver (as they were the cleanest tools to hand). It had been in the garage which has been cold for weeks so it was pretty solid.
3) smell isn’t too bad, but I’m glad I did it in the garage.
4) 140 degrees with a Gold KMC 11 EL chain (and quick link) for about 15 minutes with some shaking about was what I tried. Took out with pliers and wiped down with an old Sealskin sock (again, the closest the thing to hand).
5) all seems well, but not ridden it yet. Will update next week.
So I had my first few rides, a 75km then a 100km both on road in dry conditions. I noticed the chain got a little loud with about 30km of the second ride to go, so I’ve whipped it off and re-fried it tonight as well as doing another chain. Obviously I was expecting the putolined chain to last a while longer to this running quietly, so i put it down to at least one of:
1) 140 wasn’t hot enough and the wax didn’t penetrate
2) I didn’t degrease the new chain properly and the wax didn’t penetrate
3) I (lazily) didn’t degrease the cassette properly and the new chain has picked up some crap which has affected the wax.
4) cassette is worn (6000km on an Ultegra cassette).
I’ve done the wax on a higher heat this time and have left the chains hanging up. I’ll fully clean off the rest of the drivetrain before reinstalling the chain.
More likely a bit too hot and too much ran out / dripped off would be my guess. try it and see.
For me, it doesn't stay completely freshly-fried silent for more than a couple of rides. But that doesn't mean it's not lubed, it just sounds noisy because it's so quiet to begin with. But it'll continue like this for plenty more rides before starting to get a bit noisier again.
I find twisting the chain the easiest way to tell if it needs redoing
I definitely think new chains need a couple of goes to get maximum life out of an application, I only got 150km out of my last application.
I re-fried and let the wax cool as much as possible before taking chain out. Now I have a ridiculous amount of wax clogging up jockey wheels etc. Maybe because the trails are dry now and there's no mud to clean off the excess wax!
Feels like there's a sweetspot of temperature where the wax doesn't all run out from inside the rollers, but you don't retain too much excess between the plates where it isn't needed...
I'm 250km from my last application in mixed conditions on road/gravel, some wet, some dry. Still very quiet but there appears to be a load of spare wax on the jockey wheels.
As an aside I couldn't find any connex 12 speed quick links for the new bike for its first session in the hot wax, the original KMC link will have to do.
Shifting was a little bit worse as it got noisier so I thought it was a wax issue.
I’ll see how I get on with the new chain now and have a spare ready, it’s not really any hassle to whip one off and put a new one on. My home gym is in the garage so last night I was sorting the chains in-between sets, so didn’t really take any time at all. With the KMC removal tool the chain is off in seconds.
My home gym is in the garage
You clearly have nowhere near enough bikes.
You clearly have nowhere near enough bikes.
My BMX is chained to my power cage so the bikes do take over...
I reckon 140 is too hot. I think just hot enough so it’s the consistency of single cream is good. When it goes like whipping cream (pre whipping obviously 😉) it’s too hot. During my winter testing in a freezing shed, about 120 seemed OK. I’m still using a chain did then. It’s now remarkably clean and virtually silent still and it’s done about 150 miles. I’m probably going to do it again in 50 miles time.
I’ll try 120 next time, cheers.
I’ll buy some single cream for benchmarking purposes too.