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So.... as far as i can see in my quick skim of companies house (note this is public information and im not privvy to any other details, im more than happy to be proved wrong on my suspicions and presumptions.)
according to CW article
Baaj Capital - recently setup - dormant company until recently - looks like it does very little from its assets and liabilities being virtually identical - has a company value of just £1500 - "the venture capital company" has funded the purchase of a multi million pound company with presumably millions of pounds of stock (if they are selling stuff on naff all margin as it appears)
Through Winlong Garments Limited - which is owned by the person who owns Baaj - which looks like it does very little from its assets and liabilities being virtually identical - has a company value of just £30! Buys a couple of million in stock and takes on all liabilities of the old company.
Both owned by the person who has multiple personal entries on companies house to try and scupper the links between all the companies. Who has 36 companes/directorships. several in liquidation/dissolved, the rest appear to be mostly dormant companies which do naff all. the only ones i can see of merit are a few managing properties (probably just parking some cash investment) and a clothing importer with minimal turnover/profit/assets.
I don't really get how this works and it just smells of a Tory government style tax dodge. Reminds me of the covid PPE deals where nothing value companies get epic deal income and then run away with the cash after a quick flip. I'm sure there "must" be an innocent reason why a company with nothing can get a loan from another linked company with nothing, to buy a multimillion pound business with no sketchy dodges or tricks....
I don't actually know how an Employee owned company flogging its own company to someone else works. i can only presume it gets put in administration and all the suppliers/HMRC dont get paid as i doubt theres enough to cover the debts. no idea to be honest?
Just putting it out there. ill watch and see what happens!
(my personal bet is they flog all the stock, pay all the investors/directors millions and then nuke the company not paying any tax/VAT etc)
Neil (SuperstarComponents)
Aren't most VC buyouts generally opaque?
The publically visible ones always are, because it's the only thing that stops people getting really furious about it.
Like, you know how Maplin died? Everyone thinks "oh Maplin, out of date, couldn't compete in the modern world, never adapted or changed." But while Maplin was in bad shape, it was actually still profitmaking, except for the loan repayments to its "venture capital" owners Rutland. After Rutland bought the company with borrowed money, they inflicted a loan on Maplin to repay that, at a 15% rate of interest- mostly tax free. And when Maplin did go under, they were a preferred creditor because they weren't claiming as shareholders or owners but as secured lenders. (unsecured creditors got back 1.04% of funds due).
If it is a VC leveraged buy-out where the debt is lumped on PX balance sheet I’d not be optimistic of a good outcome, particularly due to the non-transparent nature of the new owners as Neil ^ indicates.
The business has gone into administration probably because it can’t afford its current liabilities E.g. cash flow, withdrawal of existing loans/credit. To take it on as a going concern, then saddle it with more debt isn’t going to end well.
The debt doesn't worry me or the viability of them continuing. My concern is its being bought by a tangle of companies who appear to have no real money. It gets really annoying when you run a genuine company not engaged in shenanigans which pays shed loads of tax when people are out there publicly and intentionally avoiding it (not that i know for sure that's whats happening but it will be interesting to watch and see)
A company needs money and assets to get a loan, the banks don't just give you a few million quid just for lolz. Venture Capital normally has some capital to spend....
Meh whatever, if it blows up and the government doesn't get its taxes don't complain when they don't fund the NHS.
Neil (SuperstarComponents)
I remember watching a program once about a billionaire who said he couldn't make any money when the economy was doing well and he just waited and saved all his money for a financial crash or when a business went under. He would then come in, buy up businesses and properties cheap, with cash so he could complete quickly. Their loss was his gain.
It will be interesting to see how this one plays out and how px / oo changes with the new owners.
The market always adapts and when a gap is left someone else will find the opportunity.
I give it 6 months - at best.
Northwind
Like, you know how Maplin died?
Similar story to Evans I think. VC seem to be operating as a self governing bank as its more profitable than actually running a business.
Similar story to Evans I think. VC seem to be operating as a self governing bank as its more profitable than actually running a business.
If they do that it is often because they just want a brand or similar that is part of the group/business.
Neil: you, for some unknown reason, are drawing weird and unjustified negative conclusions.
Baaj Capital – recently setup – dormant company until recently – looks like it does very little from its assets and liabilities being virtually identical – has a company value of just £1500
That statement you're reading is from 2021. It's now 2023. It's not unusual to borrow money (from related or arm's length parties) and have a particular company holding a particular asset.
Both owned by the person who has multiple personal entries on companies house to try and scupper the links between all the companies
This is just bullshit. Lazy or inattentive data entry produces multiple entries for the same person, as does automation. I've seen it hundreds of times. You're accusing some guy you don't know if deliberately manipulating Companies House records. Chill out, bro!
I don’t really get how this works
Mmm.
I'm with Neil.
Winlong/Baaj acquisition of PX will go tits up in 6 months.
As of the 19th the administrators where called in.
As of the 19th the administrators where called in.
Again?!
Again?!
No, same administration as two weeks ago but documents now filed at Companies House
I got a letter in the post about it today. Weird as not owed money I’m just an ex customer name on the database
It's from two weeks ago but documents have taken time to process/be updated.
its a pre-pack. planet x ltd went into administration and Baj bought the assets and brand, staff transferred over too.
https://www.rothbiz.co.uk/2023/06/news-8115-jobs-saved-as-rotherham-bike.html
there are two other planet x related businesses that still seem to be active - planet x retail and planet x EOT trustees.
Anyone know if they are still making new frames or just selling the stock?
its a pre-pack.
Now it depends on which bits the new owners really want. TBH, I wouldn't bet against them gutting it and walking away in <12 months.
So do we reckon it’s safe to order stuff? Seems like it.
If they had something I wanted I wouldn’t hesitate to buy from them. I would use PayPal so I had some protection though
I placed an order with Planet X about 10 days ago, I was genuinely surprised how quickly I received it. I think it took 2 days. I had assumed lower staffing levels and therefore a bit of a wait.
Fingers crossed the get some bootzipper frames back in stock, I'd not hesitate in ordering one.
I ordered 2 pairs of bibs on friday, tracking number shows delivery tomorrow, so fingers crossed
Wow - I ordered a couple of carnac jerseys for Mrs at 5pm yesterday, and she's just cycled away wearing one this morning! very speedy
Got a shock pump last week for £10 - is exactly the same as the one that came with Marzocchi forks a few years back but with "Jobsworth" logo. Nice.
[i] very speedy[/i]
Yeah, I've seen her go, she is rapid! 😉
The daily emails offering bikes at massive discounts have stopped and they're all back to full price. Discounts of stock of clothing, tools etc seem to be continuing though - I guess they're overstocked on a lot of that?
PAYDAY20
20% off the entire site till Monday apparently. Smells a bit more 'fire-saley' to me. Pay with Paypal or a Credit Card and go for it!
The daily emails offering bikes at massive discounts have stopped and they’re all back to full price
20% off the entire site till Monday apparently
Business as usual then
yes, I smiled when I received that this morning!
Was trying to find this thread earlier to post re the 20% off.
New down sleeping bag bought here 🙂
Just ordered the bar bag for a two day Pennine Bridleway ride. May not use the bag again, but it looks better than anything else out there for the price. Only needs to keep my civvy clothes nice and dry. Also two bottle cages as the ones on MrsF's and daughter's bikes have snapped.
So that 20% off, it seemingly applies to anything on the site, no matter what existing discounts are already applied.
e.g. this Chorus Disc groupset!
£1,199.99 -> £959.99 for a Chorus Disc groupset: That's well below anyone elses listed price currently, So if you're a Campag fan That might be worth it...
Yes, it works on all the ex display bikes as well which they don't usually work on.
The recent update to Companies House is an interesting read.
It basically lists all of their debt to suppliers and the customers who have credit left over on their accounts.
https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/06535324/filing-history
Interesting. Stock £3m value but stated as realisable 10% of that per the then administrator. £750k due to Sram. Waltly £150k.
Rotherham council £50k.
DPD & FedEx taking a bath.
Shimano not listed so either payment in advance or grey market sourcing.
One that raised a wry smile...£32k bonus accrual for trevor parker - ha!
I'm down as a creditor, at least that explains why I got a letter from the administrators, it's pennies though not worth the stamp cost. If I had a hundred pound order unfulfilled I'd want to know but this seems a little pointless. I did laugh at 'Please Select' being a creditor clearly their data isn't that clean!
We've been a regular customer of PX and I'm listed on that document as being owed £400 ? The thing is, we aren't owed anything as far as I'm aware, all our orders have been fulfilled and we have nothing on credit with them either, nor any outstanding refunds. Can anyone shed some light on it please ? TIA
When was your most recent order with them, and approx value?
I’m down as a creditor, at least that explains why I got a letter from the administrators
Where are you seeing this exactly? I got one of those letters as well. Had a bike on credit from them a couple of years ago, paid off in full. I ain't there must be thousands of people in that boat?
When was your most recent order with them, and approx value?
30/6 and it's being currently picked.
Before that 09/06/23 2 pairs of bib shorts - returned for full refund, approx £60
Where are you seeing this exactly? I got one of those letters as well. Had a bike on credit from them a couple of years ago, paid off in full. I ain’t there must be thousands of people in that boat?
If you follow the link to the companies house posted by cycle92 you can view all the creditors listed in alphabetical order
I think I'll not bother with that block quote effect again... 😂🙈
Just wondering if it's slightly sloppy bookkeeping; you placed the order and paid for it, but the dispatched stock isn't accounted for on their system, or cleared off a ledger, so shows as owing subsequently after delivery. That could then show up to the administrator as being outstanding to you as a creditor.
Could be something entirely different though.