Planet X - In Administration

Have sales/margins turned that much further down inside of a year?

firm generated a turnover of nearly £17m in FY 2021/22,

Pre-tax profits for the period were £1.1m

So about 6.5%, (down from near 15) not hard to imagine that vanishing with cost increases and general spending reduction over the last 12 months.

Excessive lead times broke the model that companies have been running for a long time, and for complete bike businesses (even if thats not 100% of your business) thats a big issue. Weve also seen far eastern factories just shut down leaving companies with big orders with companies like SRAM or Shimano and no frames to hang them on. The bike industry supply chain has been a total s*** show for 2 years now. You'd have been better off just not buying anything during lockdown, selling everything in your warehouse and waiting it out.

Then what we're seeing is companies not paying suppliers the bills, because they can't, and suppliers tightening the noose on those that can, because they need the cash from somewhere, which then puts the better off businesses under strain too. Its easing off now but its been a rough ride for sure. I suspect that alot of high street retailers will be under pressure now as the ripple takes time to work through the supply chain.

Who do I blame FWIW? We'll I think if suppliers had taken the sensible approach of saying you can only order 110% of what you ordered last year*, then no one would have ended up with freakin' huge, ultimately pointless orders on their books and gotten everyone into this mess.

* I did make this suggestion to more than one company.

If they go that really does cut a key player from the value end of the market

The gx scandal was is a really great bike for the money. For a bit over a grand get a bike that would do years of mountain biking without feeling there was a weak link to upgrade. I'm assuming that you bought a dropper for it

Not only do we loose that bike but it takes the price pressure off the competitors

Maybe on the On One bit can be sold and saved

The best thing they did was produce loads of different styles of bar for cheap, so you could experiment to get the right fit – and they did a huge range of cheap stems too.

I'd forgotten about Mary Bars etc.

They are an 'Employee Owned Trust' these days (maybe for 3 or 4 or 5 years ??? - open to being corrected on how long).
How did that come about / how was any purchase from the original Mr XXXXX get funded ? Did that leave the new entity in debt that increasing interest rates starts getting harder to pay? Or was it gifted for a peppercorn to the minions for years of toil ?
Anyone know ?

Or was it gifted for a peppercorn to the minions for years of toil ?

I doubt that anyone gifts a multi-million pound company!

I probably put that in to balance the options in my question !

Maybe on the On One bit can be sold and saved

Be interesting to what falls out the pockets when the administrators give them a shake.

Do they still have any rights to Tomac? Guerciotti? S.A.P*?

*three letters, began with S, probably Italian?

Of the actual bikes though, the Holdsworth Corsa looks nice (and they shouldn't have dropped the Columbus tubed version, just given it disk brakes). The Trail bikes are very good, but do any of the others have a "brand" other than the Scandal. The Hello Dave has a cult following, but not sure if that translates into new sales once everyone who want's that extreme a bike has bought one. The Rujo looks good, but lacks a USP in a market flooded with gravel bikes.

It'd be nice to see them reborn in the way most of us probably remember them 20 years ago, as sort of UK specific Surly. Trouble is, I can't see that being a competitive proposition to the administrators compared someone like Sports Direct or JD Sports who could rationalize it with their Evans or Go Outdoors business?

Might need to see what a Pro Carbon Disc frame costs at the moment as I need a larger one soon for someone who is growing.
It made sense to buy him something nice where I could get an identical spec but larger frame as he grew.

May be a problem now.

Shame to read, have read rumours of this for at least a month, used them lots over the last ~15 years mostly for clothing and components, rather than a bike (those poor QC seat tubes on the London Roads a while ago really made me wary). Hopefully some of the company can be salvaged for the staff.

How does the employee owned model work then?

I presume someone is still in charge and all 50 employees don’t all try and dib-in with ideas and opposing ways of working.

Employee owned companies can and do still have entirely traditional hierarchy based structures (John Lewis is a classic example here), I'd be surprised if it was just 50 of them sat around a table trying to hash out exactly what do to.

There's also mention of a Trust so my understanding would be that it's the Trust that actually owns the company, on behalf of its employees. I'd assume this means that (apart from their livelihoods) the employees don't stand to lose any shares or investments in the firm, but I could be very wrong about this.

looking at the financial statements for 2022YE the writings been on the wall for some time; [2021 >\to 2022]
- TOO MUCH stock £3.5m > £5.3m
- funded by £600k trade creditors and banks loans £0.75m > £5.6m
- brexit, sales to EU down £2.6m > £0.81m
- terrible cashflow

cash is king,

** note 2021 boosted by covid/cycle uptake

Dam I really like their cheap road helmets they were an absolute bargain compared to overpriced stuff of similar / worse quality.

Looking just now thought they are now £26 which is expensive !

There's plenty of infornation online about EOTs.
PX is substantially/fully owned by Planet X EOT trustees who, earlier this year, were subject to a first proposal to dissolve which was then removed.
The PX strategic report as lodged with Companies House as part of the annual report and accounts includes comments about performance and risks; see also Accounting Policies 1.3 Going Concern.
A statement from PX about their current trading status would be helpful as the uncertainty is likely to depress sales.

If/when assets are sold off it will be interesting to see what they do with their collection of ex-Jimmy Saville bikes.

That's real shame. Their Whippet is one of the best bikes I've ever owned.

They stole from me just as brazenly as people who busted in my garage door... But it's an unrecognisable company now, they do some things the same but they don't seem to do that so much. I've got a Titus Loco Moto waiting to be built up and I told myself "remember the warranty is probably worthless", maybe I was right? But the ti frame was the price of an aluminium frame. Considering lead times, storage costs, all that time the cash is tied up there can't be much profit in that, especially compared to competitors.

But I hope they pull through.

My current and only bike is a Titus Fireline. It’s been great. It is the only thing I’ve purchased from them as I was always put off by horror stories and pricing roulette. Glad I took the plunge.

I've been trying various avenues to get in touch with PlanetX to get some questions answered but no luck yet. Will post info when I get it.

– TOO MUCH stock £3.5m > £5.3m
– funded by £600k trade creditors and banks loans £0.75m > £5.6m
– brexit, sales to EU down £2.6m > £0.81m
– terrible cashflow

Brexit aside that's just the symptoms/evidence of what Ben was saying.

Easy to see how you could end up with a warehouse of expensive SRAM groupsets, forks and brakes tying up £millions while you wait on yet another delayed order of frames. And their T&C's won't let them sell the SRAM kit except on a complete bike.

So they get hit from all sides, spent money on stock they can't sell, can't sell any bikes as they don't have frames, possibly already having paid for the frames as the suppliers tighten their credit terms. And if you're not selling anything you have no turnover. And if you haven't got the turnover you can't order the next batch.

Bit of history, ref the employee ownership:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/carltonreid/2019/11/18/planet-x-to-become-employee-owned-says-founder-dave-loughran/?sh=3ec6955a1fac

https://cyclingindustry.news/dave-loughran-to-sign-planet-x-business-over-to-employee-ownership

love my Whippet, also Ruji Gravel...... hope works out.......

The Forbes article is a bit light on details, except I think we can all agree this is a crime against humanity.

introducing PowerBar energy bars to the U.K.

Sorry to hear this too. Got a Titus Silk Road from them last year, great bike with good customer service when I was asking doofy spec questions when deciding whether to pull the trigger. Just ordered some silly cheap Sram rival 1x shifter on Sat after much procrastination, hope they turn up.
Do feel very sorry for the staff involved.

Planet X EOT trustees who, first proposal to dissolve which was then removed.

I'd say that is related to their confirmation statement being filed late, rather than an administration wind up. After warning letters, Co House use this as a shot across the bows hence it gives them 2 months to comply. Causes no end of hassle for their credit rating so is best avoided, unless attention is diverted elsewhere, like finding cash to pat staff & suppliers.....

A real shame. PX (& On One) really influenced both the sort of bikes a lot of use rode and the direct selling model as the internet became a thing. I had a bit of sponsorship from Dave back the (triathlon) day. There was always a bit of chaos in terms of interaction. When small it was almost part of the appeal - you felt like you were dealing with real people spinning plates to make it all work. That 'chaos' didn't scale up too well when more folk were involved their side and the customer base became more (I'm struggling for a word) normal and possibly picky.

I do feel they lost their way a bit. I'm not sure what buying up all the different brand names was all about. Titus, Holdsworth etc. I just got confused tbh. It felt like (because I think it probably was) the result of buying up brands and businesses about to go pop, along with the contents of their warehouses. It came at a moment when they could have built a clear and identifiable single brand name, much in the same way Alpkit did with Sonder. And for a while the website was a bit garish (in not a good way), full of sales and tat. The good stuff (and by that I mean properly solid and effective and importantly good value for money bikes and frames) bread and butter got buried. Looking at the site now though I'd say it's much better - to a certain extent a lot of us have preconceptions about what they are which might not be quite right now in 2023.

Whatever - I don't like the direction the bike world is going. So many 2nd tier online retailers folding along with the bricks and mortar shops added to the amalgamation off some of the premiere league retailers. Value and innovation it is not.

Didn't know anything about this, ordered something last night, it's apparently coming tomorrow.

Didn’t know anything about this, ordered something last night, it’s apparently coming tomorrow.

Even if it enters administration, the administrators will keep it trading whilst they consider the options. Shutting it all down asap is the fastest way to kill off any residual value.

Was suspicious by the amount of stuff that was unavailable following heavy discounting a few months back, the website is absolutely depleted compared to what they used to have. Which may be a good thing, there was some amount of crap but also plenty of decent stuff as well. As said already, if they concentrated on core brands/models they could go back to being a UK Surly (without the extortionate price tag for a frame that cracks)

@stwhannah

I’ve been trying various avenues to get in touch with PlanetX to get some questions answered but no luck yet. Will post info when I get it.

You missed one: Brant Brant Brant!

(I know he's not anything to do with them now but may still have contacts)

Hannah has been in touch.

introducing PowerBar energy bars to the U.K.

There's an interesting story about that I believe... one for the journos to dig into and include in the potted history, if any of them write one as part of all this.

In the TT / Tri world, 10-12 years ago, a PX Stealth was seen everywhere, and PX would have a stand at big events.

What I've seen is that as TT bike aero development increased in the industry in the past 10 years3, they didn't (or weren't able to put the ££ in to try to do it) to keep up - as open-mould offerings just weren't up to it any more.
The introduction of didc brakes even on TT bikes has doubled down on that (there is no way I'd buy a rim brake bike in the past 6 or 7 years, maybe 4 or 5 for a TT bike, as its buying straight into obsolescence).

The good stuff (and by that I mean properly solid and effective and importantly good value for money bikes and frames) bread and butter got buried. Looking at the site now though I’d say it’s much better – to a certain extent a lot of us have preconceptions about what they are which might not be quite right now in 2023.

Dunno, it's probably COVID supply chain related but it's annoyed me for a few years now that there's only ever a slim chance of there being any frames for sale. And if there was it was at fully inflated RRP. I get they why (because they had more build kits that than frames), it's just a irritation when their old business model was selling good VFM frames.

I do remember going round their warehouse and thinking it was like a bigger, slightly more organized version of my shed. Boxes on boxes of stuff bought one the wholesale equivalent of a PSA thread (random saddles, bells, pedals, luggage, even a warehouse rack of sofas and armchairs).

open-mould offerings just weren’t up to it marketable any more.

FTFY, the Watts saved on a aero-ish frame Vs a round tube are significant. The Watts saved on an optimized frame Vs an open mold I'm less convinced on. e.g. Specialized claiming the Allez Sprint and Tarmac were as/more aero than the original Venge developed with McLaren. That to me says that the margins are VERY small that new conventional-ish frames could be as good as the previous generations extremes.

Four years ago.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/YNwXAeT8XnSW14re6

Had a confirmation that my order has been processed.

IMHO the on-one inbred changed things, the idea that it cost the same to weld two bits of steel together regardless of geometry, so why not have a cheap frame with angles that work.  Started the whole cheap bikes that work thang

introducing PowerBar energy bars to the U.K.

Ruddy ‘ell - I ate hundreds of those during my trailquest days!! 😀

The introduction of didc brakes even on TT bikes has doubled down on that (there is no way I’d buy a rim brake bike in the past 6 or 7 years, maybe 4 or 5 for a TT bike, as its buying straight into obsolescence).

Although most people I know have TT bikes with rim brakes even though all their other bikes are disc.....

4 years ago... EC130 wasn't a TT bike though.
(I'm still using the Stealth and accept its effectively obsolete vs modern tech as far as wheels and tyres.go - being limited to 23mm maybe 25 at a real squeeze, no modern wide rims etc. The bike is not the limiting factor for me other than the seat tube angle could do with being a couple if degrees steeper to get a better body position. But it's seen me through several iron distance races so far and I'm not gonna be troubling the podium even if I had an e-TT bike.)

yeah.

Wow bloomin good timing this thread... Just happened to pop on here earlier today during a very productive toilet break at work and saw this thread! Was just about (later today!) going to order a frame and some other bits totalling about £460. Wonder how many people who don't know the situation are merrily placing orders?

Sad news... Having and two old Inbred frames in the shed and a fatty frame kind of expected on one / planet x to be around for a while.

Would I be crazy taking the risk to order? Assume so....

Was just about (later today!) going to order a frame and some other bits totalling about £460

You still can and it will turn up, if in stock.

Administrators will run it as an ongoing business whilst exploring options.

I'd just use a credit card, as you can always claim off that.

You still can and it will turn up, if in stock.

Just make sure you pay by credit card as that will probably give you the most protection.  I need to order some scandal mech hangers before they all sell out!

The px/oo daily email is probably one of the only ones I read as its always worth opening to see what's on offer today. They have had some amazing bargains over the years.

I've owned all 3 versions of the scandal and loved all three.

I was looking at new road bikes the other day, I'm a mtber that rides on road for fitness so not very knowledgeable and their range just confused me. It just seemed like loads of the same bike for various costs and none of them took a mudgaurd unless it was a 1x gravel bike. I gave up in the end and looked at sonder and ribble.

I really hope they survive this or evolve somehow. I know others have had horror stories but I've only ever had good service from them. 🤞

Wonder how many people who don’t know the situation are merrily placing orders?

I did. paid by credit card. Had the confirmation email.

Ordered something.
I've had mixed experiences with them (hasn't everyone?) but for the stuff they are good for they are still amongst the best. I probably have something from there somewhere on me every time I ride a bike.

Sad to see, hope the administrators can keep it running and find a buyer. There will be suppliers that lose out as well even if that happens

My company went through administration three years ago, suppliers lost around $20m, investors $110m. Company was refloated after a few weeks debt free...

I got my old job back on basically the same terms after a few weeks of unemployment.

A handful of staff (mainly finance) were employed throughout the whole process, to keep it running whilst they found a buyer.

I got my old job back on basically the same terms after a few weeks of unemployment

Fingers crossed this is what happens for the Planet X folks

Fingers crossed this is what happens for the Planet X folks

Not sure about the suppliers losing millions part though......

Not sure about the suppliers losing millions part though…

What aren't you sure about?

I've had a 26" singlespeed Inbred MTB, Planet X SL Team road bike, Scandal 26" MTB an On-one Hello Dave MTB. All great bikes with great specs. Still have the Dave and is A perfect for a day riding steep trails.

Hope they can be sold as a going concern.