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Q - how interchangeable would the forks be in these two bikes?
I'm wondering about complications with the bottom bits of whatever headsets and whether it is at all possible to build the 456 with a headset that would allow me to swap forks between the bikes simply I.e. just slide one fork out and swap over without playing with crown races, chisels and hammers.
Forks both 1 1/8th steerer to make this possible.
Orange is older model '5' so the 1/8th headtube currently with std Hope headset
Carbon 456 has no headset yet but will need some form of step down one to accept a fork with a 1/8th steerer
One fork is Float 140 RLC, already has whatever race fitted to make it fit the Hope headset on the Orange
Other fork is Talas 150 RLC which has yet to be fitted. So in ideal position to fit a headset to the 456 to make this possible if such a thing exists and would have the same race on the fork itself.
One thing will be steerer length. The steerer will be long on the 456 as it has a short headtube. Presumably can use spacers to resolve that.
If its not possible, what forks would you put on which bike?
Hope make a metal collar that sits on top of the fork steerer - and you can then put the crown race for a tapered fork over it.
Or the on-one smoothie headset has a wide crown race that fits over a 1 1/8in steerer to work with the tapered headtube.
But neither of those do what you're asking for really - and I can't think of a solution that would let you swap back to a straight headtube without removing crown race. Sorry.
But in (sort of) answer to your other question - the c456 works great with 140mm or 150mm forks and I never need to use the travel adjust on mine.
Hope do an external lower cup for c456 frames that means the fork uses a standard 1 1/8" crown race that can then be swapped to other frames using standard 1 1/8" headsets.
18Bikes will be able to advise and stock all the options.
(I've got one of these on my c456, btw)
Cool. Thought there must be a way. 18bikes for me then. Will give them a call.
Otherwise would've been aswell just getting a tapered fork for the 456.
Good to have the option to swap though.
Current instinct is to see what the Talas 150 feels like on the '5' and use the Float 140's on the 456. Then just see how I get on.
Roll on 456 build time soon then.
How easy or otherwise was that Hope headset to fit to the 456 by the way?
In my opinion you would not be able to easily swap the forks between the two bikes. The lower crown race for the C456 will be larger than the standard 1 1/8 lower crown race on the 5 if you use a hope reducer headset.
It is not only the crown races you need to think about when swapping forks over, you would have the faff of setting up the front brake every time as well.
The only way I could think you would be able to do it would end up throwing the angles of the C456 out a bit. You would need to get a one point five to 1 1/8 reducer from the likes of BETD then fit a standard hope headset into that which would essentially make the A-C length longer by the depth of the headset say 10mm for arguments sake which could throw the angles out by a degree or so. This way you have the same headset in each bike running the same crown race allowing you to swap the forks between frames.
If you can afford to keep both forks and they are both in god condition I’d put the 150mm forks on the 5 then the 140mm forks on the C456 for no other reason than I’d prefer to have the longer forks o n my full sus frame that I’d be more likely to push harder through rougher terrain.
Thanks all - so using the reducer lengthens the headtube effectively (that's A - C, I assume)
wwaswas - is that what you've done?
Have pinged 18bikes a question.
Bikes - never simple.
And aye - was thinking the same re 150 Talas vs the 140
And in time might cut steerer to fit the 456 perfectly but for now will prob keep the options open.
And brakes - aye, additional faff there right enough.
Very helpful chap at 18bikes pointed me in the direction of a
Hope Headset Cup Complete D (Bottom 1.5" Trad stepdown 1 1/8") EC49/30 for the bottom, and a
Hope Headset Cup Complete 2 (Top 1 1/8" Integral/Zerostack) for the top.
And that appears to be job done. Hope HS's listed here, and makes sense to me - looks like the bottom cup is fitting in the tapered (49) bottom of the headtube, but expects to meet a 30mm race.
Anything I'm missing here?
One additional consideration seems to be Head Tube length - I had originall planned on a difference of 15mm in HT length between a Five and a c456 - Im seeing threads that state that the HT length of the c456 on the website is wrong.
Roll on measuring tape time tomorrow. Not sure i fancy 30mm of spacers quite as much.
Head tube length on the C456 is wrong unless you have a small. PeterPoddy has one and started a thread about it and the incompatability of RS tapered forks. I think the head tubes ar 95mm from memory but all measurements are in Poddys tread.
The reducer you have been recommended will not increase the A-C lenght. What i was sugesting was like a metal collar that you put into the frame first then press a standard lower cup into.
I would love to be wrong in what i think you are missing but i do not think by getting the headset you have been recomended you will be able to simply swap the forks between the two bikes without having to change the crown races.
The lower crown races sit very slightly inside the lower cup of the headset and the outer diamiter of the lower crown race on the Bottom 1.5" Trad stepdown 1 1/8" is going to be in the region of 49mm where as the outer diamiter of the standard lower crown race will be around 34mm.
I believe hope are like other manufacturers who make the headset so that to go from 1 1/8 to 1.5 if you upgrade to tapered forks at a later date would just be a swap of the crown race.
Did you say to the guys at 18 bikes you want to be able to swap the forks between the two bikes without changing the crown races?
I think matt from there uses the forum from time to time, maybe you could give them a ring back and direct them to this tread where hopefully they will call me a fool for my miss understanding.
What you have is right the hope step down uses a standard crown race the same as the 1/8 headset that hope also use . I have got the same thing for my bikes carbon 456 and chumba vf2
Excelent i am a plum and you get everything you wanted without the faff i thought you would need to do.
I didn't doubt the knowlege of the guys at 18 bike honest 😉 I have bought stuff from them in the past and they have been great i just thought the hope hedset worked differently from what it does.
Appologies for adding confusion to your thread. Enjoy your bikes a now slightly embaresed but fantastically envious Rusty Mac
bit tricky to see at this size (follow [url= 
]this[/url] link and you can magnify it) but here's my c456 with the Hope lower as described above;
[IMG] [/IMG]
only concern would be the number of spacers you might need to run on the c456 to keep enough steerer for the other bike.
For some reason didn't spot the latest updates to this thread last night.
Thanks for all the updates folks. Now even more looking fwd to a complete DIY bike 🙂
Spacers is something that bothers me now so started a specific thread about that.
Cos I've measured the HT on the 456 and it's precisely 90mm.
Argh.
If it comes to it I'll just have to pick one fork for one and be done with it.
A bit of trial and error first to see what I prefer would be good though.
Already leaning towards it being the Float 140's that'll end up on the 456 permanently. But less keen on making them unusable on any other bike ever if cut that short.
Orange 5 can have the shiny new '12 Talas 150's 🙂
bit tricky to see at this size (follow this link and you can magnify it) but here's my c456 with the Hope lower as described above;
Nice bike. Looks good as a singlespeed too.
Was that easy enough to set up SS - relevant mounts etc?
I fancy doing that from Nov onwards ........