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This thread has the potential to be a bit "when I were a lad" but here goes!😁
Riding in the late 80's/early 90's with a club, my lowest gear on my training/touring bike was 42/24. I have a memory of riding back from an evening 10 over the Nick o'Pendle from the Clitheroe side, my mate with his single chainring 52/18 on...he didn't have to walk but we were 30 years younger and 30 kilos lighter!😁
Have ridden mostly fixed for last 20 years (off road and on road) so a 39/23 seems very low to me and would clearly never have anything that low on fixed. I had a road bike earlier this year until I got bored of it and went back to fixed and I ran it with a 44 1x ring with a 11-25 cassette and still hardly ever used the low gear even though it was there to use.
Fixed on the road I use a 42 / 16 which is nice for hills although lower than many use I would guess although just moved down to 42 / 17 for the winter.
Winter was a 42/18 fixed, cider in the bottle stopped it freezing.
That’s a pretty low gear at 63”. Probably needed in the Peak District but would be very under geared around here.
It was bloody low geared around here, but I used to grind big gears and winter was the chance to develop some souplesse 🙂
I had one of these — a Halfords five-speed “racer” with just one big ring.
Ah yes and the utterly pointless 6" long "mudguards" that did nothing. 😂
I too had a "racer" although it was actually more of an Audax bike, a Dawes which I had between the ages of about 13 - 16. It wasn't dissimilar to your bike up there ^^. At least it came with a double chainset!
And then I part-exchanged it for my first MTB when I was 16.
I wasn't a club roadie BITD, but there weren't many steep hills in Herts when I was growing up - and I just avoided the worst ones or stood up to grind it out on the ones I did tackle. Being skinny helped I suppose.
By the time I got into road riding again in 2011, I was on a compact double chainset with 11-25... then 11-28... and now 11-32.
Modern road bikes with discs and wider tyres are so good, you couldn't pay me to get back on a retro roadie.
Only started riding with a club in 2010, after a gap of 15 years but things I remember from 25 years ago were dubious lycra shorts and a sponge chamois because proper chamois skin chamois were way too expensive. Down tube shifters and 2x5 gears. When I started again in 2010 one didn't go on a club ride until one was able to ride 50 miles. Self sufficiency was vital, groups woulds be small generally and etiquette was drilled in regarding keeping a wheel, maintaining a steady pace, not half-wheeling and calling out road hazards. In the club, time trials were Tuesday evenings, then if you wanted to go out with the racers you went out Thursday evening for a chaingang, Saturday afternoon was the fast group ride with no stops, and Sunday was the steadier social ride with a cafe stop. Equipment was varied but generally the Saturday rides and chaingangs would see 53/39 chainsets and 11-25 cassettes. A compact cassette was a novel sighting. Sunday club rides were slightly more mixed but the old boys leading used to know all the lanes and it wasn't unknown to be in the middle of what you thought was nowwhere and then popping out to cross a main road that you recognised. Lumpy rides would normally include Gospel Pass or up into the Black Mountains from the south and west. I have fond memories of watching the old boys grind up stony lanes with each of them berating the other for the choice of route. I also remember proudly when they asked me to take over the routing and ride leading. The general group make up was of a benevolent dictator as ride captain and then as the group changed up whilst riding, normally with a shout of 'change horses', the front riders would pull to the side and the group come through the middle. This changed eventually to the lead right rider pulling out to the right and dropping back, in a through and off movement. @IdleJon will recall also the cyclocross scene was much different back then, with smaller fields of riders, and all mixed in together. Also soup, especially chowder 😉
I did the Manchester 100 sportive a few years back with a 13x21, as its flat. I had a few folk look at the cassette and thing it was just 8 gears all the same as it was 1 tooth increments.
I can't fit a bigger cassette than a 26t on my two vintage road bikes as the rear mechs are tiny (Shimano 7402 Dura Ace and a 600 Tricolour)
@midlifecrashes - same here! 5 speed racer (downtube friction shifter obvs), cow horns and a set of knobblies. There only seemed to be one 'off road' tyre option then, a skinny affair with tread akin to a maxxis medusa. Loved that bike.
The general group make up was of a benevolent dictator as ride captain
I resemble that comment 😉 . Our club (Twickenham CC) looks a lot like @shedbrewed did 25 years ago. We have disciplined group rides, through-and-off is standard for 7 or more riders. Bit-and-bit pace line for fewer. Riders are trained in group riding on social Saturday rides and can choose which pace to ride. Tuesday evenings are harder rides for experienced club riders at any pace from race pace all-out, to "steady". Most are non-drop rides and smooth riding is always fast. It's why I ride in a club.
Rode last night's Group 2 Medium-paced group ride on a 38 x 11-25 11-speed on my cross/gravel bike. Wasn't undergeared, even in 38x11 on the downhills. You ride what you have. Humans are pretty adaptable.
I used to manage on 42/21 when I was young and lived in Northumberland. Then I moved to shotley bridge and was riding in to the Pennines, I couldn’t manage it and switched to 39/25. Later in life we moved to Yorkshire, I swapped the old 9spd out for 36/28 11spd to cope with the dales. When I had to concede the C40 no longer fitted me, its replacement arrived with 34/34 and I love it! I’ve never been a competitive rider, always for exercise, fun and the views, suits me.
I used to be a bit of a roadie around the late 90's and it was definitely a case of 'ride what you have' in terms of gearing. I distinctly remember going on a club ride once and someone being absolutely castigated for having fitted a gear ratio of less than 2:1 as being "soft" and other more politically incorrect versions of said word. Don't forget even MTB's had only recently gone for a low ratio of less than 1:1 on mainstream bikes with the move to 9 speed! Thankfully I got a "pass" to use easier gears as a new rider and as I was/am short I even had 650b wheels on my standard frame to avoid toe overlap (where they came from I have no idea, all I know is that getting tubes and tyres was a mission), used to fly up the hills compared to everyone else! Turned to MTB before compact chainsets etc became mainstream at the lower end so have never owned a road bike with low ratios (my commuter/gravel bike I had a few years ago doesn't count as it had Claris and a low ratio of 34/28 and was terrible at climbing).
Simple. We didn't know any better.
My 2x6 52/42 11-28 (sometimes 11-21) is still in the garage. It has seen use on the turbo with 11-34 cassette, still bloody hard for a slow old man.
Wouldn't call myself "old school", but when I started, mid 90s, it was 42/52 and 13-23, and around Leicestershire then 21 and the 23 were reserved for special occasions only (about the only time I can recall being told I could use them was the climb up Saddington Tunnel). When that's what you've got, that's what you use...
My first "nice" roadie, I guess I built up 2008ish. 39/53 and 11-25. That did a few years of Peaks use when we moved to Sheffield, before I downsized to a compact 34/50 on the front. Honest reaction? It doesn't get easier, you just go slower...
(I do ride fixed on my commuter 44/16, which is fine for general tooling around, although its a bit grunty for some of the steeper bits of Sheff. Meh. Suck it up, princess)
When you go back to the early days of the TDF, that was truly deranged. I know Henri Desgrange was completely anti-freewheel - affected the "purity of the bicycle" and there was the whole game of flipping the back wheel at the top and bottom of the climbs to change gear.
Other than a nasty Cambridge commuter with steel rims, I've never had an issue with rim brakes on road bikes - indeed actually prefer the calipers on my current summer bike to the discs on my winter one.
I know Henri Desgrange was completely anti-freewheel – affected the “purity of the bicycle”
I've just been listening to Ned Boulting's latest podcast which is about his book 1923.
I suppose we did not know any different. Also you had to be tough when out doing massive rides and trying to drop each other on every hill. It is hilarious really.Used to finish a 70 mile club ride. Then sneak extra miles in on there own, secret training. Now same people would not dream of secret training! Every millimetre is on Strava.
and the winter fixed wheel epics on a cheap 531 bike with mudguards. The pain was exquisite.
As with most things in life we just got on eith it. Having it easy is a modern thing just like whinging and self entitlement. OK I jest but there is an element of truth . Say 1980 so not that long ago. My road bike had a 42/52 chainset 14-21 block. That was OK.. My TT wheels had 13-17 5 speed block.. We just pushed harder on the pedals. The old men did the same. We saw no need to twiddle , you are just as fast grinding. Age now means awimpy 39 inner ring on the TT bike and an extravagant 7 speed 12-18 block. In 20 years people will wonder how we live having to cycle at all.
Got up Spread Eagle hill in Dorset (ish) on the 42-17 with overloaded Carradice bag when i was 17
I found it pretty easy. 50/42 and something like 13-25 out back on a slightly too large "he will grow into it" road bike bought at almost the exact moment I stopped growing.
Rarely used the inner ring as I am a cycling Superman grew up in Suffolk and rarely rode other places except on holiday where being a belligerent and fit teenager was a great substitute for too high gears. 🤪
Even in Suffolk though side pull brakes 😬😬😬😬😬
This thread has the potential to be a bit “when I were a lad” but here goes!😁
Aye kids of today. Soft i tell you. Soft
Bring back national service. No wide range cassettes and fancy compact chainsets. Make them ride on cottered cranks that work loose and proper bbs with loose bearings and loads of play
You know it makes sense
I started road riding in the early 90’s and then 42x23 was the normal and early club rides in the peaks were a bit of a sufferfest but there weren’t any guys in their 50’s (like today) on the faster club rides. You ride reliability and CTC (as stated earlier in the thread) when you stopped racing.<br /><br />
Move on a few years and I’d progressed to a 39x25 which I used for my first experience of the alps, the Marmotte. Even as a Cat2 roadie it was a bit tough getting up the Galibier. The locals all had “tripeeeel” as they kept on pointing to as I grinded past them! <br /><br />
I still have my 1995 Dave Yates 653 (fully refurbished with Campag Record 9speed). I occasionally use it for flat coffee shop rides.11-23 block.
Come to think of it, my first proper road bike had a 39/23 lowest gear. My knees hurt just thinking about it.
I won the Mid Shropshire Wheelers road Hill Climb up the Burway circa 1992 on my Specialized M2 Team Ed, Bontrager Comp fork, Specialized Fat Boy tires etc. I certainly got one or two frowns and mutterings about having an advantage due to my low gears. If they weren't all so obsessed over pushing the highest gears possible, maybe they'd have won, given that my bike probably weighed 8lb more than theirs. Roadies were a weird bunch back then.
Roadies were a weird bunch back then.
Still are. 😉
Got up Spread Eagle hill in Dorset (ish) on the 42-17 with overloaded Carradice bag when i was 17
I did most of the Fred Whitton route in the late 80's early 90's when it was organised as an Audaxy Grimpeur sort of event (Not called the Fred Whitton back then obviously) but that was on 42/52 and probably a 13-21 or 23 with a saddle bag.
About 60-70 starters and probably half didn't finish. Have a vague recollection of some from my club having ridden over on the satuarday (100+ miles) then the route on sunday (100+ miles) then back on the monday morning. Having stopped both nights in a youth hostel somewhere (i was a wimp and cadged a lift from one of the other guys who had to be back at work first thing monday)
However, some clubs still have road captains who get upset if anyone rides more than 0.0001 mph above or below designated pace
****ing Garmin's etc and the need to publish the route in advance have killed group rides
This tells me why all the roadies I pass with a cheery " Good morning" look at me as if to say " What's @@@@ing good about it ! " 😉
On the same subject I ride a lot of moor roads on a 29er Ti HT with knobblies and a lot of them ride past me like I'm stood still! 🙄I guess that's my equivalent of stubbornly grinding up climbs in all the wrong gears !!
Normal ride between 20 to 30 miles Somerset levels , very questionable road surfaces but I've convinced myself over the years that it's a decent workout 🤔 More importantly I enjoy it even though my first choice will always be MTB rides .
From reading this thread I'm clearly a weakling!
God, I'd never have properly got back into cycling if it weren't for compact chainsets and wide-range cassettes. 50-34/11-32 was enough to get me going, now running 48/32 and 11-34 and just about hauling myself up stuff. I get that once upon a time, there was only so much possible (largely down to materials and mfg techniques) but I'm definitely firmly of the mind that just because a good athlete is fine on 53/39 doesn't mean most people are. And I like cycling better when more people can do it - compact and subcompact chainsets definitely help those of us who aren't ectomorphs out.
52/42 & 13 - 23 in the early eighties. Felt a tinge of shame when I put a 50/36 12-27 on my road bike which sees the most climbing last year.
I’m definitely firmly of the mind that just because a good athlete is fine on 53/39 doesn’t mean most people are. And I like cycling better when more people can do it – compact and subcompact chainsets definitely help those of us who aren’t ectomorphs out.
You're absolutely right, there's no way most recreational cyclists should be on the same gearing as even "keen cyclists" let alone amateur racers or pros.
Back in about 2008 / 2009, there were half a dozen Sportives in the UK and they were almost exclusively the preserve of fit racer folks on a weekend off.
Errrr, except we called them Reliabilities, and you could probably do one every saturday and sunday from NYD to probably Easter, ish. And where i was, you could ride to most of them.
I remember being told, after finishing one near Ludlow maybe, that reliability trials were most definitely not sportives, because....well, I've got no idea tbh. Lack of signs? Smiles on peoples faces vs scowls? Map reading? Cost?
@IdleJon will recall also the cyclocross scene was much different back then, with smaller fields of riders, and all mixed in together. Also soup, especially chowder 😉
Hi Chowder T, how are you? 😀
We also used to organise Welsh league cross races anywhere that we could, which meant coal tips, slag heaps, Welsh national DH courses (I'm not joking), local parks popular with dog walkers. Often no permission was asked, I suspect. That meant that the courses were very often terrible. But it was cheap and easy to organise. And lower numbers of people, who tended to be self sufficient, usually meant few complaints (other than from ambushed dog walkers!). Seeing a load of muddy racers unashamedly changing into dry kit in a lay-by on a housing estate stays in my mind. (Mynydd y Garreg?) As does seeing Percy from Pembs completely naked in the Gopa stream at Pontardawe, washing the coal dust off himself.
I like the big numbers in races these days - I remember getting quite bored in a few races simply because I was effectively doing an off-road TT.
**** Garmin’s etc and the need to publish the route in advance have killed group rides
Not sure I understand this.
Personally I'm quite happy to attend a group ride not knowing the route in advance, our Wednesday ride is always like this, the rule is the destination cafe is never announced in advance and you have to guess where we're going as the ride progresses. Having no one guess it till you literally arrive is the aim, which can require some devious routing.
I remember being told, after finishing one near Ludlow maybe, that reliability trials were most definitely not sportives, because….well, I’ve got no idea tbh.
Back In The Day™ the point of a Reliability Ride was to prove to your cycle club that you would be a Reliable Clubmate for the forthcoming season.
Summer - racing and evening TT
Autumn - Hillclimbs
Winter - long steady miles on the "winter iron"
Early Spring (effectively January - April) - prove that those winter miles had worked, demonstrate your club cycling abilities, your self-sufficient nature, willingness to help your clubmates and so on.
They were basically club-level audaxes but - unlike audaxes - were done as a club rather than individually.
Sportives didn't really exist - the idea of paying £30+ to ride on open roads would have seen you laughed out of the chaingang. Audaxes were accepted because there was a degree of navigational skill and hardiness about them.
A lot of modern Sportives are proper pansy-like by comparison. 60 miles?! That'd be the distance that you rode to get to the start of your evening TT before racing the TT and riding home again!
Saying that, I used to routinely ride the 12 miles up to Eastway Cycle Circuit, do the 32 mile evening crit then ride home again.
People just used to grind up things at a stupidly low cadence. Also, only skinny midgets really rode much anyway, fatties sat on the sofa watching footy instead.
I remember being told, after finishing one near Ludlow maybe, that reliability trials were most definitely not sportives, because….well, I’ve got no idea tbh. Lack of signs? Smiles on peoples faces vs scowls? Map reading? Cost?
Could quite easily be the standard of riding... Well drilled groups averaging a speed comfortable for everyone in the group compared to a swarm of riders trying to kill each other to get a "gold standard" time.
(Not to say that the last 10-15 miles of a reliability wouldn't be run off at 30+ mph with everyone on their mudguard clad winter training bikes, and the poor buggers on 68" fixed shouting "easy" from the back...)
I have to say, none of the responses so far have made me long for a return to the days of silly large gears and rubbish kit!
sounds like road cycling back in the day was about ‘suffering’ rather than actually having fun on your bike
although I suppose proper hard men would enjoy the suffering. Me..I think I’ll limit my use of the retro bike to 20 mile flat coffee rides.
I enjoy going up all the small hills local to me on 42/16 but I would not call it suffering and I would not call myself a proper hard man. It just feels like the right gear for my riding.
IM still riding almost daily my 2002 (Once) Giant TCR - still much lighter than any bike I've owned, completed Paris Roubaix on it, gearing 52 with a 21/11 cassette - I still class it as a climbing bike and I think its still got a place on Leith Hill (long) on Strava in the top 10 from about 6 years ago... amazing bike...
I think we managed because that was the norm?!
although I suppose proper hard men would enjoy the suffering.
I think that's probably about it. Road race cycling and the training for was once a niche sport, rather than the mass participation thing it is now. I don't think there were too many around who went out for a ride that was not training for something. People who did it liked the suffering! Today's roadie riding is a much broader church, and better for it. I've got to confess I was a probably a up uperty back in the day when my plumper (or basically normal) non obsessive friends started invading 'my sport' but these days I'm really proud that road riding is no longer a play thing of the freaks.
People just used to grind up things at a stupidly low cadence
Big Mig used a triple. I remember it making the Comic at the time. Was branded "Tea Time" Mig. Now they're all riding compact inner rings and bigger sprockets. Technology and training has move on.
I don't know if you've raced but you'd be surprised what you can do with the adrenalin, group effect etc.
Climbs that seem terrible on solo or social rides are just blasted up at speed you might not have thought possible (with accompanying pain obvs).
42/23 when I gave it a bash in the Lothians (your area iirc).
but how did mere mortals cope?
The sensible ones bought a triple. They were never really fashionable though, so died out with 10speed and compact chainsets.
The sensible ones bought a triple. They were never really fashionable though, so died out with 10speed and compact chainsets.
Pop over to the Cycling UK forum where there is often wailing and gnashing of teeth that the venerable triple chainset is dying out and how it was the best gearing ever and stories of folk who've bought another ten of them to see out their dying days... 🙄
I bought a triple chainset and a 12/27 cassette to give me a wall climbing 30/27 bottom gear 😅