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Ah, when this label was the pinnacle of MTB aspiration…
Hold my beer...
@chakaping and @Malvern Rider, both of those decals still mean something to me for some inexplicable reason and yes I do own a bike with each!
My retro Sunn has double butted Tange tubes. Rides really well.
I've either never heard of Ultimate or forgot it existed.
Seems they used it on the earlier version of my old Team Marin, so perhaps similar to the Fuji tubing on that.
Seems to all be Reynolds tubing now. Is it just that they are able to supply better?
some of the Sunns from year 1999 had Fuji tubing too. Think they were the lesser models though.
There was Prestige, Prestige Ultimate Superlight, Prestige Ultimate Ultralite and Prestige Ultimate Ultrastrong, different wall thickness' and butt lengths depending on the tube, some of it had wall thickness' of 0.5mm! Ultrastrong was ribbed length ways and was used for downtubes. I have no idea how the Fuji tubing compares.
top end Sunns of 1999 had Columbus tubing.
Anything half decent and not CEN.
You do all know that the flex characteristics of steel are the same, fancy stuff only gets stronger (not stiffer) enabling it to be made lighter?
Back in the day Columbus, Tange and True Temper were big names, not sure why Reynolds seems to have it sewn up, in the UK at least.
I spec'd my Shand with Columbus Life, it's 1.8kg iirc, rides light.
Lightest steel frame I've ridden was a 1.6kg road Dedacciai, Salsa claimed 1.35kg for one of theirs which I don't believe.
Had three main tubes of it on my 1992 Kili Flyer, which is kind-of the same approach Cotic take now with the 853 I believe.
I don’t think 853 seat or chain stays are available. If my memory is correct.
I’m sure my Sunn Revolt 2 was Columbus. Very nice bike but too XC even in the 90s.
Edit. No sorry it was Fuji SL.
Ritchey Logic tubing on the Metal Guru, made be range I believe. Fat chance were doing some nth degree stuff bitd, I want to say quad butted but can't remember, one of the first to Tig weld too.
I don’t think 853 seat or chain stays are available. If my memory is correct.
They certainly didn't used to be, I have an 853 main tubes 725 seat & chainstays on one of my bikes which is around 12 years old. I thought I'd heard that you could now get 853 seat and chainstays but I might have imagined that.
I know my White Spider was a mix of Columbus tubing but I can't recall exactly what after 30 years
“You do all know that the flex characteristics of steel are the same, fancy stuff only gets stronger (not stiffer) enabling it to be made lighter?“
Yes, there’s almost no difference in Young’s modulus between all different steels - but if a steel is stronger which allows you to thin the tube walls, thus making it lighter, then the reduced wall thickness also reduces the stiffness of the tube.
A builder can then choose to add stiffness back by increasing the tube diameter. Basically the fancy steels allow you to tweak the stiffness much more than with cheaper steels, without the weight going through the roof.
Yep I thought we'd all been around long enough to realise that, but Al can't help himself with the patronising, eh?
I had an early rigid Spesh Stumpjumper (1988) which was Tange Prestige. Felt like it had a zip and a bounce, but so did I back then.
I always loved the feel of my Rock Lobster 853, which was of course pre-CEN and the feel was mainly flex.
I did briefly have a Kona Deluxe road bike with Deddaciai EOM tubing and carbon rear end, and that rode really nicely. Probably should have kept it but was lured by an Arkose (which has been brilliant though more workmanlike).
I've now got a Town Crier 29 frame, and even though it is post-CEN it has a very nice feel as it's built to be an XC style bike, not quite old style lively like the RL, but very enjoyable. Shows it's partly down to the build and modern tastes (it's not very modern in that sense). The Town Crier doesn't have many gussets and no big tubes, and the butting profiles are apparently very similar to 853 but it is 'only' cro-mo and not air-hardened like 853.
I had an early rigid Spesh Stumpjumper (1988) which was Tange Prestige. Felt like it had a zip and a bounce, but so did I back then.
Yeah,lots of that^^ 🙂
The only steel bike I raced at a decent level was my (rigid)Explosif Pro .I loved that bike and keep thinking I would like to ride one again sometime..>puts rose tinted specs back on< 🙂