Forum menu
as a squishy road user, you also have some responsibility to not do dumb shit
and there endeth the lesson
Amen to that. Just because we are a forum full of cyclists doesn't mean we automatically side with a cockwomble. Don't undertake lorries and ride in the correct lane. This will magically reduce the risk of being dead
the00 - Member
Want to buy that driver a drink, poor guy
Poor guy. All the stress when he did nothing wrong.
It's time cyclists lost their feeling or moral superiority and began to consider themselves road users subject to the same rules as drivers.
Those particular cyclists do seem to be taking the same attitude as the average car driver. Perhaps its time car drivers lost their feeling of moral superiority about obeying the laws.
These particular cyclists are idiots. It happens. Personally I prefer an idiot cyclist to an idiot driver since the latter is more of a threat.
I do find it crap though that lorries are allowed to drive around with huge blindspots. On a site they would need a guide to deal with it but on the busy roads not a problem.
Probably could predict that all of them would, because had they intended to turn left they'd probably just have turned immediately, ignoring the lights, and continued. Isn't that what "nearly everyone" does ? *sigh* 🙄Could he have predicted SOME of the riders would continue ahead
But yeah - poor lorry driver. "Got it all on camera, mate", the guy really does think they haven't done anything wrong, doesn't he?
I do find it crap though that lorries are allowed to drive around with huge blindspots. On a site they would need a guide to deal with it but on the busy roads not a problem.
Whilst I do agree with you and am encouraged by fifeandy's response above I think the main thing they can do in the current circumstances is be predictable in their movements so other road users can anticipate their actions. I think it would not be unreasonable to say that that happened in this video.
Yeah I think they should have some form of ASL at the junction.
Cyclists will always try to get to the front of the queue so with all that space for the left lane filter I'm not surprised so many were cutting across.
Lorry design really needs updating to get rid of that blind spot. You can't expect everybody to obey the rules all the time so you have to be aware of other users.
cyclist fault absolutley.
IMHO it's not that specific cyclists fault as much as the group/herd/swarm....
however i do think that our cycle lane up the inside of traffic and ASL infrastructure conditions cyclists to ride like this.
I don't think it helps but the follow the pack/herd is exerting a far bigger influence.
Probably 90% of them wouldn't have acted the way they did if others were not...
Cyclist should have backed off when he realised that he wasn't far enough in front of the lorry before the road funnels down on his side. I don't think I've ever seen anyone pedal so much and accelerate so slowly 🙂 Driver not at fault, I suspect he was accelerating to get in a gap left by cars on his right and the cyclist put himself in a stupid position. Embankment isn't great in general but that is a particularly rubbish section of road for cyclists for a number of reasons.
Im just amazed how unaware the cyclist was. Directly in front of a lorry and not even realise how close it is!?
I can't really tell what the driver could see or what his intentions were from that video. I suspect he was paying attention to the cars trying to merge from his right without taking into account that cyclists would be simultaneously trying to merge from his left.
All I can say for sure is that that junction is a prime example of piss poor infrastructure.
Know that area well after working on site on left just before lights, driving there you really do need eyes in the back of your head for avoiding the cycling masses, but as usual with this stuff 6 of 1 and half dozen of the other, unless lorry driver hasn't driven in London before he would have known that cyclists would do that and vice versa for cyclists, no need to take that sort of risk.
Even before the incident I thought that almost squashed cyclists position was mental. Why would you park up beside the wheel of a truck, what if the truck driver decided to turn left. Utter madness from the majority of the cyclists in the video.
The only person at fault is the cyclist.
The only person that should have anticipated the others direction of movement was the cyclist.
Truck driver in correct line, drives straight, I see no issue.
I'm sure as well to get into the left lane, the cyclists would have passed the rear of the truck which these day carry a big sticker saying do not undertake!
TLDR
Anyone who rides up the inside of an HGV is a moron.
For info there are three lanes at lights, middle and right-hand lane are straight ahead ONLY and filter down to one after lights so lorry driver really has no options although I suspect he knew perfectly well what was going to happen only a saint would have sat there until no more cyclists undertook him
[quote=Dickyboy ] I suspect he knew perfectly well what was going to happen only a saint would have sat there until no more cyclists undertook him
I assumed that the longer he waited, the more cyclists would come through?
This, Google-translated in cyclist speak: if you can't outsprint the HGV, don't attempt to.and there endeth the lessonas a squishy road user, you also have some responsibility to not do dumb shit
Didn't even look like an attempt at a sprint, more like a gentle meander in the wrong gear.
Cyclist in question in insane in the membrane, insane in the brain! 😯
Bunch of cyclists trying to undertake a lorry in it's blind spot from a left only filter lane, and one of them is surprised they got hit? What planet are they on!? 🙄
Cyclists all acting like idiots there, no question. 100% to blame.
The company I work for manufactures cameras to remove blind spots - it's now in quite a few cars to help with parking. Because of this I got see quite a bit of the behind-the-scenes lobbying going on.
The haulage companies actively fought against implementing systems like this for road use because they'd said they'd have more liability in an accident (nothing to do with the quality or performance of the systems). They lobbied the London Mayor against making them compulsory for lorries used in London. For lorries used exclusively on site (under HSE rules), they bought the best systems available (e.g. for mining tipper trucks).
It's not an accident lorries have these blind spots, it's deliberate :/ That's the real problem that needs solving.
People (whether they are driving or cycling) always make stupid decisions, we just need to reduce the likelihood they result in death.
Bunch of cyclists trying to undertake a lorry in it's blind spot from a left only filter lane, and one of them is surprised they got hit? What planet are they on!?
but they got it all on camera though, so definitely in the right
Truck driver in correct line, drives straight, I see no issue.
But the lane he's in goes right as the road goes from two lanes to one. Check out the junction on Google earth.Someone not trying to run a cyclist off the road would be moving right.
The cyclists undoubtedly made a poor choice in congregating there to go straight on and in not making sure they were in front of (by enough distance to be seen) or behind the HGV by the time the road thinned, but this was clearly encouraged by very poor road layout, unsuitable for the traffic and particularly cyclist volumes present.
The bloke with the helmet cam was going on the left of vehicles indicating left, also, which is always a dodgy move regardless of the type of vehicle.
The HGV driver also made a bit of a poor choice - those saying he "rightly" expected all the cylists to turn left, is that before they move? What about when they start appearing in front of him? I'm not saying he did anything deliberate or necessarily wrong (particularly bearing in mind there was traffic merging from his right too), but he did also make a poor choice in not slowing down and/or allowing room on his inside for the cyclists that, with hindsight, he should have realised *may* be there.
I don't think HGVs with significant blind spots are an appropriate vehicle to be using in places with large numbers of pedestrians and cyclists.
Riding up the inside of an HGV towards a pinch point.
WTF did he expect to happen
poor choice in congregating there
Not poor, just wrong. A left only lane, not a feeder/ASL. Any cyclist, or driver for that matter, going straight on from that lane is in the wrong.
A left only lane, not a feeder/ASL. Any cyclist, or driver for that matter, going straight on from that lane is in the wrong.
And yet the infrastructure (road layout, light phasing, the road before that junction) encourages you up the left, then there's nowhere to go as there is no ASL.
As I said earlier: If you're going straight on & are in that lane, you either need to beat the traffic or not be surprised when the traffic doesn't mysteriously part for you.
And yet the infrastructure (road layout, light phasing, the road before that junction) encourages you up the left, then there's nowhere to go as there is no ASL.
It doesnt encourage you, its available for you. If you want to go left you can use it, if you want to go straight move across into the correct lane. Its like ASL, you dont HAVE to use them, but people keep repeating it like you do so morons who dont think for themselves use it every time with no thought.
If you're going straight on & are in that lane, [s]you either need to beat the traffic or not be surprised when the traffic doesn't mysteriously part for you[/s] you are in the wrong.
It's a left only lane.
Cyclist was a slow, scared, self-righteous moron. This clip should go on TV as an example of exactly what not to do.
[i]He didn't deliberately clip him[/i]
Looks to me like he did. Yup, you shouldn't go in a left turn only jnctn and go straight in any other city in the world! I can't judge what happens in London! But, I reckon the driver knew they were there and either didn't give a shit or was trying to prove a point.
It's a weird one - notice the brake lights come on as soon as he makes contact (1:08), then he moves away from the kerb. No way he could've felt the contact. Braked when he heard the shouts? How did he know what they were shouting at? "OI! No!" could've been anything from anywhere... unless he knew...
But the lane he's in goes right as the road goes from two lanes to one. Check out the junction on Google earth.Someone not trying to run a cyclist off the road would be moving right.
Aye, a car would probably swing right straight away but this is a HGV that's considerably longer, he's gotta think about a good few feet of trailer behind him so needs to go in a straight line for longer to make the slight turn without dragging his trailer through the right hand land too. Whilst watching the cars filtering from his right and the cyclist appearing from nowhere in front of him, a lot to consider.
The cyclists were riding with a sense of "I own the road" plain and simple. They shouldn't have gone into the left lane but filtered up to the truck and waited behind it in the absence of a stop box, and saved their legs by drafting it. Trying to undercut a HGV like that is just beyond stupid, bordering on suicidal.
For all we know, there could have been a moped or another cyclist/s i.e. vulnerable user on his right.
It doesnt encourage you, its available for you. If you want to go left you can use it, if you want to go straight move across into the correct lane
Except that lane is full of traffic, and you have little idea about the left only lane until you're in it - road goes from 1 lane to 3 back to 1 very quickly.
Ideally, cyclists should wait to merge back into the main line of traffic before the junction. I've seen that happen about zero times.
What usually happens is people that haven't sprinted off the line wait in the no mans land in front of the left hand lane on the junction for a gap in the traffic.
The left hand lane is also very similar to a lot of "cyclist friendly" infrastructure in the capital where cyclists are sent up the inside of queuing traffic.
The junction design leaves much to be desired.
No winners here.
The person on the bike showed poor judgement, the driver shouldnt be expected to drive such an unsuitable vehicle and the road infrasture didnt provide space for both.
If the truck had a bin wagon style cab and the road had a cycle lane it wouldnt be possible.
Cyclist is a complete bellend there. Plain and simple.
the road infrasture didnt provide space for both.
It does though. The cyclists chose to ignore the 'left tun only' 🙄
What a bunch of bell ends.
Theres not much more to say about it than that, really
Funny that cyclist bloke leans into the truck as if he could push it away. I reckon riding up onto the pavement at that moment would've been more advisable 😆
binners - Member
What a bunch of bell ends.Theres not much more to say about it than that, really
+1
It does though. The cyclists chose to ignore the 'left tun only'
Well I for one couldn't see any gaps that could have accommodated the number of cyclists at the front after it was clear that it was a left filter lane.
It's shit road design. People being "wrong" because they can't merge into stationary traffic en-masse doesn't deserve a potential death penalty. Is it that difficult to understand?
It does though. The cyclists chose to ignore the 'left tun only'
Again the issue here seems to be why a whole group of cyclists chose to ignore the left turn not specifically the one who got clipped.
The first one jumps the lights then the rest follow... even accepting the first couple might have (still wrongly) got ahead of the HGV it was pretty apparent they wouldn't ALL get past.
I have no idea what they expected the driver to do ???
Step on the brakes and have people (including cyclists) who actually followed the rules run in the back... swerve into the opposite side of the road?
If I found myself by accident in a car in the left lane at the front I'd either wait or turn left anyway or possibly (and wrongly) out accelerate the HGV ... I don't see how that changes at all on a bike. If anything I'm more cautious as I'm not cocooned in a metal/airbagged vehicle???
However if I found myself the 3rd or 4th car in the left hand lane then the latter option isn't even an option... its just suicide hoping the car in front accelerates fast enough...
Be this a cyclist or car I just fail to see how anyone but the cyclists as a group were to blame. "This is London" seems a particularly stupid excuse given how many cyclists get killed or injured in London doing exactly this.
They will do that every day and know that road well. They choose, on a daily basis, to use the wrong lane. On that day the choice had repercussions.
Unless, of course, they are all tourists and this was their first trip out in that there London
They will do that every day and know that road well. They choose, on a daily basis, to use the wrong lane. On that day the choice had repercussions.
+1
They will do that every day and know that road well. They choose, on a daily basis, to use the wrong lane. On that day the choice had repercussions.
True.... though I'd say On that day the choice had repercussions[u] for one of them[/u]. It has repercussions on someone (the poor sod has to swerve/brake) every time just so they can arrive 20 seconds or a minute earlier...
However as per the thread this almost serious repercussions was about a whole group of cyclists all taking a gamble that would lead on of them into serious danger.
Had the bloke who got clipped been at the front he would have presumed he got away scot free... with no repercussions when in reality the repercussion was experienced by the HGV driver and the cyclists behind.
I'm not condoning the first rider ignoring the left turn only OR not waiting for the lights .... or the second or third who "got away with it today" but the stupidity for me simply increases as you go down the line and following the guy in front blindly.