I've got roped into a charity fundraiser.
The plan is to ride Leeds to Scotland (Gretna), and back again, in a day. This is now less than a month away.
It's 400km. Around 16-18 hours riding time.
Overall, I'm a pretty fit 54 year old. I'm riding several times a week, with the odd run thrown in too. But, my rides are usually 1-2.5 hours, I rarely ride longer than 3 hours.
AND, it's nearly all MTB or gravel. I don't have a road bike; I have a second set of wheels with road slicks for the gravel bike, but TBH it only gets used like that maybe 3 or 4 times a year.
So, today, I did a quite hilly, windy and obviously hot, 93km road ride. Less than a quarter of the Leeds-Scotland-Leeds ride next month. And I was done in after just that distance.
I have ridden 8/10/12 hour rides before, but not regularly.
Any tips on how to get prepared to be a long distance roadie in under a month? Is it basically... do longer road rides?
Pretty much. Your body will adapt and "learn" what it's like to keep going for so long.
You also need to concentrate on reducing stopped time. This can be harder if there is a group of you but, in the other hand, sharing draughting will help keep your average speed up so learn how to do that too.
Also, chafing. Buy some bum butter, chamois cream, whatever you want to call it, and get used to using it.
If it were me, I'd be badly spraining my ankle or having a positive Covid test the day before.
You’re going to suffer.
VO2 Max intervals can boost your FTP relatively quickly and will make at least modest hills feel less stressful on the day, gearing that feels near your threshold now will feel closer to z2/3 endurance/tempo with enough training/racing...
Balanced out by multi hour z1/2 rides.
Practice pacing yourself on long rides to stay in zone 2 (easy to have a conversation/not breathless) and avoid going in to the red on hills.
Also figure out what you can keep eating and drinking for they length of time without feeling yucky,and keep eating and drinking small amounts regularly.
18 hours seems optimistic for 400km doesn't it? That's 22.2kph without any stopping at all. Not saying you couldn't ride that average speed, but you're unlikely not to have some breaks?
Ride at least one long road ride per week (4 hours approx), do it at as much as you can in zone 2.
In the week, try to ride at least 2 sweet-spot sessions (only need to be 2 x 20 minutes) best on rollers or turbo trainer.
Do not try to change too much at this late stage, else you'll pick up an injury.
Check your riding position and fit on the bike.
Wear your comfiest padded Lycra on the day.
Ensure you're well rested, eat plenty of wholesome foods. Cut out the junk food and booze.
You'll be fine. Just take it easy and try to minimise your stops. Make sure you eat and drink plenty on the ride, including carb and electrolyte drinks. Again, don't introduce anything new on the big day. Make sure what ever you eat or drink is fine with your stomach well in advance of the day.
Back the pace off a wee bit and eat (a lot) more
For example, I find 100 miles at 15mph really easy, at 17mph it's an effort, at 19mph I'm ****ed at the end. That 2mph makes quite a difference. Backing off the pace should allow you to go further.
Mars bar every 20 miles plus as many cafe stops as possible will help no end.
Also, if you aren't a roadie, are you used to drafting/bunch riding? Go and do a couple of local club runs, they'll soon show you what's what. That will make things a lot easier.
Group ride is always easier/faster than solo.
Definitely practice drafting.
Keep your energy up.
Make sure your arse is up to sitting on your preferred saddle for that long.
Stop and eat, but don’t **** about, it’s really easy to waste an unbelievable amount of time.
That’s a long ride to do in a day, good luck.
Do your training rides at a cruising, rather than fast pace.
Wear your comfiest padded Lycra on the day.
Do not wear brand new shorts that have not been washed. You will not finish!
Ride every other day between now and then with one long ride a week which should edge up to around 120km towards the end of the period. Use HRM monitor and cadence sensor to:
Get cadence to average high 80's/low 90's rpm
Practice keeping heart rate in zone 2 to 3, you may end up walking to start with.
Borrow a road bike from someone with compact chainset and as wide a block spread possible.
Another plus 1 for the right pace and backing off your normal pace. i did my first 100mls after riding no further than 30 mls in a single ride, just backed off my normal pace. As said above 1-2 mph can make a colossal difference.
Also keep hydrated. Let your salts fall and cramp will be a killer. I always use a weak energy / hydration poweder. Never up to the recommended concentrations but enough to taste it. Drinking that stuff for long periods at full strength is…well i couldnt do it! Weaker usually keeps me hydrated enough to avoid cramp then i eat enough food for energy.
New bike time.
Use witch hazel to toughen up.
Do a lot of stretches and core work (little and often) in the lead up.
Do you use a HR monitor? Use it, stay in zone 2, watch the numbers when climbing, drop to a bottom gear quicker than you think.
Candence = spin, not grind as it helps to clear lactic acid. Even when tired, resist grinding, change gears and spin (80 to 90rpm).
Can you draft properly? Learn to draft properly.
Get really good padded gloves and new bar tape.
Get new, v good bib shorts, don't trust old because after 12 hours they'll be a baggy mess.
If you like slightly baggy tops, nipple tape.
60g carbs every hour, 3mg/kg caffeine, single dose every 6 hours (big one 45 mins before the start to get to race weight. I used to use nsaid but I'm on blood thinners now and MTFU.
Stretch on the bike every 30 mins (even at the start), but only 80% of what you think.
Have you got support? I love tubs of rice and jam alternate with pork scratching but a pain to carry.
Presume you have decent road lights?
Unslam your stem.
Cross bar bags are handy for extra shite.
Organise your pockets. Right is food, middle is spare clothing (oh, arm warmers, get arm warmers), left is more food with your phone.swap if you are left handed.
I prefer a gilet to a jacket.
New pads for the helmet.
Pre prepared syringe or two of chamois creme to squirt down there as required.
Don't stop, you'll never make up for the rest you had, just chug along.
If you stop, 30 sec touch toes and refueling then go, maybe treat your face to a damp cloth if you are a sweaty git.
Don't trust any dogs with orange eyebrows.
Any tips on how to get prepared to be a long distance roadie in under a month? Is it basically… do longer road rides?
Pretty much.
Fit the road wheels to your CX and do the rest of your rides with that set-up. TBH, I think you're going to have to get used to suffering a bit. That said, longer rides are basically just a mental thing. You'll go through some dark places mentally, times you'll want to throw the bike in a hedge. But equally, there'll be some great moments as well. Trick is learning to deal with the dark moments and knowing they'll pass.
Honestly - with a month to go your best bet is just to fit the road wheels, ride that bike as much as possible and try and do some long rides. You won't be "race fit" but you should at least be expecting it.
+1 for you’re going to suffer. Fitness-wise there’s not a lot you can do at this stage. You can fine-tune your position on the gravel bike, if you don’t use it frequently. Practise being aero (elbows in not out if you’ve got flared bars) - no sense giving yourself more work to do.
Keep it slow and steady. How are you planning to carry your kit and food? Is there a support vehicle?
Do invest in a good quality pair of bib shorts if yours are a bit tired. Be sure they fit and that you break them in a bit. Work out what fuel works best for you over time (for example, you might want to avoid carb-heavy bread or cake during the ride as it absorbs water).
18 hours seems optimistic for 400km doesn’t it?
18 hours riding time seems about right.
If you've been riding regularly, you'll be fine. It'll hurt, but noone finds 400km easy.
Do some longer rides sure, but don't overdo it - definitely have an easy week in the run up.
Bring some caffeine pills or something, just staying awake for that kind of distance is hard.
As others above have said,a lot of it is a mental thing,getting in your zone and don't faff about at stops.I did a 300 in a day last weekend without much training, and mostly on my own.I was creeping along in a horrible headwind ,so if you get drafting/sharing thing sorted out with your group it will be fine.
Lots of good advice there, but really it’s just keep on chugging along. Sounds like you’re fit enough and you just need to keep the pace down. Eat plenty, drink plenty and just keep riding. You’ll get there. It really is mostly mental at that distance. I just did the Frontier 300 - 300km, ~4500m of ascent, 50% gravel and stinker of a steep hikeabike in the middle. I’m a wee bit younger, but ride less at the moment and I’m 6’3” and 15st, so I work on the hills. It was tough but I just kept on riding and enjoyed a lot (not all!) of it in the end. Actually, I’m quite jealous!
Ibuprofen seem to help me (as a precautionary measure).
definitely think about / work on position. Riding that long, just keeping your head up will tire muscles in your neck and shoulders so unslam the stem, take peak off your helmet, and make that as easy as you can.
Being slightly less aero will make it a bit harder. Having fatigued your neck so much you can't look ahead of you and have blinding tension headaches will finish your ride completely.
Fit the road wheels to your CX and do the rest of your rides with that set-up.
Agree with this. New bike will feel weird.
Wear your comfiest padded Lycra on the day.
Urgh. Yuk, lycra on a hot day 🤒
Pre prepared syringe or two of chamois creme to squirt down there as required.
Double yuk.
Get a nice pair of Ralph Lauren cotton boxer shorts and wear them under a pair of comfy, loose fitting shorts that allows air flow. Much nicerer.
I appreciate that I will be in a minority of 1 with this position, but nowt worse than minging sweaty nadgers for 18 hours.
( Don't stop at Asda mid ride to buy some nasty cheap replacements if the main pair get soaked from not having mudguards in a rainstorm. They will not be the same)
I reckon it's doable if you get the food and group riding bit sorted. Though you may have issues if the group is going 1/2 mph more than you're comfy with.
Good luck.
AND, it’s nearly all MTB or gravel.
@hardtailonly what route are you doing? I can't work out of this comment is what you normally ride or your getting to Gretna off road?
What fitness levels are the people your riding with? Are they similar to you or fitter / worse than you?
There's nothing worse than trying to hold a wheel of someone whose fitter than you on a long ride.
How light are your 2nd set of wheels? And what tyres are you running? Tyres will probably make the biggest help
It sounds like you're plenty fit enough. Stuff like this is mainly mental, plus getting your food, bike set-up etc right on the day. Do a few big rides ASAP to get this sorted and get you confident and you'll have a great day.
what route are you doing? I can’t work out of this comment is what you normally ride or your getting to Gretna off road?
@damascus - I read that comment that the OP does most of their riding MTB/gravel therefore it's the 400km on road that is causing concern...
OP: the best you can hope for on this sort of timeframe is to sort out the logistics like how you're carrying stuff, making sure the bike (especially the drivetrain) is clean and serviceable and everything that you're wearing is comfy. You'll need a few long rides to work all this out so focus on that rather than fitness because long rides will soon highlight any niggles. Work on addressing those rather than vague plans of "getting fitter".
Oh and good luck, try to enjoy it!
What climbing is involved in this ride? A quick strava check shows c 17000 feet for a straightforward there and back route. That is one immense one day ride. For the coming 3 and a bit weeks I'd ditch everything except getting miles in and hours in the saddle. It has all been said above really....no new kit for the day, no new saddle for the day, no new nutrition for the day. (Daughters chap did Liverpool to Leeds last summer, their biggest issue was that they took 30 minute breaks rather than 5-10 minute ones. It meant that they were out riding until 2100 rather than finishing at c 1830. Do that on this ride and it will make an 18hr ride take well over 24)
Do you have a support vehicle? Carrying food, water, spares?
It always amazes me just how much time it takes to find food and water on a trip and how much faster you are when you don't have to sort that out on route and carry it all.
And if you can't get a support vehicle dump a vehicle the day before with everything you need as you will be passing the vehicle twice and it might be useful to know there's water, food and spare tyres or tubes in it.
Thanks all. Some good advice there.
Just to clarify a few points ...
Most of my current riding is MTB/Gravel. Overall fitness is not an issue, well, for 2-3 hour rides.
This is the route:
https://www.komoot.com/tour/743027399
388km. 3500m climbing. Fleet Moss (obvs, twice) would seem to be the main killer climb, rest of it is not too bad, but lumpy.
We have 2 support vehicles, so food, water, spare clothing etc, plus mechanical support, so can minimise what I'm carrying on the bike.
The support vehicles also mean that there is the option of bailing out, getting a lift to a train station etc if it all goes horribly wrong, or if I (or anyone else) are significantly flagging and holding down the group pace too much. But, mentally, I'm determined to do it all.
Don't really know much about the other riders, there's 6 or 7 of us. Most seem to ride road 'for fun'. One guy is apparently very used to endurance riding (and is using this as a 'recovery ride' 🤯. But think the rest of us are more mortal!
My plan is to do:
* a lot more core and stretching over the coming 3-4 weeks
* possibly try out a mate's decent road bike - will try it for a 3 hour ride to check it fits and is comfortable
* break in my new pearl izumi bibs (see the psa on another thread)
* at least one 4-6 hour ride per week for the next 3 weeks
* a couple of 2-3 hour rides per week, possibly doing some hill work.
I need to decide what to do about a planned 10/12 hour MTB ride in the Peaks on 2 July. As I'm in the Peaks, I'd much sooner MTB, and kinda think that 10/12 hours in the saddle will still be good preparation. But maybe I should turn it into a road ride ... 😬
New cassette and chainrings for as low gears as you can fit.
It sounds like you’re plenty fit enough. Stuff like this is mainly mental,
This, and being comfortable on your bike. BTW I started hallucinating on a 400km ride last month, through tiredness, so try and bank plenty of sleep in the week leading up to the ride.
New cassette and chainrings for as low gears as you can fit.
I've a new (under 300km) drivetrain on, 1x11, 42t chain ring, 11/46 Cassette. I'm comfortable with that range.
(Although, if I end up using my mate's bike I think that's 2x11, need to check what the gearing is, but suspect it's a compact and 11/32 cassette.
This, and being comfortable on your bike.
The 'being comfortable' is the bit that's worrying me the most. Neck, shoulders, back were all tense after yesterday's ride. Might try a higher rise stem, but its probably more about getting more time on the bike, core work, stretching when we stop, and ibuprofen!
I’d bring a ton of ibuprofen with me. I reckon your back and neck will give up long before your legs.
Other than that all good advice I reckon. Never ridden anything like that, but I don’t find riding long distances is as much a physical as mental challenge. As long as you fuel properly and pace yourself you’ll be grand
You’ll also be bored out your mind after the first 100 I suspect
Get a nice pair of Ralph Lauren cotton boxer shorts and wear them under a pair of comfy, loose fitting shorts that allows air flow. Much nicerer.
I appreciate that I will be in a minority of 1 with this position
There is a reason why that is
Riding on Ibuprofen is a really bad idea. Not only is it bad for your kidney's which need to function well for hydration during your ride, it can mask some subtle pain or injury that you should attend to - better to stretch and/or rest the area concerned that be exaggerating it because you can't feel it.
And don't focus on FTP, its no good to you now. As above long slow rides with practised kit and a healthy diet is the way to go - good luck!
I thought I read somewhere that Ibruprofen reduces cycling gains from "training rides."
If you go for the 2x11 compact road bike, I strongly endorse getting an 11-34 cassette, been using them ~2 years and 34/34 is great as a bailout gear when legs are getting tired. I was using 11-32 before, but having 30 and 34 as eaasiest two sprockets makes such a difference for me.
I’ve a new (under 300km) drivetrain on, 1×11, 42t chain ring, 11/46 Cassette. I’m comfortable with that range.
You might struggle to keep up with the group with this gearing on the flat and rolling hills if everyone else is on a road bike with 2x. But you might appreciate the gearing later on when your legs are tired.
Borrow a road bike and take your bike as a back up if space. Then if the gears are too hard later on swop over. By that time the pace will have slowed down anyway.
Go OG TDF style.....brandy and speed*
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*probably not a great idea 😆
Most of my current riding is MTB/Gravel. Overall fitness is not an issue, well, for 2-3 hour rides.
A lot of MTB riders, on switching to road, find the struggle is not so much the overall fitness, it's the way that fitness is deployed.
MTB, you're doing very erratic efforts - short bursts of peak power, periods of relative rest (eg freewheeling downhill), periods of full body exertion like moving the bike around a lot over jumps or through singletrack. There's also a lot more stop/start at gates, top of hills etc.
Road, it's much more a constant steady state effort which can come as a bit of a shock when you don't have those "micro rest" periods.
I ride regularly with @hardtailonly. I can attest that there is definitely not much stopping/starting on our MTB rides!
Fitness wise you'll be fine I reckon..
You need to bloody well learn how to keep a lid on the pace though!
Road, it’s much more a constant steady state effort which can come as a bit of a shock when you don’t have those “micro rest” periods
That's what downhills on the road are for 😁
I'm in the exact same situation as OP! 170 mile ride over 3 days in September with colleagues all of whom are commited roadies. I have been MTB only for the last 30 years but have bought a gravel bike for this.
Did a 60 miler on canal tow paths a couple of weeks ago just to see if I could go that far, it wasn't nice. My arms were killing me! I did the miles ok but dont know if I could get up and to it again for another 2 days running. I have the same issue of not wanting to lose MTB time to road training lol.
Don't get married at the half way point.
388km. 3500m climbing.
Hmmmm. That sounds tough. The 400km bit sounded eminently doable, but 3500m of climbing is a different mater.
There is no substitute for time on bike. But part of that is eating properly too. And for 12h TTs I take ibuprofen to ease the pains (1200 mg in a day is a maximum for one day). You can ride about double your longest ride, so try for about a 200km ride sometime this month at a nice steady pace. Find out what you like to eat and drink. And hone a comfortable position. Take a SIS caffeine espresso gel every three hours and a normal gel every hour or so with some normal food too (mini pork pies are rocket fuel).
You'll be fine, just don't go too hard. And eat and drink more than you think you need to. In my last 12h TT, my fastest hour of the 12 was the last one. Just pace yourself properly and enjoy it.
Most of my current riding is MTB/Gravel. Overall fitness is not an issue, well, for 2-3 hour rides.
There's a world of difference between 2-3 hours of MTB/gravel and upwards of nearly a day sat on the road.
On a 2-3 hour ride at the most I'll eat a banana and get though less than a litre of water/fluid - and as it's MTB/gravel probably only actually sat down for half that time. All I can imagine is that you just need to ride more, and for longer, far longer and then kinda accept you'll be getting a lift back from Gretna.
