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Not having a load of headsets about I can't double check this, but I have a frame with a tapered headtube which takes ZS44/ZS56 semi integrated headset (FSA I think).
It's been supplied with the cups in, but nothing else.
Will an integrated tapered headset drop in to this? I think it should, but would appreciate any advice from anyone who's tried it.
So I'm suggesting that a lower like this:
https://www.chainreactioncycles.com/ritchey-wcs-headset-lowers-press-fit/rp-prod130218 in ZS56, will be the same as an integrated headset line this:
https://www.chainreactioncycles.com/ritchey-wcs-headset-lowers-drop-in/rp-prod130225, but without the ZS cup.
or is it still a bit of a minefield with weird tapers and different OD's etc.
cheers in advance.
Not entirely sure what you're asking, but your links to press-fit (semi-integrated) and drop-in (integrated) -pretty sure they're not compatible.
I always go to the Cane Creek headset finder to get the numbers, btw.
Ok, It may not be clear.
is the drop in headset just a semi integrated headset without the press in cups? (obviously in like for like size)
The drop-in headset is just a bearing (and race etc.) with no cup - the cup is an integral part of the frame rather than something you add. The bearing needs to match the frame's cup, which may be different to a semi-integrated cup.
What's the frame?
is the drop in headset just a semi integrated headset without the press in cups
No, it's an integrated headset - ie. it presses directly into the frame, which has the cups already installed (integrated).
so the bearings for the integrated and the semi integrated headsets are different dimensions?
I get what you're asking. I have used the bearings from an integrated headset in a semi-integrated headset. The markings on the bearings were the same- size, angle of the top of the bearing, everything. The semi-integrated cups do just make a surface for the bearing to press into that's often the same shape as a fully integrated headtube. I'd be pretty confident that the Ritchey drop in bearing will fit the pressfit cup.
so the bearings for the integrated and the semi integrated headsets are different dimensions?
It depends on the headset(s), you need the bearing to have the same internal and external diameter, thickness and the inner and outer angle of the bearing need to match - or at least the side that sits in the cups needs to match the angle of the seat on the cups.
The easiest way to ensure this is simply to buy a replacement headset, remove the existing cups, and fit the new cups and headset from that - how much money are you going to save if the only components you have are the frame cups anyway? Is it even worth it? There are several standards with different bearing seat angles, it's quite confusing.
If you don't know what headset the original cups are from, it's going to be hard to make sure any bearing you buy is the correct one. If the angle of the bearings don't match the cups, they won't be correctly seated.
I'm not saying that other bearings definitely won't match, but if you don't know what the seat angle of the cups you have installed is, you're basically guessing, which might or might not work.
What bike is it?
Surely it doesn't really matter what bike it is, what matters is what the headset cups are.
Surely it doesn’t really matter what bike it is, what matters is what the headset cups are.
indeed.
get what you’re asking. I have used the bearings from an integrated headset in a semi-integrated headset. The markings on the bearings were the same- size, angle of the top of the bearing, everything. The semi-integrated cups do just make a surface for the bearing to press into that’s often the same shape as a fully integrated headtube. I’d be pretty confident that the Ritchey drop in bearing will fit the pressfit cup.
great, that's kinda what I thought, but when you have some weird differences in sizing, like ZS55 and ZS56, it can be difficult to know what to expect, due to:
If you don’t know what headset the original cups are from, it’s going to be hard to make sure any bearing you buy is the correct one. If the angle of the bearings don’t match the cups, they won’t be correctly seated.
I’m not saying that other bearings definitely won’t match, but if you don’t know what the seat angle of the cups you have installed is, you’re basically guessing, which might or might not work.
That.
so it's as I thought, it's a yes, probably, but also possibly not, it depends 🙂
I had hoped it had moved on a little since the days of the old where we had to use this:
cheers all.
Yeah, it's a pain in the backside. I spent ages trying to source a replacement stainless bearing for a semi-integrated lower cup a while back. It was a maddening process that, I think, ended up with a mix of the original bottom cup, a Hope bearing and the Hope fork crown thing rather than the original one. And don't get me started on the (maybe) Campag standard top bearing in my cross bike which is slightly taller than it ought to me, maybe.
Look here they are not interchangeable.
actually, that looks like there's one bearing type for 1.5 and one bearing type for 1 1/8th. implying that all Hope 1.5 cups have an inner bearing diameter of 52mm and all Hope 1 1/8th cups have an inner bearing diameter of 41mm.
So you could take a bearing from a std EC 1 1/8th upper and drop it straight into an IS or ZS no problems.
not certain it'd be interchangable between manufacturers though..
Ah sorry I was just referring to the actual cups/races not the bearings them selves, but looking at my link yes you could be right but as you said only within the hope range.
