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Ride what you enjoy and can justify. My MTB is nearly 8 years old and I didn't get it new. The last bike I got brand new was the roadie and that was through the Cycle To Work scheme so is comparatively budget compared to others. That's cool though. I love them both.
Am I 'priced out' of biking? No.
If you ride big bike park lines you're likely to have an expensive bike. Riding bikes in the woods can be a really simple thing though.
I've said it before here - I don't have any more fun on my bike now than I did when I was riding a £160 Raleigh or a £500 Marin in the later 80s and early 90s*. Rigid bikes and rim brakes and no-one knew any better. Yes there have been improvements since then but no we don't need them all.
£500 then is £1200 bike now. £1200 for a CrMo frame and fork with rim brakes. Bikes can be better value than they were then. Yet the bike industry has successfully complicated, marketed and obsolesced its way into riders thinking a packed feature-list £4-6k bike is what's right for group rides at the weekend. It's not wrong.. but it's far from essential.
*Edit, yeah I know "get a decent bike now then!" ..set myself up : )
Can’t believe no one has mentioned being forced into more cycling by rising prices
All depends what transport you use I suppose. I drive a car that does 60mpg so petrol increasing is not noticeable to me and it is certainly not going to change my method of getting to work to cycling as it won't most people who are spending £3K+ on bikes.
Just to point out, 90th percentile is household income of £80k+, individuals it's the £56k linked to by @appltd.
As ever, many people are a lot wealthier than they they think and don't see the realities of what a lot of people live off financially.
All this talk of amazing bikes for £2.5-£4k, I'm wealthier than average by a fair margin, but I can't / won't afford that.
I think it's easy to complain about cassettes, but I've just looked at XT chainsets and they're about £125. They've been that price for literally decades now.
Second hand is the way forward. I’ve only ever bought two bikes new. Now I keep a bike until I fancy a change and then sell it and use the fund’s for something else. Treated myself last year to a new frame and some nice wheels then built a bike over a few months from a mixture of used and new bits. Came in over budget but that always happens. After selling the previous bike it cost me about £600
Cycling is accessible, Bicycles are aspirational, don't confuse the two op.
The bike that £2.5k bought 10 years ago may have been mid to high end of a manufacturers range, whereas now its much lower down probably. I'd argue that they both perform the same for any given measurable though (weight, ride comfort, longevity etc).It just wont have the same model rear mech. Technology and manufacturing techniques have moved on at such a pace that the trickle down of 'quality' components is impresive. Deore 1x12 groupset and brakes? one of the best on the market imho!
But does it matter? If it doesnt, buy what you can afford/justify and enjoy a bike that is probably better than anything on the market 10/15 years ago that wasnt at the bleeding edge of tech (and budget).
If it does matter what rear mech you have on your bike, well, give up now. You'll never win the arms race to buy the newest/most expensive thing out there so give up trying so hard.
As for rear cassettes as a measure of value, its doing more heavy lifting now than in the 3x and 2x era, of course it will be more expensive. Manufacturers have effectively moved the front rings onto the cassette, so we're still paying for them. As mentioned above, the only real change currently is the lack of bargains/sales on day to day kit, supply still cant keep up with demand and wont for a while yet.
9-10 years ago I worked in an LBS. £2200 got you a full suss Saracen Ariel with an alu frame, fixed seatpost and Acera 2x9 speed gears (deore rear mech). Nice bike, rode well, but not mid to high end.
That guy on QT is priceless. The mind boggles how he landed a job paying north of £80k.
The weird thing is that he did have z glimmer of sense when he started ranting about (m)billionaires, but only a bit. And he's probably the sort of cretin who thinks IHT is bad as well.
I will say in defense of 12 speed is that unlike 8/9/10 speed you don't have to change cassettes chains and so on every 12 month to stop the whole thing grinding itself into dust. They last much much longer than stuff of a decade ago. And overall I think bikes have become better, the components on them by and large are fit for purpose, they aren't beefed up roadie stuff anymore, frames are better, and even basic forks are light years ahead of what used to be offered at premium prices.
And bike prices have been made for ages now, It's been at least 20 years since the first 5 or 6 figure MTBs were released and they still sell out, so some-ones buying them.
If your salary is in the top 10% and you can’t afford 5k on a bike then what on earth are you pissing your money away on? Priorities, people!
And thats it right how much do you priorities bike stuff. Im not in the 10% but earn a good salary we don't have kids and riding bikes is pretty much all I do so I save and miss the odd holiday with my wife for it. Although it seems more expensive but I think changing a bike every few years does make it cheaper I just got a rolling frame set and am going to swap my drivetrain over.
I will say in defense of 12 speed is that unlike 8/9/10 speed you don’t have to change cassettes chains and so on every 12 month to stop the whole thing grinding itself into dust.
How does that work?
Is it just better materials or is there something in the design?
I hope you don't think it was me claiming to be poor whilst being in te top 10%. I posted that to demonstrate that despite earning a lot now (wasn't always the case) and being a keen cyclist I am still not in the market for high end bikes.
Certainly the prices we've become accustomed too are now much higher on average.
I need a new pair of road shifters - Shimano ones (105) are nearly £200 a pair. Or I could pay silly money on eBay for a tatty pair. I just can't justify that so I'll be going down the Ali express route and trying the sensah shifters.
Ultimately it's not a big deal. If you can't have ultegra but only 105 or tiagra, you can't have xt but only deore - does it really matter? It's only bikes.
Is it just better materials or is there something in the design?
Honestly I don't really know, but yes, materials better design all play their part. I do know that my last 12 speed chain and cassette lasted 3 years and was really still useable after nearly 6000km. Yes it was harder to get the cable tension and really smooth shifts but I'm pretty sure I could've wrestled another years use out of it. chain wasn't even at 0.75 and that was a mix of GX, and XO1. It's very impressive
It would be interesting to see like for like (as far as possible given supply restrictions) sales figures at these new on average higher prices. Perhaps the market will accept these higher prices longer term.
As mentioned earlier some complete bike specs just don't add up price wise considering everything is oem. It used to be way more expensive option to assemble your own custom build, but I reckon with the help of a few sale bargains I could easily beat a few companies with equivalent if not better parts.
I hope you don’t think it was me claiming to be poor whilst being in te top 10%. I posted that to demonstrate that despite earning a lot now (wasn’t always the case) and being a keen cyclist I am still not in the market for high end bikes.
don't you know, being a higher rate taxpayer puts you firmly in the high roller bracket.
or at least able to afford a high roller...
6 figure MTBs
Got a link? Reckon I’d struggle to commit north of 100k into a single bike.
I hope you don’t think it was me claiming to be poor whilst being in te top 10%. I posted that to demonstrate that despite earning a lot now (wasn’t always the case) and being a keen cyclist I am still not in the market for high end bikes.
I read it as intended by you
But I do have a solution
"eat the rich"
I'm going down the 2nd hand route for my "new" bike. Trying to get it all bought and working before the energy price hikes. My last new new bike was a PX FreeRanger on cyclescheme which works great with slicks on as well so I'm getting rid of my road bike now and just keeping the two bikes.
Do you remember that immensely naff Gold plated Muddy Fox Courier?
( still only 5 figures though)
It used to be way more expensive option to assemble your own custom build
Was it? I mean, maybe, but there is always a pile of stuff you get rid of at the earliest opportunity on a pre-built so you have to cost that in as well.
i’ve seen someone on an older hardtail with standard seatpost doing BPW before, i doubt they were hitting many of the black trails!
Why do you doubt that? Do you think ability is proportional to the depth of the riders pockets?
Never been to BPW but having seen some videos I'd probably be happy hitting some of those blacks on a hardtail and I'm by no means a riding god, it is nothing more than a big BMX track. I did the Naughty Northumbrian on a DMR Trailstar LT with 130mm revs and a 90mm stem and I've done Fort William DH on similar.
Why would you need a dropper at a bike park anyway?
There was a gold fatbike that’s doing the rounds in the emirates, that is 7 figures though. And not sold out, oddly.
Never been to BPW but having seen some videos I’d probably be happy hitting some of those blacks on a hardtail and I’m by no means a riding god, it is nothing more than a big BMX track
LOL yeah.... ummmmm errrrrm. Sure.
BMX blue 🙂
Got a link? Reckon I’d struggle to commit north of 100k into a single bike.
haha me too, typo, meant 4 and 5 figures!!
weeksy - unless that vid is flattening it all out much more than is obvious I as a really old mincer would happily ride that on my hardtail - slower of course but it looks easier than laggan black which I have been down on my hardtail
LOL yeah…. ummmmm errrrrm. Sure.
I'm shit at riding but I'd happily ride that on my 100mm travel hardtail without a dropper.
weeksy – unless that vid is flattening it all out much more than is obvious I as a really old mincer would happily ride that on my hardtail – slower of course but it looks easier than laggan black which I have been down on my hardtail
HArdtail woudn't be nice, but yes is completely OK...
But it makes me laught with things like the BMX track, when BPW is so far from that it's ridiculous... but the internet heros tell me all the time that FoD is the easiest place in the world and Southern Enduros are for 6 year old girls on pink basket bikes 🙂
I just find it amusing.
I as a really old mincer would happily ride that on my hardtail – slower of course
Most things can be ridden slowly on any bike but who wants to ride slowly? 😉
Yes. Two bikes ,rigid on one 29er, still fine for be bashing, old giant reign, really struggled now even with some modernisation as my most ridden mtb, bike parks, winch and plummet, woods funs trails. A second hand replacement is looking like £1700. Usually I would have upgraded as I went but the standards change have made that impossible so the bike has just got more and more out of date with the push to make bikes more like cars that you replace the entire bike.
It's getting pricy isn't it?
On the plus side, R&D seems to have completely stopped in the non-E bike world so my 2019 bike is, as far as I can tell, still up to date with all the current standards and fashions, other than I went with a 275, I've been window shopping and aside from some shiny paint I don't think I'd gain much from a new bike at the moment... well unless I want a motor or bigger wheels.
I'll be happier when consumables are more available, and hopefully we'll go back to a time when RRPs were sort of a guide and not set in stone.
Most things can be ridden slowly on any bike but who wants to ride slowly?
me. the longer you are riding the more fun 😉
with the push to make bikes more like cars that you replace the entire bike.
This +1, my only complete new bike was 30 odd yrs ago, now I'm just sticking with 9sd & qr axles, can't be bothered with keeping up with the arms race for the riding I do. Recon I've got enough bikes & spares to see me until I have to go E bike in my old age
with the push to make bikes more like cars that you replace the entire bike.
Buying a frame and components separately is very much a UK thing. The two biggest markets for MTB USA and Germany, buying a complete new bike is more the norm.
The new stuff is silly prices especially consumables like drivetrains. Im still happy on my bikes with 10 speed and also happily still run a 2x9 speed. Some complete new bike prices seem way too high now. 6k is crazy money. The industry is forever getting cleverer at convincing people to "change and upgrade". in the main the improvements are quite marginal.
Depends where you expenditure priorities are I'd say. I don't spend a lot on anything else, so have pretty decent bikes. Other people spend on leasing a car, or have a wife that insists they need a new extension on the house, etc.
in the main the improvements are quite marginal
Not always. Each year the geometry is slightly tweaked but my current trail bike is from 2007 and all those tweaks add up to a huge change between that bike and any I could buy now.
or have a wife that insists they need a new extension on the house
Sexist much?
LOL yeah…. ummmmm errrrrm. Sure.
The really big stuff is, yeah, otherwise it would be lethal.
That isn't but also not at all that worrying for a hardtail. My point about seemingly not being able to do blacks on a hardtail sans dropper still stands, you are right though, I worded it badly.
6k is crazy money
I bought a £6K bike back in 2018 after saving and a bit of a bonus from work. It's not totally crazy, and I don't think that I'm somehow an outlier for wages or commitment of my monthly wage. What I will say is that for the £6K I've not had to change a thing (other than some cockpit changes) and I've just replaced worn parts.
Oh, and while you can ride BPW on a hardtail, some of the drops on the blacker trails would test my ankles fo'shure I don't think I'd want to do all day on one
Buying a frame and components separately is very much a UK thing. The two biggest markets for MTB USA and Germany, buying a complete new bike is more the norm.
I'm not on about building a custom new bike more the ability to triggers broom your bike that have been lost. As a part breaks wearout renew with the updated version then every so often a new frame to fully pull yourself upto date.
Depends where you expenditure priorities are I’d say
Depends on your expenditure commitments I would say.
30k single living in a cheap area can have much much more disposal income than 50+k, kids, parents in an expensive area.
I’m not on about building a custom new bike more the ability to triggers broom your bike that have been lost. As a part breaks wearout renew with the updated version then every so often a new frame to fully pull yourself upto date.
There seems to be a reluctance to triggers broom stuff too, based on what I’ve read on more NA centric forums. ‘Why spend xxx on a part when xxxx will get me a whole new, up to date bike’. On stuff that’s rarely more than 3 years old.
Horses for courses.
I paid £675 for a Voodoo Bizango hardtail and another £80 (Maxxis Forekaster) on new tires when the originals (Maxxis Ardent OEM) had sidewall tears. I only do XC/bridleways and low speed trails (I'm unskilled!). The bike has been brilliant and got me out into the fresh air and kept me fit. The only issues I have now are comfort on long rides (saddle!) and brake performance on very steep hills (rotors and better pads?).
I'd say I've been priced into biking!
I'd say that the only thing preventing a 26" full suspension Trigger's broom would be linkage or rear triangle related and that's not due to changing standards. It'll be difficult enough to find a chainstay for a 3 year old boost 29er for example, let alone something pre 2015.