Grand Old Dukes 2025 - 111 miles of Gravelfoyle

Didn’t do it last year, but looking at this too.  TrainerRoad has gravel plans but they don’t look much different to road century or general FTP increase plans.

Did it last year. Great event. Mix of different types of track, from perfect smooth to almost single track to short sections of horribly rough stuff and the odd wee section of road. There is quite a lot of climbing, so it’s is quite a day.  Unfortunately I had a seatpost malfunction and had to skip the last loop as I didn’t have the legs to ride out of the saddle for 15 miles! Would definitely do it again. Would be really hard if the weather was grim.

There is quite a lot of climbing, so it’s is quite a day.

I had a look at the profile but I think it's a bit compressed to show the whole distance, it's pretty jagged though! Seems to be endless 'little' climbs e.g 50-75m elevation, and 4 or 5 bigger climbs, 3 of which come right towards the end?

TrainerRoad has gravel plans but they don’t look much different to road century or general FTP increase plans.

Yeah, I watched a GCN video with Connor Dunne training for Unbound. Basically endurance and raising FTP.

I've got a rather ambitious plan for the next five months, Nov/Dec/Jan building endurance with one long sweetspot workout per week, one fasted morning ride midweek and a longer (fuelled) ride at the weekend which will be either Z2 road or muddy winter gravel. Will be prioritising strength work also so 2 weight sessions a week although I'm still not moving big weights, mostly functional stuff.

Then I'll hopefully step up the intensity on the turbo Feb/Mar/April until I can move the training outside hopefully! Should be able to fit in one or two proper big gravel rides before the event.

That's the principle at least, somehow doubt I'll stick it all the way through...

General riding fitness. All the short more intense stuff will be fine as that's all most of us have time to do.  Put together a plan that you'll want to do. If you hate the turbo then only do it when needed. Build some miles into other rides - throw an hour loop onto the end of a weekend ride with mates who are more relaxed etc.

Not done this event but do like a long MTB or gravel race. You'll need to get some big rides on. It's not just your legs but your whole body that needs to get through. Also need to work out what gear you will use through practice. What food you will eat. Not being a race makes this a bit easier as it will be easier to replicate in training rides. You don't need to replicate it 100% but get close. For the dirty reiver (200km) my practice rides were 150km ish for time convenience.

Just get out and ride, but it's Scotland in June so even if you only rode slow and stopped lots you'd still have enough daylight to finish.

And food/drink, eat & drink lots early on so you've enough 'stored' up.

Also don't forget comfort, so big fast tyres run low pressure and a position you can sit in all day.

You’ll need to get some big rides on. It’s not just your legs but your whole body that needs to get through.

That has been my general focus anyway as have some big ambitions for next year, I had a big weekend in Aviemore recently and finished strong and comfortable so happy with that. Will be kicking off April with 180km mixed tarmac/cobbles and gravel as a sort of 'Hell of the North' and then have two months to fit in 2 or 3 more big rides if my 9 day working fortnight plans come to fruition.

Booked! Just need to not re-fubar my back between now and June.  Would have been nice to have a bit more information about the weekend on the website prior to booking, but it looks like it’ll be a good ride regardless.

I've just plumbed in a Trainerroad program for May/June next year, for an as yet undecided big hilly day out (Fred, SDW24, Cingles) and I'm currently doing their base block. But when you get to the build and specialise blocks can't you tailor for more climbing focus (hilly gran Fondo or something?)

I've found for questions on program/training structure, the response from the TR help desk has been very quick, highly informed and engaged to make sure you get the most out of the system

Feels much more structured for a big goal than Zwift sets

Booked! Just need to not re-fubar my back between now and June.

Thanks for the heads up, that's me booked ?

It's in June so I think I can afford to spend more time on base and strengthening work and just generally enjoying whatever weekend rides I can grab during the winter, then maybe focus on intensity March/April/May.

Right now my attempts to go from virtually zero to 10km trail run form in the last 8 weeks have left me with some sort of calf tendinopathy so will be a gentle month or so on the bike to begin with...

TrainerRoad adaptive training plan currently has me scheduled for 12 weeks base, 9 weeks build, 4 weeks base, 9 weeks speciality (gravel) with Grand Old Dukes as my only event currently scheduled.  Not entirely sure what the rationale of going back to base between build and speciality is, but the adaptive training plan has done wonders for helping me regain some lost fitness over the last year, so I’m not going to start arguing with the AI now.

I'd not be too bothered by the distance, but 3000m of elevation is a lot IMO.

And all the recently roughly filled, tyre killing potholes might have been smoothed out by then.

Sounds like a nice big day out. You'll be fine.

How do you train for something like that?

I'd probably just do a few 100km gravel rides, then a 100 mile one.

Along with my normal riding.

Looks like a good event, might look into it.

NB early bird entry price ends tonight at midnight.

Sounds like a nice big day out. You’ll be fine

You in @didn'thurt? ; )

I was waiting for an email from organiser but got myself an early bird entry, as much to secure the time off in my wife's diary...

I've got an excellent (and probably entirely unrealistic) bucket list of muddy winter gravel rides I want to tick off, leading into 'classics season' in April with one or two long but relatively flat rides, leaving me May/June to add elevation with some Highland epics. Think one high intensity turbo session a week building from sweetspot to threshold stuff as time goes on.

Feels like the perfect event to enjoy training for!

Thanks for the invite and it is very tempting but I wouldn't want to slow you down.

Price goes up at midnight..........

I did it last year and have done the Reiver before. Much preferred Grand Old Dukes.

i didn’t go in with any expectations and it was a bit of a grind to finish but I really enjoyed it. Signed up again this year.

Ian, you should do it.

Does anyone know if it's a 'register the day before' type of event? Trying to figure ot the logistics for this and wondering if we need to stay in Aberfoyle or we can do it as a day raid from Perth.

Nothing about it in the FAQs, I was also hoping to make a dash from Auchterarder.

Ian, you should do it.

Which Ian are you talking to? 😉

Im not doing GOD - i did do Gravelfoyle 10 last month however. There was registration the day before, and on the morning of the event.

Mrs SSS and I also normally help out and marshall for Dukes Weekender/GOD, and there was also registration in the morning of the one last year (2023) if i remember. We didnt marshall for 2024 GOD as it was same weekend as Etape Caledonia which we were both riding.

The start will either be at Dounans or Cobleland. Dounans was the start in 2023.

If it were me, id assume that 'locals' could register in the morning....

And look out for me and Mrs SSS

How's everyone getting on, anyone started training in earnest?

My goal is 9hrs or under, or 20km/h average.

I don't really know how this will feel though as average pace seems so varied on gravel rides, I've done faster on mixed farm track/tarmac rides, but recently sitting between 17km/h and 19km/h on rides with a mix of singletrack, gravel, road etc. I expect Gravelfoyle to be 'good' gravel, but them there's probably less joining tarmac than I'm used to.

Not feeling the benefits of a decent winter's riding but I've not been training very well, just smashing myself on long tough rides at the weekend and recovering all week. Going to try a more focused approach of shorter Z2 road rides during the week and shorter gravel rides at the weekend with more sort of sweetspot efforts on climbs.

Oh and I'm going full Dylan Johnson and getting a hydration pack, I just can't eat/carry enough solid carbs alone, albeit there will be feed stops at least...

Just realised that I didn't update this thread about the sign-on in case anyone else was curious. I emailed the organisers and they confirmed that registering on the day is fine.

Unfortunately that wasn't the only logistical barrier so I'm having to give it a miss this year. I'm still following the traiing plan I built for it in TrainerRoad for the fun of it.

If I was riding it I'm pretty sure I'd invest in the biggest tyres that my frame can take. Lots of chat on the internet about XC tyres being faster than 40mm on a lot of surfaces and not much slower on tarmac. I'm less interested in this than having chatted to a few folk who've gone as fat as they can and they all said it just made the bike feel more fun to ride. As it is I'll just wait til my current tyres wear out before enfattening.

Suddenly feeling very underprepared for this, even though we're still 8 weeks out.  Overall fitness is where I'd hope to me, but for a variety of reasons winter training has been limited to the indoor trainer and running.  Had my first outing on the gravel bike at the weekend felt good on the bike but concerned that my back may not be up to the distance.  I completed a gravel century ride last September after recovering from a herniated disc, but that was after a summer of riding.  Just a two hour ride was enough for the tightness in my back to be very noticeable (not painful as such, more just discomfort - but the thought of an additional 7 hours was not a pleasant one).

Have to admit the amount of climbing is starting to worry me a bit too - around where I live the hilliest century ride I can plan still only has a third of the amount of climbing in G.O.D.

Oh well, will have to try to get out for some longer rides A.S.A.P. and see where the back is at closer to event day.  I foolishly changed my entry to the GrALBA race entry too, so feeling a bit more pressure to ride it as fast as I can rather than just aim to get round.  Guess that's all on me though - nothing stopping me from taking my time, resting my back if needed, and rolling in last.

Funny, I was just going to post something related to this.

My training hasn't been ideal either, although I'm still feeling relatively confident. I've just not achieved the consistency I wanted to, even just regular short easy morning road rides etc. to build up endurance. Instead it's been snatched midweek rides and smi-regular big weekend rides (so standard 'weekend warrior' style then 🙄 ).

Am confident I'll get through it, I've done a couple of long 7-8hr gravel rides, not 180km right enough but rougher surfaces which I'm hoping counts for something. I'm painfully aware I've not been doing enough climbing either...

I was like you when I came out of the winter, longer or steeper climbs, the likes of which I hadn't done much of during the winter, were actually putting my back into spasm! I had faith though and just tried to build up slowly whilst using lower gears where possible. I've also been doing a lot more upper body work (barbell rows, deadlifts, push-ups etc) just to get my back used to working! I think if you stick at it and have faith you should come through OK.

The last couple of weeks I was going to start doing more mid-week hill climbing sessions but first I hurt my knee then I picked up some sort of lurgy so I've not really ridden for a week now, and it was patchy before then. I've got 4 (or even 5) days to myself next week which I'm going to use as an 'endurance block' basically doing as many low intensity miles as I can (co-incidentally taking in some big gravel and road routes I've been wanting to ride) then I'll take a week off and just hit the shorter, higher intensity miles until G.O.D.

Goal is to manage round in 9 hours. I think with the right feeding and prep I can do this but I can rarely stick to a training plan so it all boils down to May/early June riding.

Where are you based @qtip ?

Based on the Cambridgeshire / Suffolk / Essex border, so not quite the flatlands of North Cambridgeshire but not exactly hilly either.

I wish I'd done like you and paid more attention to strength and conditioning.  It has been on my 'must start doing' list ever since I knackered my back but procrastination on that front has got the best of me.  Hopefully starting now will be enough to make some difference by June, combined with some longer rides to get used to being on the bike for extended periods.

I'd had a similar 9 hour-ish goal.  Back issues aside, I think that was a fairly realistic goal although it's hard to know how average speeds around here will translate to much hillier terrain.  Also, not really sure of how technical the route is likely to be as have never ridden in the Aberfoyle area - it sounds like quite a mix, but that could mean anything really.

I'm going to give it a go, unless rides in the upcoming weeks show that the length of time on the bike is really not currently viable.  I think I just need to remove all expectations and treat it as a post-injury re-introduction to long distance sportives (which is what I really had in mind when I booked it, and before I foolishly "upgraded" my entry type) rather than a race.

Posted by: qtip

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I wish I'd done like you and paid more attention to strength and conditioning.  It has been on my 'must start doing' list ever since I knackered my back but procrastination on that front has got the best of me.  Hopefully starting now will be enough to make some difference by June, combined with some longer rides to get used to being on the bike for extended periods.

I'm no expert so speaking purely from experience, don't try and overcompensate by going heavy with the weights! I'm still shifting relatively paltry weights when deadlifting etc. (e.g. I'm 90kg and proudly deadlifting 3 x 12 x 30kg 🤣 ). With my back it's as much a functional thing and a psychological thing i.e. teaching my back it's OK to be under tension (physio calls it 'graded exposure').

Also watch the long weekend rides, I quickly realised they were doing me no good (from a training perspective that is) as I just ended up knackered all week. After my big weekend next weekend I won't do anything over 100km but will focus on lots of shorter sweetspot style stuff as that's the likely intensity I'll be sitting at during the ride.

Will need to look out for one another on the day, I'm easy to spot, I'll be the only one with v-brakes on my bike probably (bright blue anodised ones at that 😎 ).

Good advice about not trying to overcompensate - I'll definitely be taking things cautiously as I don't want to return to slipped disc hell.

Would be great to put a face to the username come event day.  Bright blue V-brakes sound snazzy - takes me back to my pimped '97 Kona Cinder Cone!  I can't think of any stand out features for identifying myself - will be on a green Giant Revolt with slightly fancy wheels, bald bloke probably dressed largely in black.

Hows everyones training coming along? Mrs SSS and I are marshalling at G.O.D. So ive seen the prelim route and where we'll be sitting.....

So far so good! I managed a 450km/4-day mixed tarmac, gravel and MTB weekend two weeks ago.

Didn't maybe take as much recovery as I'd planned but my last three rides suggest the 'endurance block' approach has paid off, at low intensity I'm faster, and I surprised myself at how fast my one attempt at a 'race pace' ride was, albeit it was too fast to maintain over the full GOD distance.

I'll probably be my own undoing though as I can't really resist the temptation to cram the next few weekends with big rides, if only thanks to the weather.

Hill reps tonight. Unsure exactly what sort of hills I should be focusing on but I've picked a local 8-10 minute road climb as being a good middle ground of the GOD climbs.

Got out for a 165k gravel ride at the weekend and back felt fine, so my worries about finishing are alleviated.  Fitness is currently good - great for me in fact, but really not sure how I'm going to cope with the elevation or how average speeds around here are going to translate.

Going to do some hill reps in the coming week to try and get the legs used to more climbing in a shorter distance but the only steepish off-road climb around here (or on-road for that matter) is only around 3 minutes long.  May have some time to head somewhere with more appropriate terrain towards the end of May, but wary of doing too much too late.

Information about the schedule for the weekend seems to be very sparse - or have I missed some form of communication?  Would be helpful to know about start times, registration times, etc.

@13thfloormonk - do you have a Gralba race series entry, or the standard G.O.D.?

Just standard, wasn't really interested in the other events in the Gralba series, or was interested but knew I couldn't make them.

Is there anything different on the day?

Posted by: 13thfloormonk

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Is there anything different on the day?

Ah, you set off 15 minutes earlier by the looks of it 😉

There go my chances of getting into a fast group! 😂

Also 6:15/6:30am start times, that'll be an early start driving from Auchterarder 🤮

@qtip Im unsure that youve missed any comms. As they are just finalising the route etc. But there will be registration available on the Saturday - likely late afternoon/evening. And registration super early before the event. The Start/Finish is at Cobleland Campsite

Interesting!

Route has pretty much been reversed by the looks of it and appears maybe to have slightly fewer, but bigger climbs?

Also a suspiciously singletracky/hair-pinny looking descent above Loch Katrine

Check out this route on Strava: https://strava.app.link/cm1vJ4jwQTb — Grand Old Dukes 2025 Final

In other news I've had a head full of yellow snot for 5 days now, hoping to get a final 75km hilly ride tomorrow and a couple of short sessions up to and including next week, but as it is my taper has pretty much started 3 weeks out 😂

Crunch time!

After 10 days off the bike I've thrown any notion of tapering out of the window and just getting back on it. Had a good 2hr smash on the road bike on Saturday and felt good, out on the gravel bike on Tuesday and also felt good although the gusty tailwind sort of confused things a bit. One more ride Friday eve I think just to do two test climbs at 'race pace' to try and get used to how it should feel at a sensible heart rate on the climbs, slower than I'm used to probably.

I've actually had a proper look at the course profile and it has finally sunk in how much climbing there is! I make it 8 decent sized climbs (200-250m elevation, 2-5km length) with a couple of little bumps in between. However I'm especially glad I spotted the 6 little buggers right at the end, the final 25km is basically a saw tooth of 6 spiteful little 50m climbs..

New tactic is pace everything until 150km then death or glory on those last ramps! 😎 

Well that was brutal!  Spent pretty much the whole thing solo, but was actually pretty glad of that.  Was much happier at my own pace rather than trying to hold a wheel.  Not sure of my official time but Garmin says 8:45.  Very happy with that as was hoping for sub 9.  My rear disc rotor (centre lock) decided to undo itself around two thirds of the way around so I had to stop a bunch of times to hand tighten it!  Battled with cramp from only 2 hours in but the back held out pretty well - had some pain for the last couple of hours but nothing too bad, although it has properly seized up now.  Really not used to that amount of climbing, but what a great course and stunning location.  I imagine the steep muddy single track descent (I forget where this came in the course) could have got a bit lively with riders grouped together.  All in all a grand day out.

Posted by: qtip

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Not sure of my official time but Garmin says 8:45.  Very happy with that as was hoping for sub 9

Awesome effort! I was chasing sub-9 but had to pull the pin just after the muddy singletrack descent, I clearly hadn't done the time or the work in the run-up and was hurting all over within 40km. Ironically legs were doing OK and I might have managed 9:30ish but just daundered back to the car after a coffee at Loch Katrine pier 🙄

Sorry you day didn’t turn out as planned.  Definitely a tough course.  I found the long climbs weren’t too bad as you could get into a rhythm, but some of the undulating stuff with steep pitches really took it out of me.  There was a fairly long road section in the second half that was a welcome respite.

Posted by: qtip

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I found the long climbs weren’t too bad as you could get into a rhythm, but some of the undulating stuff with steep pitches really took it out of me.

Weirdly I enjoyed the undulating bit! It was the long twiddly seated climbs that seemed to be killing my back, shorter punchy climbs out of the saddle felt pretty good.

My legs were cramping a bit, a relatively early on. Last time they cramped like that was about 80 miles into the Fred Whitton at the bottom of Hardknott, it did cross my mind that the GOD was like the Fred Whitton of gravel! 😂

Was there with work.

Hats off to everyone who entered - a big old day out!

Great job by Kerry, Beth and co.

@13thfloormonk - were you at the cafe at Katrine? I saw a bike (White and green) I recognised, but then was half a mile back down the road before I suddenly remembered I had seen it on here...

I made the mistake of heading in the opposite direction to many of the riders, having forgotten it was on this weekend and having had a last minute opportunity to ride.

Posted by: matt_outandabout

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13thfloormonk - were you at the cafe at Katrine? I saw a bike (White and green) I recognised, but then was half a mile back down the road before I suddenly remembered I had seen it on here...

That was me! Shame, would have been good to say Hi in person. What were you riding?

 and stunning location. 

I have to constantly remind myself that my local riding is properly stunning and amazing quality of rides. But yes, lovely.

Who stopped for goat ice cream?

Mrs SSS and I were marshalling at the single track after Stronachlacher. Mrs SSS at the entrance. Me at the exit at the road crossing before Loch Chon.

So when you saw the marshall with the midgie net. That was me....  

@matt_outandabout did you cycle from Aberfoyle to Stron? I saw lots of riders who wanted to ride up my marshalled section coming up from Aberfoyle, but kept going cos the event was on and theyd be riding against the flow.

@qtip that was Primrose Hill at Loch Katrine presumably. Beth/Kerry said that was lilely to be muddy after the race cohort had been on it first, leading to tricky conditions for the rest of the field. Sounds like it was.

Good everyone enjoyed. When we returned to Cobleland with the signage etc after we were relieved, lots of folks who enjoyed the event.

So if you saw/past me....  Hi 😀

@SSS - no, I was dropped at Stronlachar(sp?) and rode back to Dunblane. So only the lochside of Katrine and Loch Archray - it did puzzle a few as I was told I was going the wrong way....

Posted by: 13thfloormonk

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Posted by: matt_outandabout

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13thfloormonk - were you at the cafe at Katrine? I saw a bike (White and green) I recognised, but then was half a mile back down the road before I suddenly remembered I had seen it on here...

That was me! Shame, would have been good to say Hi in person. What were you riding?

blue Vagabond...