[Closed] Going Ti... is it worth it (groan, not again)?

I'd suggest that only you know the answer to that. I bought an expensive carbon bike a few years back and it's the best bike I've ever owned, others may not feeel that way, but I knoww I like it 🙂

You see Marmoset, that is a great answer.

Rides better but whether it's worth it is up to you...

3 years ago, I was in the same quandary. Today, I'm still riding my Soda and still loving it.

Marmoset +1

6yrs on my mk1 tinbred, and never regreted it once.

yes

Oh my... I guess you shell out that much and you just can't not like it, eh?

I very nearly self imported a Litespeed 10 years back (they wanted to sent it to a bike shop and surprising no bike shop I asked was interested!) and it would have cost £1400 then...

Well, I guess its all down to the test ride innit.

It does look a thing of joy and beauty though:
[img] [/img]

neil - seriously, the only diff is the kudos.....................

....and weight

simon, you know I've [i]wanted[/i] a ti frame for a looooooooooong time though.

JFDI man !

Well, I have badgered Cy into getting a demo...

After that it would be rude not to.

Plus as Co didn't happen this year it should happen next year. It would be nice to have something 'different'...

🙂

Whether or not it's worth three Souls is not a question you should probably ask yourself (or one that I dwell on too much) but it rides beautifully, is very pretty, quick and versatile and there isn't another bike I'd rather have. My Soda's built up as an XC/AM mutant at the moment for a big trip to the lakes, and it's a hoot. Change of tyres and bar and it's a competitive race bike. No regrets here. Buy one before you think better of it.

bol, that's pretty much the question I have been asking myself (3xSoul!).

I guess my bigger worry is that having wanted a ti frame for so long what if it just isn't THAT much better and I'd actually be happy with my Soul (or even a new orange one)? Disappointment I mean.

Hence the test ride I guess. At least I should know after that, eh?

I think that could be a problem. Built up the same I can't imagine that it rides that much better. It's only about a pound lighter. It does feel a lot more special to own and is nicer to look at though. I know that shouldn't and doesn't really mean anything, but my bike sits in my hallway and I walk past it ten times a day, so sad or not, it matters to me. If you've got a lot of bikes, I wouldn't bother. If you only have one, go for it.

I can see both sides of the argument. I bought a little Ti hardtail (cheap import) to see what the fuss was about and it was immediately obvious that it was a lot more fun and lively than the Inbred I'd been riding.

I've since bought a Ti tourer/commuter. For touring, it's definitely a comfier ride than the steel equivalent I was previously riding.

However, I'm also massively enjoying a mmmbop and I just can't see how a Ti Ragley could offer value for money against that.

Yes, it is.

[IMG] [/IMG]

i hope it is ive just spent 10% of a years wage on one

Good job well worth it

I'd say no it isn't worth it and there is a lot of self affirmation going on here.

I bought a Moots 10 years ago but I cannot honestly say that it is noticeably 'better' that a good quality steel frame (my mates de Kerf for example, or even an old Tange Prestige frame I have)

Don't get me wrong, a very nice frame and very well made. But 'better' no.

So, ti frames are nice but they wont fill the emptiness that is gnawing at my soul... okay!

I got the chance to take Ian Potters original Soda test bike round the car park at Sherwood Pines a few years ago now - I already had quite a bling build Soul and the Soda just felt so much quicker and zippier....

My riding abilities simply don't justify it, but if I had the money, I'd have the Soda in a heartbeat.

Well, I did a little experiment namely the same x-c route of approx. 35 miles, undulating naturally, and with the same under-tyre conditions, ie dry with one week apart.

Apart from forks - steel had 120mm Fox's and Ti had 100mm DT Swiss - everything else was the same. So same Hope Pro 3's with same tyres, same Hope Mini Pro's with carbon levers, same carbon bars, same stems, same XT, same pedals, same saddle. Oh, on the steel was fitted a Thomson seat post and on the Ti was a Ti one.

What was the most comfy, ie feeling less beat-up? Have a guess.

boxfish - Member

3 years ago, I was in the same quandary. Today, I'm still riding my Soda and still loving it.

Had the same point myself a few years back. Took a slight wrong turn with my Setavento of a couple of years (rohloffed), but perservered and bought a previous generation Soda. Love it - my best bike to date, and I love it. The way I see it, mountain biking is a luxury, so I might as well buy something that makes me dribble 🙂

Cinnamon Girl wrote :

Well, I did a little experiment namely the same x-c route of approx. 35 miles, undulating naturally, and with the same under-tyre conditions, ie dry with one week apart.

Apart from forks - steel had 120mm Fox's and Ti had 100mm DT Swiss - everything else was the same. So same Hope Pro 3's with same tyres, same Hope Mini Pro's with carbon levers, same carbon bars, same stems, same XT, same pedals, same saddle. Oh, on the steel was fitted a Thomson seat post and on the Ti was a Ti one.

stoppit. you're turning me on..... 😀

stoppit. you're turning me on.....

I've not lost my touch then. 😉

No its not worth it.

Any difference in flex is minute in Engineering terms and is generally hearsay.

Yes it will be lighter than steel but if your a true weight weenie you'd be on a carbon frame.

People say they last a lifetime but you get just as many failures as steel and be honest what is the longest you've kept a bike for before lusting after the next?

Didn't stop me buying one though!

Being a very happy owner of a Soda for 3 years I had a test ride of the new one on Friday, itch I've been wanting to scratch for a while.

Guess what - I came away with a new one 🙂
I just thought of the new one being more of a strum and less of a twang when it gets choppy. The stiffness in the bottom bracket of the new one is noticeable when putting the power down, and the frame feels more taut. It will probably feel less different to your Soul than the old Soda.

Like you its probably a bit of middle aged consumerism, but I fell for it and can't wait to get all my kit transferred over to it hopefully for the weekend.

Only you can decide if its worth it.

Mate of mine got one a few months back - he looooooves it! Sold his carbon HT soon after as he started to hate it in comparison 😯

I am saving up.. 😉

My comparison was between a Soul and a Litespeed. After 2 years I am not bored with Ti. 8)

a vanity purchase.
i could understand if there was a lifetime guarantee and ti frames never broke but there isn't and they are not indestructible.

the difference between ti and steel(or carbon/good alloy) is the cost of a riding holiday or trips round the country's best riding spots.

Yes it really is worth it.....I`ve had Ti frames for the last 15 years and only on my 2nd in that time (On One 456) 😛

The only reason i sold the Litespeed 18 months ago is cause it did`nt have the geometry for the stupid stuff we throw our bikes down twice a week 😯

Another + is that you only scratch bare metal which you can polish out 🙂

Go on, you really want to................ 😉

FCOL let the guy have a mid-life crisis. 🙄

Very occasionally one should throw caution to the wind ...

If you have the Ti itch, there is no alternative but to part with the cash and buy one. Sorry

Scratch the itch. You know it makes sense. 😀

I did. Now a 456ti owner with no regrets. The £800 I paid would have been wasted on beer and unnecessary bike part upgrading anyway.

BUT, my 456ti its not worth 5 or 6 times the price of a steel 456 IME as it is not 5 or 6 times better. It IS better though and I'm loving it and I can honestly say it is the best bike I've ever owned and have no thoughts about selling it.

Also, chances are, I'd have spent a similar amount of cash on frame changing in the time I've had my ti456 since I was on my 3rd steel On One (in 3 years) when I went for the Ti frame.

Believe me, you're only regret will not be buying one sooner.

danti: was the demo off Cotic?

Mr Smith: according to the website the soda has a Lynskey unlimited lifetime warranty.

So concensus is that its not 'worth' whatever the multi of the steel equivalent but the joy of the shiney thing is the end in itself... And its not really a rational purchase, just a luxury!

Okay, I can handle that.

Just have to wait and see when they can get me a test ride...

Yeah, of course it's worth it. Buying stuff always makes you feel better doesn't it?

For a short time at least.

When it comes to Hardtail frames, it's 95% geometry and about 5% frame material that makes the difference.

And steel is already more springy/forgiving than aluminium in most applications.

Ti frames are really hard to justify IMO, WAY harder than an expensive full sus bike... And I've also ridden some pretty rubbish ti frames too, most notably either too flexy or geometry was all wrong. I have ridden one or 2 very nice ti bikes though, that did make me think (for more than just a moment) maybe I'd be better off with one in my garage...

But the reality is, if you're buying ti for "the feel" you're either buying an overly flexy frame (like the Airborne Lancaster I owned briefly), or you've bought into the marketing guff.

If you're buying a ti frame as you absolutely must have a lightweight hardtail frame, but won't buy an ally or carbon frame for reasons of fatigue... Then that's more plausible.

If you're buying a ti frame cos you really believe you will own it and ride it for the next 15 years, then fair enough...

But the extra £1k will save you more than the 1lb in weight that the Soda is lighter than the Soul by spending it elsewhere... And if you REALLY want more give/feel/flex/spring in the back end, spend some money on a decent tubeless wheelset and some fast/big/grippy/light tubeless treads... I've been riding for a long time now, frame materials do make a difference but it really isn't that noticable when compared to other things, and I believe that tubeless tyres make much more of a noticable difference myself.

So there! 😉

All that said, Ti bikes don't half look sexy though... And money no object, I'd probably have a Litespeed, or a Soda just like that...

neil - the soda is more XC than the ti456 of course......gimme a shout at work / email at work to advise when this demo's occurring and i'll pop out with the ti456 as a comparitor.... okies ?

Having had both, I prefer the way the Soul rides.

Ti is emphatically [u]not[/u] a bike for life. My Soda lasted about a year until it had to be retired. It had 2 cracks from rock damage, and one major one across the seat tube/top tube weld. On the same type of riding, my Soul has lasted since they first came out, and is still going strong.

Agree with johnners re not bike for life (sadly); have had a Ti road frame break at BB less than 10 000 miles use (OK it was replaced foc quickly) but this has dented my confidence in Ti + all teh stories / reports I hear about welds breaking , cracks. My Ti MTB is light and fun and probably quite tough, but having just bought a BFe steel I find latter is actually quicker uphills (more stiffness in farme BB area?) and I feel more confident in it over rough terrain. But you may need to buy a Ti just for your own satisfaction ---- 🙂

Simon, will do.

How it is designed and who builds it should be a big consideration. I rode a Hummer and a Handjob for comparison after getting my Hummer. The Hummer isn't significantly better to be honest. In fact, it feels stiffer and less comfortable. Ti is also not a bike for life. You can knacker it just as easily as any other frame - cue the pic of Luke's 456 with the separated disc mount.

Ti can be lovely but it isn't necessarily the wonder material that you might be hoping.

Having said that, I would still go for Ti as my first choice material for a hardtail or a cross bike! 😀

Cheers

Sanny

I'm in the process of having an indi fab made for me, I have heard these cracking itch.es with a lifetimes warranty

Loved my Soda rode and raced it everywhere until it cracked, bought a Soul to fill the void until the new Soda arrived and still riding the Soul. Granted I haven't tried the new Soda but it would have to be a lot better to ride to get me to part with the cash. I've had a few Ti frames and still the nicest to ride was a Fat Ti but it was a tad too small otherwise I'd still have it. It also had a wishbone rear end so must be something in that 🙂

Bike for life? Depends. If you're still riding an original Stumpy and thinking it's cutting edge then ti is for life. Look back even over a couple of years to see what's changed - frame angles are slacker now, longer fork travel, tapered head tubes, disks etc. etc. even full suspension - if you're someone who needs the next shiny thing then it ain't for life, but don't let that stop you.

Metalheart - yeah it was up at Cotic last Friday.

As much as I like my steel Singular swift, the Ti Pegasus which is exactly the same geometry is more comfy over the same routes

So, rOcKeTdOg, sounds as though you are agreeing with the point I made. 8)

[i]Agree with johnners re not bike for life (sadly); have had a Ti road frame break at BB less than 10 000 miles use (OK it was replaced foc quickly) but this has dented my confidence in Ti + all teh stories / reports I hear about welds breaking , cracks. [/i]

10k miles - that'd be a couple of lifetimes for the majority on here!

Well got a demo on a Soda today.

Boy, what a bike. It was punted by Cy as being the Soul+: Lighter, tighter, faster, prettier 😉

And it was all that.

What I wasn't prepared for was showing me up. Ive not felt quite so, well, mismatched before. And it kinda felt delicate...

I'd have to say though it's probably the nicest hardtail I've ever ridden.

If I thought I could do it any justice I'd get one. So now I need to get training otherwise there's no point really. .

Thanks to both Cycleworld and (obviously) Cy/Cotic for making it happen.

What is this busting frames you speak of..........Kobe Ti still doing the biz!

I love my Airborne - it might just be me but I had a scandium bike that was super light, but being 12st I just felt that it was going to break under my weight, the airborne is just so comfy for long rides, even with panniers 🙂

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If I thought I could do it any justice I'd get one. So now I need to get training otherwise there's no point really. .

All the more reason to get one. I find mine is just the compensation I need for a general lack of skill and fitness. I'm 15 stone and have never felt I was anywhere near too heavy for it either.

I find mine is just the compensation I need for a general lack of skill and fitness.

See I found it magnified my lack of skill and fitness. To be fair I've been concentrating on climbing of late and been neglecting the bike but still!

Decided to set some targets for February time. If met it's the Soda, if not then a new Soul.

I've got a ti Serotta 29er and everytime i ride it I enjoy it so much. I've toured on it, raced on it and just did SSWC on it. Bike for life ? Nah but it rides nice.
Do it.

I have 4 bikes & 4 different frames - steel, ti, ali & magnesium, indecision rules my life 😳 😥

Ti is a frame material I've never broken...

it's also a frame material I have never owned 😆

Ti is a frame material I've never broken...

Well if I get one you definitely ain't getting a shot!

So, rOcKeTdOg, sounds as though you are agreeing with the point I made

yes but i didn't get turned on 🙁

Just bought a Kobe Ti from the classified. Looking forward to building up and riding her 😯

I used to always want a ti frame, largely because of what I'd read about the magic ride quality.

But now that I could afford one, I've decided against it because of how fast bike design is still changing (and because the failure rate seems higher than steel - not wanting to open another can of worms).

Think I'd rather spend the extra £1k over steel (or a carbon 456) on full XTR, if I had to spend that much on a HT.

Well if anyone is interested I've only gone and ordered the blushing Ti bride.

Lets just hope its as nice to live with as its plainer sister.

Frame arrives Monday, I'm quite excited really...

😀

My frame arrives monday too. Never before have I looked forward to a weekend passing quickly 🙂

Had my Airbourne Lucky Strike to spec built this summer and love it! Feel like I've neglected my full suss as a result!

[url= http://www.flickr.com/photos/monotokpoint/sets/72157624201550137/ ]* Detailed pics *[/url]

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[url= http://www.flickr.com/photos/monotokpoint/4721995798/ ]DSC01939[/url]

Jonny5 - Member

My frame arrives monday too. Never before have I looked forward to a weekend passing quickly

Yeah, but its going to the shop to get built up. It'll be end of the week at the earliest before I get my sticky little mitts on it...

Gonna be a looooong week.

depends if dhocarl is selling it.

I quite like mine. Understated and sooooooo light.
[IMG] [/IMG]

Flashes - I have to say that while it's not something I'd ever contemplate riding/owning etc, there is something very cool about your bike. It's about as close as a bike can get to 'shabby chic' as possible.

[IMG] [/IMG]
15 years old & still fast as hell. Demands to be stomped up hills in the big ring & the faster I ride the smoother it gets.

metalheart - if you'd consider selling your soul frame please let me know..

Infidel: not currently planning on selling the Soul at the moment.

If the soda turns out to be the bike of all bikes then that might change....

😀

>kiwijohn

Is that the hei hei?

I think I prefer "understated"

I love the ride quality of Titanium after countless aluminium frames I decided to bite the bullet, first I bought a Litespeed ti full sus then a Lynskey ridgeline HT. Both get used and still look like new, another benefit of TI frames anti ageing..

I think Kiwijohn's bike looks AWESOME

Can someone tell me what it is?

heres my minimal contribution, and mh - congrats 🙂 lets go ride [although i'm skiing and boarding this w/e] :

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oooh - saddle angle looks odd......?

Rigid Hummer?

It's a 95 DBR Axis TT.
I believe it was a DBR team bike back then, not sure who though. Sold to someone here in Oz who raced it at the 96 worlds in Cairns. It's been around, but I'm keeping it.